Mary, as far as I know there is only the slightest link between Thomas and Oliver Cromwell. I had to look this up but it appears that one Morgan Williams married Katherine Cromwell the sister of Thomas in the 1490's. Oliver C was the GG Grandson of this union.

I don't think the Puritan regime was very popular in England either.

I suppose to 'modern day' folk raised to believe that bloody battles, massacres and murders are despicable it is difficult to see how O.C and his 'followers' could allow or encourage these things to happen however much tip-for-tat and revenge taking was involved. Hindsight is a wonderful thing but religious zealots, from whatever age, are/were so convinced they are/were right that a balanced account of the truth of the events has often become part of folk-history and very difficult to 'prove'.

Oliver Cromwell Irish Military Campaign

Slightly off-topic - but to those who struggle with the books - I have two suggestions to make.

One - think of the book as a first person book written in the third person. When the author says "He" and it's not clear to whom she is referring, assume Thomas Cromwell.

Two - try it as an audio book. My daughter is "reading" the unabridged Wolf Hall (she grabbed it as a special offer from Audible) and is finding it enthralling; she struggled to get into the book by just reading it.

I like the audio book suggestion. That is how I read The Silmarillion, a book I was unable to read in print.

Thanks, everyone. Vee, the article you posted seems quite slanted in sympathy towards Oliver Cromwell, inconsistent with all I have been taught in my classes. How did you select the source?

Donna, you might find the film version of "Wolf Hall" very well done and accessible. I did.

I haven't seen the film :). Thanks for the suggestions, Martin!

Donna

Mary/woodnymph, I found the info on Oliver Cromwell just by searching thru' google. I chose that particular article because it seemed very balanced. One side is never truly evil or the other without a stain on their character.

From what you have mentioned here (and sorry I can longer access the post) your 'classes' have been taught by an Irish American tutor and when you added that your final class had dealt with the 'problem' of how a reunited Ireland might be brought about I understood that she was from the Nationalist camp.

You may not believe/agree with whatever I write but speaking as a English person this is not the sort of conversation you will find taking place in either the Dail or Westminster.

Certainly there is a group of people intent on bringing Ulster back into the Republican fold but bombing, maiming and killing of innocent civilians leading to horrible reprisals is not the way forward. Buying huge quantities of semtex from Libya's Gaddafi, with money largely collected from US supporters and drug smuggling has caused a terrible rift between the communities in the past. Relations between these groups has greatly eased in the last few years.

If the people of the Northern province want to reunify with the Republic they have the right to use the ballot box; they are not being forced to stay part of the United Kingdom against their will!

I have very many Irish friends but they don't sit about talking of the bad-old-days of four hundred years ago nor what wars some ancient Norman rulers undertook over eight hundred years ago, they don't even blame the English for deliberately starting the potato famine as some US writers have claimed.

If you don't believe me or the article above 'read around the subject' as I was always taught in history lectures.

I loved Wolf Hall, but Martin is right - the audio book with narration by Simon Slater is excellent.

Just my two cents, but I found 'Wolf Hall' and 'Bring Up the Bodies" astonishing. Mantel absolutely inhabited Thomas Cromwell. They are perhaps the finest historical novels I've ever read. And they're not even my historical period. I'm eagerly awaiting the third one.

The third book is to be titled The Mirror and the Light and it has been rumoured that Mantel has possibly been side-tracked by the TV production and the awards that it took; plus she seems to have been writing other stuff.

In some ways I found the books easier to deal with than the TV series, not to say that I didn't think it was a wonderful production. But it was not always easy to tell who was who or which lady in waiting was up to no good. In the book we were told Lady Mary so-and-so was the sister/sister-in-law/evil Aunt of Queen No II, Mistress No IV. On the TV series we had to know that the Lord in need of a shave was the one plotting to get his daughter into the King's bed, that the men in black were the scholars/lawyers and that the cloaked figures lurking behind pillars and in doorways were spies.

Laceyvail nailed my feelings about these books. And I am not a history buff.

Tried to listen to the Wolf Hall audio on CD based on recommendations here, but it was full of skips. That is the problem with library CDs -- used and worn out. I'm going to try to download a digital audio direct to my computer. Haven't done that before, so it will be a learning experience!

Rose, it's quite easy. I download to my computer and then upload to my iPod or phone to listen. One tip - download in parts, as if you take the whole thing and it's a long book (like Wolf Hall) there can be problems with it failing to play about two-thirds of the way through. Having it in parts doesn't effect the listening, it just goes from one to the next without you having to do anything.