In part it depends on what you want to store there. Both open in the same direction which can also be a determining factor (sometimes need to use the RAS half moon units instead for clearance when opening). I use the LeMans more often.

The Lemans is easier to access IMO, holds taller items a bit better than the baskets, heights can be adjusted slightly (but have that done upon install as they are difficult to change later). It is a tad more expensive for the unit but easier to install. Less parts to fail.

For groceries the RAS is a better choice by far or if you don't need storage for any taller items.

I like the ease of using the Lemans more and it was my first choice until I went with my own design.

I had the rev a shelf one in my condo I just sold. Found it to work great and hold lots of small appliances and bowls.

Thanks for your replies!

Does anyone know what the sq inch capacity of the RAS is (the larger one with the 18" minimum cabinet opening)? I can't seem to find this information anywhere. The hafele that I would be getting is the middle size with 884 sq inch capacity.

I don't know the square inch capacity, but I did notice one other thing: The Hafele is made for cabinets that are ~33" to ~40" on the long edge of the corner cabinet (side "B" on the web diagram), while the RAS is for corners that are 48" on the long edge. So you might already be constrained, depending on how far along your design is...

Here's an old thread with corner solutions and space calculations.

http://ths.gardenweb.com/discussions/2472094/corner-cabinet-space-calculations-and-analysis

For us the answer came down to the position of the sink. By using a corner cabinet we were forced to place fillers in between cabinets to get the sink centered with the windows. We ended up with a bind corner.

Please let me know if anyone knows the Knows the usable le storage space of the 45” lemans pullouts blind vs a 24” lazy Suzan ?

Our original plan was to put a lemans unit in a blind corner but we ended up with the rev a shelf unit. We have the 18" unit and each shelf measures 16 x 14" for a total of 896 sq inches for the four shelves.

What I like about the rev a shelf pullout, is that first half pulls out like a rollout drawer and it goes back in with soft close.

• @Carrie Bono "Usable" storage is a hard one to determine with these type of shelves because, yes, they have calculated square inch measurements, but because of their very unusual shape, a large percentage of that is wasted unless you have a very particularly odd-shaped item you intend to store on it. The things that fit on the outer areas lose space if they are square shaped, and the middle is restricted.

For anyone who wants the current link for Corner Cabinet Space Calculations and Analysis, it is https://www.houzz.com/discussions/2472094/corner-cabinet-space-calculations-and-analysis. It is a long, thorough and useful discussion. The link from wilson853 (I know it is from 6/3/2016) gives it with the gardenweb, not House designation and results in an error and not being able to find it.

Can someone w/ a Lemans check how much clearance you have in the opening when the shelf is widest? We have a 16" opening width and I'd really like to buy the version that requires 16 1/8" if it will fit. I realize it sounds stupid to ask if 16 >= 16 1/8" since obviously it isn't but I'm hoping there is some pad in the measurement that will allow me to use the bigger unit. Thanks.

Oh yes, those measurements do have ease planned into them. I confirmed this myself with the company last year when I was wondering if I should plan for more than the allowance for safety. They said absolutely not, that the measurements allowed for enough clearance already. Note, however, that the 16 1/8" (actually 410 mm which is slightly larger than 16 1/8") is for face frame cabinetry with the LeMans II. If you have frameless cabinets, the clearance requirements increase to 16 1/2". You could probably rig the installation to make it work, but it could be risky. It's a great product, though, and the bigger the better as far as shape and area utilization. Download the full specs straight from the manufacturer Kessebohmer here under installation instructions: https://www.cleverstorage.com/corner-cabinets/lemans/

Thanks - I was hoping someone with a unit installed could check the max opening for their unit so I could see how much margin was in their specs.

Thanks - I really appreciate that you're trying to help. But what I need to know is how wide is the opening in your cabinet in inches/mm, and how much extra space there is around the shelf in that opening at it's widest point.

That was a demo model at a showroom out of town for me. You can call them if you want and ask for specs. The cabinetry is Ultracraft. The showroom is Factory Builder Stores in Grapevine, Texas, phone 817-410-8868. I really think you would get further contacting the manufacturer, Kessebohmer, directly. They have a responsive customer service department that promptly answered my technical questions last year about the LeMans II specs. I ended up doing something entirely different with my corner cabinetry designs and did not use a LeMans II.

I don't know if there's much margin in the specs. I have the LeMans 50 which says that it requires an 18 3/8" opening in a frameless cabinet.

I have a 20 inch opening in mine, and there's only about 1.25" inches of clearance when it pulls out, which implies that it really needs 18 3/4" of clearance which is even more than the spec. (However, looking comparing my actual installation with the diagram that shows how far apart the two poles should be mounted, the diagram says they should be 560mm apart, but the poles in my cabinet are about 580mm apart. I suspect that extra 20mm (or 3/4") could account for why my installation wouldn't seem to fit through the 18 3/8" opening.)

But either way, I wouldn't count on there being a massive amount of give in the specs. (That said, if you have a framed cabinet, if necessary, maybe you could cut slight 1/8" deep notches out of the face frame for where the shelves line up with the face frame?)

Thanks - that was very helpful. I'll probably roll the dice and buy one from a place with a good return policy and then do a test fit to see if it will work or not.

By way of update to this thread, I attempted to design a LeMans II 60, the largest size made, into my kitchen and realized only in the final stages of cabinetry finalization that the door required for this size of LeMans was so large that it was a warp risk for a 5-piece wood door and would put excessive weight on the door hinges. As mentioned in a previous comment, the largest LeMans II 60 offers more of a semi-circular shape without the peanut indention and thus provides the maximum storage area. However, I would not recommend using it unless you have a configuration with a pull-out drawer on top of the LeMans area simply to shorten the dimensions of the door required for the LeMans. I had originally planned to order two sets of LeMans trays and make the entire cabinet a 4-tray-pull-out LeMans which you can do in the same style of their high pantry option, attaching more trays to a single pole set. However, in the end I changed this cabinet design to close off the blind corner and use a drawer stack leading up to the corner instead due to logistics concerning the oversized door that would have been required. Some cabinetry doors are more prone to warping than others. A solid wood slab would have the greatest risk, then a 5-piece wood door. An MDF door would have the least risk of warping in a large size but might also present some concerns about holding solid to hinges with that weight and screws fitted into the MDF panel.

Can anyone compare the IKEA Utrusta corner unit as far as durability and quality?

@julieste There is another thread somewhere here at Houzz about that. The cabinetry builder in California, @jdesign_gw has used the IKEA boxes with his own doors to put together entry-level cabinetry for some of his clients, and he is familiar with the IKEA competitor to the LeMans II and provided some commentary about it. If my memory serves me right, the IKEA version isn't made of materials that are as sleek as the finishes on the LeMans II, but if you are on a budget, certainly it would work. Maybe someone else will see this and comment, or you could try to search the archives to find where this was previously discussed.

As the owner of a custom cabinet manufacturing business, I would recommend the Lemans over the Cloud any day. The fit and finish on the Lemans is much better. It's our go-to whenever we have a blind corner condition. We would only use the Cloud if the architect/designer was adamant about using it.