Complete Kitchen remodel and need suggestions on ideal layout.
I started out to redo the kitchen in a fixer upper house we bought.
Initially I was going to refinish the current cabinets with a little tweaking.
However, I discovered the boxes of the bottom cabinets are MDF instead of
ply-board. The cabinets are probably 30-40 years old and after a thorough
inspection I really don’t trust them to hold up granite slabs. So, I have made
the decision to just go ahead and change out all the cabinets. Now that I am no
longer limited by the layout of the old cabinets, I am now free to change
anything. Normally, I could knock out the layout in my sleep. However, I have
been working on it for some time so I am having trouble thinking outside of the
box to see the best layout for the space. The kitchen was designed to have just
one cook so the sink and stovetop are so close together that it is impossible
for one person to be standing at the stove and another at the sink. The other
major gripe is the refrigerator sticks out badly and is the first thing you see
when you come in the kitchen. The following is the current layout of the
kitchen (each square is 1 sq. ft.):
I had planned to steal a little space from the adjacent room that is being
used as an office/library. The doorway between it and the kitchen on
the left should work well to recess the refrigerator. Next, I was going to move the cabinets
with the stove top on it up 14" toward the sliding glass door and reduce
the size of the raised bar overhang behind the stove top. It isn't really wide
enough to sit at to eat and it is just a place for my husband to drop clutter
every time he comes in the back door. So cutting it down to just a decorative
topping worked for me. There are upper cabinets above the stovetop that will be
removed to open up the space. I was going to add in cabinets to fill the gaps. I
can’t decide whether to leave the extra cabinet angled at the stove or to leave
it off.
Last, I was going to add a narrow island to have
functional work surface that didn't make me feel like I was working with my
head against a set of upper cabinets. Yes, I am aware the island would be tight but it
would actually have two and a half feet on either side (The same distance
currently between the cabinets coming into the kitchen). I taped paper the size
of the island to the floor to insure it would be workable. It is more
strategically placed and sized than it first appears. There is more open space
around the sink/stove area and the oven/microwave where most of the movement
occurs. However, the island would be within easy reach to be able to set things
on the island from the refrigerator, sink, stove, oven and microwave. Once the
refrigerator is recessed there will be room to stand in front of the
refrigerator and open either side of it. I need a permanent island so power can
be run to it and have a place to sit in the kitchen. In the fall I spend many
many hours prepping and canning vegetables from the garden. After too many back
surgeries having to stand at the counter for that many hours is miserable. This would have resulted in a layout like this:
The ceilings are only 7' 7" so that is another challenge I am
working around. I really can't add interest by varying the height of the
cabinets but I can do it with different depths and moldings. So, basically, I
have the option to start from this (but I can't get the old layout out of my mind):
Anybody have any thoughts of a better way to do the layout for function or
aesthetics?
These are some pictures of the kitchen that were on my computer from
when I was buying the house (easier to see structure with just a few pieces of furniture for staging). Based on the wallpaper, I would say the last time
the kitchen was updated was about 1988. Just a little past due. These should
give a visual of what I am starting with:
This is the slab for the island:
Any thoughts? I was ready to put in the material orders but made the mistake of letting my husband go with me when I went to make my final selection on the slabs. The previous color scheme is stuck in my head like a song I can't get rid of!
Comments (15)
Related Discussions
Kitchen Remodel: Suggestions Needed On Layout
Comments (5)What else would you like to change in your kitchen? The things in my original post are what really bother me. I really hate the current pantry space and refrigerator placement. I think those bother me the most. What doesn't work for you about the sink/DW, is it that you see it from the living room?Do you like having a breakfast bar in the Living room? Currently the island is two levels. The sink and DW cannot be seen from the living room. I don't know why I dislike their placement so much. They just seem awkward to me when I am working. When I remodel, I may make the island one level. If they are seen from the living room I won't be bothered. I don't mind the breakfast bar where it is. My living room is fairly large and is kind of an L shape. What's that "empty room", can you make it a pantry? Are there kids living here? The "empty room" is an empty room with electrical outlets and a window. I am thinking of making it into a pantry and office combo. One child. I wish I could put the refrigerator where the panty is now. I think it might be odd, because it would be at the at the end of a walkway and near a doorway....See MoreOpen Palette : Need suggestions for Kitchen Update/Remodel
Comments (12)You have a large amount of darkish wooden surface -- the individual bits are elegant but the sheer mass of it seems to make the space a bit claustrophobic. To modernize and brighten the kitchen without an enormous investment, I think you are quite right to start by painting your cabinets and the soffits as well. Unless you are really pleased with the window valence, you might also think about removing it for a more modern look. And I believe it is not a big deal to have a few of your upper cabinet doors glazed. Finally, in the realm of cost-efficient changes, you might think about tweaking your lighting scheme. Certainly look at installing undercabinet lighting if you do not already have it. In its kitchen displays, HD now has UCL that is not harsh, does not heat the cabinets too much, and is of all things GE flourescents. It is not dimmable, but the cost is reasonable and the effect is nice. And think about changing the receptacles in your ceiling cans from convex to something with baffles, so that the light is more in pools and less diffuse. If you like having the fan and do not feel the absence of a vent, I would leave the fan, perhaps either lowering it a bit or trying to find a light kit that gives you usable light at the cooktop. I would also leave the floor for now if you can. Cool tile is nice underfoot in a warm climate, and you would only have to worry about making sure that the colors of your cabinets and walls work with what looks to me to be pale gray. I would keep the granite you have now. After the painting and light tweaking is done, you can consider such alterations as having it honed or changing the backsplash if you think something more is needed. When you are ready to go the whole nine yards -- moving walls, changing the shapes of windows, and doing new cabinet layouts so as to create the handsome open spaces that so many people on this forum manage to create, then it will be worthwhile to look at new everything. Cheers and good luck. I'm sure you know that a few of us would give our eye teeth to be starting with your "before."...See MoreNeed help with layout for kitchen remodel
Comments (12)Sorry, I meant to say den, not family room. There are beams in the attic and those walls were framed in below. We will verify it, of course, but the seller built the house and told us that the walls between the kitchen and den and the wall between the kitchen and dining room are not load bearing walls. They were in the early stages of planning their own kitchen renovation when a job transfer derailed their plans. I have considered moving the kitchen into the den area, but I wondered if that would drive the cost of the renovation up to a point that we can't afford. I'm not sure if we'd gain much wall space, due to the fireplace wall and the glass doors. I could be completely wrong, though, which is why I'm here looking for feedback, so thank you!...See MoreLayout Suggestions for a Kitchen Remodel
Comments (12)moganbla, If the view is a concern AND if you are willing to change the doors and windows, you may consider enlarging the window in front of the large sink. You can put a large window (an entire wall of windows) which you would look out of when seated at the island. On that wall, you don't put any uppers. Changing windows and doors is expensive AND you need to do it carefully because it changes the look of the house from the outside. For example, if you chose to replace the slider door with a glass door, I would replace the door in the laundry room with the same door so that they are cohesive. If you don't want anyone to look into the laundry room, you put an opaque glass or a shade inside. Play with it on the paper and have someone give you an estimate. Then you can decide if it is worth it or not. Is that the bathroom that you will be using in and out of the pool? Do you have another bath in the basement for the pool use? I have a similar L design kitchen of mamagoose' design, where we look out to the view from the island and the sink. No uppers. It works great. I do not have second sink on the island. In your kitchen, second sink would be great if you want to optimize for large parties and multiple cooks. When you have 2 sinks in the kitchen, you lose the storage capacity of the sink cabinet. Sink cabinets are not good for storage because of the plumbing. When you chose NOT to use that for trash, again, you are losing more space because of that second sink. I have a similar size kitchen and similar lay out without second sink and it works fine for me. The reason I chose not to have the second sink was because my kids were young and I knew that they would be doing their homework there for many years to come. My younger son was doing his calculus homework on it yesterday. He prefers it there because he can spread out more. (my kids have small bedrooms and their desks are not big... Again, what kid would have desk as big as this island.) They would be less likely to use the space if their work would get wet. I also wanted to have uninterrupted counter space in the house that was NOT my dining table. Everything in kitchen design is a game of optimization that works for each individual. What works for you may not be for another person. Think through how the house will live now, when the kids are little and when the kids There is no one way to do this. Good luck with your new house/kitchen....See More
mama goose_gw zn6OH
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoI wouldn't recommend flipping the sink and DW, but here are three options--1) with a mobile cart. 2) with the fridge moved down, the cooktop moved to that wall, leaving more prep area, where you would have no cabinets overhead, and would be facing the DR--disadvantage in that the cooktop is in the walkway, and 3) practigal's suggestion to make the window wider:
Click to enlargeslake2000 thanked mama goose_gw zn6OHslake2000
7 years agoEverything is flexible except the island. It isn't a question of just wanting one but as physical requirement for functionality. It doesn't matter how pretty a room is if it isn't functional. I got hurt in a car accident and after 5 years and 18 surgical procedures on my back I have to have an island I can customize to my needs because I just can't stand for hours on a hard floor anymore. However, thank you to everyone for shaking me to my senses. Sometimes you just can't shave the corners off to make a square peg fit a round hole. I really do know better. The family business involved every phase of real estate from pour the foundation to warehousing the mortgage loans. Unfortunately the family member that could always get me to move past a mental block has already passed away. I am about to get even with my husband for changing my color scheme that eliminated the sink I wanted. The sink and the island were the two things on my list and I am not about to spend a large amount of money and do the majority of the labor and not get at least one of the things I want. Therefore, there is only one solution.
I can't steal the extra width from the office/library, therefore I have put a call into friend of mine that is a contractor to give me a ballpark price on drying in an addition. I can take it from there. So let's see if I can knock out three birds with one stone. I need a master suite, the deck needs to be replaced AND the kitchen enlarged. The blue line is a possible outside wall location:
When the foundation is poured for the addition, I will have them pour enough for a patio to replace the deck. Then the roof for the addition can also extend to cover the patio. I already have plans for a new deck drawn up so I know where all the plumbing and electrical needs to be for the outdoor living room and kitchen. Here is a closer picture of the available square footage and possible addition:
As for the kitchen, it can be completely gutted and everything moved. I bumped the outside wall out 8 feet but if anybody has a brilliant idea that needs more room the line is easy to adjust. I have one shot at this because I won't change it again other than paint or drapes. Since I will have to make adjustments to the roof line, I should be able to fix the ceiling height. Since any window would open out onto a covered patio, a skylight may not be a bad idea to bring in light. I mainly use upper cabinets for anything I need regularly. Since I can now access all the room I need I will bump the base cabinets up to 30" depths. Necessities in the kitchen:
1. ISLAND
2. Wall Oven (So it can be raised high enough to be easy for me to get things in and out of it. Currently, I have the microwave above the oven.)
3. Door going to the outside (I use it for ventilation and the storm door has a door for the dogs in it.)
4. Dishwasher on right hand side of a 33" double sink.
5. Upper cabinet within reach of the dishwasher for a short person.
6. Enlarge the little bathroom enough for a pedestal sink and have a door that opens into the kitchen (that way there is a restroom available close to the patio for when we have company).
7. 36" Cook top
8. Refrigerator
The room directly below the kitchen used to be a two car garage that somebody closed in but just put carpet down instead of actually putting in a floor with insulation. The floor is about two feet lower than the kitchen floor. I use the 5'x9' closet for a lot of my storage including all the vegetables I can from the garden. I could move the closet to opposite the washer and dryer to create a laundry room/walk in pantry and the current exterior door could be the main entrance.By doing this addition I have to address the entrance from the garage to the kitchen. We normally park the car, walk down the side of the house and go in the sliding glass door right above the kitchen. Having to go around that addition would be a long hike carrying in groceries. After that all the square footage left over can be used for the master suite. I thought about converting the three bedrooms on the main level into a master suite and have all the extra bedrooms downstairs but it is never a great idea to reduce the number of bedrooms if it can be avoided. So I just have to figure out how to get the suite to fit in the space available.
At least this way I can have roughly a 20'x20' bedroom with 10 foot ceilings so it is in scale with the bedroom furniture. Yep, my husband is going to really wish when I showed him the granite slab I wanted that he said, "That looks wonderful dear. Would you like me to go pick up that copper sink for you?"
mama goose_gw zn6OH
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoThat'll teach him. ;)
Here are some plans to start you off,
messy because my Paint program doesn't do diagonals well. I added 2' to
the kitchen in the first plan, but left the sink under the window, and
left the laundry m/l in the current location. It could be flipped with
the over-flow pantry, if it needs to be on an exterior wall, but that
would put it farther from the kitchen. There is a prep sink on the
island, making a nice triangle, but the clean-up sink and DW aren't
close to the DR. I took the entry hall space from the master suite--you
could have the entry door on the outside wall, or have a small sheltered
vestibule, reducing the length of the hall.
In
the second plan, I used your footprint, and switched the sink to the
top wall, overlooking the DR, with the cooktop on the outside wall,
making venting easier. There is no prep sink in the island, which is
only 6' wide, but in both plans there is plenty of room between the sink
and cooktop, for staging, appliances, and prep. You could have a prep
sink, but it would be back-to-back with the clean-up zone. The entry
hall is in the existing former garage, with the pantry off the hall, and
the laundry near the exterior kitchen door. The entry has a small
covered roof. The door swing on the kitchen entry can be switched to open inside, if that's against code for your area.A
third option, keeping the laundry in the same general location, with
the entry in the existing garage room, and the over-flow pantry in the middle. I
don't know how much of the former garage you want to preserve:
All plans have the powder room door off the kitchen--I wouldn't have it opening directly into the kitchen. ETA, pantry and laundry flipped, entry through new master space:
slake2000 thanked mama goose_gw zn6OHslake2000
7 years agoI married a smart man. When I told him what I was about to do he replied, "Yes dear. Whatever you want. Not a problem." So, I still have some tweaking to do on the bedroom but the kitchen is starting to come together.
On the island the upper part is at counter top height and the lower half is at table level. For what that island is about to cost, it better be able to whistle Dixie. lol. Here is a closer view of the kitchen:
Thank you to all of you. I am still moving slow but at least I am finally starting to get the elements put together.
mama goose_gw zn6OH
7 years agolast modified: 7 years agoWow!!! I was thinking the remainder of the garage room would make a good exercise room, craft room, or office, but walk-in closets are so much better. ;)
I forgot to mention it on the plans I posted, but if you look in the top right corner, under the word 'dishes' is a little white thing that's supposed to be a stool for the cook, to use in the prep area. I put in the stool instead of a corner susan (similar to mushcreek's), but it could be anywhere in the prep area.
mushcreek's corner prep space:
Kitchen reveal
slake2000 thanked mama goose_gw zn6OHslake2000
7 years agoGreat minds think alike. The little circles on either side of the island are stools tucked under the over hang. One next to the stove for the cook and the other for whoever is sitting in the kitchen talking to the cook.
Since the two halves of the island are different heights, on the low side I am going to put little drawers in the gap for the pieces I need all the time.
I am going to put the pull out trash cans in the island but on the high side. I have gotten in the habit of when I am doing prep I put a plastic grocery bag on the counter to put the trash in. Then when I am done I can tie it closed and it can go directly outside so there is nothing to become smelly or leak in my trash can.
The garage used to be the craft room but I am moving that to one of the bedrooms. The exercise room is downstairs. I can't believe I am adding square footage but the layouts in the mid to late 70's left a lot to be desired. We have been looking at the one section but here is the whole house with the detached garage that has about another 2,000 square feet in it. The garage sold the house because it was already set up as a woodworking shop in the big section on the far right.
Then there is a full walkout basement:
I have plenty to keep me busy for a long time. If the house isn't enough, the garden is always calling my name. Below is the picture showing the garden so you can understand why the island for canning vegetables is a necessity instead of a luxury:
Well, back to work on tweaking the plans so I can get a preliminary layout to the contractor.
cpartist