Single stage vs. Two stage, worth it? My head hurts-help!
simplifyingmylife
8 years ago
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tigerdunes
8 years agosimplifyingmylife
8 years agoRelated Discussions
Single Stage v. Two-Stage Furnace for Mild Climates?
Comments (12)neoheatpump - he lives in N CA in 1000 sq feet - do you really think a 2 stage furnace makes sense? OP - Your heat load is hard to determine because you may have zero insulation and a window open all the time. Probably not but impossible to say without more info. Since your heat load is hard to determine, it is hard to say if you can even have a 2 stage furnace that makes sense. I know around here, when it is 60 degrees out, I don't need heat. In most cold climates, you don't need heat at that outside temp. Solar and internal heat gains give you well over 10 degrees in an insulated, tight house. I'll guess that you have a leaky older house. Your best bang for your buck is to tighten the house. A 95% furnace is overkill for your climate and size house. I would guesstimate that for your situation, you'd probably need $200 a year in gas. A 95% furnace might save you $10 a year over a 90 and $30 over a 80. Very hard to get that to pay off when you pay $1000 extra for it (or more). If you need more gas than that for heat, then you would be better off insulating the house better. My political rant here is that CA is so stupid sometimes. You would do better for the environment by having a heat pump. It would be more efficient in every way than using NG to heat in a mild climate. But you have tiered electric rates that discourage your best option. All they have to do is relax the tier in the winter for heat pumps. Lots of places have lower electric rates for homes with heat pumps - around here we just have lower electric rates in the winter (to encourage heat pumps). Rant off - if you stay in lower electric rates, a heat pump will be cheaper to run. With the typical $.10 a kwh and $1 a therm, at mild temps a heat pump will be half the cost of NG or less. It will cost more however and may not pay off but is a better deal than a 95% furnace (compared to your most cost effective 80% or 90%). Rant back on - does CA mandate 95% furnaces? It would be far more effective to outlaw SUVs or mandate hybrids.......See MoreTwo stage furnace with ECM vs single stage furnace
Comments (58)Thanks for the comments tigerdunes. We've been over this quite a bit already. The pricing is average for the North East....labor rates tend to be quite high and the $600 rebate makes the price of the furnaces excellent. I obviously have two stage thermostats and the sizes of the furnaces were decided after heat loss calculations. I live in an older home in a cold climate and my calculations were within 10% of my contractor's. The calculation for my two floor unit came in at 75kBTUs. The contractor initially wanted to install a 100kBTU unit, but I talked him down to 80kBTU. The furnace for the renters below me is a bit large, but it was the smallest two stage available from American Standard. I thought about installing a 92% efficient 40kBTU single stage furnace with selectable motor speed, but as the 60kBTU two stage with variable speed motor was the same price after the rebate I went with that one.so that both furnaces essentially the same and to get the variable speed blower. I imagine having the second stage will also be nice on very cold mornings....See More14 seer singel stage Vs 16 seer two stage.
Comments (22)I realize this is single stage vs. two stage thread. My goal in stating what I stated was to show there is a realm above 2 stage, more or less as well as to show there are differences from one manufacturer from another. It wasn't my purpose to hijack a thread. There are those out there that say 2 speed equipment is unnecessary... so why would manufacturers make 5 stage equipment and variable speed equipment on top of an already unnecessary system? Many times in the field I've heard of people saying 'I don't want to gold plate anything'. Part of my response was geared to show that 2 stage systems these days are middle tier systems. People change homes so much: yes, this is why my job can be really challenging. Many times it's not replacing a whole system (which would be required to go to a 2 stage machine... in most cases*). Many times my job involves retro fit decisions. Replacing one or two pieces of an older system. In situations like that it's more about repairing the existing system and give a homeowner a solution they want. If I find out a home owner is only planning to stay in the home a few short years I rarely if ever even offer the 2 stage equipment. 2 Stage equipment is for those of you looking to stay in the home for at least a decade or longer. HVAC is not a one size fits all market. I am more likely to repair an existing system in some fashion than to replace. But replacement in some cases is the better option regardless of how long you plan to live in the home. If you live in my climate (Katy, Texas), you will have a tough time to sell a home without a functioning AC system....See MoreTwo-Stage Furnace vs. One-Stage Furnace in 1800 sq ft Chicago ranch
Comments (9)Two stage furnace isn't any more prone to breaking than a single stage. The difference between 2 stage and single stage? Gas valve has two different modes of operation. One is partially open, the other is full open. Both types of gas valves would have similar lifespans. There isn't anything more overly complex with a two stage gas valve. Cost to replace 2 stage gas valve out of warranty would be marginally higher, but by then you'll likely be in the market for a new one anyway. gas valves are probably one of the most reliable parts to a furnace at least in my experience. Provided of course the installation is performed properly. If you get garbage in the gas line, you can't expect the gas valve to work can you? You're in an extreme heating market (Chicago) so naturally it will seem like you're always having to do something to that furnace. The more you use something, the more it is likely to break, need maintenance etc. I doubt you will see much difference in repair cost vs a single stage furnace....See MoreHVAC Consulting
8 years agosimplifyingmylife
8 years agosimplifyingmylife
8 years agotigerdunes
8 years agosimplifyingmylife
8 years ago
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