- If I make a "big batch" of 5-1-1 as stated in the intro to the
Container Soils thread, and screen it properly, roughly how many cu. ft.
should I expect to end up with? I can see that this is very much
dependent upon the material I start with, but even a ballpark estimate
would help me as I've never made it before. I'm lucky enough to have sources for bark in the ideal size range. I usually use a 3 cu ft bag of bark + 5 gallons each of peat and coarse perlite and an appropriate amount of dolomitic lime and end up with about 4-1/4 - 4-1/2 cu ft of soil. A 2 cu ft bag of bark + a scant 4 gallons ea of peat and perlite yields about 3 cu ft.

- Any ideas regarding amending the original recipe to better suit my needs? Using unscreened Turface or stable calcined DE instead of perlite increases water retention with little or no sacrifice in aeration.

- 5-1-1 is great because it drains. Smartpots are great because they
drain. But is that going to cause problems in an arid spot like mine?
Assuming the answer is something along the lines of DUH YES, what
should I consider for fixes? Bigger pots? Different pots? Bigger pots and soils that drain well enough to negate the potential for over-potting are always a good thing (from the plant's perspective). If you suspect you're over-potted, use a wick temporarily until the planting matures a bit and roots have colonized the entire soil mass. Some growers thing having to water more than once a week is worse than torture, but your plants love it. You decide what's best, but don't let anyone tell you there's no price to be paid for watering intervals measured in weeks as opposed to 1 or 3 day intervals. My preference has me thinking that if plants are going 3 days between waterings while they're growing well, the soil is heavier than it needs to be and I'm losing potential. In winter, I sort of expect longer intervals because my basement grow area is cooler and dimmer than ideal, by quite a bit.

- I've got seedlings going for various chilies and small tomatoes,
with five varieties of the former and three of the latter in 2" pots of
;( bagged starter mix. If I'm lucky enough to have all of them thrive
until transplanting, should I expect issues in getting them to take in
5-1-1? I haven't had issues, but you CAN separate some soil and add an extra measure of peat, vermiculite, or Turface/calcined DE to it and use it to top off the main soil mass in the pots and plant the seedlings into that. Water doesn't perch above a different substrate unless the particles in the lower layer are about 2.1X the size of the particles above.

I hope that helped, Wyatt. Welcome to the forum!

Al

Al, it is a great pleasure to be here. I'd say "more than you know," but given that you tend us as tirelessly as you do your botanical herd I think you must derive as much pleasure from the forum as anyone!

Thank you for the estimate of what I'll end up with, volume-wise, from a Big Batch. Given the number and scale of nurseries in the area I'm hoping to find decent materials to work with, and so I expect that a yield somewhat close to yours is possible. Fingers crossed!

Ditto the recommendation of Turface/Calcined DE. I've seen you make that recommendation before (and I'll heed it!), and so I apologize for not phrasing my question better. What I'm particularly worried about is losing moisture from all surfaces of the media. It's entirely possible that I'm overthinking this, but it seems that instead of just having the top side of the mix fully exposed to the air as in a "normal" pot, these will allow for a bunch more evaporation out the sides as well.

- Is this a valid concern? Enough to either switch to standard pots instead, or increase the ratio of calcined products even further?

- And just out of curiosity, if the unscreened Turface/DE doesn't affect aeration why do you (seemingly) prefer perlite? Cost- or weight-related?

I hadn't even considered the issue of over-potting, which should give everyone a great illustration of my ignorance. Correct me if I'm off-track, but you're saying that even with young plants that won't immediately colonize the entire pot, I shouldn't be shy about watering? I'll likely fall into an every-third-day rhythm if the plants dig it, so I won't be one of Those Folks who withhold the water. But I hadn't given a single thought as to adjusting the volume I provide, though I'm sure the first time I picked up the watering can the lightbulb would've popped on. Regardless, this presents a few more questions.

- Should I water based on the volume of the media with 5-1-1, or should I water based on the size of the plant? This somehow feels like I might be wandering into a philosophical battle, but I'm sure you have firm answer so I'm asking anyway!

- Would you recommend the seedlings in an intermediate pot before they go into their final 15gal homes?

Thanks for all the detailed and thoughtful answers! I apologize that they beget further questions but I suppose that's the name of the game. Thanks too for bearing with my somewhat slow response. My work schedule is highly irregular and my computer time follows in suit. It's a bummer, except on the short days!

>W

Even though I don't use 5:1:1 and no longer grow chilis or tomatoes, I found this discussion thoughtful and interesting. =)

You're definitely asking the right questions, Wyatt, and it's clear that you've taken the time to familiarize yourself with the wealth of info that's available here in the Container Gardening forum (much, to his credit, from Al). As usual, he's done a very thorough job of answering your questions, but, since I have some experience growing tomatoes (and other fruits and vegetables) in fabric pots, I thought I'd add my two cents. In short, the combination of Al's 5-1-1 mix and porous fabric pots proved to be difficult for me to manage in our hot and, often, dry summers here in NC. For large indeterminate tomato varieties in 15-20 gallon fabric pots (even after substituting DE for perlite), I've found that I absolutely must water every two to three days (usually two) when temps are in the upper 80s and 90s or risk the mix drying out to the point of becoming difficult to rewet. I really like growing in fabric pots, so I've been gradually modifying the ingredients and proportions of my potting mix in an effort to mitigate this somewhat, but it's an ongoing experiment. In the end, I very well might switch back to plastic pots for annual fruits and vegetables, where my experience with the 5-1-1 mix has been very favorable.

This was just what I needed! Go, gardenweb!

Great thread. Fabric pots were awful for me, and quick draining soil meant dead dried out plants.

I grow a small Tabasco pepper tree in fifty gallons of soil. Im sickly and live alone. I was in the hospital for a week and came home to a pot full of peppers.

It was nice not lose everything. Mostly lost seedlings in tiny seed pots.