In case it is useful, I highlighted the area of the house that is existing. I added in a few things like the entrance to the kitchen being 34 inches and the north/east orientation.

Thanks mama goose. You are awesome. It looks like the aisles as drawn are 36 inches, assuming the scale on my monitor is right. I checked it against some of the other measurements that I know for sure and it seems right.

One thing I should have mentioned is that we have 10 foot ceilings. I didn't realize plans didn't show uppers, but I was planning on having uppers along the south and west walls. I want cabinets to go all the way to the ceiling because I can't take the dust that ends up on the top of our current cabinets. We have lots of dishes/trays etc. that we use only for entertaining, so it doesn't bother me to have a second row of uppers that are a little hard to get to for things like that.

I hadn't thought of moving the sink even farther down the east wall. I was initially loving the idea and thought it made great sense for the reasons you mention. But we do use our dining room a fair amount and I wonder if it would get annoying to have to go all the way around the island to clean up. We will probably use the dining room less once we get the family room off the back, but I'm just not certain about that. The other thing is that it seems like 36 inch aisles are the bare minimum so would moving the fridge to the west wall limit me to french door?

Love the landing area by the ovens. One other design element that I am considering is that I think I want a framed in pantry closet, rather than cabinetry, for the sole purpose of reusing some of the old doors taken from other areas of our house by previous owners. We have several narrow doors (about 24 inches I'd guess, but I'm not home at the moment to check), that I was originally contemplating putting side by side opening to the center, but now I'm thinking of reusing our current original back door that has a window in the upper third, and turning the window into a chalkboard. It's possible both of those ideas are totally crazy, but I liked the idea of tying it to the other doors on the first floor. Kind of like the pantry door here, but with chalkboard instead of frosted glass.

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Do you need island seating when the table is so close? It looks like you won't have much walking room between the island stools and the table chairs, especially if someone is sitting at one or the other. (If people are sitting at both, it looks like they'd be almost back to back.) Look at the NKBA guidelines linked above, #8 Traffic Clearance at Seating.

I like the idea of reusing your old doors!

Thanks Chicagoans. I think I will want a table of some sort somewhere in the kitchen or family room, but not nearly as big as drawn in the plans. I'm not at all wed to having it where indicated, and we specifically don't want a built in booth/bench because I don't want to be locked to using any particular area for a table. I'm open to any and all ideas, and was thinking if we end up putting a table where currently drawn, I might use a bench on the wall side to save space.

I'm in Chicago also, so if you have any recommendations for any suppliers or even contractors I'd love to get them! Particularly GCs and cabinet makers.

I love the idea of using the old doors. I love an old house.

Like you, I'm having any upper cabinets go to the ceiling and our ceilings will also be 10'. I can't stand the dirt and grime above cabinets either.

I would make the seating in the kitchen into banquet seating so the north wall becomes a built in seat. That will give you extra room between the table and the island.

Looking at the kitchen, I'm wondering if you should flip it to the north with the seating on the south. I say that because now all the seating can look into the bathroom. By flipping it, you'll avoid the guests looking towards the bathroom door.

Regarding the fridge; my feeling is you'll be using the family room/kitchen/breakfast room more than the dining room, so I'd prefer the fridge closer to the family room the way you had it.

I was trying to get the clean-up zone out of the middle of the kitchen, and the existing southwest wall is too short, IMO, but if you put the sink up against the corner, it looks as if it just fits. Sink vs. fridge is 'six of one--half a dozen of the other.' Just depends
on which one you'd rather have on the end closer to the DR. Or you could keep the corner sink (in red) since you already have plumbing there. Here's a version with the ovens next to the fridge in the original location, and a framed pantry.

But both of the plans I posted would work better with aisles that are at least 42", and 48" would be much better. I think you need to reconsider the depth of the island.

Can you post the plan with measurements please?

Thanks - I'm going to have my husband help me figure out measurements tonight and I'll try to post them tomorrow. Architect is out of town this week and so I can't get more detail from her at the moment, but I'm having some trouble getting the measurements to tie. She got us these quickly as a first draft so we'd have a starting point before she left, and I'm not sure everything is exactly right (now that I look closely, it looks like she marked a 42 inch range in the drawing which doesn't even seem to be a thing).

If I use the 25' lot line as my base for the 1/4" = 1 ft key on the drawings, and measure from cabinet to cabinet instead of countertop to countertop, I take it back and think the aisles are 41-42" instead of the 36" I previously thought.

What would your thought be on just moving the island north 6 inches? The center entrance is unfortunately kind of bossy and inconvenient so I don't know if moving the island even more would even worse for flow or leave the area where the table is drawn as unusable.

That's better news. The island looks deeper than it needs to be, too, but I've been fooled before, just comparing sizes on a drawing. You need a minimum of 40-41", which would include 24" cabinets, 1-2" overhang on the working side, and minimum of 15" on the seating side.

Can you give up one of the seats on the side? Or have an overhang on both sides, and keep the stool near the DW in this plan tucked under when not in use?

Again, I would switch the kitchen so the table is on the south wall and the kitchen itself is on the north and west wall. As stated, now all the diners have a view to the bathroom. By switching the working part of the kitchen to the north, the view will instead be to the study wall.

Some
of the diners will get a peripheral view of the bathroom door, or possibly
the shower door. At any rate, here's the flipped plan. It does solve
the problem of the fridge blocking the light from the window on the
south wall, but with upper cabinets on the north wall, there are no
windows on that side. (Unless you are planning to put windows on each side of the FP.) Uppers could be omitted in favor of a window on each side of the hood (I
love that look) or, you could use backsplash windows, which would let in light--since there
are no views on that side as well, you don't need full view windows.
Having the fridge there detracts somewhat from the fireplace as focal
point--although that wouldn't stop me from flipping the plan if it
provided better function.

Where do you bring in groceries?

GW stacked cabinets.

GW discussions--10' kitchen ceilings.

Here is my old back door that I repurposed as a pantry door. It's a focal point in the kitchen. I'm glad I did it.

Note that I used a dropped soffit arrangement to eliminate the dust issue. Much less expensive than multiple wall cabinets.

Thanks homechef. Your kitchen looks amazing and I'm glad to see the repurposed door in practice.

Cpartist, you raise a good point on the view of the bathroom that I hadn't thought of before. I tested it out last night, and because the bathroom door is 14 inches south of the kitchen entrance (and we have a small original 24 inch door on it), the bathroom ends up not being very visible from the kitchen. On the plans as drawn, only the first seat in the northwest corner of the table has a view of the bathroom, and it's just part of the shower wall. We are also in the habit of keeping the bathroom door shut to keep little kids out. So I think I'm ok leaving the seating area along the north wall. I also suspect because we are only 12" from the lot line on the north side, it is going to be a lot easier (and maybe required) to keep vents and things along the south wall. All water and gas in the house currently is along the south side.

Here is a marked up version where I added some additional measurements. Not indicated in the picture, but there are 4.5 inch moldings around the kitchen entrance on the south wall, which cuts into some useable space on each side of the opening.

Mama goose -we can definitely give up a seat on the island. I guess ideally we'd have 5 because we have 5 people in our family, but as long as I had 3 for the kids I'd be ok. Currently we find it easiest to bring in our groceries through the front door because we are only a couple of feet off the sidewalk and parking is easy. With the new addition and mudroom at street level, the backyard and garage are going to be much more accessible than they are currently, but I could still see it going either way. It will closer to bring in from the back of the house, but often our garage is cluttered with bikes and strollers so we tend to only park one car in the garage and other in the street. But from the mudroom, the stairs up to family room will be on the south side, which I think tends in favors of keeping kitchen on south wall as well.

I'm going to look for some pictures that will be similar to our mudroom setup half a level below the family room because I think it will help orient the space.

I'm in Chicago also, so if you have any recommendations for any suppliers or even contractors I'd love to get them! Particularly GCs and cabinet makers.

Well hello fellow Chicagoan! (I'm in Clarendon Hills, western suburb next to Hinsdale; love the area and my neighbors.) And what's with our crappy weather today?!

Anyway, I used Northstar Cabinets for a big reno: kitchen, mudroom, and 4 bathrooms. All custom sizing (all are 39" high - we're tall) and I thought very reasonable. However that was 7+ years ago, almost 8, so I can't speak to how they are now but I've been very happy. Walter was our guy. They're in Posen so a lot less pricey than places closer to me.

A dear friend is a designer and has had good experiences with Brakur. However, I think her main contact there went to a competing firm, name I can't remember. Anyway, Brakur is worth a try. and she's an excellent designer / KD with reasonable pricing if you want a contact.

My GCs were Collins and Sarsfield. Great guys to work with. Pete Collins lives in Clarendon Hills and does a lot of local work... strong interest in keeping clients happy since we all know him and his family. (If you contact them feel free to tell them (or Mary Ann, the designer) Katie M recommended them. Walter the cabinet guy likely won't remember me.)

Thanks so much Chicagoans. Going to put them on my list of people to call!

Thanks for all the help so far. Work and life have been busy for the last week so I've neglected my kitchen plans, but my architect is back in town and we are meeting with her next Tuesday so I am back on it today.

A couple of new thoughts/developments since I last posted after looking at appliances and considering the input of my husband (which I do actually do occasionally, especially on kitchen stuff as he is the more frequent cook!).

- instead of double ovens and cooktop, we will likely get a 36" inch range and a speed oven/microwave mounted somewhere on the lower cabinets (I like the 24" Miele, but all others seem to be 30" wide so may go with another brand like GE just to make any future replacement more likely to go with existing cabinets).

- on northwest wall we are now considering a 24" or so cabinet with drawers that we can use as a landing area for junk drawer type stuff and maybe a glass cabinet above so we could use it as a bar area for parties. Then the rest of that wall will be a framed in cabinet. I want to install a countertop at regular height (see inspiration picture below) that we might keep a regular microwave on, soda stream etc, and then have room for (non-built in) bar fridge below if we find we need extra cold storage. I think the closet itself probably needs to come out at least 36" inches from the wall to give a little space between the countertop and door, but I plan to use 2 of my 24" doors opening to each other on this closet so the opening will be wide.

- I am getting a free built in 15" ice maker from my work. After debating keeping it in the basement, I think I want it in the kitchen (it's nice) because we use a lot of ice.

- We will then install a insta hot/filtered cold faucet on the sink, which has me wondering if then we will want a separate prep sink near the icemaker for people getting water (we drink A LOT of ice water in our family). I forget if it was mamagoose or someone else on another thread that suggested the idea of a corner prep sink, but that kind of appeals to me because that is where our current sink is and while I don't want it for my main sink anymore I think it makes good use of space I'd probably under use otherwise.

So given all that, does anyone have any suggestions for me before we meet with the architect. I'm still unclear in my own mind what the arrangement of major appliances should be.

Here's my pantry idea picture (although this looks deeper than I am envisioning).

deme68 · More Info

Here's my existing plans with some additional measurements.

Also, what programs do you all use to do these amazing mock ups? I'm just marking on the pdf we got from the architect, but I'd like to be able to manipulate the individual elements myself (assuming my poor technological skills could figure it out).