Squash Caserole, Sum and Substance, Key West, Paradigm all do well in full sun in upstate NY zone5b.

I have Sum and Substance coming from Hallsons this spring, so that is probably where it should go. Last year, I put a Squash Casserole in that bed, but I had to move it out by the end of the summer. It was struggling, but it was a very small plant. I will be amazed if it even comes back this year.

Its a pretty big spot, so I think I can put three hosta there. thank you for the suggestions

My Brother Stefan, September Sun, Yesterday's Memories, June and Fragrant Fire are all adjusted to a lot of sun, and doing well here in Northern Colorado.

I've had great luck with Squash Casserole in Dallas, Texas in the sun. Moccasin had good luck with it in the sun in Mobile, Alabama. Mine was a good size from day 1, though. I got it from Hallson's in the early spring and put it in a sunny spot the first year. Next to it, I melted Elegans. Paul's Glory held up well as did Cathedral Windows.

I had a Sum and Substance that I kept in full Florida sun until it turned gold. It rewarded me the next year by looking even better.

I have a shady lot so no suggestions growing a hosta in full sun but I have an idea for you...plant a pretty shrub to protect the hostas...why not use that area for sun plants instead of hostas?

Different people and different experiences. I had Sum and Substance in full sun and it fried in mid June every year. I moved it to half day sun and its perfect. The closest I have to a hosta in full sun now is Paul's Glory and Dancing Queen. Both made it through the long days of June without browning but were terribly faded and starting to brown by the end of the summer. I'd buy a small tree.

I planted a little Cathedral Windows last summer in full sun and it probably quadrupled in size. I did give it plenty of water. This year I plan to divide and relocate it.

To the above I would add Winter Snow, Stained Glass, Fragrant Bouquet & Fragrant Dream.

Just a quick comment, I'll try to give you a more specific list at some point. The Plantaginea family not only tolerates sun, they do better in sun than they do in shade, and will bloom more prolifically in lots of sun. There are a great many hostas that will do just fine in full sun, but the key is to provide lots of water, and keep the plants mulched. Some varieties will look a little stressed the first year, but by the second year should be fine. Young plants will adapt more quickly than mature plants, but even mature plants will adapt in a year or two.

Thank you all! Just what I was looking for, great ideas.

Don, I already have a September Sun in another part of that bed. It is indestructible. As a last resort, I could move it. The spot I am trying to fill is more prominent. Yesterdays Memories is also on my order from Hallsons for this spring. But if I do the Sum and Substance there, would they look good together?

Bkay, I think my Squash Casserole was just too tiny. One of my orders last year, from someone new, was just several very small plants. Nothing did well. Cathedral Windows would be good, Windy also recommended it, so it obviously does well in sun.

Nicholsworth and Bev, I have already done just that. I added a Hydrangea bush, and planted an Ivory Silk Lilac tree nearby, hoping for some shade. In a couple of years, I should have a little shade. I have also planted some other sun perennials.

So, if I go with the Sum and Substance, which other two do you think would look good color wise? I am not very good with visualizing things. Which is why I move things, a lot.

Thanks so much. I appreciate all your input.

Oh, peren, your post showed up while I was typing....I also have a Winter Snow on my spring order. Now the question is what looks good with Sum and Substance.

Jamie, as you have discovered hosta with thicker leaves and darker hosta are best suited for shade as the only color a hosta leaf gets is from chlorophyll. The more chlorophyll the less sunlight needed. Dark colors absorb light and heat up more as well.

Hosta with thinner leaves transpire more easily and lighter greens or those with more variegation (edge or center) have less chlorophyll which allows them to do well with more sun.

Fragrants; Avocado, Fragrant Bouquet, Cathedral Windows, Guacamole etc., etc., etc. do better in hotter/sunnier climates as their parentage is warmer sunnier climes..

Your full sun in 4b is less than a 5,6 or 7..... so I would think you would have a large group to choose from. Hosta that I have in the most sun (no full sun anywhere at my house (who has all this full sun?). Hosta that I have in the most sun that do well are S&S, June, Patriot, Minuteman and between two Great Expectations the one getting the most sun is bigger (Same with June).

I think you should have a pretty good choice.

Good luck,

Jon

Jamie:

Plantaginea is in full sun here in southern Ontario and it handles it well. I also have Orange Marmalade in full sun and Paradigm as well as Sun Power.

Transitioning can be hard. I am always pushing trying to find those that do well in more sun without having them all same.

Barb

To those mentioned, I'd add Inniswood.

tj

I think that Sum and Substance, Cathedral Windows and Plantaginea would be a striking trio. In my neighbourhood it is common to see 3 or more S&S together in distinct clumps towards the end of the driveway.

Great photos, McTavish, much easier to see how coloration can change in sun than to try to describe it. Many hostas will grow in full sun, but change their colors, sometimes enough to be unrecognizable. Montana Aureomarginata is a good example, it will take sun, but turns a soft green with parchment edges. Great Expectations will have a much lighter center. Obsession, normally a very dark green, thrives in full sun, but turns into a not particularly attractive faded olive/chartreuse color. Blue Angel does come up blue, but quickly becomes a deep green.

Cathedral Windows clearly is a variety that will have drastically different colors depending on light level. Oddly enough, Stained Glass, a close relative of CW, retains its bright coloring in full sun, as does Fried Bananas.

The leaves of hostas grown in sun will generally be smaller than the leaves of the same variety grown in shade. There are exceptions, Montana Aureomarginata will have roughly the same size leaf in sun or shade, same with GE.But if huge leaves are what you are looking for, look in the shade.

A great many miniature hostas will absolutely thrive in full sun, and seem to hold their coloring better than some of the larger varieties. I'll post a list of some of the better sun loving minis later. One of the best is Allan P. McConnell, which quickly clumps up into a plant about 12 inches tall and 16-20 inches across, but retains it's small leaf size, and looks crisp and neat all summer long.

Cathedral Windows is a mesmerizing hosta grown in a lot of sun. It takes on a burnished gold colour that is so lustrous. I took many photos of this one last year. I highly recommend this with S&S - it can hold its own against the size of S&S simply with its dazzle!

Mctavish, wow that is quite a difference. Cathedral Windows loses a lot of its appeal in full sun. I think I will stay away from that.

Several of you suggested Plantaginea, and it sounds like that does well in sun. I know it has great flowers, but I'm not sure I'm a fan. Of course, I have never actually seen one.

Paradigm is one I was thinking of ordering anyway. I have seen several posts from people in MN who have good luck with it.

Dhaven, I never thought of minis. I guess I always figured they would be the most fragile. I'm surprised they would do well in sun. Love to see your suggestions.

What about Fragrant Bouquet? Jon suggested that, and I actually bought one last summer. Its in my "what am I going to do with these" garden. Have any of you had that in a lot of sun?

Thank you all so much. I love planning gardens at this time of year. It's March 1st, so even in MN, spring can't be far away. Well, actually sometimes we get our worst storms in March, but I am trying to be optimistic.

Jo, what a difference between your Cathedral Windows and the one McTavish posted! Yours still has beautiful color. I guess it depends on where you are located, but you wouldn't think there would be that much difference between the two of you.

Now you've really got me confused. (thats not very hard to do)

I guess the only way to know, is to give it a try. I am forever moving hosta. It drives my husband nuts. He has learned not to ask why I am doing it. He never likes my answer.

You will like Plantaginea when it blooms. The flowers are 4 inches long and extremely fragrant. The hummingbirds adore Plantaginea and other large, fragrant hosta flowers, especially Fried Bananas.

It is generally thought that most hostas with very large, very fragrant flowers have Plantaginea in their background somewhere. Many have come through Fragrant Bouquet. In addition to Cathedral Windows, consider Guacamole, Stained Glass, Avocado, Fried Bananas, and Holy Moly among others. Cathedral Windows is a variety that has quite a range of coloring out of tissue culture starts. It is possible that the two different plants pictured are genetically slightly different, and react differently to more sun. Note that Josephine's gorgeous specimen gets 7 hours of sun a day, rather than full sun.

I actually have a Holy Mole growing in almost all sun. I forgot all about it. I have to move it anyway since I didn't give it enough room when I planted it.....so, it might as well go there. I'm sure you are right about Plantaginea. Everyone seems to love it.

I would still like to hear about sun lovin minis tho when you have a chance.

Some of the toughest, hardiest hostas are minis. There are of course quite a number of minis that are not good growers, and quite a few more that will be small to medium at maturity, even though they are sold as minis. But most minis are very good growers, and don't require any special treatment. Mine are all planted and then left to fend for themselves, and they do just fine.

Here is a list of some of the minis I grow in full sun. There are a great many more that get half sun or more, but these will all take full sun and thrive: Blue Cadet, Blue Boy, Tiny Tears, Hime, Venusta, Baby Bunting, Purple Lady Fingers, Little Wonder, Kifukurin Ko Mame, Blue Mouse Ears, Green Mouse Ears, Emerald Gem, Estrellita, Gracillima, Lemon Lime, Twist of Lime, Feather Boa, O'Harra, Ops, Allan P. McConnell, Tot Tot, Saishu Jima. Also the following Lakesides: Neat Petite (grows like a weed in full sun), Baby Face, Downsized, Dot Com, Lime Time, Little Gem, and Zinger.

Another excellent hosta for sun is Camelot, considered a medium, and the leaves are probably too large for mini status, but it stays low to the ground. It breaks all the rules about what does well in the sun, it's got very thick substance and it's blue, and it stays blue most of the summer. Not widely available, but a terrific hosta and worth seeking out.

Thank you. It will take me awhile, but I will look them up. I know nothing about the smaller hosta. I appreciate you taking the time to list them all..

I have more sun than I know what to do with now.

If it has been mentioned and I missed it I apologize........But what about Sun Power?

Toy, I have been trying to grow Sun Power in another part of my yard for the last three years. It looks pretty much like the day it was planted. Right now, its in sun from about noon on, so I don't think it would do better in full sun. It always looks so nice in other peoples gardens. Not sure if its the plant or where its planted.

Great info dhaven, thanks.

Jamie, this ought to make you laugh.....see that little plant under my Cathedral Windows? That is Sun Power! I swear it has something against me, lol. It has been over three years but I think it is finally accepting that it will live in my garden. Maybe it will be happy this season, who knows?

I thought I wanted Sun Power for a sunny location, but now I'm thinking I'll go with Dancing Queen.

Thanks Jo, nice to know I am not alone. Misery loves company I guess. I am wondering if mine will even show up this year. If it doesn't I don't think I will try again.

I think mine hates me too.....

There might be another aspect to this full sun question. Jo's Cathedral Windows certainly has more color than mine ever did. Is that because her garden is southeast facing and loses sun by five or so in the evening? My garden in the pictures above is west facing and gets sun from mid afternoon on. It's very hot, we are on the side of a hill and the garden is exposed until after nine when the sun goes down.

In my picture above with Cathedral Windows and Stetson there is a small pointy light green plant between them. That is Plantaginea. It is ten years old. It has never done anything for me and never produces a flower. I assumed that it was because we have a shorter growing season in 4b.

Meanwhile I definitely recommend Fragrant Bouquet. The color doesn't wash out in full sun and it does flower. Here is a picture of it on the other side of Stetson (shown above in my first picture). I still don't know why Stetson manages to keep it's dark green color while others don't?

PS. I'd also recommend Frozen Margarita from the same family. It is sort of a grandchild from Fragrant Bouquet. It is lime green compared to apple green of Fragrant Bouquet . It also doesn't have wax so is shiny.

Sounds like Josephine's Sun Power and McTavish's Plantaginea are non-growers. I suggest digging them up, checking to see if there is any visible problem with the root systems that can be helped (snarled roots, or invasive tree roots, for example), then replant is a shady location in a hole with about a third compost and two thirds dirt, or a third peat moss and two thirds dirt, and if they haven't come around in another year or two, replace them. Some individual hostas are simply not 'good doers', regardless of variety or location. This seems to be a problem more common in tissue culture plants than in those split off from established clumps, but it can happen to any plant.

For those of you having issues with Sun Power, try it's sport Abba Dabba Do, a terrific grower, excellent in sun, readily available, and an outstanding addition to the garden. Or if you can find it, get a Dab A Green, which is the reverse sport of ADD, also a good grower and will take full sun. Not quite as fast to mature as ADD, and will probably mature a bit smaller, but a very beautiful hosta. This one came from Q&Z, and was a very unprepossessing baby hosta (think UGLY), not showing much of any variegation and with a blobby sort of leaf shape. It didn't sell well, and I don't think it was produced again. Some of them wound up in a grocery store nursery sale in my area, and once I found out the parentage, I grabbed up all 6 that they got in. They aren't mature yet, but look better every year.

I'm also partial to Frozen Margarita. I like its bright green apple color.

First year with first bloom -

I moved it to a sunnier location last year.

Mctavish, I think my garden is more like yours than Jo's. It faces southwest, and it doesn't have anything around it anymore, so its in the sun until the sun goes down. I had to laugh about your Plantaginea.....it gives me a reason not to get one. Dhaven almost had me convinced. I love my hummingbirds, but I still think its kind of ugly. But I was very happy to see your Fragrant Bouquet. I just bought it late last summer, it needs a home, so thats where it is going.

I think Sum and Substance, Fragrant Bouquet, and Holy Mole for that spot. I am also going to move Blue Mouse Ears to that area. Its the only mini I own, and right now its in a spot where something larger could live. I did not know it could take full sun.

As for Sun Power, that has me stumped. There are no tree roots in that bed, and the other plants around it, all new the same year are going great guns. I kept thinking it was just a dud plant, but then I remembered where I got it. Its not a little tc, its a division from a friends old Sun Power. Go figure. If it comes back, I will try a different spot, but it might be one for the trash.

Dhaven, I appreciate all the info. I am looking at other minis, and I actually have Abba Dabba Do coming this spring. Nice to know it was a good choice.

Donna, I agree Frozen Margarita is a beauty. Another one for the list.

McTavish, I actually have an angled northeasterly (not true north) sun exposure for Cathedral Windows. It gets sun from sun-up till around 3:00, then as the sun swings around to the front of the house that area is shaded, then around 5:00 it comes back around from the other side as it assumes its westerly setting. I believe that is why there is so much colour to the hosta. There is no area that does not get sun.

In my second last house, I actually had true North exposure at the front - the sun never hit the front door...I had lovely hostas, heucheras and dicentra growing like they were on steroids!

Now as to the Fragrant Bouquet...it gets direct sun (easterly and westerly exposure) from around 11:00 am the entire afternoon including setting sun with no break. The colour is much paler than if it grew in shade. Here's a look at it. I am content with the colour I guess. It was new last year so I will be observing it this year to see if it gets washed out too much from the sun. It remains in a pot and I just rotated it from time to time.

I love the vigour the hostas gain grown in more sun. A couple may get a little singed here and there (like my Plantaginea ) but they end up being more robust. It's a trade-off - vigour for looks but it's getting better each year. Eventually the hostas settle in and burn less and less.

A lot of my hostas take on a golden tone from all that sun - the only "shady" spot I have is on either sides of the house and shade doesn't last that long. The northwest side is the friendliest for hostas here where the heat from the sun is least intensive. Even my eastern exposure has prolonged sun - from sun-up till around 1:30-2:00.

My neighbour in the back was selling her house this past summer. A drone took pictures while I was outdoors at the time. My house is the second one looking from the left - you can see a green/white umbrella in the photo and forsythias lining the driveway. Interesting view...see the shady areas on either sides of house? That's it - that is my shade and my one small tree in back to the right of green/white umbrella. Good old suburbia.

Dhaven, I think my Sun Power was a scrawny liner and it has taken three years for it to grow. Nothing untoward happening at root level - just a lazy hosta. It is in sun and it has definitely grown a bit this past year. It is fuller and leaves are longer. I have hopes it will continue to grow. I can only dream of a large, luscious looking hosta with gorgeous waves like some of those beauties in the Alphabet, sigh.

Very cool perspective pic Josephine.

Reading the comments on Sun Power led me to wonder if this hosta actually prefers part-sun...I checked the various online descriptions and the say "will brighten up any shade location" and the Hosta Library description says "Part Sun to Light Shade". I googled pictures of Sun Power and I don't see sun loving companion plants beside the large specimens. I suspect that it can tolerate sunnier places without looking completely washed out, but looks best and grows best in part sun...

Jo - Just looking at the photo in general, I can tell that a skilled gardener lives in that house! Wow - you clearly must have the lovliest property in the neighborhood!

Yes Jo Fragrant Bouquet is such a great one.

That is quite the perspective indeed and by a drone non the less. We have had people take aerial pics and they have come by with huge framed photos for huge money. We have always passed.

I grew up in a city but I have become completely countrified. I am really torn - part of me thinks that Google maps, aerial photos by plane or drone is awesome and the other part is horrified by the utter lack of privacy.

p.s. I totally agree with windymess!

Agreed peren, but I'm afraid we date ourselves when we talk of privacy LOL.

So true windymess lol!

Windymess and peren.all - thank you for the compliment.

I was gardening that day and am actually in the picture in my pjs.....talk about a surprise when I first heard the sound! I took a photo of it. Never having seen a drone before I didn't know what to make of it. The photo I posted above, among others was available through MLS so I pooched one since my property (and I) was in it, lol.

I took this iPad photo once I realized this was a "camera in the sky", lol.

When I first moved in, it was apparent that I was the only gardener around. We had dandelions galore, weedy lawns, and no gardens...just the odd non-descript shrub here and there.

I am pleased to say that over the years the neighbourhood has improved - 80% less dandelions, greener lawns.....and - more gardens! A few of the houses are rentals so when someone new expresses an interest in my garden, I immediately offer them some of my perennials. (ulterior motive on my part - encourage tenants/residents to enjoy and look after their properties and get into gardening/beautifying their surroundings. It's a win/win.) ;-)

Perhaps one of these days I'll move so I can have more space in which to garden....it is a goal of mine. I'd say that I have close to two to three times more the number of plants than this property can hold.

ConnieMay, you make good points re Sun Power. I wonder if it is a hosta which hates to be moved? I've done that and wonder if that is why it never got bigger -transplant shock perhaps? Not too many hostas I know are divas but there are some that just do not like being disturbed...like GE for instance (in my garden).

Bumping a post from last year, because my crispy Guacamole has made me curious about which hostas not only tolerate sun, but also look good.

Golden Waffles flourishes here in light. King Tut also grows in full light here and never gets burned. Of those recommended, I grew Squash Casserole in sun and it did burn.

I have a smaller area along the southwest corner of my house that gets considerable sun most of the afternoon and really gets blasted with hot Kansas "killer" sun in late afternoon (garden zone 6).

The hosta I have grown successfully in that spot have mostly been named above: in the larger sizes, Cathedral Windows (wonderful coloring); Planteginea (Aprodite, I think); Paradigm; Fragrant Bouquet; Paisley Print; and a really old (and big) unidentified hosta that I'm guessing might be Undulata Albomarginata.

I also have the smaller Rainforest Sunrise (love it) and a couple of the "Mouse" hosta (one is Blue Mouse Ears I think, the other is unknown by has dramatic color contrasts and seems a bit smaller). None of this last group is listed as sun tolerant, but they are growing fine in the same area.

The secret is lots of water. Fragrant Bouquet, especially, will burn on the edges if it gets too dry.

Hope that helps.

Kate