Sounds good.

I am debating between utile and kohler. Which one do you like better and is there a price difference

I visited a bath showroom on Friday to inquire about Kohler Choreograph and Swanstone. They said Kohler is not currently allowing orders for Choreograph. Does anyone know if this is true?

Anna H I think they may have discontinued it since I have noticed the price has dropped and only certain styles are available on various sites.

They have always had a hard time keeping Choreograph available, according to the reports of people here trying to order it. Someone who was on here recently wrote that Kohler has replaced it with a new product. Look for Luxstone.

Just be aware that not all shower walls are created equal. One kind of shower wall that has shown to last a lifetime and still look good is the kind called “solid surface.” The definition for solid surface is that it has the same material through-and-through. So the color is the same all the way through. Another aspect is that there is no surface added to it - no shiny gel coat or anything. If the surface has shine, it is due to the solid surface product being sanded and buffed to a shine. These two things mean that the solid surfaces are easily repairable from any scuff or scratch. Sometimes the homeowner can repair it alone, using scotch brite pads. Other times, a professional can come in and use filler or tools the homeowner may not have. Because the solid surface can be repaired, does not stain easily, does not promote the growth of molds or mildew, and does not build up with soap scum, it makes a wonderful shower. Some names of these products include Corian, Swanstone, Transolid, and probably others. You can purchase them through some big box stores, though there may not even have a display available. But if you ask in the department, they will have materials to look at. Local kitchen and bath showrooms will also have the same arrangement and sometimes have a shower on display. Even when they don’t, ask a salesperson if they sell a solid surface shower. Don’t expect them to know the definition, and ask if it is repairable or if it has a gel coat and if the color goes through the material. Marble-ite and The Onyx Collection are examples of coated showers that are not homeowner repairable. If you plan to live in a home long term, a solid surface shower may be a good choice for you.

Part of my issue is I’m looking for a 60” x 48” low profile shower base which is apparently more difficult to find than I anticipated. Corian has been next to impossible to find, Swanstone doesn’t have that size, Onyx is not full solid surface but makes that size, Kohler could be customized but is not shipping and I just sent an inquiry to Bath1 about Transolid. If anyone has any other ideas, please let me know. Thanks!

Anna H, Grifforms is online and will make you any shape and a whole lot of sizes of Corian pans. Check them out. You can configure your pan and submit it for a price in all of the price ranges of Corian.

Anna -- have you checked out Grifform? They specialize in custom Corian shower pans. Not inexpensive, especially with shipping, but they can likely make whatever you're looking for. I experienced the same frustration as you trying to source Corian locally. And I'm really ticked at the fact that they offer standard size shower pans in other parts of the world but not in the U.S.

https://www.grifform.com

I did price Grifforms but shipping from the pacific northwest to the panhandle of Florida made it not cost effective. I may still get the Corian pan from Palmetto in South Carolina. I was just disappointed that they wouldn’t ship shower walls to me, just the pan and I’m concerned about the color (white) matching. I could do a custom Corian pan from Palmetto and Swanstone walls if their whites are similar. I’ve requested color chips. I loved the feel of the Swanstone. Thanks everyone.

Anna:

Don't worry about Corian panels matching a base please. I've seamed new Corian next to old inconspicuously. I wouldn't say that about all solid surface manufacturers.

Shortly before the stay at home orders, I went to my local Kohler store to look at the various colors available with Choreograph walls. Per the sales associate, all are available except for any discontinued colors, which I believe are noted on their website. However, he did note that some colors are more popular than others (I believe he mentioned the veining ones are pretty popular) and those tend to take a bit to get as they will need to make them. We ended up wanting just plain white (we already have it in a another bathroom) and I was able to get it in about a week as I made sure I ordered from a company that had it in stock.

Please ignore the shower caddy. Not sure why my husband had that in the shower when I took this photo (no longer there). Shower walls are Kohler Choreograph in plain White. Wash cloth hooks and shampoo/soap bar are also from Kohler.

I'm in the midst of planning for all 3 of our bathrooms to be remodeled. I'm not interested in tile/grout, so I'm looking at solid surface. Choreograph is out (too long of a wait) and I'm not looking for a $10K shower. I'm curious that I'm reading several people in this thread saying OnyxCollection is not solid surface (Nancy in Mich?) The Dealer says it is, the website says it is (and lots of other dealer websites say it is). I have the samples and it looks like it is. Our dealer also says that any scratches can be buffed out and there is no gel coat. How can I find out if that is correct?

feronian2, my understanding is that Onyx is solid surface. We had looked at it but had trouble getting a proper quote. The dealer ballparked ours 48"x34" shower at $8K but never sent a written quote. He wanted to sit in the living room and right it up. With COVID I didn't want him all over the house. Just in and out of the bathroom. I really liked their base and was leaning toward Onyx but the base was the wrong dimensions for where our shower hole is. And since we have hydronic in-floor radiant heat I didn't want to mess with trying to move it in case the tubing got damaged.

We ended up getting Swanstone solid surface in white and their web site says scratches can be buffed out. Which is a good thing because I think we got some accidentally during install. We protected the bottom of the base but not the curb well enough and it got scratched up a little.

We are finally putting up the kohler choreograph shower walls in my son‘s bathroom.

The braces were removed today. The rainshower looks crooked as it is still loose so we can finish patching and painting ceiling (as well as other touch up painting in bathroom). I will do that this weekend. Next is quartz on shower curb and then glass shower door and wall. Hopefully all will be done by end of July, depending how long it will take to get the glass as it will need to be custom.

As I mentioned in previous post, we have Kohler Choreograph walls installed in another bathroom for a few years now and love it. Luckily, we never had to wait for the product as we pick a boring unpopular color - white. However, I will say I also always confirmed with vendor that they had the product in-stock.

I am obviously not a photographer as you see part of my iPad cover in the photo, lol, and I am too lazy to go back to my son’s area to retake.

We finally finished the installation of the Kohler Choreograph walls and the accessories, and the bathroom OVERALL, thank goodness. My son christened his remodeled bathroom with a shower last night :). Now just a few decor things to add a pop of color.

I've read almost every post going back 4 years in this thread and I am so grateful to have this resource! We are looking to replace a standard bathtub (pink! complete with tub to ceiling pink tiles!) with a solid surface shower. Question: what are the pros/cons of installing Swanstone on the ceiling Trying to decide if 96" surround walls will be enough or if I should order 1 additional panel for the ceiling. We would like to put a recessed light in the shower, in case that matters.

yes, I did the ceiling with an extra panel in swanstone used glue and braced it up for several days. Oh and yes I installed a wet area light in the middle. About 15years and looked great. Cleans easy having panels on ALL surfaces

I did the ceiling of my shower, too. The product I used was Transolid, not Swanstone, but it the same kind of stuff. In 1994, I was moving into my first house purchased post-divorce. I had put most of my money into the house down payment, asbestos abatement, and replacing the furnace. Then I discovered that the shower surround was not attached to the walls and the wood and drywall behind were all rotted. I had to hire someone to replace the wall studs and rebuild the wall and did not have money left to tile. So, I purchased a wallboard not intended for showers and figured I would replace it in a year or so with proper tile. This stuff looked like tile and had a shiny finish. (I was stupid then, no excuses!) My carpenter fit the panels very well and caused its edges beautifully. I had him do the ceiling, too. I figured with no edge to catch the condensation drips, it would last longer. It was still there (and water tight) 20 years later when I sold it. Yes, I disclosed that it was not intended for shower walls and should be replaced. I believe it lasted so long because no water pooled on the top edge because I had the ceiling done, too.

Look for the DALS shower lights. They need no electrical box behind them and are only as thick as the drywall sheet.

That is my new, 2018 shower in Transolid (not the wallboard non-shower material in my old house from 1994). For some reason, the Houzz app for iPads does not put in the paragraph breaks no matter how I try, so without paragraphs, things can get confusing.

@rureadyinla are You also know the LA area? Did you install yourself or use a contractor?

thequadsqueen... yes I am in los angeles. we attempted to install the walls ourselves and then decided to hire out, lol.

@rureadyinla haha i always think we could diy, then quickly realize we can’t lol. mind if I ask you for your contractor/worker if you were happy with the work? not sure why I can’t message you directly...

thequadsqueen... i just sent you a separate message.

I wanted to share my shower for the discussion of solid surface options. I have Swanstone shower panels with an Onyx Collection low profile shower base and Onyx Collection caddies. The shower is 60” x 48”. The shower was installed this week. I had wanted to do a Corian shower and was not ever able to source it. And I tried everywhere I saw here and even a few places locally and it was not happening. I’m not disappointed. I love the way this turned out and I can’t wait to use it. We opted to pay to have this installed in lieu of DIY.

Just want to say thank you to all who have contributed to this thread. My husband and I LOATHE tile and are planning a master bath remodel with solid surface options. No clue who to contact to install it, since our shower is 5x6' and nothing out-of-the-box fits, but there you go!

Kim HV,

Best of luck with your search. I believe the trick for you will be NOT looking for a kit, but buying the individual panels. For instance, Swanstone has 62" wide panels, or these taller ones, so there go your two side walls. Your contractor will have to fit two 3 ft panels together for the back wall. So there will be a seam filled with caulking there. They sell the corner moldings in their Accessories page, but no "T" molding for a straight seam.

You can check with Corian and see if they have one.

Swanstone does not sell a shower pan larger than 36 x 60, but there is a place online, Grifform, that sells Corain made-to-order pans. See if they will make one your size.

You will be able to do this. All it takes is money. Lots of money. I was planning on using Swanstone for my shower before I found the Transolid it, so I am familiar with their products. Check out Corian. You can also try calling Transolid and talk with their rep. I found a conversation with them to be very helpful. I believe that their non-kit panels are all 36", though. I also don't know if they have a T-molding for fitting two sheets together along a back wall.

Thanks so much for the tips, Nancy, I really appreciate it - this is very helpful! "Lots of money" makes me panic sweat, but at least I know that this route is going to be more waterproof and hopefully last longer without needing constant pampering the way tile and grout do.

It's been a few years since I've commented, but just a quick update to say we're very happy with the way our Choreograph walls have held up in both of our small bathrooms. I guess Kohler has phased Choreograph out in favor of another solid surface, so that's always a bit telling, but we've not had any issues with ours. Having a nice smooth matte surface instead of tile/grout makes it all worthwhile to me. It's SO much easier to keep clean. No matter the brand, I'm sold on solid surface showers for life!

I have to agree. We put in Flexstone/Sentrel and I wish we had panels instead of tile and grout in all our showers. We did 96" panels to the ceiling so no seams. It isn't very expensive either. But it isn't solid surface, they are plastic. However I thought the patterns available were attractive (they send free samples of the material so you can see it in advance) and the price was right, almost $1500 for the panels, bench, niche, corner shelf and trim. We don't plan to walk on them so I expect they will hold up for the life of the shower. There are corner guards behind the corners and silicon caulk on top. Where we secured things to the wall like the grab bar, bench and corner shelf we put silicon in the screw holes. Also there is silicon around the edges of everything. It should be bullet proof.

I'm also sold for life. I will never put in a tile and grout shower again.

mmmm12COzone5 - I hadn't considered something other than solid surface, and that price point seems far more accessible. Thanks for sharing!

Kim, just be careful when looking at products that are not solid surface. You probably have seen how fiberglass and acrylic shower enclosures can look after a few years. Ask lots of questions. Find out if you have hard water and if you do, learn how that affects the surface material. Remember that scratches and scuffs cannot be repaired, too. Does the shower enclosure have any kind of top coating, or is it the same material through-and-through (this is the definition of a solid surface material)? How does this top surface layer wear? How long is it guaranteed? Will it be repairable if it dulls? What cleansers can scratch or harm it?

Nancy, it isn't solid surface. It is a thick plastic with a picture underneath and a plastic coating on top.

Kim, we originally wanted solid surface and had some companies out to bid. They were $18K-$20K. We then had a company that represented Onyx and they said about $8K in person but the rep didn't put it in writing so we don't know what it included. We asked him to but he wanted to sit in our living room (during Covid) to do it and we asked him to email it to us. It never came.

In the mean time we got bids for tile. We decided to go with tile but then the tile guy we hired (who did a great written bid) wasn't doing a good job on the install and when the Covid lockdown started he said it was too stressfull and quit. So we had a torn up bathroom at the start of Covid.

We got the Flexstone/Sentrel samples and were satisfied with the material and all the positive reviews of Flexstone on Home Depot that people had done themselves.

The differenence in the two product lines is Flexstone is available through Home Depot and Lowes and Sentrel is available direct through the manufacturer for DIY or though their dealers for an installed shower. The Sentrel can be bought in the 96" panels with all the customizations you want. Probably to get the shower installed would be double materials cost. If I include our shower pan, plumbing fixtures, grab bar etc we are probably at $2K ish (not including the wedi backerboard as that was installed by our tile guy before he quit) so maybe $4K-$5K to have it installed is my guess.

I can say the Flexstone/Sentrel will get a cut from a box cutter so it isn't hardy for sharp objects. And if you stand on the panel you can dent it. This is our third shower in this bathroom. Hopefully this is the last one we will ever do.

They send 3 samples for free from the web site so everyone can decide for themselves if they like it or not.

Just an update on the Onyx collection--we went with this for both bathrooms this summer. One is a standard size, 3-wall shower (36x48) with an onyx pan and panels to the ceiling. The other is for a tub surround in a subway tile pattern (60x30 up to an 8 foot ceiling). Including all the trim and the delivery to our house (we are not near a city) it came to about $2000 for all of it. We didn't get any seats or caddies (we have stainless fixtures we are installing instead). We've been using the shower for about 2 months and love it--VERY solid and very easy to clean. The tub surround is going in this week. Once it's all done I'll post photos, but this was a great solution. I can affirm it IS solid surface and can be "repaired' the way any other solid surface can, by a homeowner (unless you get a matte finish--that is a special treatment and would not be repairable by the homeowner). It definitely requires finding a salesperson who is knowledgeable, and the person we worked with (Southern MN) was AMAZING. I recommend finding someone not at a "big box" store who actually knows the product line--we did research both ways and although the one we chose was much further away, it was worth it to work with someone who really knew the product line.

@Nancy in Mich - those are all important considerations; thanks for pointing those out. I think we do have hard water so I'll need to account for htat, as well.

@mmmm12COzone5: $18-20K??? That would have given me a heart attack. That's just about what we were quoted recently for a whole new heating system! I appreciate the extra detail about your experience with Flexstone/Sentrel and the price points. This is very informative.

@feronian2, I'd love to see pictures if you're comfortable sharing!

feronian2,

That is an amazing price. Are you saying you basically got a full shower and a tub surround for $2K and then did the install yourself?

Amazingly good deal!

Any idea how much kohler luxstone shower is, replacing an old shower in Southern California.

FWIW in my area - Va / WV/ MD - I have recently been quoted ~ $5000 for a 36 x 48 x 84 tall Onyx panel system with pan and 2 caddies, by 4 different suppliers/installers. That price doesn’t include installation or shower doors. I am now looking for an alternative, even tile. Definitely will check out this Kohler product if I can find a qualified installer. I absolutely will not spend close to $10k on a shower that small. Venders tell me Onyx has had 4 price increases in the past year 2020-2021, with a 14 week wait.

@claybakin247, my alcove shower is also 36 x 48. Got a quote to rebuild the bathroom and it's 3 times the cost of all its elements (plumbing fixtures, tile and vanity). Hard to justify. Losing steam researching alternatives to tile. Pandemic isn't making any of it easy either.

Not sure if this is helpful to anyone, but we had the plumbers install choreograph around a tub (3 walls); and the GC installed swanstone over a solid cast iron shower pan, and both installs seemed to go well. The directions are pretty straightforward.

I don't know how materials/labor costs compare.

The appeal for me was that if tile install screwed up, there's a zillion grout lines leaking into whatever was/wasn't prepped properly underneath. With the solid, there's only the seams where issues might occur (and choreograph has a channel system the panels fit into, so I think that would channel water to the bottom of the install).

@tartanmeup Thats in line with what I'm being told. I've lost steam on the non-tile options too. The Onyx installer I had scheduled, who recommended it to begin with, totally screwed me over. At the 11th hour he told me he didnt want to do my project.

I then proceeded to gather quotes from 4 different venders and vender/installers, all of them booked until next February or March. One even admitted ceramic tile is now probably more economical, which was not the case before all of the Onyx price increases.

I am a ceramic artist/potter and am creating my own tile for a border to be installed at eye level, with solid surface material above and below. Some of the Onyx vender/installers will not install customer supplied tile so that narrowed the field of installers for me. I am also having difficulty finding an independent skilled installer in my area since mine bailed on me. I keep encountering roadblocks at every turn.

I am going to consider this Choreograph product (now called Luxstone?) and also Swanstone, solely for the ease of maintenance aspect. And hope the price comes in at a much more reasonable cost than Onyx.

Thanks to all who have shared info and photos! It really helps those of us who are planning a bathroom renovation in these trying times.

I see people are going through the same issues we did when we replaced our shower last year. we ended up spending $1500 on the panel system, niche, corner shelf and corner bench. pictures of the material here.

https://www.sentrelproducts.com

same company

https://flexstoneproducts.com

The sentrel sells to installers and the flexstone through lowes and home depot.

We love the look and the material. No special skills needed for install so my husband did it himself.

We felt the material was beautiful after getting the free samples.

We bought directly from the company and got 96” walls so no seams.

You can see other people’s real life installs in the home depot reviews.

https://www.homedepot.com/p/FlexStone-Royale-36-in-x-60-in-x-80-in-11-Piece-Easy-Up-Adhesive-Alcove-Bathtub-Shower-Wall-Surround-in-Calacatta-White-SSK60367831CW/304669705#overlay

Thanks for sharing, @mmmm12COzone5. Flexstone and Sentrel are the same company, you say? I wonder why they have two different websites like that. How long have you had yours? Good reviews on the HD site.

We put ours in a year ago. It has been basically maintenance free. No possible way for it to leak.

Sentrel is aimed at selling to installers so every customizable option. You can also find an installer through that web site. We ended up buying through Sentrel because we wanted 96" walls, no mitered corners, corner shower bench and enhanced niche.

We originally contacted flexstone for the samples. Also consulted with their helpful and friendly sales guy who told us about all the options.

They use the same usa based factory and the sales guy is able to go out to the manufacturing floor. Felt like a family based company.

Cynthia Crane - I spoke with a good Kohler rep and he said that Luxstone is sold through and installed by authorized dealers and their installers work directly through that authorized dealer. Choreograph is the same material except sold through many other channels for DYI-ers. Kohler has temporarily stopped manufacturing Choreograph due to COVID contraints. I like these products because the corner joints between the wall panels do not require caulking and they are of course a solid surface.

The term ”solid surface” in bath and kitchen remodeling is used only to refer to a product that has the pigment going all the way through the product, with no surface treatment. Solid surface products can be renewed or repaired in place using Scotch scrubber pads or other tools. Since there is no surface treatment, scratches and nicks can be buffed out. These products do not dull over time and can last a lifetime. Last I knew, Luxstone and Choreograph do not meet those criteria.

We installed the Choreograph system in one of our bathrooms and upkeep is good. My complaint is that the narrow insert with small slide-in shelves which work as a built in grooming product caddy is problematic. The little shelves are prone to popping out and then the bottles and / or soap hit the shower floor. Anyone else experiencing this problem and have you come up with a hack to keep them securely in place?

I know this is an older post but any of you ended up with Kohler LuxStone? Cost wise how much more is than tiles?

We had a rep come out to quote luxstone. He said their smallest size starts at about 12k. For our 48 inch wide shower we were looking at something closer to 20k. We were pretty bummed since in our last house we were able to purchase the choreograph and do it ourself for around 2500