It is a marketing ploy. They will come out with similar type roses with maybe slight improvements with different names.

I love my Heritage and Sophie's Rose. I think you will still be able to get some of these on the secondary market. If the patent has expired. And honestly I haven't found Heritage to be that prone to BS. Not as bad as some of his other roses. Sohpie's Rose either.

Nik and Buford hit that nail squarely on the head. Watch for "new and improved" versions of those being dumped. He can't sell as many new (read "higher priced") roses if he offers the old "superseded" types. He's in the business to make money, which, of course, he needs to be, but this is a marketing ploy, as has been stated.

I did read that Wild Edric had been discontinued in the U.S. since it didn't do well in U.S. weather. Which of the hundred areas of different U.S. weather are they talking about? Having said that, my four Wild Edric plants are still on probation. They are basically very thorny rugosas whose beautiful and fragrant blooms last about five minutes in the heat before looking positively ugly. I still find them rather fascinating since they're so different from my other roses, but they're probably not suitable for torrid heat. I'm holding on to all of them for another year at least anyway. As for Potter and Moore, this oldie is just my cup of tea, it's healthy and it stays small. There may be others just as good or better, but I derive some sort of satisfaction by keeping this "discarded" rose alive in my garden.

Potter and Moore

Sister Elizabeth

Cottage Rose

Wild Edric

..well, those are certainly very lovely Ingrid, although I know some are no longer with you.... I do like the arrangement around the boulders there very much.... thanks for posting these... always welcome...

...I note there is a collection of Austin roses in San Diego, which I think is not far from you, at a place called Barona Ranch Resort.... perhaps they grow better there for some reason, cooler nearer the sea perhaps..

...I'm having to agree with earlier comments about these roses being dropped, albeit quietly so, as none of them can now be ordered online, except 'Sophy's Rose' as a Standard.... you wouldn't know any of those were ever available, unless you had the printed catalogue to hand... so it seems you can only order these by phone or post...

...and I'm not liking their new website too much, finding it frustratingly difficult to navigate.... however, to be fair, they do offer some 700 roses, and looking through all the lists, there is something for everybody, even the most discerning, so I think we should be thankful for that in this country....

Marlorena, I have been to the Barona Casino's garden, once even on a blistering hot August day. The roses were all on a drip system, and in addition to Austin roses there were quite a number of modern roses. With a few exceptions, the Austin roses were "resting", while the modern roses were blooming their little heads off. That's where I fell in love with Yves Piaget, which I've tried twice without noticeable success in my garden. I can no longer remember which Austin roses did well, although I reported on that here, but it's been quite a few years.

Fortunately, at least in the States, quite a few of the older roses are still available at nurseries like Rogue Valley and Heirloom, and even in local nurseries. Apparently not everyone agrees with the Austin assessment of what is popular and does well here.

I was thinking there are many marketing reasons DA would want to do this, selling the new rose more dearly not being one of them. One interesting reason for planned obsolesence is not allowing the 'buying public' to form a real opinion on a particular rose and how it performs in this or that climate. This takes time which DA does not make available because by the time a rose's traits, good and bad, become public knowledge the rose has been obsoleted.. The result of all this is that while DA themselves have made a name for their, so called, 'English roses', not many actual roses will remain in history as classics worth to preserve. A pitty really but, of course, they don't care.

On the David Austin US website, there are more roses available than are shown on the main English Rose page. One has to click on an Alphabet letter on the top of the page to bring up an additional list of roses. I was able to find older Austins this way...

Are there any old DAs with long lasting blooms and speedy repeating circle?

Just wanted to register my indignation on behalf of Sharifa. Compact, tidy, upright, healthy (in my climate), and oh, that fragrance! Mine is in the midst of another big bloom cycle, and I love to walk by and snarf up a big noseful of that lovely scent before heading into work every morning.

I sympathize with DavidAustinCorp and their need to make a profit, especially in these difficult times, but I guess I'd like to see a little more loyalty toward cultivars that many people still love. After all, the rose business is built on the strength of people's emotional connections with these plants. To treat good cultivars as though they were disposable widgets runs contrary to that connection. This hobby is about passion, idiosyncrasy, and the preservation of the beautiful and unique--not about fungible units. They're pieces of history, not air freshener cartridges. By all means, axe the unworthy, but not roses of outstanding qualities that are widely beloved, like Sharifa.

<climbing off high horse now>

plectrudis....that was beautifully put, I must say..

Ingrid... I've heard you mention Yves Piaget before, I shall look it up sometime, as it must be very good for you to keep trying with it.... I think my local seller has it...

Krista in NY... thanks...I've tried the alphabetical listings here but none on the supp. list shows up, however, I have found 'Wild Edric' which despite being on this list, presumably for future removal, is also on their 'bestselling' list.... how weird is that..? it's the only way I could order that one if I wanted...

...another query I have is that one of their latest much talked about roses 'Sir Walter Scott', has disappeared completely... whether it's because they've simply sold out of bare root for this season I wouldn't know... I find that odd so early in the season... it was newly released this year.... I have to assume it's sold out already... yet there is no indication that you could pre-order it for next year....it just isn't listed....

..Austin's work in mysterious ways.....

They obviously dropped Sir Walter Scott for reasons unbeknown to us their target market. It is not listed in the 2015 introductions. Btw I hate their new european posh site.

Marlorena, I found it for you. Still not listed in the 2015 introductions though. Click below

Sir Walter Scott

Just noticed you mentioned they put Pat in their 'to discard' list. It is a wonderful, airy, fragrant and totally healthy rose in my climate if you keep it in afternoon shade. They must be mad to drop it. I notice they describe her disease resistance as 'poor' in their site. Absolutely not true where i live. Dear DA, we get mildew here in the South, of which she gets none, not blackspot.

Nik, thanks for posting the UK link. It is a confusing website, and I wonder if the US site will change to this format. I found Miss Alice and Sharifa Asma on the UK site by typing in a name search. Another way to find them is to click on Shop All Roses, which shows 186 varieties of Austins for sale. But they are not in alphabetical order, I had to scroll to the bottom to find Miss Alice and Sharifa Asma.

Nik/Krista...thanks.... I've managed to find them too now, by typing the names in the 'Search' box... in fact all those on the supplementary list can be found that way, even old Heathcliff and WS2000 etc...

...I'll have a look at that 'Shop All Roses' too, Krista... thanks again....

....terribly confusing site....

Marlorena, here is Yves Piaget for you, one of my most favorite modern roses. The first picture is taken at the Barona Casino, somewhat washed out in the bright light. The second is YP in my garden, where the roots were unfortunately eaten partially by a gopher, after which it never really recovered. Its replacement was an inferior specimen from a local nursery, but I do want to try it again at some time.

...oh, those are gorgeous Ingrid...thank you...and I can see why you like it so much... I wonder if I might get one, as I've just checked my local nursery again and they will have it in stock from November...

..I note it's a Meilland rose from France... I don't mind those actually...

Yves Piaget

I would say go for it, Marlorena. The bush is a bit gawky but the roses are so large and sumptuous that you hardly notice the bush.

I have two newer DA roses: Boscobel and Tranquillity. And they are my biggest disappointment: BS all summer long. On the other hand: Heritage, Geoff Hamilton, Cottage rose... have no BS. We had very hot summer, but Heritage was always in bloom.

soncna, I don't know where you're located, but I have had the same problem with 'Tranquillity' this season, much to my disappointment. I think it's a rose that needs spraying to look its best, however mine grows in some shade and I tend to blame it on not enough sun... even so, if it doesn't improve next season, I will have to reconsider this rose...

..no ants at the base of this one, so I can't blame them...

I live in a north med climate. I spray as little as possible. I have many healthy OGRs and a lot of problems with modern roses. Funny thing is, that near both problematic DA roses; I have some OGRs, which are completely healthy. I sprayed Tranquillity at first. But after I found out, that I have to spray it every two weeks to remain healthy, I gave up. If I remember correctly, both roses were labelled as disease resistant. Not in my case. I have planted Tranquillity last spring: last year I blamed rainy summer. But this summer it was very hot and sunny. Sadly, Tranquillity was BS magnet again. But I have many DA roses, which are happy and healthy (Pat Austin. Lady of Shalott, Golden celebration, St. Swithun, Evelyn, Tradescant,Heritage,Wedgwood rose...).

I don't spray at all and 'Tranquillity' is my very worst DA for black spot.... it's my worst rose for this full stop... most of my other roses get a little at this time of year, but I really have to reconsider this rose... noted blackspotter Zephirine Drouhin is a picture of health compared to this one..

..you have a fine selection... I have Lady of Shalott and St Swithun and both are exemplary healthwise...

....it's such a shame as when it's growing well, it's such a gorgeous rose too..

Apart from the single Kew Gardens, I have yet to see an Austin white which I would consider for a nano-second.. Even supposing I was enamored of frilly roses, the whites are invariably disease sumps - Susan Ellis whatever, Tranquility, Glamis Castle, the truly dismal Claire Austin, even Winchester Cathedral...all BS ridden. Lichfield Angel and Crocus Rose (although hardly white) the the only reasonably healthy Austin 'whites' I have come across (and the remarkable, but messy Snowgoose)..

Camps, this is anecdotal but I have never had blackspot on Winchester Cathedral... but powdery mildew that is another story...!

Yikes. Guess I'm not the only one who's disappointed in Tranquillity. We don't have bs in zone 10a/20, so the foliage on Tranq looks good, but Tranq is throwing out long canes I've already had to cut back (I want to keep it in a container). That's what I get for falling in love with a pretty face. Truly a shame there are no white Austins worth the effort.

Sir Walter Scott cannot be found anymore by searching the DA UK site. The direct link posted above still comes up with it but the ordering does not work. It seems that they have dropped the rose from their inventory. Maybe because it seemed like a good rose for my climate..

...it's just showing as 'sold out' on the link you provided earlier above here...

... I think you'll find that it's proving so popular that there are no more bare roots available for this season.... probably all the Scottish gardeners buying it up.... and that it will be available in May as a potted rose, once again....

Marlorena, you are right in that it shows bare roots as out of stock. Still, this smells fishy...

It also is still not listed as a 2015 Introduction and now I cannot locate it through the search function either. I do think it has been quietly dropped.. Maybe DA Limited do not like Scottish gardeners?

..well, when I click on that link again and check for bare root, it says ''availability - out of stock'' with a red x beside it - don't you get that?.... I also note that it does say it's only available bare root and not potted so I may be wrong about the potted option appearing in May... and that surprises me to be honest....with it being such a new rose...

...I can't believe they've dropped it so soon, I mean what would be the point in that?

...this company does work in mysterious ways.... when using the search box it doesn't show up at all as you say.... I think this was the same last year though....all very odd... I might send them an email....

If Wild Edric is a hybrid rugosa, it ought to do well in Northern tier gardens in the USA.

For the supplemental (about to be superceded/dropped) list I have. per Marlorena's post above

WS 2000

Heathcliff

Sharifa Asma

Cottage Rose

John Clare

Mary Magdalene

Miss Alice

Sister Elizabeth

Sophy's Rose

The Dark Lady

Pat Austin

St. Alban

William Morris

Heritage

The Alexandra Rose

Any others? The reason I repeated the list is that here in the USA, it is likely that Heirloom, at least, will be requested to not propagate any more of these if they are truly being dropped by DA. Any American gardener who lusts after one of these might want to buy now, this year, while it is still available.

I thought that both Sophy's Rose and The Dark Lady were quite nice when I had them. Heritage OTOH, makes a nice litter of rose petals at the foot of its bush, and as for Pat Austin, it can't take bright sunlight. Sharifa Asma has quite a following in the USA and will likely continue to be grown by some of the specialty nurseries.

I might have to order John Clare from DAUSA. I like both the poet and the rose.

Sir Walter Scott is sold out by David Austin's Swedish agents as well but there's a waiting list for it. I would not be surprised to learn that Swedish buyers are partly responsible also for the clearance (is this the right word?) at the website. It looks like a perfect rose for our Swedish conditions and we love spinosissimas already, hybrids and species, a staple of our gardens. I have 10 varieties now and will add Sir Walter Scott at the first opportunity.

That does not explain why it cannot be located by search in DA UK site, why it is missing from all lists and why it is not included in the 2015 Introductions.

In the beginning it went missing in action from the 2015 Intros list as Marlorena was first to report. But it was searchable as I discovered. Now it has stopped being searchable..

Unless DA sell all their stock to Sweden and they want to hide this rose from everyone else..

marianne, I think you are confirming for us that it's a very popular rose, so perhaps it is not surprising that it is sold out, but as Nik says, we should still be able to search for it. I have found this with other roses listed by Austin, that once they become 'sold out' they seem to be removed from the website. Try searching for 'Fabvier' for instance, this was on their list until recently.

...I have emailed Austin's for an explanation, as I had another issue with them over another rose, so I await to hear what they have to say...

ok.... I got a prompt reply from Austin's, which didn't answer all my questions, but the 'Sir Walter Scott' rose is simply out of stock, bare root, but will be available as a container rose from May/June this year. As I have had an issue with another rose they sent, instead of accepting a refund, they have offered to send me as an alternative, a free potted 'Sir Walter Scott' rose as soon as they are available.... I thought I might as well accept that...as it's so popular, even though it wasn't on my list of desired acquisitions....

...they didn't answer as to why it doesn't show up on their website...

mcnastarana,

...we won't know here of any further additions to the Supplementary list until we get our catalogues in September I suppose... then we shall see which others have been added....

I think I may now have the answer as to why Wild Edric has been discontinued. For the first time I just noticed the other day that the bottom of many of the leaves were covered with rust. To me rust is the worst so that was not a happy finding. I had four Wild Edrics and one is already gone because I needed a spot for one of my new Charles Darwin plants and two of them are away from other roses in the back, which is also where it receives the most heat, so I hope the one in the front with more shade will be all right. Strange that the rust did not show up until now, but there are so many factors that can influence disease.

I used to track several roses on the supplementary list. My experience was that they remained on that supplementary list for a long time. So if DA follows that policy still, the current ones should be available per the supplementary list for a number of years into the future.

Kate

Rust appears to be common in the run-up to leaf drop, even on varieties that aren't prone the rest of the year. The modern rose Hot Cocoa, otherwise "very disease resistant" (HMF) gets rust on very old leaves.

I am very surprised by a few things here, first of all in my garden Heritage & Pat Austin are both very healthy & constantly in bloom, compared to a few other Austin's they are better by leaps and bounds (CPM, crocus, jude, I'm looking at you).

Also, I always hear people talking about Crocus rose being so healthy for them, yet for me it is always the first rose (Austin or non austin) to get blackspot, and definitely the first to completely defoliate, usually by early June it is naked & looks horrid amongst my other happily blooming roses. I was hoping it would grow out of it, I really wanted to put it on the ground this year, it has been in a very large pot for 2 1/2 years, but it ALREADY has blackspot here in early april, so I think I may be removing it soon, I don't know if it would be any better in the ground, but I don't want to go though all the trouble of planting it if it is going to completely defoliate every year, I have too limited space to deal with that.

Roseseek, that is a very interesting observation and it definitely makes sense, nature is often so surprisingly purposeful in its actions. Too bad some of the new, human made cultivars can't take a hint & hold off on the blackspot until late summer!

Jessica

I saw the late-growing season affliction with rust yesterday on Ribes aureum at Santa Fe Dam near Los Angeles. The plants, growing in wild, dry areas, leaf out in Nov/Dec and go dormant as the soil dries out in spring. Some of the plants were orange w/ the disease. Not a rose, but showing that rust is like a scavenger after the plant decides to go dormant.

To Nature, that is part of the cycle. To us, it's something we must prevent. That should tell us quite a bit.

I observed a related phenomenon with interest this spring. Well, it's interesting in retrospect, initially I was horrified!

My teas all kept their leaves all winter this year, and were shiny and healthy with it. Then, like a switch had flipped, end of Feb, they all started growing in new leaves, and the old leaves variously, spotted, or rusted or suddenly yellowed. I picked them off, and the new foliage is spotless. Lady H in particular abruptly came down with rust - the only time I've seen any disease on this rose - but ONLY on the old leaves. It's almost like the rose decided it didn't need these leaves anymore and just stopped 'defending' them.

The plants removed the sap from them, leaving them to develop the fungi which helps them shed them. Nature "told" the plants to dump them, but we seldom listen.

Plants shade their old leaves typically once a year and if they don't do it all at once, like winter or dry season decidous plants do, they will do it slowly mainly during the new growth season. Senescing leaves are prone to fungal attacks.

For me, that's a very common sight, especially with warm climate roses and roses that do not get pruned. Every spring I tend to get old sickly leaves intermixed with young healthy growth. Chinas, Teas, Giganteas, HMs, all sorts of roses with lots of oriental blood in them get it.

This year, because winter forgot to visit us and we had less of the strong winds we get over here, this phenomenon was particularly evident and still carries on even during the, early for us, spring flush. It's natural, it's nothing to worry about but it is unsighty. I tend to help roses with their shedding but there's not much one can do with large roses intermixed with evergreens apart from trying a strong blast from the hose every now and then. With small roses one can defoliate by hand. With roses in dormancy and in a decidous plant setting one can use limesulphur spray to help the plants defoliate in time.

Pleased to report that Sir Walter Scott is now normally 'foundable' on the DA UK site. It is also included in the new arrivals (up to this year's Chelsea event I expect). Maybe all that was just a computer glitch?

The question in my mind is, can an English rose be a Scottish rose? lol

Nik...yes I noticed that too the other day... Austin's work in mysterious ways and it puzzles me what goes on at times, as they were due to send me this rose, potted, in May but now tell me they cannot send it until the end of June... no reason given, but I wonder perhaps if it's one of those roses that's slow to develop in a pot?

..I also wonder if this rose sells out quickly, as I have rarely seen it available since it was introduced, and they struggle to keep up with demand?... still, I'm looking forward even more now to receiving it, whereas I wasn't too bothered before...

I was disappointed to learn that Sir Walter Scott will not be available in the US. I wrote to David Austin in Texas to check if the rose would be sold here, and it will not be.

Greedy, greedy company. The majority of the discontinued David Austin roses have either reached or are near plant patent expiration. In the USA the patents expire after 20 years, anyone may propagate them without paying royalties to DA. To control his profits, DA is forcing nurseries such as Heirloom Roses to drop those discontinued roses or be banned from selling the new ones. As of today, Heirloom is no longer propagating those discontinued roses such as Chaucer, Happy Child, Pretty Jessica, et al.

Heathcliff at a nursery -- candy apple red 3" bloom: