More pertinent info from the other thread:

She chose her own
inspector, and all the structural inspections were done to the bank's
satisfaction when the house was purchased. She was told that an older
couple had lived in the home, and had done no maintenance for some time
before they passed away, which is why she had her stipulations written
into the contract.

The man who installed the vapor barrier last
week is returning to check the crawl space for other problems. When I
was cleaning walls and closets I didn't notice any ceiling issues, or
any problems with discolored or crumbly sheet rock. There was some mold
on the window seals, but it was the kind you get because of condensation
in cold weather--also common in bathrooms, on caulk around bathtubs and
showers. It was colder weather when we worked on the kitchen--I
think it was about the time that Houzz and GW merged, and I didn't
notice any mold, mildew, or mustiness.

She said today that she's borrowed two dehumidifiers and so has three
running constantly, and is emptying them several times each day.

Sorry your friend is dealing with this.

Does she have central AC (which would remove a lot of the humidity inside)?

She needs to buy the type of humidifier that has a drain hose, so it can be left on 24/7 and does not need to be emptied manually.

I think it would be helpful to know why the lawyer said a lawsuit wouldn't be worth pursuing.

Thank you. She does have central AC. I think she was hoping that with the installation of the vapor barrier, and with cleaning everything, the problem would be resolved, and she could just use the one she has. I'll suggest she get one with a drain hose.

She told me that the lawyer said that no one would take it on contingency because the mold isn't toxic, and doesn't cause health problems, and a lawyer who bills by the hour would soon surpass the value of her property losses.

Someone on the KT forum suggested small claims court, which I in turn suggested to my friend, but she dismissed it and said she had no case. I think at this point she is just exhausted and feels hopeless--maybe she'll feel better if the crawl space checks out OK and the mustiness disappears with the humidity.

One thing: most dehumidifiers have a male outlet for a hose attachment - usually underneath.

My suggestion is to have at least one BIG dehumidifier for the basement/ crawl space and smaller ones in rooms where there is a problem.

Could there also be a problem with the grade of the soil around the foundation? (water running toward the house instead of away from it)

Mold will not grow w/o very high humidity or water infiltration into the home somewhere. Repair that, and all the mold problems will cease. If there is no water problem, then even if no vapor barrier is present she would not be experiencing the mold problems.

Why did the agent and the buyer not verify that repairs were made before closing? Sorry to hear of the problems.

I can't speak for how the RE agent verified her info, but my friend said that the agent called her and told her that the seller's POA had signed the contract stating that the repairs that my friend asked for had been done. My friend accepted the RE agent's assurance and the POA's signed contract as verification that the repairs had been done, without asking for a second inspection.

The original repairman evidently remitted a copy of his bill (I assume to the seller's POA, since they were responsible for having the repairs done), stating the drainage problem had been corrected, but did not include any info about the vapor barrier. A copy of the bill was attached to the purchase agreement, and it's been verified by the RE agent that no mention was made of a vapor barrier. The repairman now states that he was not instructed to install a vapor barrier. At this point my friend doesn't know for certain that he even corrected the drainage problem.

Due to the high volume of rain we've had, my yard was saturated for weeks, so it's possible that she still has a drainage problem, but I was there last week when the second repairman installed the vapor barrier, and I heard him tell my friend that she had a perfect crawl space--that it was the cleanest he'd ever seen, and wonderful to work in. Would he have seen ground water infiltration? Mold? I don't know when he's scheduled to do the second check.

The two borrowed dehumidifiers belong to the RE agent, so while she's not admitting any responsibility, she is trying to help.

It seems a bit early to try to point blame. I don't think she really knows what the problem is yet. Surely there was rain in the last 2-1/2 years, even if not this much. A vapor barrier has been installed and it sounds like the problem is as bad as ever -- maybe worse (3 dehumidifiers plus AC running and still having problems). I lived in a couple of houses with crawl spaces that as far as I know were built before vapor barriers were used and a third house that was new construction. The inspector noted the lack of a vapor barrier and we asked for one. The builder refused, we accepted the explanation as to why the house didn't need it and closed. Never had a problem. If it were just a vapor barrier and rain, every house around would be a moldy mess.

First and most important thing is to find out where the moisture is coming from, get it stopped and get everything dried up. Look carefully along the floor and any other areas where there were moldy items. Water flows downhill and spreads out. What is above and where would the water channel horizontally? Look at the floor, walls, windows, pipes, attic, roof and roof vents. Make sure the AC is properly sized (an oversized AC unit can cause the air to cool too quickly and not dry the air properly -- even make it rain inside. The problem would be worse in periods with less heat and more humidity). There is a good chance there has been a slowly leaking pipe, roof or something that is getting worse.

Once she finds the source of the water, stops it and as she is drying things out and cleaning up again, then you can look at whether she has any recourse or insurance for the costs.

To answer your question, I would say that there is a bit of fault to go around. But if you requested in writing that the repairs were done, and have a signed document stating they were, then you probably have some recourse against those people.

The larger problem is one of damages. Your position has a causation problem, the logical fallacy of post hoc ergo propter hoc (following it, therefore because of it). Just because one thing follows another doesn't mean that the first caused the second. The repairs were not done as specified and represented to the buyer, following that you had mold, therefore the incomplete repair caused the mold, That last thing is an assumption that will get you in trouble. The problem is that you have to prove that the lack of a vapor barrier actually was the cause of the mold, something that you are going to struggle with. They really only need to point out that the house has never had a vapor barrier and had no mold issue before, or that the moisture level in the house wouldn't have been significantly different with a vapor barrier, or that the walls have no vapor barrier and thus a sealed crawl space adds no real protection, etc. Without that you will be limited on recovery to the installation costs of a vapor barrier.

In the end, these things, rather than who is at fault, are the real obstacles to recovery. I am sorry to say that there may not be a satisfactory legal option that is worth pursuing.

A bigger issue is: did your friend's realtor not advise them to inspect the work? I can't imagine not checking the work out.

I don't think anyone in the chain advised my friend to physically verify that the work had been done, and because she is partially disabled she would not have gone into the crawl space to check on it herself (no excuse--if verifying that the work was done was her responsibility, she should have had another inspection of the crawl space). Both of her sons had purchased houses in the previous year--the inspector she hired was recommended by one of them.

I think the fact that her request was written into the contract, and the fact that the POA signed the written contract stating that her requirements had been met, set up an "Everything is in order, I'm protected" thought process.

bry911, your second paragraph might be exactly what her lawyer told her--I was given the abridged version.

When you have a water problem, you look up to see where water is coming from. It runs down, so you look up. If the crawl space is clean and wasn't a swampy mess, I don't think you've found the problem. If water is trickling or seeping down a wall (may be running along a pipe, vent, or framing and not saturaing drywall) all the vapor barrier in the world and all the finger pointing won't help. It may be making matters worse.

You have to find the source of the water. If she has a roof or window leak allowing water to run down and spread along the floor, the vaopr barrier not being there would not have anything to do with her mold problem and neither the estates nor the agents would be responsible. It might even be possible that the vapor barrier is now holding moisture in the home with no way to dry out. That's why you have to find the source.

Two and a half years later, it is not likely that a leak was something the inspector missed -- and recovery against inspectors is often very limited (refund of the inspection fee) anyway. If you have been having a lot of storms, it is possible that wind or hail could have damaged the roof, a flashing or otherwise caused the leak to begin. That might be covered by her insurance. If the leak is the result of rotted wood or a maintenance problem, it may not be. Key words in insurance are sudden and unexpected, but policies have been rewritten to address water, roof and mold issues. Once she finds the problem, she can figure out whether there might be coverage and she can certainly stop the damages and clean up costs from escalating.

There is information missing here...

What kind of drainage problem did the inspector find? Did your friend keep a copy of the report? Find out what this problem is and if this problem has been corrected. My feeling is that it has been corrected, since your last guy that went into the crawlspace describes it as "perfect". This leads one to believe that the source of the moisture was/is not coming from the crawlspace nor the lack of a vapor barrier.

She's been running the AC and dehumidifiers constantly since discovering the mold. I spoke with her on the phone this evening, and she still sounds depressed. The repairman is scheduled for tomorrow.

Did I mention a clogged air conditioning condensate drain as a possible source of water? The more she runs it, the worse it would get. Happens with some frequency, but doesn't usually get this bad. I suspect the roof or some exterior source.

I dont blame her for being depressed. It sounds just awful. She needs a professional to find the cause of this. I agree with lascatx- what about the ac unit?

I am sure it feels overswhelming right now, but it will improve once they find what or what else is happening to cause this problem. I hope they find something tomorrow and that it is something quick and less expensive to repair.

I would think that for the mold to be as pervasive as you describe, that there would have to be a lot of water getting into the home somehow... not just a little. it should be easy to find the source.

I spoke with my friend today. She said the repairman checked the crawlspace and said everything looks good. Other than a couple of days last week, we've had much less rain than earlier in the year, so I'll suggest that she keep an eye on ground water infiltration if we have more rain than usual.

After reading some of your posts about other sources of water coming into the house, I remembered seeing an older window AC in the smaller bedroom (her craft room) where the worst of the mold was found. When I was helping her clean, she had said that the window AC didn't work. I cleaned the cover and rinsed the filter, but it didn't occur to me that the non-working AC would not have an outside cover to seal it. I asked her yesterday if the AC was covered or sealed, and she said that she didn't think so, and had never thought about it. So her dehumidifiers were pulling water from the outside through the window AC. Her son was coming over this afternoon with plastic sheeting to cover the unit, so that might solve part of the problem.

She sounded more upbeat today, which is a relief. Thank you all for your advice and concern.

If the repairman said the crawlspace looks great, than this area is not the cause of the problem. For the amount of mold you are speaking of, he would have seen signs of water infiltration down there.

About 4 years ago, I was representing a buyer and we found high levels of a few types of mold. None was of the toxic variety. We, along with the seller looked for a few days for a source of moisture and could not find anything. Then, the seller finally told us that before the basement was renovated (very nicely too), it flooded. The ONLY thing that remained in the basement now that was there during the flood was an old couch. It looked fine. We hired a mold remediation expert and the source was the couch! We got rid of the couch, and the next mold test came back good.

Do they intend to fix the non-working window AC otherwise why seal it instead of getting rid of it?

She's kept her furniture, although everything has been thoroughly cleaned. The crawl space repairman told her that if she can keep the humidity level down, the mold spores won't grow, but because they are so common and ever present she won't be able to get rid of them completely.

I think I misspoke--the AC is a window unit, but is built into the wall (so maybe it's a wall unit?), with window trim around it. It's really old, and if she takes it out, she'll have to replace it with a window, or patch the hole in the wall, inside and out, and right now she's just trying to get her belongings put in order. She has a handyman who can take care of removing the AC for her, eventually.

We've had some gorgeous, dry, sunny days lately, so I think that is helping.

GLad to hear things are drying out. She might want to look under the AC unit to see if there could be any rotting wood or cracks that could be letting water in. If no one has she should have someone check to make sure the area around the unit isn't' still wet. If that gets sealed up in plastic and can't dry out, things could get worse -- at least in that wall and area. Sounds more like the culprit may have been found though, and thats the first step. Find the source -- stop it, dry it out and clean up.

lascatx... what source of water infiltration was found? I have read the entire thread and don't see it mentioned.

They think there may have been ater coing in from a window AC unit that wasn't being used and wasn't sealed. If that sits with water under it and/or gets sealed up with water that can't dry out, I'm concerned that it could develop more mold, wood rot and even attract termites.

Update: The repairman is correcting drainage in the back yard, although my friend says that he's convinced that water infiltration was not the issue, and the vapor barrier will correct the problem.

I don't think the window/wall AC was allowing water to infiltrate, or at least it didn't appear to be when I cleaned it, but it was letting in humid air and mold spores from the outside.

I'm not totally convinced about the AC, though. We have two small rooms on the south side of our house, which are not air conditioned (or heated unless temps are consistently below freezing). Both are used as air locks to exterior doors in the winter, with a window kept open in each during the summer. In the larger of the two, the mudroom, I keep a window fan running most of the time in the summer, but I know that humid air enters when the fan isn't running, and I've never had mold in that room. However, it's an enclosed, glazed brick porch on a slab, so no crawl space. The smaller room is at the end of a new addition, is framed on three sides, joins the glazed brick on the other side, and is over a crawl space with a sump pump. It will eventually be two smaller areas--a 5x7 bathroom and an air lock entry, but it's currently being used as a tool room. No mold issues there, either, so experience tells me that it's not just humid air that's causing the mold bloom in my friend's house.

If you aren't cooling the air in your room, you aren't creating condensation. Her AC is.

If you aren't sure you've found the problem, get someone up in the attic -- look at where there are pipes and where they go. It's a puzzle, but you have to find the right piece.

If the crawlspace is in great shape, is dry and does not show any signs of water infiltration, why is your friend having a repairman redo the outside grade?

From the time she purchased the house, she felt that the back yard did not drain well, especially behind the poured carport, which is on the opposite side from the rooms where the mold was worse. I think that's the area that is being corrected.