The most prolific DA I have grown is Mary Rose. Its ALWAYS blooming. I did grow Graham Thomas, he got tall and leggy and didn't bloom as much as I would have liked.

Good luck with your new rose garden!

Thanks, altorama! Believe it or not, I grew Mary Rose in my last rose garden. Man, she is one thorny beast, but yes, very prolific. I drive by my old house sometimes and I can see that she has grown to insane proportions. The GT I was planning to train up a lattice on the side of the house. I hate to hear that it didn't bloom much. Maybe I should consider a different one there; I'm not married to GT by any means.

Well, my friend also grew GT and it looked great. I think mine was just a dud.

In that case, we'll see what happens! :-)

Most were just meh for me. Heritage was the best of the lot. They will probably need treatment for blackspot, not sure how your roses did at your last house. I'll check with a few folks. AquaEyes (Christopher) grows a lot of roses, he may have some recommendations, and he is probably closest to you.

I would put in a word for Marchesa Boccella, blooms well, fragrant, does not defoliate without fungicide treatment, maybe a little messy by the end of the season, but it is NJ.

Of those you mentioned, I'm currently growing only 'Abraham Darby', 'Jude the Obscure', and 'Tamora'. As with all my other roses here, these came own-root. AD grows vigorously. Where I have him he gets some shade during the middle of the day. JtO puts out a good amount of growth in the season, but gets more Winter damage than AD, and so has to start a bit further back each Spring. Mine is rather upright in habit, and I doubt it'll get as big as my AD. 'Tamora' has the least Winter damage of the three, but is altogether a smaller, bushier rose, also rather upright. As with most roses in NJ, all get a touch of blackspot eventually in my no-spray garden, but neither of those three are anywhere near my worst offenders. All three are very fragrant, but each smells rather different.

In a previous garden on Long Island I had 'Glamis Castle', 'Molineaux', and 'St. Cecilia'. These were purchased bare-root and thus budded onto 'Dr. Huey'. I got to live with them only for two years before I moved. I can tell you that 'Glamis Castle' got hit with blackspot pretty hard by about this time of year, and was rather spindly in growth. 'Molineaux' was a cute little thing in a happy, cheery color, and bloomed a lot. 'St. Cecilia' grew fast and was trained against a fence by the second year. This was almost ten years ago, so I don't remember the finest details.

If you're wondering what else I have here, my inventory can be found in my HelpMeFind member garden, linked below.

https://www.helpmefind.com/gardening/l.php?l=3.23781&tab=2&frmt=1&scp=0&order=16&sb=1

:-)

~Christopher

Paul Shirville is a low grower and a very sharp salmon pink. I'd put it in front at one end and buffer with white.

Diane, most of them did okay; I think Mary Rose was the only DA I had. I don't see Marchesa Boccella on the Heirloom Roses site but will look elsewhere for it.

MichaelG, thanks; that's a good suggestion. I had been planning to put it closer to the back, so I appreciate the tip to move it nearer the front.

Christopher: Um. WOW. Do you live somewhere that I can drive by and stick my nose out the window? I can only dream of having so many beautiful roses! You must be somewhat south of me going by zone; I'm in Essex County. Thank you for your feedback on the ones you've grown. I'm surprised St. Cecilia got so big; it's described as a medium-sized bush from what I've seen. Disappointing to hear that Glamis Castle didn't perform well, but I'll put it in the front, and if it's too spindly and disease-prone, replace it. I'm interested to hear you don't spray as I try to keep my garden as pesticide-free (edit: and fungicide-free)as I can. Have you tried the milk spray or do you control blackspot with something else?

Thanks again to all who have responded! I truly appreciate it.

Cool, I will look for those! Of course I'm familiar with New Brunswick, but haven't been that way much. I am sure I will be consulting you for more ideas on chem-free gardening. Love the idea of the mixed bed--like I need an excuse to plant more perennials! I'm enchanted by the idea of a rose named Eugene de Beauharnais--is there one named for Hortense as well?

One more question: I didn't mention this one upthread because I'm planning to put it somewhere else, but I also purchased an Apothecary's Rose, mostly because I'm a history geek. I'd love to find whatever was the white rose of York to plant near it as well, but most of the sources I've seen say it was an Alba Semiplena, and I can't find that on offer anywhere. Any ideas on where to find it, or failing that, something that would be a close substitute?

The Albas 'Maxima', 'Semi-Plena', and 'Suaveolens' are basically identical save for petal count.

:-)

~Christopher

annachosak -- I just got home and read an email from Rogue Valley Roses. They have both 'Maxima' and 'Semi-Plena' available right now among their latest restocks. And while they don't carry it, you may want to add the Damask 'York and Lancaster' to your historical collection. The legend has it that the two families saw a rose with both white and "red" (really going as far as dark pink) flowers and took it as a sign to settle their differences.

:-)

~Christopher

As for "chem-free gardening", I'd say that the best bit of advice is to become comfortable with imperfection. The next bit is to look up information on plants that attract beneficial insects, and to be patient. I've found that a food source has to reach a certain threshold before things find it. This goes for both pests and the things that eat them. So aphids didn't really hit here until after the roses were in the ground for a while, and it wasn't until the following year that I started finding ladybug larvae. And now that the roses are two years old, they've achieved enough size that birds can perch on their canes and pick off all sorts of bugs.

The final bit is to discover what you can use and add to the soil to make it better that's as abundant and cheap as possible. When I laid out the beds, I laid down cardboard to smother the weeds and grass. I was also cutting back branches of an overgrown Callery pear, and used the snipped up leaves and twigs to hold down the cardboard, and the thicker branches to make the log edging. I did get a delivery of 15 cubic yards of shredded and partially composted tree waste mulch to use as a base for building soil, but after that, I started collecting used coffee grounds daily from Starbucks to pile on. In Autumn, I collected leaves to add as well. Oh, and word of advice about that -- shred them first. I put them down whole and they made it rather hard for the Spring bulbs to come through, but they're almost completely decomposed by now. I also snip up any bits from dead-heading and pruning and leave them where they fall. Eventually they get covered by more coffee grounds. The point is that by continuing to add organic matter, you'll provide an environment for all sorts of organisms, and together they help keep your garden growing.

:-)

~Christopher

You're a peach! I just ordered Alba Semiplena from Rogue Valley Roses--thank you! I was confused by the York and Lancaster rose though; it looked pink in the picture, but other descriptions say it's striped.

Also thank you for the tips on chem-free gardening, especially building up the soil, which is something I struggle to do right. How do you shred your leaves, by hand, or do you have some sort of device to make it quick and easy?

Have you read The Organic Rose Garden by Liz Druitt? I learned a lot of good stuff from her.

I've never seen 'York and Lancaster' in person, but my impression is that it's somewhat along the lines of the true 'Seven Sisters' or "Smith's Parish" -- blooms vary from white to dark pink with all shades in between, as well as "pied" blooms. So seeing one bloom isn't really representative -- you'd have to see a whole plant blooming to see the variations.

I did the leaves for the first time last year, and DIDN'T shred them. I came to regret it by Spring, since it meant I had to carefully till the top layer to let the bulbs get through. I may be looking into one of those shredders that go on top of a garbage can for Autumn. But another part of me thinks maybe I should skip the leaves. There's a weed tree (Ailanthus altissima) in this area which sends seeds out with little "kites" that have them landing everywhere. I pull the seedlings by the hundreds in Spring, and I'm still finding them coming up now. This year they're worse than ever, and I wonder if it's because I hauled in more seeds along with the piles of leaves. Since I'm trying to get populations of self-seeding annuals going in the garden, I don't want to use any pre-emergent herbicides. So I'm still not sure if I'll be collecting leaves again. I might just stick to the coffee grounds. My daily haul fills a wheelbarrow.

I had no idea Liz Druitt wrote a gardening book! She's my friend on facebook after seeing her posts on threads from other garden friends, and in my various garden groups. I'll have to put that book on my list.

:-)

~Christopher

Oh, do! It's marvelous, and she writes very entertainingly. I could lend you my copy in return for a visit to your garden (she begged hopefully). I saw she had a Facebook profile but there was no way to friend her or follow her.

I feel your pain on the weed tree. We have a mimosa next door that I look balefully at every day, cursing it and its determination to sow offspring everywhere.

Thanks, but I feel as though my garden isn't quite "visit-worthy" yet. There are still so many gaps I'd like to fill, and my plan to get flats of annuals this year was cut short by a surprise and expensive car repair bill. This late in the season, I think I'll just skip it now. I also have a bunch of roses that either just went in the ground this year, or are still in pots. I'd feel like it's not quite worth the drive. But, hey, if you know you'll happen to be in the area anyway, drop me a message. Just remember that it's still a "work in progress".

:-)

~Christopher

No probs! My own front yard looks horrible right now after ripping out the bushes, so I understand. I've been reading through the "Which DA roses would you never plant again?" thread and starting to rethink my choices, so I might pick your brain again on better choices for OGRs.

Sharifa Asma and Sweet Juliet are very healthy, very fragrant, and prolific Austins. I would add Jude the Obscure for fragrance (though not as good as the other two for health). Abe Darby is very fragrant but struggling without spraying. Tamora is runty in my garden -- about 18" tall so has to be placed accordingly. Evelyn was very blackspot prone and no longer lives in my garden.

I'd like to agree with the recommendations for Marcessa Boccella. She is almost always in bloom in my garden and has a strong classic damask, fits all your criteria.

Lori, that's odd -- my own-root 'Tamora' is easily 4-feet tall now. It came as a band in 2013, but in 2014 I moved it, and cut it back hard before doing so.

:-)

~Christopher

Thanks, Lori! I'm more and more tempted by Marchesa. She does look lovely. I very much appreciate your feedback on the DAs.

I forgot to mention I do grow MAC, I think she gets through the winter because she is on the south side of the house, and flexible enough so I can push her behind Veilchenblau.

Reine des Violettes is also a great rose for me.

Update: most of my roses are here and ready to go in (hopefully next week). I ended up with:

MAC

ZD (for porch front and side)

GT (for the side of the house, next to ZD)

JtheO

Comtes de Champagne

Peace

Sharifa Asma

Stanwell Perpetual

New Dawn (to train into a tree in the yard)

Anne Hathaway

Paul Shirville

Apothecary's Rose and Alba Semiplena for the herb garden

I'm still waiting to find Bolero, which sounds very promising, and Evelyn, which I might keep in a pot to see how it does. Most of the others will be planted in a circle around a small fountain at the front of the house. I'm planning to put MAC at the back; my vision is to have it growing fairly tall to screen our bay window, and to fan out on the sides (assuming i can convince it to do so) to achieve the look of an arching fountain of blooms. Here's my question: I ordered two MACs. Would I be crazy to plant them next to each other to get a more "fountainy" look? I don't know if they will achieve the monstrous proportions here in NJ that I see in pics from CA. Am I better off putting the second one on the other side of the tree with New Dawn, or somewhere else altogether?

Annachosaknj6b, I look forward to your garden photos! I, too, have nascent rose beds. 3 yrs into the oldest part I am having a few, "What was I thinking?!?!?" moments and a couple of roses which despite my obsessive research just aren't doing what I expected. At all. It is part of the adventure of rose gardening. I hope your roses grow to be just what you have envisioned!

Thanks, Holly! I'd love to see pics of your rosebeds too!

Holly... I've been having ''what was I thinking?'' moments for the last 30 odd years, and it's still ongoing...

..people say you live and learn.... I live, ... don't learn...

..look forward to some photos sometime.... I always like to see lots of those... there is never enough...

I was so ill last year that it is a miracle from God that I have any roses left! They all look terrible from a year of no pruning, but are blooming their little canes off! I only have 17 right now, but 14 are blooming! I take roses with me every week to various drs, the vet or to church. That, I think, is my favorite part of rose gardening: the look of delight on someone's face when I hand them a bouquet. That sheer joy makes me forget the blackspot, Japanese Beetles, mystery caterpillars, sulking roses after they were moved, etc.

Gorgeous!

Aw, thanks! I noticed almost all of phone photos are of buds. Something about the hope and potential in a just beginning to open rose bud.

I have had a couple of bad days & hadn't been outside until this morning. Deadheaded a bit and communed with my roses. It was lovely! Didn't have phone to take photos, but Century 2 band from June is covered with roses, maybe 8! And my sulking Sugar Moon has 4 tiny roses. Didn't think SM would bloom at all this year. Cynthia, the ever faithful, is setting up another tremendous flush and Veldfire has shot up a cane and set bud. Life is good!