Flat or knock down ceiling?

11 years ago

We've decided to bite the bullet and cover our popcorn ceilings with new sheet rock! I assumed we would do a flat finished ceiling but the contractors said they always do knock down. They said they usually do the flat in some of the million dollar homes, but they could do it if we want! I was slightly offended then realized, I must have good taste! Am I making a big deal over nothing? I think knock down is, would or could be a dated look just like popcorn!

Featured Answer

dcxena

10 years ago

I am am BIG knockdown fan after having it done in my house (see comment from me above). Having said that, IMHO, no matter WHAT type of surface is used your ceiling will never be perfectly flat for plank installation, so you'll always have to work with that fact. I have also seen all different types of knockdown, and if they aren't using it as an excuse to be sloppy, I don't think it will be any more of an issue than smooth. Attached below are pictures of my kitchen and ceiling.

Comments (36)

PRO
Brickwood Builders, Inc.
11 years ago
Go for a flat ceiling. I've never heard of such a thing as what these guys told you.
feeny
11 years ago
Flat, definitely flat! The advice they are giving you is wrong, and you will be almost as unhappy with a textured ceiling as a popcorn one (nothing is actually worse than popcorn) for exactly the same reasons.
Related Discussions
New here: want to knock down walls! Help with kitchen layout!
Q
Comments (15)
Thank you for your observations. I love new perspectives on our old space! Blfenton: We also have a finished basement, so we have plenty of 'living' space. The dining room is not used at all--that�s why our main goal was to add that unused space to our kitchen--it is the space that everyone gathers in. From the front door, you can enter the kitchen through the dining room, or go straight through a hallway to enter the great room on the left, kitchen/nook area on the right. Our house is also 10 years old, and the appliances are showing signs of not lasting much longer. A leak in the kitchen faucet last spring stained a cabinet that needs sanded down/replaced...The kitchen has always been cramped, but now we've decided to try to use the space we already have to improve! Gooster: At this point, I'm open to anything! I have considered combining the laundry room and mud room, and moving around the pantry, 12 feet just isn't enough space in width! Our main entrance for a family is the garage. The mudroom is where all shoes, coats, backpacks, etc live, so it must be located directly from the garage entrance. We live in a wooded area and frequently bring in mud, leaves, dirt, snow, etc. Love the pic you posted with the windows�lovely! Dilly_NY: Moving the kitchen to the front of the house has been tossed around. If it's a nice enough looking kitchen, seeing it from the front door wouldn't be a problem. Then, the dining space would be in the middle and sitting area at the back? Here's a photo of the kitchen, looking toward the door.
...See More
Did I mention how much I detest knock-down finish?
Q
Comments (14)
Well, I LOVE my recently added knockdown ceilings. Ya wanna know why? because I had POPCORN ceilings before! DH and I did all the popcorn removal ourselves. It was torture, but well worth it. We had a company come out and do the knockdown..DH really wanted smooth ceilings but yes, our ceiling was all wavy and would have to be "floated"and would cost a lot more...so we went with knockdown. We had it sprayed and troweled so it is very big "blobs" (for lack of a better word...you know what I mean, I am sure). This is a 1970's ranch we just purchased a few months ago and are totally renovating. In my last house I had popcorn...and in the house I grew up in? POPCORN. Geez, I hate that stuff! I just did the 1st coat (primer) on the knockdown and yes, it is hard...I have to apply pressure on the roller to make it in all the little grooves and whatnot. My shoulders were bunched up in knots at the end of the day. I guess I don't have it so bad cuz my house is small (2000 sq ft) and the celings are low (8 ft) but I am not looking forward to doing the paint. I keep putting it off. I actually like the look of KD on walls, but my DH hates it so we didn't add it to the house. My DH was a builder and said just what you did...knockdown (and popcorn) is used to disguise shoddy workmanship. We needed it on the ceiling, but not on the walls. Good luck, I am sure your rooms will be GORGEOUS when you are done!
...See More
Knock down ceiling texture
Q
Comments (4)
That's kind of a big difference...maybe he didn't knock it down enough? The absolute hardest part of our almost completely DIY'd kitchen remodel was the ceiling texture. Prior to remodel, the kitchen was closed off from the LR and DR and it had no texture on the ceiling while the LR/DR had a sort of swirly texture...but in plaster, not drywall. I can't tell you how much we stressed about getting the texture right. We called in 2 dry wall guys and a guy who specializes in patching old plaster. They all turned the job down saying they didn't think they could match it as it is apparently a texture that is unique to our home. Anyway, my DH and his brother practiced and practiced and eventually felt confident enough to start slapping it on the ceiling. It looks great!!! I told that big long story to say that our ceiling, with 2 DIY'ers with no plaster experience and a very unique texture, looks better than what you are showing.
...See More
Do we have to knock down and rebuild? What's more cost efficient?
Q
Comments (24)
It sounds like you are not fully informed about some of the issues with construction in your area. Exterior - definitely a big one. The arched windows, the round column, the frilly embellishments, the classic rough stucco - we're not big fans of. Lyfia, agree these could be updated. You might check with your local zoning folks first. The neighborhood I moved from last year specifically disallowed the type of architecture you want to change to. The neighborhood was known as a "bungalow" area. You could build anything you wanted to behind an early 20th century bungalow facade that met certain criteria. They sell for $200 to $500 per square ft, so they are out of reach to many people. Still people buy them as blower uppers. People do not come to that neighborhood expecting to find an eclectic array of houses. Thus the housing value for the neighborhood would be expected to decline if you started building odd looking homes. If your neighborhood does not have any architectural design restrictions, others in the neighborhood would forever point at your modern house as, "that house," and not in a friendly way. foundation - cheaper pier and beam type - floors creaking, some sagging. We wish this was a sturdier more modern basement type foundation. Pier and beam can be cheap, but some of the most expensive homes in the world are built on pier and beam. Pier and beam might be the only possible foundation depending on earthquake prevalence. If your floors creak and sag, that's a remodeling issue, not a rebuilding issue. What is modern about basements? I could probably count on two hands the number of basement houses in California. Something about earthquakes makes them impractical. truss roof - low 8 feet ceilings throughout the house. We cry a little every time we experience nice high ceilings. Truss roofs can be built above any room height. I think the room height is more of a problem for you than the structural design. Square footage - small for the family. We'd love a bigger 2n'd story - not just a room on top of the garage. Small rooms and bathrooms. 4 bedrooms, 3 baths in 1590 sq feet. We could do with a better floor plan. Unbelievable!!! I thought 3-2 in 1800 square feet was cramped. Pitched roof - we've grown up in flat roofed houses with roofs that we could walk out on to. We'd love to have that again - and a partial terrace would be phenomenal. Just curious what part of the world you grew up in? You're not originally from California, are you? Dated interiors - floors, floor boards, moldings, tile floors - this I feel would be an easy change Sure. This is last one is all remodeling, but you have other issues. If you are absolutely in love with this location, I would suggest looking for a more run down house in the neighborhood, buy that, and redo. You have a serious multiplier effect going on. If you buy a 1500 square foot house at $300 psf, and remodel/rebuild it to 3000, square feet, you likely still have something in the range of $300 psf in value. That's what is going on in the bungalow neighborhood I mentioned above. Most of the psf cost goes into kitchens and baths, so adding larger bedrooms and family rooms is relatively low cost.
...See More
PRO
House of Holland - TX
11 years ago
Flat - all the way
PRO
JLADWL
11 years ago
What do they mean by "knock down"? Is that what I might refer to as a t-bar ceiling? Just wanted to clarify?
feeny
11 years ago
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Knockdown_texture
PRO
Brickwood Builders, Inc.
11 years ago
Hope this link works. http://www.google.com/search?q=knock+down+wall+finish&hl=en&tbo=u&rls=com.microsoft:en-us:IE-Address&rlz=1I7ADRA_en&tbm=isch&source=univ&sa=X&ei=yYTsUKBykYzRAYGvgdgH&ved=0CEgQsAQ&biw=1152&bih=620
PRO
LM Designers
11 years ago
Flat, don't believe these guys and maybe look for someone else to do the work. I don't trust their word.
feeny
11 years ago
last modified: 11 years ago
One wonders whether they are hoping to come back again in three or four years to refinish the knock down texture to a flat ceiling, once you realize that is what you really should have had in the first place. ;-)
charleee
11 years ago
Are you by any chance in California? The finish is called a California Knock-Down and it's very common here.
PRO
Rehder Construction, Inc.
11 years ago
melsdeal,

A knock down is the easiest and most inexpensive option. This is a common practice they use in tract homes to speed up the process. Flat ceilings are more in tune with today's trends. Do you want a perfect Level 5 flat? This takes more labor and time for the drywall subcontractor to do. You may also want to consider a semi-smooth finish if you are on a budget. And finally, you may want to consider matching the existing wall texture pattern.

Best of luck with your project!

Steve Rehder
melsdeal
Original Author
11 years ago
Thank you everyone for all of your responses! feeny- that link is exactly what the contractors are talking about and I have never liked that look. Rehder Construction, Inc.- I realize it is the easiest, most inexpensive option. I guess I will have to pay extra to a company willing to put in the extra time it takes. I don't know what level 5 flat means but I will google it! I don't consider flat a trend like I do popcorn and knock down. I grew up in an old house that my elderly parents still live in. It has had the same flat ceilings now for 90 years and they still look beautiful! I was just there today admiring them! I don't have wall texture that I would need to match, thank goodness because I do not like wall texture at all! oldbobbi-I'm not in California, I'm in the midwest and it is common here too!
Thanks everyone! I'm going to go with FLAT!
PRO
Rehder Construction, Inc.
11 years ago
melsdeal,

Please see this link for the levels of drywall finish http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drywall. This is a good reference (scroll down to the bottom). A skilled drywall subcontractor will use very harsh, direct lighting to detect any imperfections. Skim, coat, and sand...repeat (if necessary)!

Yours,

Steve Rehder
pvbch
10 years ago
Our home is 22 yrs old. The ceiling has a popcorn texture that we're wanting to remove to update the home. I like a smooth ceilings over the knockdown style. The company is suggesting we go with a knockdown style vs a smooth ceiling to hide any imperfections that might show up. Is this this true???
Laurie Tillett
10 years ago
We just renovated our 1980s era condo. Ceilings were popcorn of course. We went with the knockdown ceilings as our building wasn't the most expensive when built and had many imperfections in walls, ceilings. We have a very subtle skim pattern...almost imperceptible, and quite frankly I don't even notice...even with standard condo 8 foot ceilings. It was all a matter of where do I want to spend the money....I'd rather spend it on things I actually notice. Ask for a sample board of the different patterns of knockdown...seriously, I don't think you will find it offensive at all. it will just depend on the style of your house and how much money you are willing to invest in what aspect of the renovation.
PRO
User
10 years ago
Very few flat ceiling have a level 5 finish. If you are painting it with flat paint slight imperfections are not noticeable.
dcxena
10 years ago
Chose knock-down instead of flat for the $400k+ renovation of my 1938 Colonial Revival. SO happy I did! TOTALLY prefer it to flat--the dimension and character it gives to the ceiling are lovely! People are stunned when they find out it's not original to the house.
Lesley Delle_Grazie
10 years ago
last modified: 10 years ago
I read somewhere, possibly even here on Houzz, that the popcorn ceilings were done for more than just easy, cheap installation; they are also known as acoustic ceilings as they deaden sound. Now everyone is going with open concept design, high flat ceilings, and no carpeting, and wondering why they can hear every sound anywhere in their homes. Melsdeal, your childhood home, being 90 years old, is likely of more sound construction than the cardboard boxes that get built these days, and I doubt very much there's even a hint of "open concept". No offence to all the designers here, but in my experience, it's all about how a room looks, not how practical or liveable it is. I'm sure that 10 years from now, we'll all be back to acoustic ceilings, closed in rooms, and dusty-blue-and-country-geese, or some other blast from the past, lol! Just something to consider.
User
10 years ago
A contractor knows every blemish in the finish of the ceiling will show with a flat finish. That's why he is reluctant to do the flat finish. if his workers don't do a first rate job, it will show.
centaurita
10 years ago
I have been wrestling with the same decision: smooth vs knockdown. For me, being the chief painter and brush washer - I am seriously considering the knockdown due to the fact I will have that much less to paint before I can move in.
The main concern I have is this: I was thinking of putting planks on my kitchen ceiling (see photo) after a year or so, and I wonder if this texture will make a big difference when trying to lay the planks flat.??
What do you think?
Ultimate Farmhouse Kitchen · More Info
centaurita
10 years ago
last modified: 10 years ago
@dcxena, Thank you for the insight and posting the pics.
LoL - One of the few things we are taking from the old farmhouse to our new one is a light fixture almost exactly like the one you have.
I think your ceiling looks nice and I am more convinced now.
dcxena
10 years ago
I find it very cool that you have exactly the same light fixture! My house was built in 1938 and I hunted hard for reasonably priced, restored ones from that period. Found them on Etsy (let me know if you want the name of the vendor I prefer). This is a "Virden" light fixture; check out this old catalog: http://www.oldhouselights.com/antique_lighting_catalog_virden_frame.htm
centaurita
10 years ago
Wow! Sweet old catalog.
This place was built in 1900, but I knew the light was from some time after late 20's. We are going to put edison bulbs in it and hang it in a foyer area in the new place and I've been looking around for something new that won't clash with it for the connecting hall. Not so easy to blend old with new sometimes :) but we really want to switch to LED's for the majority of our lighting. Thanks again!
scotty123mac
9 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Melsdeal We had our stippled ceilings removed before we moved into our condo. They hang plastic on the walls and floors and it looks like it has snowed in there! They then coat with two coats of "mud" , sand each one, and then add two coats of paint. It looks beautiful! So glad we had it done. It should not be that expensive for one room (around a thousand at most I would guess)
hayleydaniels
9 years ago
Old post.
PRO
Laqfoil Ltd.
9 years ago
I wish I'd seen this post sooner.

Removing popcorn is not just very messy, but in older homes there is also a danger of exposing yourself to asbestos.. Anything oil based also carries the danger of exposure to VOCs, and oil-based finishes also harm the environment more than water based ones.

There is a better solution. We're talking no mess, no dust, no toxic vapours (in fact, no vapours at all), with a finish as smooth as a mirror and unlimited design options. It's called stretch ceiling. A fully recyclable membrane is stretched across the ceiling, either over an existing ceiling, or in a new build, instead of installing drywall and covering it with popcorn. Tracks, or profiles, screwed into the walls or existing ceiling around the edges hold the membrane in place. These profiles and the membrane take up less than one inch of room height.

If you later desire a change, a new membrane can be inserted into the same tracks, or the tracks can be unscrewed and the screw holes easily filled with a little bit of filler. You will not need to do this as maintenance, however. The system lasts a lifetime.

We take care of installation for you, and installation is included in the price that we quote.

We carry over 280 colours, in high gloss, matte, satin, and fine canvas-textured finishes.

Here are a few examples, please feel free to visit our profile for more, and add them to your ideabooks!

Call us for a quote, we do not charge for a site measure/quote in areas that are near our offices. If you are further away, you can still get a free quote by supplying us with your measurement information. We have a network of authorized dealers across North America and beyond.
PRO
User
8 years ago
Absolutely love a regular flat ceiling with moulding but ... having said that have to deal with new old purchase of area that has knocked down. california.. rough whatever you want to call it. So what is the call.. flat or matte paint? Have this one area to deal with... Thanks
lindagem
7 years ago
I heard that some million dollar homes are bringing BACKpopcorn, in some cases even the glitter! (Florida)
Connie
6 years ago
Don't be fooled , We just removed the popcorn ceiling in my daughters house ourselves, the ceiling under the popcorn was perfect just a little sanding here and there and all we had to do was paint after. Now I am removing the popcorn ceiling in my house with the same result except for one room where the popcorn ceiling had been painted we didn't even have to sand. From a standpoint of someone that has done two homes themselves , one built in 1992 and the other built in 2005 if you want smooth ceilings and the contractor tells you it is more expensive to do smooth he is totally trying to up charge you or he hasn't a clue how to remove the popcorn and he messes up your ceiling himself , unpainted popcorn just spray with water and it falls off brilliantly as you scrape. Painted you may have to spray twice in some areas but the popcorn falls off in large pieces. The ceiling doesn't need to be floated after it is removed just painted

Unless the remover gouges the drywall
PRO
User
6 years ago
Flat. Contractors like to advise what is easiest and lowest cost for them. They are not designers and should not provide design advice.
Donna Brown
6 years ago
I bought a 2017 brand new model home in a new subdivision. I wasn't sure what the textured ceiling was at first, but my sister and son said it is knock down. I love it. It gives it charm. It is not at all like my sons old Popcorn Ceiling which he had removed. No glitter or sparkles. It is actually more versatile with decorating. Either modern or old fashioned style will work. It is kind of relaxing to look at. Our house is in Michigan but it appears like a ceiling from another part of the country. It was not worth getting one built without it since it would take 9 months. I am 61 years old and always had flat ceilings. It doesn't show imperfections. Step outside the box and try something new.
Annika C
5 years ago
last modified: 5 years ago
We just purchased an older home with flat walls and popcorn ceilings (underneath the popcorn are smooth tape lines so they weren’t trying to hide much of anything). We are changing all of it, except the bathrooms and kitchen, to knockdown. Our last home which was brand new had knockdown texture except in the bathrooms and kitchen and I LOVE it. If you mess up hanging a picture or get a hole/gouge in the wall it’s easier to hide/spackle. We do have multiple young boys in the house so holes, dents, scrapes, marks, etc happen a lot! But our walls look fresh all the time. Knockdown is nothing like popcorn. It doesn’t collect dust, cobwebs, or randomly fall on your head if you hit it.
marihoula
5 years ago
knockdown ok for modern mid century home with high ceilings 9 and 12 feet)???
jjaazzy
5 years ago
Marihoula, yes. As for the others the reason the flat surface they are talking about is costing more is because he is referring to a glass type finish, it is a skilled art, there is no room for error. It's not just flat, it's glass flat. knock down on the ceiling is no problem I don't see it becoming the popcorn of tomorrow. Popcorns main downfall was grabbing all the dirt in the air and you could see it piling up. I have had Knockdown on ceilings and walls. I wouldn't regret putting it on a ceiling again, it's a ceiling not that big a statement. But, I would be leery of it on the walls again, if you touch that wall to do anything, patching it so you think nothing ever happened there is tricky. The house I moved into had it and the prior owners did some really lumpy horrible patching. I got creative and fixed those areas but it never looks like when it was first done because it has a unique spray on "knock down" pattern.
Nikki Stewart
3 years ago
Smooth ceilings are wonderful for new construction… But we bought a 1953 rancher as a re-

build and we went for brocade ceiling texture. If the walls are somewhat uneven, as they will be with older homes, it hides the flaws.
Robyn Gill
3 years ago
"The ceiling doesn't need to be floated after it is removed just painted." What does floated mean?

Flat or knock down ceiling?

Comments (36)

Related Discussions

melsdealOriginal Author

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

melsdeal
Original Author