Hubby and I are going, too! We are retired, going to visit out dtr who lives in London and her new fiancé. Thirteen days in London, three in Paris, in early April. We are lucky that the new fiancé is a London native and will be a terrific tour guide.

I have no idea what out itinerary will be as we are leaving it all up to the fiancé, his mother, and our dtr. I have no suggestions for you …yet! I just got excited when I saw your post and wanted yo say hey!

Try to see at least one play in London. You can go to Leister Square and get discount tickets. The Reduced Shakespeare company is funny and a good choice for kids. Mama Mia is also lively and fun.

If you can, take a day trip to Brighton Beach. We loved walking the boardwalk and rode on a roller coaster over the English channel.

We did a Jack the Ripper tour which was fun. Westminster Abbey- do the tour for sure.

Paris, I loved Montemarte. Galleries Lafayette was also beautiful and a fun visit.

I really liked Wicked while in London last time. Looks like I'm going for work again in May so will see another show then. I recommend doing the hop on hop off to see some of the things where you won't be going inside. You get a guided tour that way.

We stayed at a hotel near St James Park tube and it was convenient for us as I met my mom after a conference I attended and we came from different airports and also one of the few places I could find where we could have separate beds and air conditioning. It was part of the IHG chain, but can't remember the name now. Was very quiet in that area and the hotel room was larger than your average one in London. It also had a tub and separate shower so we could get ready at the same time. Tube entrance was just across the street and around the corner and there was a star bucks across the street and another place just around the corner called Pret a Manger. Good sandwiches and options for breakfast that are healthy. It was more business district though, but didn't bother us. Scotland Yard head quarters was just around the corner too.

You'll have fun. We had rain and sun. I wore a thin rain jacket that was easy to fit into my purse when not needed.

I didn't participate in the other thread, but here's a few suggestions to get you started. (We've lived in England and the Continent on work assignments)

London in 9 days will allow you plenty of time to do all sorts of things and to just hang out like locals. Be sure to hit a production in the West End; there are many kid oriented shows and the quality is very high and the price reasonable. They have half price TKTS booth, day of showing, in Leceister Square but for the high demand shows you'll need to book in advance. I assume you have the other touristy stuff covered (Big Ben, Tower of London, Westminster etc) and of course even museum-weary kids may love the stuff in the British Museum (esp the Greek and Egyptian stuff). Also, be sure to drop by the British Library (some of the oldest documents in the world, e.g. Magna Carta. Great teaching moments). There are many lesser known museums with great collections as well. The best part of these places are that they are often free -- just limit your visit to a short period and see what is of the highest interest.

Out of the central city, consider a journey to Windsor Castle, Stonehenge, and perhaps Bath (Shakespeare). You could take a train to other cities, but it is pretty slow going (surprisingly) and perhaps not so worthwhile.

When locating your hotel/rental, try to stay on the same tube line as ST. Mary's and locate something within an easy walk to the tube station. Holburn, for example, has great access to many of the sites you may want to see within a few stops.

In Paris, three days are short. You might try Notre Dame, or even a trip out to Versailles. Shoppers may love the marche des puces (flea markets). Clignancourt is the most famous and easily reachable by metro. I love the Musee D'Orsay and the Rodin sculture garden, but I know it is not for everyone.

I think it was Robo that did Air BnB in London. I have not. Does DH's company do any corporate housing? They may know of something they use for transplants or people on extended assignments?

I am not sure I would go to see a show in the West End that is just something you can see in NYC; to me it feels no different. If you can find something unique, fine, otherwise I personally would not spend my limited time in that way. I know you said your family is not much for museums, but there can be a way to approach them that makes it more accessible. Maybe have each kid research it a little and choose three things they want to see in the museum; get them a little vested. My girls loved the V&A museum for the costumes. I would break up the city time with a visit to Bath and Id try to do Stonehenge too. Kids tend to like both of those. You can take a train or a bus, but driving isn't too crazy IMHO.

Then you are taking the Chunnel over? That will be a good experience, too. While you do, of course, need to see the Mona Lisa, i personally find her a great disappointment (in a plastic box, continually besieged by tourists). My favorite is Winged Victory, which is at the top of a wonderful staircase and makes your jaw drop. You will find her! Truth is though, you need to go to the Louvre, and see the IM Pei entrance, etc, but I think many people like the Musee Dorsay better (both the bldg itself and the artwork therein). Most people like impressionist art and the Musee Dorsay has all the greatest hits. I would take a nighttime cruise on the Bateau Mouche (not a dinner cruise), its the best way to see the city at night, and all the lovely bridges.

In three days, you will just want to enjoy the city, and see the must-sees. Versailles would be a day trip; personally i love it but really for the gardens more than anything else. The best part of Paris will really just be walking around. Everywhere you look there will be something interesting, beautiful, delicious.

Marche aux Puces was a total disappointment to me. I went there so ready to shop, and everything was either wildly expensive (i picked up a $7,000 vase) or literally a pile of junk like you'd find at a church yard sale right at home. I found nothing compelling, and I love to shop and have been to flea markets in many countries.

In both cities, id take hop on hop off buses ... yeah its so touristy, but it's a great way to get the lay of the land and see everything at least once. If you google Frommer's and Fodor's, I always like their "best experiences" lists. Which reminds me, kids love french hot chocolate! It often comes unsweetened with the sugar and cream on the side, so you can pour it exactly the way you want it!

Paris is my favorite city! I've spent a lot of time there, but not recently.

Thinking more of things that might work with kiddos.

On Ile de la Cite:

Saint Chapelle has really cool stained glass upstairs where the royalty worshiped. Seldom crowded.

Your kids might want to climb the steep, narrow stairs inside Notre Dame. I think the outside is more interesting. Read up on gargoyles so you know what you're looking at. Why are there zodiac signs on a Catholic Church when astrology is a no-no according to Catholic doctrine? What other unexpected symbols can you find on the building?

All road distances in France are measured from Kilometre Zero is Paris. The marker is in the square across from the main entrance of Notre Dame. Have the kids find it. To the south of the church, visit the English language bookstore Shakespeare and Company at 37 rue de la Bucherie. Alas, George Whitman is dead, but his daughter took over. There's even a website now! George used to let artists and writers sleep in the store. If no one was napping in the loft, he'd let you climb the ladder and look around. No idea whether his daughter has kept that tradition or not. Buy a book and have it stamped with the famous "Shakespeare and Company Kilometer Zero Paris."

This part of Paris is very old. As you face the bookstore, there is a wonderful old church to the left with an interesting history. They also have classical music concerts there sometimes. Rene Viviani park on the far side of the church has an Acacia tree that was planted in the 1600's.

As you face the bookstore, turn to the right and walk to rue du Petit Pont, which runs north-south. To the left (south) it soon becomes rue du Saint Jacques, which was built on what was the main road to Rome just after Caesar conquered Gaul!

Kids can take a fancy to silly names. Cross rue du Petit Pont to rue de la Huchette. A little way down the street, find rue du Chat Qui Peche (Street of the cat who fishes.) on the right. It is one of the narrowest streets in Paris. It will take you back to the river. Not much to see but the name is cute.

Take the metro to the Champs Elysees (Metro: Place Charles de Gaulle-Etoille) to the Arc de Triomphe. If you end up on the street, there's a tunnel to get to the Arc. Climb to the top for a nice view. To the west, notice how they aligned the Grande Arche de la Defense (a modern office building with a terrible interior layout) to the Arc de Triomphe.

Instead of climbing the Eiffel Tower, view it at night from the Trocadero across the river. The bridge is Pont d'Iena.

The Louvre is HUGE. If you just have to see the Mona Lisa (La Jocande in French), be there when the doors open. There are always crowds for it. I love art, so my approach to the Louvre is to visit their website and do other research to know that what I want to see in on display and on what day. Some rooms are closed on certain days and the museum is closed on Tuesdays. I visit my old favorites, then spend a couple of hours with one type of art. Otherwise it all runs together.

Other museums that I like are more human in scale:

Musee de l'Orangerie: Monet's waterlilies!! There is also another very nice collection there that won't take long to see.

Musee de Rodin: Sculpture outdoors and in. The building is basically a large house. In addition to the "Thinker" and the "Kiss" he made statues of a lot of famous men. Those make more sense if one knows who they are and what they did.

Musee Marmottan-Monet: Nice collection of Renoir, Monet, Morisot, Degas, Pissarro, etc.

Musee d'Orsay: Larger than the ones above, but has more variety. A favorite of mine!

Lastly, if you like dark hot chocolate, go to Angelina's Tearoom on rue de Rivoli. It's a very expensive, touristy area so don't plan to eat lunch there. This part of rue de Rivoli with its mass of tourists in attractive to pickpockets, so take extra care and avoid distractions.

I have to say my experience with seeing a show in London was different than NYC. Actually prefer London very much over NYC. The script of course is the same, but the intermission is a very different experience (besides the bathroom line), but they walk around selling ice-cream and other things as well (the ice-cream was very memorable - not a big chain type and a few flavors to choose from). The feeling too was very different and I loved seeing the show in British English which makes it different in some ways too.

Not sure about your teens interests. I was in Windsor for a few days as that is where the conference was that I attended. I'm not sure if LEGOLAND would be of interest to your teens. We drove by it on the way to the conference facility. Wasn't that far from Windsor proper. I don't know that I think there was much to see in Windsor otherwise that might interest teens besides changing of the guards and I'm not sure if a teen would find that interesting or not. My co-workers liked it, but I've seen that so many times before that it is not a big deal to me.

Thank you, yogacat. We'll be in Paris in July and your remarks are most helpful.

In London, one of the first things I would do is ride the hop on/hop off buses to get the lay of the land. And pick up a London Walks brochure from the hotel concierge. Let your kids pick a tour or two they might enjoy. They are cheap and fun and most are only a couple of hours. The Westminster tour is one I would recommend since you bypass any long lines. Another is Secrets and Spies if that is of interest. The guides are great. I have taken a lot of these.

The Churchhill War Rooms are also another recommendation. The entrance is near Whitehall, & is underground. It is where Winston Churchhill ran the war, the rooms are left as they were, and it is self-guided. They added a museum recently but it still is small and doesn't take long.

If you venture out of the city, consider one of the all-day bus tours. Most pick you up at your hotel and drop you off at the end of the day at or near your hotel. The price usually includes lunch and a tour of 3 major locations such as Bath, Stonehenge, and a cathedral along the way. Another includes Canterbury, Dover (white cliffs).

I agree with Lyfia, the theater experience is fun in London. The theaters are smaller in London. You might consider a matinee too. Wicked was fun and the Reduced Shakespeare company productions hilarious, but not sure they are still doing those.

Doubletree (Hilton) has been renovating some properties in London recently. Some have 1-2 BR apartments. You might checkout the chains and see if you can get a good rate, especially if your DH has any status with them. Many will include a full English breakfast, or at least continental which will save some money.

Be sure to take some extra passport-size photos with you and buy tube passes (Oyster card) when you get there. It's good for the buses too. Zones 1-2 should get you most anywhere within London you will want to go. You should plan to put at least 20-30 pounds or so on each one to start and you can add to it.

Second yogacat's suggestions, especially the Rodin Museum if the weather is nice and you are interested in sculpture. If you are planning on going to the Louvre or Musee D'Orsay you may want your own guide. Michael Osman is an American artist who has lived in Paris for years and is a very good resource for first timers to these large museums. You can't possibly see everything, and he will ask you about your preferences and interests and will map out plan so that you don't spend a lot of time just wandering. Teens, particularly, can get bored when there is no focus to the visit. He has a website if you are interested. I engaged him for a day for DH's birthday several years ago and it was hiis favorite present of all times, Michael's vast knowledge of art and history really make some of the paintings spring to life, and no consulting maps, getting lost, wandering hallways, etc.

We have taken a couple of Segway tours of Paris (and in many other cities) and really like this way of covering a lot of ground in a half day, especially if you're interested in architecture or just want to get a feel for the scope of the city. I think Segway or bike tours are perfect for your first day. Your teens will love it!

From London you may want to consider Greenwich as a day trip. The maritime museum and Naval observatory are there, and of course the Prime Meridian. You can take a boat to Greenwich, have a pub lunch and take Docklands light rail back to London, to see different sights along the way and experience different modes of transportation.

Rather than a blockbuster type show that, you can easily see in New York, I recommend the National Theater on the South Bank. It's the home of the Royal Shakespeare Company but the plays are not exclusively Shakespearean---although those works have been our favorites. If you've ever been baffled by a WS play this is the place to see one, as the actors' diction and cadence are so perfectly natural you will always know what's going on.

I know you will have a wonderful trip and wish fine weather for your stay

Unfortunately the specific apartments I stayed in were one bedrooms :( We stayed in Belgravia and it was lovely but quite far from the cathedral. I think in London we used Homeaway.com.

Of all the things you've mentioned, I highly recommend the Tower of London. Suitable for kids (especially bloodthirsty ones) and just a really interesting, high quality attraction.

Visit Kings Cross station to see Platform 9 ¾.

Maybe go to a street market? Something like Portobello Road?

In Paris, I would also put a plug in for the Centre Pompidou in Paris if your kids are into art at all. It's a super cool building and kind of interesting to go up the clear escalators on the outside. Plus modern art is fun and I believe they have a graphic arts gallery. Also on the top 2 floors they have (or had when I was there) a chronological exhibit where you can see the development of modern Western art which I found very cool and educational.

I really enjoyed the Marche aux Puces in Paris but definitely not for shopping--but great sightseeing! I will saw however that the neighborhood we walked through to get there (we approached from the South) was super sketch. Next time I'd take the metro another stop and approach from the North of the market.

I underestimated how huge the Louvre was and was just exhausted from walking around. Got lost at one point. Some highlights for me were Napoleon's apartments and the sculpture court. This blog has photos of both.

Wow, you guys are amazing! I am really overwhelmed by the process of trip planning and this is giving me all kinds of places to start -- I might have to print this whole thread and take it with me in my luggage, LOL!

I did find out that dh will have to work longer than I thought - a full workweek (we were hoping for 3-4 days). That cuts back the time we will have to spend as a family. And we're losing a few days to travel - the first day will be a redeye flight to London plus train to Paris -- with the time change, that's basically 24 hours wasted, getting us into Paris and settled in by evening. If we stay 3 nights in Paris, that will mean 2 full days to explore and the 3rd day basically lost to checkout, the train back to London, and settling in. Then we'll have Saturday and Sunday as a family to explore London before he starts work and the following Saturday after he is done. That Sunday we fly home early. So given that my husband's time is limited, do you think that Paris for 2 days/3 nights is about right? He is not that interested in Paris but definitely wants to see the Harry Potter studio tour in London -- other than that, it is all up in the air. We could shorten Paris to two nights/one full day to get more time in London but it sounds like seeing it in 2 days is already pushing it. Again, the kids and I will do the Tower and museums and Westminster Abbey and all that while he is working -- I'm just not sure I'm up for taking the train for any far-away day trips in England without him.

Do you think it is worth checking a bag? We did a week in Florida with 4 carryons and if we get a flat, I'm going to make sure it has a washer so we can reuse clothes. But still, it seems like we might be better off checking a larger bag or two, if only to give us room to haul stuff home. But then again, the larger bags will be more unwieldy lugging on the train from place to place -- and then there's the delay getting the bags at the airport. Don't know about London but in the airport we'll be flying out of here, the baggage handling is notoriously slow.

Also, does anyone know if there are places to stash baggage if we arrive before checkin or want to spend the day after check-out? I don't know how that works with a VRBO-type rental -- I know with a hotel, you can usually leave it with the hotel. Especially for checkout day in Paris, I'd like to spend the rest of the day there and take a later train, but I can't see dragging our luggage through Paris all day.

Outsideplaying - tell me more about the extra passport photo for the tube pass....we got our passports last year and I might have the extra photo from the kids and mine, but my husband doesn't have one (his passport is old.) Can we just take one and have it printed or do we need to go somewhere to have it taken? What if you show up without them -- can they take one when buying the tube pass?

Thanks again and please keep the suggestions coming -- I really appreciate all the detail you are putting in your responses!!!

Check out vivienne files and look into capsule wardrobes for efficient packing suggestions.

Yes, you can have a photo made in most larger train stations. There are photo booths to do so. It's just cheaper to take one of your own if you already have one. Walgreens or some of the drugstores here do them. We just had our passports renewed and used Walgreens.

I ditto kswl's suggestion of Greenwich. Forgot to mention that, but you'll get a great view of parts of London from the river and then it's a quicker ride back to London on the train. And the Royal Shakespeare and Portobello Rd market, but it is mainly on Saturday.

I almost always check a bag unless I have a very short trip. Flying into Heathrow, by the time you go thru passport control, bags are coming off or soon after. BTW, I'd wait to get money from an ATM in the airport. There are several and you will get a better exchange rate. If you have AMEX, they don't charge a fee. Check your credit cards to see what their fees might be.

Good free things.....British Museum (can be overwhelming but the guide will give you the highlights to hit), National Gallery (art, but great art and on Trafalgar Square and the best, cheapest cafe to take high tea if interested), St Martin in the Fields (next to the National Gallery, we did some crypt rubbings here), St Paul's Cathedral (just beautiful example of Sir Christopher Wren architecture and can challenge the kids to the steps; also a pretty good crypt cafe for lunch), covent Garden (little shops all around and sometimes street entertainment on weekends), walk down Regent St and window shop but the kids might still enjoy Hamley's, a huge toy store (lots of interesting little side streets too like Carnaby, but I am dating myself).

I would not shorten the Paris component, it will be hard to see even the basics if you do. I so agree about the Saint Chapelle, which maybe isn't a basic but IIRC its very close to NotreDame so not a time waster. Small and intimate and so pretty. Won't you be in Paris by early evening? Try to stay up if you can; if you can manage to go to bed Paris time you will have escaped jetlag, which is really important for a short trip. Can you shower when you land? I know you can in business and first but if you can as a freq flyer or even pay, it can help keep you awake.

We have done very long trips with each of us trailing one carry on roller bag and one backpack. Especially with laundry and consistent weather, that should not be difficult. Every VRBO is different but I think most will accommodate a luggage drop off .... since a very high % of guests will be flying overnight and need that on the way in. I'd just make it a requirement. You can also store luggage at airports (not convenient) and at most train stations.

Luggage storage on the TGV or Eurostar is very ample and easy (since most people taking it have luggage; not like getting on Amtrak!) I don't find a backpack (esp if you are willing to wear it as one) and a wheeled luggage cumbersome at all ... except when you get to subway stations that only have steps!

I always take a lightweight collapsible bag like a Longchamps in my luggage, folded, so that I can use it for any purchases on the way back, I check the rolling luggage then (who cares if it gets delayed on the way home) and carry on my spoils! (sometimes fragile.

I really would not hesitate at all to take a train to someplace like Bath. Its the same language, after all, not far away, frequent trains from Paddington. An adventure! Plus nowadays with a cell phone, how lost can you really get?

Pret-a-manger is a really good recommendation for a travelling family in London. It is a chain with many locations. Relatively healthy, good value, good selection, "fast food", long hours, and tasty. I am happy they have them in NYC now!

PS I am not sure about the comment about small theatres. There are many small, old, ornate theatres in NYC, too. I have to look up Reduced Shakespeare, though, I haven't heard of it and that sounds intriguing for kids.

You don't need a photo for the Oyster pass - so no need to worry about bringing any or finding a photo booth.

I think I agree with you MtnRdRedux and I didn't bring the size up on purpose as I've been to smaller and larger ones in NYC. There was a difference in atmosphere though between the ones I've been to in NYC vs. London. I think it is worth the experience and also seeing the show in British English makes it different. Unless somebody has seen every musical/show there is then I'm sure you can find one to see that is new to you.

Just want to add that we rented a small studio apartment from myparisvisit.com They have apartments of all sizes and prices. It was so much fun to be in a real neighborhood in the 1st. We shopped at local stores and even did a little cooking. Some of the apartments in the building were occupied by locals, so we felt tres Parisienne.

The kids will love the street performers. Some are very talented. You've gotten great advice above. Mona Lisa is a bit disappointing, and Winged Victory will knock your socks off. Venus De Milo was also pretty astounding if you could see her through the mobs. I loved the Musee D'Orsay.

http://www.myparisvisit.com/

Sorry about the theater size thing. I guess all the ones I have been to in NYC have been large. Haven't been to that many so I shouldn't have made the comparison so quickly.

Oh, what fun! I second the Pompidou, Musée d' Orsay, Musée de l'Orangerie and would add the Musée Rodin which is a gem. The gardens are lovely and the house is a delight. Wandering the 7th Arrondisement is wonderful (the Eiffel Tower is there, too). There is little better than taking back streets through Paris. Grab something to eat and settle in one of the many small parks that you find everywhere throughout the city. You can also go on the tour of the sewers which the kids might like. I have never done that and it is very popular, so you may want to research it some to find the best time to get there. The sewers are called Les Egouts de Paris and the entrance is in front of 93, quai d'Orsay. I would also try to stay in the 7th. I do and then I walk everywhere. It is the best way to see Paris and if you get tired, take a break at a café and watch the world go by for a bit.

I mentioned Theatre in London as the weather can be unpredictable and the siteseeing fatigue can set in -- it's a great way to break it up.

BTW, on the bus, the best bet in London in good weather is the "Hop On, Hop Off" double decker bus that shuttles you around the sites. It is a good way to get an overview, as pointed out above. These are the red buses you see on TV.

I do like Pret a Manger and which they (and Delifrance) would expand into the US. In terms of food, I adore British-indian (raj) cuisine, and specifically, Balti. But it's not for every family. Pubs (yes, with kids) are a good option for cost-effective meals -- "Slug and Lettuce" is a chain that is pretty reliable. For non British food, another chain, Wagamama, is a good value with an emphasis on noodles. I'm giving you chains rather than specific recommendations until you know where you are headed. There are definitely way better choices in each genre -- London is quite the foodie destination now. Note when the kids get fussy, Chipotle is now available in London and Paris, at a price that'll make you gasp.

With just two days in Paris, you'll have plenty to do in the Central city. For shopping, Rue du Faubourg Saint Honore is the haute couture destination (between Champs Elysee and the Tuileries). The hipster/funky district is in the Marais. If you are into cooking, E. Dehillerin is the shop to go to, with fantastic French cookware. It's near Les Halles.

Yoga at has done a great job. If you think of adding one more day to France, our kids loved the Peace Museum and the American Cemetery. If the like Harry Potter, Mte Ste Michel is awesome!!

Reduced Shakespeare are hilarious, campy and educational, an unusual trifecta One of our sons absolutely LOVED their shows. He saw his first at age 10 I think, and went back every time he was in London, including during his summer at RADA. they used to perform at the Criterion Theatre which has lots of dining options in the immediate vicinity.

A sneak peek:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=yqmfrqAVeK0

For Paris, I would chime in on Sainte Chapelle and the Rodin Museum. Just loved the Rodin! And as others have said, just walking around and taking in the city is wonderful. We did a morning pastry class which was a fun experience but with limited time might not be the best choice.

Have a wonderful trip!

Utilize the services of your husband's employer's travel services, particularly for London. We found that to be the best way to rent an apartment for a week. For Paris, I'd recommend that you stay in the 7th arrondissement, and again, use the services of the corporate travel department. If they farm it out to a travel agent, then contact that agency for places to stay.

I'd secure accommodations first, then plan the itinerary. You will have ample time to see London (and surrounds), but will have to be efficient in your planning while in Paris.

Most importantly, this is a great opportunity for your family!

Thanks again. I think we have figured out where to stay in London but are still confused about Paris. What exactly is the 7th arrondissement? When I search myparisvisit.com, I don't see a district called that, exactly. I guess I should do some googling for the general layout of Paris -- that would probably help!

@lkplatow: Paris is divided into 20 administrative districts, called arrondissement, each with a number. Your activity in a two day visit will be primarily in districts 1 to 8. Link: Wiki Definition and Map The 7th includes the Eiffel Tower, Musee D'orsey, and part of the "Left Bank" --- the 6th is also quite popular with tourists (including St Germain de Pres). The Louvre is in the 1st, Champs Elysee and Arc de Triompe in the 8th.

St. Germain des Pres is also a great place to stay. Gooster's mention of the Avenue des Champs-Élysées made me think of this song which a darling young man at our university used to sing when I was there during my year abroad in college. Enjoy. Les Champs Élysées

You can tell what arrondissement an apartment is in by the zip code. The last two numbers are the number of arrondissement. So 75001 is in the 1st and 75011 is in the 11th.

Having trouble finding a place in the 7th that is both affordable and available. I found a "where to stay in paris for beginners" article online which said that anywhere in 1-8 is pretty good for first time tourists so I've been focusing my search there, and there seems to be lots of reasonably priced flats in an area called Marais which seems to be the 3rd and 4th arrondissements. On the map that looks pretty far from the 7th -- does anyone know how long (walking distance) it would take to get from, say, the 3rd Arrondissement to the Eiffel Tower? I'm guessing (hoping?) that since the city is old, the streets are close together and it is probably not as far as it looks on the map. Also, we are hoping to take a river cruise at night and have been told that it is hard to find a taxi afterwards to get back home, so we would like to be walking distance to the river. If we stay somewhere in the 2nd or 3rd, those districts are set back from the river -- do you know how far they are in walking distance and would it be safe to walk there at night?

I find Paris pretty safe at night (but then I am used to NYC, so non-city people may feel differently). And yes, it is hard to find a taxi at night after those cruises, especially since it always seems a 50/50 chance that they will be on strike!

If you go to google maps, you can select walking directions, and get a precise answer to your question. That said, the metro might be another good answer, but I confess I never took the metro in Paris so maybe someone else can chime in about the ease of doing so and if it's ok at night in areas like Marais.

I understand Marais to be charming. Id rather stay in a charming place and have the space I need than be somewhere closer that is too small and or devoid of character ... and walking around Paris is the best part! After the cruises there will be plenty of people about and cafes open, esp in summer. Window shopping. If it is cool stop for hot chocolate, if not, stop for sorbet. Wear comfy shoes and consider it part of the experience.

I just looked at it on Google maps. They say an hour! However, I would almost say that between the Eiffel Tower and the Marais District is everything you want to see; they sort of bookend it. I will d/l a map to show you what i mean.

I think if you click on the map it gets bigger? Let me know if not and I will try to fix it.

Edited: So to the far right you see the Le Marais area. Google says it's like 1hr walk direct to the Eiffel towel. But that is about the farthest site you would want to see. In the map above, I plotted some of the ones you'd probably want to see ... Notre Dame (Saint Chapelle nearby), Musee Dorsay, Louvre, Des Invalides, Arc de Triomphe via the Champs Elyssee, etc. Even that route is 2hr18, to give you an idea of scale. You can get the Bateau Mouche at any number of spots along the Seine.

We stayed at a little hotel in the 1st and found it charming, close to everything we wanted to see with a great little bakery around the corner. Might be worth a look...

http://www.hotel-britannique.fr/

I usually stay with friends
in Paris, but here are several places I’ve stayed. Keep in mind that even expensive French hotel
rooms are tiny by U.S. standards. The hotels below all have good metro access.

• Hotel Verneuil St. Germain des Pres
  (arr. 7) - My absolute
  favorite. Very quiet street just
  inside the 7th.
• Hôtel des Marronniers (arr. 6) – My second choice. Less expensive
  than Hotel Verneuil.
• Hotel d'Angleterre (arr. 6)
  Lovely and expensive.
• Hotel
  Claude Bernard Saint-Germain (arr. 5) Busy area near the University.
  Convenient, but definitely down market from the ones above.
• Hotel du Levant (arr. 5) Very
  convenient, basic and inexpensive.
  I think of this as a hotel for European tourists.

The Marais is currently very
trendy, but has few metro stations.

I've never been
uncomfortable walking around alone at night in the areas you are likely
to visit. Areas to avoid at night: the northern neighborhoods and the
area around Chatelet les Halles (a major metro/RER hub in arr. 1). It's going through another seedy period.

I
travel light - even for business trips. If it won't fit under the seat
on the airplane, I've over-packed. I wear a lot of black and change
things up with tops and scarves. Leave your jewelry at home. Carry
passport, credit card and large currency in a pouch down your shirt. You
will probably notice a strange hand if it wanders there!! Carry a very
small purse with small cash (so you don't have to dig down your shirt)
plus tissues, and things that could go missing without major trauma. I
don't carry a camera mostly because it doesn't interest me but also
because it screams, "Hey pickpockets, I'm distracted. Help yourself!" The same would apply to using smartphones while walking around.

I have travelled a great deal and I don't take any special precautions of any kind in re pick pockets. I think the most important thing in re such crimes is to having confident body language and just paying attention. I certainly wouldn't forego a camera just to foil potential pick pockets, but then I seem to be far less worried about these crimes than most. I recall a very long to and fro on here where people were beside themselves about the risk of wearing backpacks as purses, which are my fave!

OP, were you looking for a hotel or a rental apt in Paris? I know you wanted laundry, etc in London but wasn't sure if you needed that in Paris too?

I've never been pick pocketed but have seen plenty of it, especially in Rome. In Paris I was once accosted by a woman with a stroller asking for directions outside the Gare du Nord. There was a doll instead of a baby in the stroller. I didn't know if she was mentally ill or a scammer (didn't matter, I couldn't have helped her if it was the former) so I just walked away and she went on to the next person.

And those "safe" neck pouches or money belts make it a production to get money out for a purchase and simply advertise the wearers' inexperience, fear, and that they are carrying all their cash.....perfect way to identify oneself as a good target.

KSWL, I object mostly on fashion grounds, LOL. : )

Actually the number one way to look like an American tourist in Paris is to wear sneakers. Quel horreur! (sp?)

OK - so we finally ironed out the exact travel times for when and where we'll be in each city. We ponied up more money and booked a beautiful flat about a block from the Eiffel Tower (figuring there's no way we could get lost and not find our way back home then, LOL!) It actually wasn't that much more than the hotels people linked to in this thread and it was for a huge two bedroom place, so I guess I can't complain, even though it was more than we wanted to spend.

So anyhow, we will be arriving in Paris on Tuesday evening about 7 -- I assume we will be beat from traveling (will have taken a redeye flight to London then gone straight to the train to Paris) and probably go right to bed (though I suppose if we have any energy left, we could pop over to the Eiffel Tower, as it will only be a block away.) We will have all day Wednesday and Thursday to see Paris. We have to check out of the apartment by 11 on Friday and figured we'd go straight to the train station and catch a 1:30 train back to London. So we have two solid days plus til 11 on Friday morning.

It seems from looking online that the best bet for avoiding crowds is to go first thing in the morning to every attraction -- obviously not possible when we only have 3 mornings (one of which we need to be back at the apartment at 11). We definitely want to see the Eiffel Tower, the Catacombs, Notre Dame (and the stuff at Kilometre Zero that yogacat described), and the Louvre. We also definitely want to take a nighttime cruise on the river. Anything else would be gravy -- I'd love to see the Arc and some of the other museums (especially Rodin) but I am not sure there is going to be time and I don't want to be manic about rushing from thing to thing just to say we saw it all. The catacombs seem to get big lines as the day goes on, so I thought seeing those first thing in the AM would be good. Same for the Eiffel Tower (which we can probably do on Friday morning before we leave since it is so close.) The Louvre will be open late that Wednesday night and I thought we might book a tour so we had a guide to take us through -- the collective wisdom of google seems to say that the evenings are much less crowded than the daytime hours. So Wednesday night maybe the Louvre and Thursday night the river cruise? Or I can see that you can actually get a hop-on hop-off river cruise -- maybe we could take that back from the Louvre to our apartment.

So if any of you experienced Paris travelers want to take a stab at drawing up an itinerary where we hit the things we want to see while hopefully avoiding the worst of the crowds (and including details like the best way to get from place to place) that would be great!

Also, has anyone done the Harry Potter Studio Tour in London? We are trying to figure that out as well - it is a ways outside London so it seems we can only do it together as a family on the weekend when my husband is not working -- would Saturday or Sunday be less crowded or doesn't it matter? Also, it seems like you have to take a bunch of different trains and a shuttle bus to get there from London via public transportation -- any tips for figuring that all out?

Seems like the other days in London when my husband is free, we may do a trip to Brighton and one to Greenwich that kswl mentioned above -- do you know what else there is to do in Greenwich besides say that you stood on the prime meridian? I'm wondering if my kids will be bored.

You have no idea how much I appreciate all of your replies -- when I first posted this thread, I was a bit apprehensive and overwhelmed and not even sure I could manage going to Paris and now I am feeling much more prepared and confident, and can barely wait! So thank you all so much!!!

Just one thing, you really have to add the Musee D'Orsay to the list IMHO. Shorten your time at the Louvre to simply the greatest hits. Among non-museum goers, I'd venture to say most vastly prefer the D'Orsay but of course you cannot go to Paris without going to the Louvre; I believe they will not let you out of customs should you let on.

You will have fun. Be confident. Nowadays, with smart phones and ATMs, it's very hard to get lost or in any sort of bind anywhere in the world, really.

Just a word, don't be afraid of the Metro in Paris (Interactive Map). It's quite convenient to just get on and save some walking through strange neighborhoods. There are maps at each station and so you'll know exactly where you emerge each time. Most guidebooks will have the metro stop name and the exit you should take from the station. If you go to the Louvre first thing the morning (instead of the night), speed walk to the Mona Lisa and then take your time to see the other major pieces, including Winged Victory. You can board the metro at the Eiffel Tower stop and a direct line will take you to the Musee D'Orsay and Notre Dame (no line changes). You can also walk from the Musee D'Orsay to the Louvre (1 km apart) via the Tuileries (the large plaza in front of the Louvre).

Sorry I didn't see your message regarding the Marais. Here's a future comment to future travelers... It's the equivalent to what Greenwich Village was like, the hip, artsy district where locals go to dine in small restaurants and shop in small, trendy boutiques. It's a great option for adults, maybe less so with small children as there can also be a lively bar scene that spills out into the streets. It is also quite convenient to the Louvre and Notre Dame, but has not many major hotel options.

You are in a great location and won't waste time getting to the attractions on your list. The metro is very safe and easy to navigate. 3 days in Paris has some excellent suggestions. You will see a few highlights and can plan another trip to see more in the future. Here's what I would want to see with my children:

Eiffel Tower-yes, climb to the top. The view is spectacular

Museum D'Orsay (used to be a train station)

Notre Dame (stand on the star, which is the city center)

Louxembourg Gardens (spectacular place for a picnic lunch). We stayed in that district once (I think it's the 5th.)

We enjoyed Sacre Coeur. Loved the Montmartre area. Full of street artists and lovely cafe's.

Many people have written about how to hit the highlights of Paris. Do you watch the travel channel? Rick Steve's has an excellent show and also has books. On our first trip I took his Paris book out of the library to help plan our 5 days.

https://www.ricksteves.com/watch-read-listen/read/articles/paris-itinerary

One bit of advice: when entering a store or restaurant greet the staff with "Bon Jour" and smile. Almost everyone there speaks English, so if you struggle with your French they will most likely speak English. The French get a bad rap as being unfriendly. I did not find that to be true. As long as you show them respect, acknowledge them and ask for help, you will get along just fine.

I love to plan vacations and then sit back and enjoy as it plays out. Plan on doing LOTS of walking and eating! Enjoy!

OK, another question -- in kind of a strange mashup of this thread and Sue's 14-year-old-girls one, my 14-year-old daughter has a, shall we say, high-maintenance hair routine involving a hair straightener. My understanding is that the American voltage straightener we use will not work overseas, even with a voltage adapter -- is that correct? I did some googling around and the travel forums recommend buying a European hair straightener but the ones they recommend are around $60-80 -- I didn't even pay that for the hair straightener she uses every day, let alone something that is going to be used for 2 weeks then stuffed in a drawer somewhere on the off chance we visit Europe again.

Any suggestions for a cheap but decent hair straightener that will work in Europe? I saw a few on ebay that ship from China and sell for like $10 but I am skeptical that they either won't work or will completely fry her hair.

Before you suggest it, no, she won't even consider NOT straightening her hair -- she's a 14 year old girl, LOL!

I use a hot brush which I take with me. I don't travel with adapters, but the hotels I have stayed in usually have those and some even have voltage transformers. I have witnessed all sorts of contraptions being brought to my room by "engineering" in various hotels to try to accommodate my appliances. Sometimes they work, sometimes not. But I have often noticed that the appliance will run much hotter than it does at home, which worries me, and would really worry me with a straightener.

I also have vivid memories of travelling to Paris with a girlfriend who plugged in her curling iron ... and it melted.

Short story. The only safe thing to do is buy one there. I bet you can find one for less than 60-80. Consider it an adventure.

You'll be in London first, right? Go to Boots - it's a drugstore/pharmacy. They are on just about every major street in London. They sell small appliances and I'll bet there will be a hair straightener cheaper there. You could probably check online before you travel. It should also work in Paris although you'll need a different plug adapter. Absolutely worth the $$. A friend of mine blew the circuit breaker in the hotel once trying to use hers. You might be able to sell it when you get back if you know someone else going over.

The key issues is that it is not only a different plug, but different voltages, amperages and cycles in the different countries. You can get a voltage transformer, but they are cumbersome and expensive and some high amperage appliances may still be problematic. (This is based on expat experience).

I found that electronic appliances will generally be roughly the same price as the US, if you go to a "big box" equivalent or a drugstore chain like Boots. If you don't want to search out a Darty in Paris (big electronics store) you can order in advance via Amazon -- there are a few models that are designed to be used in Europe with an adapter or already have a European plug.

I took adapters to London but never needed them. The hotels were set-up to accept US devices. There is a great portrait museum right behind the National Gallery in Trafalgar Square. Also, you can take a short train ride to Hampton Court ( Henry the VIII's place). I loved walking in the Trafalgar Square area just to see the street performers.

Regarding food: Pret A Manger is my favorite! Everything is fresh, they gave great selections, and are reasonably priced. I do not like to spend time inside restaurants, so we grabbed things to take with us. Wear comfy shoes and just walk! I found everything to be fascinating!

Paris
also has the Batobus, a hop-on/hop-off boat that runs a loop around the Seine.
Stops at most of the sights in the 1st, 6th, and 7th (Louvre, Tour
Eiffel, D'Orsay, Notre Dame). Runs during the day, last one leaves Tour Eiffel
at 9:30 PM or so. http://www.batobus.com/

I
agree on the Rodin, Musee D'Orsay and Orangerie (I want to move into one of the
Water Lily rooms!). I might go inside of the Louvre this year, but maybe
not, now that the Picasso Museum is open (it had been closed for a long time).

If
you plan on going up into the Eiffel, start looking for timed tickets as soon
as you can, otherwise you'll have to go with a tour provider or wait in line
(forever, it seems). http://www.toureiffel.paris/

I
have a dual-voltage curling iron, I only need to use the plug adaptor, check
Amazon. iPhone is dual-voltage as well.

The
Monoprix stores are good for a snack, and I found a Le Pain Quotidien near
my hotel in the 7th.

My
favorite restaurant is Firmin le Barbier, which is a couple of blocks from
Eiffel. Not a big selection, but the food is excellent.

You
may not have time for one of their tours, but check out the Paris by Mouth web
site, they have great recommendations for all types of restaurants. A fun tour
company is Set in Paris, they go to various movie settings around town.

I'm
going back next month! Enjoy your visit!

diane, how can you tell if an appliance is dual voltage? If an iPhone is dual voltage, what exactly does that mean? can I just plug it in as normal? Do I need some sort of adapter? sorry to hijack, but I'm also (unexpectedly) going to Paris in July (maybe we should have a Gardenweb meet up :)

Either on the label or in the technical specifications it will say 110V/220V or 110/220V. You will need an adapter, as the plugs are different in France. Yes, I just plug my iPhone and dual voltage curling iron into the adapter, then directly into the wall. I have a an "all-in-one" adapter similar to the one shown here: http://www.amazon.com/Kensington-International-Travel-Adapter-K38120WW/dp/B00I3E1ENW/ref=dp_ob_title_ce

When looking for appliances, search for "dual voltage". Amazon and TravelSmith are good sources, but search.