Range in front of Operable Window (Eliminate Hood)

9 years ago

Hi all - looking for some building code references that would indicate that a Gas Range could be installed in front of a window, which would be opened at the top (awning or vent style to allow airflow when cooking) is allowable.

I've seen lots of photos of it being done - but I'm the one that will need to go to the building department to get the approval and I'd like to have some sources to backup my case! Any help is of course extremely appreciated. Look for more posts from me coming up as we're going to be remodeling a concrete block florida beach cottage over the next several months!

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bellsmom

9 years ago

I can't help you with your request for codes. But I do have a small window behind my gas range and I love it. Since I usually do messy cooking on the front burners, spatters are minimal and clean off easily. No problem at all with the window heating, and I now have a powerful Capital Culinarian range, not the one I had in the photo below.

If I could have afforded to lose the cabinet space, I would have made the window much larger.

However, I never open it when I am operating the top burners. Of course, mine opens at eye level, not high as you show.

In your case, I see no problem with the window behind the range. I do not, however, quite see what use the top window will be if you want to use it to exhaust stove odors and heat. When you open it, won't the wind be at least as likely to blow in as out? Circulating the odors more widely through the house? And won't it be really hard to reach the crank to open and close it?

Or do you need the window just for general ventilation? Are there perhaps not enough windows close to this one for general air circulation in the kitchen? In that case, this makes sense. But why not make both windows openable? Or is that against code? Certainly you would not open the bottom one when using gas burners.

Certainly many people choose to do without a range hood. But have you considered both a big window and a range hood? There are may pictures of this on HOUZZ. It can be spectacular.

[Traditional Kitchen[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/traditional-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2107) by Dallas Home Builders Ellen Grasso & Sons, LLC

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Comments (8)

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Joseph Corlett, LLC
9 years ago
The first order of business is ascertaining gas supplies. It's hit or miss down here.
Mrs_Nyefnyef
9 years ago
The splatter on the window would drive me nuts. An extra cleaning chore I would never invite into my kitchen plan. Add to that your setup means you will have to stretch across the range to clean the splattered window.

What happens if it's windy and your top window is open? Also, is it dangerous to have high heat near glass - is that why a window behind a range is against Building Code in so many places? Even if the heat doesn't crack the glass, will the heat warp the glass frame over time? What about your home's insurance - I bet your insurance company would have an opinion on this set-up. And if you don't tell your insurance company, and heaven forbid there is a fire, good luck getting your insurance reimbursement.

Why do you want a range in front of a window? What is your reasoning? When you are cooking at the range, you will be looking down at your pots and pans, not admiring the view out the window.

This post was edited by Mrs_Nyefnyef on Thu, Dec 25, 14 at 18:04
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Hi, Greenhouse -- I still feel pretty new here myself, but let me say Welcome to Gardenweb Kitchen Forum! My kitchen is still under construction. In fact, the masons came today, coincidently, to raise the bottom of my window by about 11" to get it above the countertop. Thus, I cannot give you any of my pictures, but here is a link to one thread about windows behind ranges with several pictures, and here is one outside link with a nice picture of a window behind a range with a hood. I am not really nervous about the placement anymore. I decided to raise the window up so that the bottom of the window sill (properly called a "stool" if you are speaking to a window vendor) is about 3.5" above the top of the burners. I plan to make a stool out of my countertop material (an idea I got from GW, cannot remember who), and so that will "catch" any pans before it hits the window. Other thoughts I have had that might be useful to you. I realize that it may be important to make it look like this was planned, i.e., to try to avoid having it look like I just stuck a range in front of a window. To that end, I plan to use some obscure glass rather than clear glass. The way I decided to do this is to have a fixed, non-operable window, with two layers of thermal pane. Inside of this, I am going to have a stained glass panel made up by a local artisan, and just place that in front of the thermal pane. Then, on the inside, I will have a pane of plain glass, just to make it easy to clean. As I already mentioned, a stool out of countertop material should also help it look less like a standard window. Finally, I plan to tile around the window opening rather than use a wooden casing, as many normal windows do. I think that with all of that, it should look planned. Another issue you touched on was the hood. Since the whole point of keeping the window was to preserve the natural light, I am planning to use as slim of a hood as possible. I am thinking of one of those ones with very thin bottoms (like this Fisher&Paykel) or one of those with a glass canopy, which many companies make now. Unfortunately, I really fell in love with this Miele DA 249 glass canopy hood , but it is very expensive. The downside to these is that they tend to look very modern, and my kitchen was supposed to look more transitional/traditional. Oh well, you can't have everything! Oh, another thing: my range will be 30", but my window opening is about 34", so I decided to get a 36" hood so it covers all of the window area. Mounting the hood may be a bit of a challenge, as normally they should bolt to the wall behind the range, where you and I will have a window. One option would be to use a hood meant for an island, so it would hang from the ceiling. I don't think this will work for me because I need to vent out the wall, but it may work well for you. Instead, I am planning to use a regular wall-mount hood, but to make a support that "hangs" down from the top of the window, down to the level where the hood mounts are. Hope this helps! A_D
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A few thoughts... I think it looks like it is going to be a great house and I am a huge fan of people building homes like this themselves. - Be careful about what you don't know that you don't know. Don't just check with others on things that you know you don't know but also on stuff that you think that you do know. - When people tell you that you can't do something or shouldn't or that it's a terrible horrible no good very bad idea — ask them why. Understand what the fundamental issues are and then decide if it really is a bad idea or if you can mitigate the actual problems (especially vs the perceived problems or the just-because problems). - Don't trust city/county building/planning departments. Trust inspectors even less. Some are quite good but many are rather poor at knowing what they are doing. You need to meet code... Or whatever their interpretation of it is. Most importantly though is that you want a well-built and safe house that will function well for you and last a very long time. - When you get a chance watch the movie Still Mine (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Still_Mine). ----------- To your specific problem... You've got two issues to deal with; the window over the range and the need for proper exhaust. There are two problems with the window that I can see. First is that, depending on your cooking style, it may get a lot of grease and other stuff on it and require annoyingly frequent cleaning. Make it non-operable and keep the trim simple to make this easier. I've known two people with windows over their range and both wish they did not have it due to the need for frequent cleaning. Everyone is different though. Second is the potential for the glass to crack when it's cold outside. Make sure you get the proper window and install it correctly to prevent this. Personally I would go with the slim windows on either side as in the photos above. As to hood/exhaust. If you will have a gas range then for your health you need proper ventilation for it to remove combustion by-products. DO NOT rely on code or what inspectors say. If you cannot have proper ventilation then I would strongly recommend an induction cooktop and electric oven as then you will only have grease and cooking odors to deal with which are not harmful to your health. Good luck and please post about this project as it moves along. I'd like to see and hear how it goes.
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Just a suggestion on your layout. I think you'd be better switching your prep sink and your cleanup sink locations. Your island isn't very large; I can't be sure but it doesn't look like you have the minimum recommended 18" of landing space on one side of your sink (and that minimum would be way too small for a lot of people I think - I have 2.5 feet on my "dirty dishes" side and it feels tight). You're also doubling up on that area with seating, which means it really can't be both. Plus, I think the island location would be better for prep anyway, as it's closer to your fridge. If you switch those sinks, someone could be doing the dishes/emptying the dishwasher while someone else is prepping and cooking, and no one runs into anyone.
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dcward89
9 years ago
This just seems to be 1 tiny, tiny, tiny step up from no ventilation at all. I mean it's so high, how will you reach it to open it? How will the grease be extracted from your kitchen? How will you like cleaning that window every single time you cook?
gtbzz85
Original Author
9 years ago
OK, WOW, not the responses I was looking for! I'm only hearing "No, No, NO!" I really appreciate everyone's concern - but this is the only location for the range (in front of the window). I'm aware that the area doesn't have much access to natural gas, I'll be using propane. The glass is impact rated glass - can withstand a hurricane, not worried about heat from the range affecting it at all (range has a 8"+ tall bump out on the back of the range that will help the direct heat from affecting the closest part of the window - the rest of the heat should dissipate easily as it rises.

If anyone can help me with the code references that help me prepare for meeting with the building code officials I would be very appreciative. A quick search on google images or houzz shows dozens of beautiful kitchens with ranges in front of windows without hoods - so it's at least possible in some areas, I'm sure I can convince them here too, just need some direction. At this point I'll settle for a little encouragement on this project instead of all the negativity!

Merry Christmas!
jakuvall
9 years ago
I've done one once in front of a window. Needed 9" clearance, HD to be inoperable and tempered.
We seed a pop up down draft.

I've run into discussions on a pro forum regarding national code and as I recall there is little in the residential code but generally impossible to pass fire code.
What you can do will be at the discretion of the inspector.
gtbzz85
Original Author
9 years ago
Thanks Bellsmom - I think I need to refocus my project to include a range hood - it will just cover up some of the window, but that's OK by me if the project will work.

Glad to hear your splatters are minimal on the window. I was assuming the same thing, glad you have first hand knowledge!

Thanks for the detailed post, even including a photo!
HomeChef59
9 years ago
I'm not going to tell you no, but let me describe what happened with a similar arrangement.

In a previous house we had a small bath room with 12' ceilings. There was a window that opened like the one in your picture. I couldn't reach to open it even if I stood on the sides of the tub. The previous owner gifted us with a broom handle that had a hook on the end. You could grab the latch and move the window open or closed. We kept the handle next to the window for easy usage.

If the window was open and the shower was running, the height of the ceiling would conspire to create a huge vortex of rushing wind. It felt like a tornado in the room. The window wanted to suck the shower curtain out.

Now, I don't know if this window arrangement will cause a vortex, but it could under right conditions. Alternatively, an under mount hood arrangement would work well in this application.

I have had a home where the range top was placed with windows on each side of the range top. This worked really well. Perhaps you might consider windows on each side. Cost it out and see if it's a viable alternative. If it isn't, post your plan here and see if someone can suggest alternatives. There are a lot of very creative people on this site.

Range in front of Operable Window (Eliminate Hood)

bellsmom

Comments (8)

Joseph Corlett, LLC

Mrs_Nyefnyef

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dcward89

gtbzz85
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Range in front of Operable Window (Eliminate Hood)

bellsmom

Comments (8)

Joseph Corlett, LLC

Mrs_Nyefnyef

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dcward89

gtbzz85Original Author

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gtbzz85
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