Mine does not get pink botrytis dots or noticeably hang onto old petals like the 'Sally Holmes' a few blocks away in my neighborhood does. It also has at least some bloom nearly all of the time, including right now, between regular, larger flushes.

I can't comment on ultimate size or height as mine is just three years in the ground and being pruned, as on HMF, to "maintain a shorter habit" as a free-standing shrub -- taking a specimen of it done this way at SJHRG as an example. Currently it is about 5'x5', but we will see. It is coping marvelously with a less-than-ideal (semi-shade, lousy soil) location and I love it. It is already, hands-down, the most frequent bloomer of the hybrid musks here, where they tend to want to take the summer off.

I would classify its thorniness as "medium".

Scent-wise, both MAC and SGMC have nice scents but I would say MAC is stronger. However, my Secret Garden is not located where I would necessarily notice "wafting" (wrong direction, wind-wise) and perception of scent is so individual.

I can't speak for how the rose will do in your climate but know it well in Sacramento. It is not a "Hybrid Musk" but a "Musk Hybrid," or Hybrid Moschata. There is no resemblance in growth habit or fragrance to Sally Holmes. SGMC has supple long canes armed with many sharp prickles and clusters of extremely fragrant (think cloves) white single flowers. I adore how its fragrance wafts through the air. Here, there is no disease and no botrytis on the flowers, although the dead petals cling for a while. It sets nice hips if you don't deadhead it. Mine is on an east-facing wall with quite a bit of shade and it doesn't bloom as much as I'd like, but in the cemetery, still with some shade, it repeats very reliably. The cemetery one just grows about eight feet because there is no place for it to go - at home, it sends out 12-foot canes and threatens to be huge, and I prune it to a framework every winter so that it doesn't overwhelm its spot.

Many climbers can be grown free-standing and kept to a large shrub. That's how I first knew Madame Alfred Carriere, and it was exquisite at about 6 ft tall with a very woody trunk. I espaliered it on a wall behind my garage and it is a monster with very sharp prickles. I don't get to see it much back there, and I think this is the year that I take it out. I'm tired of fighting it.
Anita

My SGMC is very, very fragrant -- and it's one of the few roses from which I can really detect "wafting."

My concern is that Paul Barden found SGMC not hardy for him -- so I wonder how it would tolerate Zone 7?????

Fer sure, I think it would be a smaller plant there than it is here in "La-La Land."

And, no. Blooms don't get "yucky." Petals drop, before that happens.

Jeri

lilyfinch -- I'm glad I was able to help! If I can offer another suggestion, consider a Type-3 Clematis with dark flowers to grow into 'Renae' as it matures and is trained onto the pergola. The Type-3s are normally pruned hard each Spring and bloom on new wood, allowing you to prune and train 'Renae' without worrying about maintaining any particular rose cane as a "trellis" for Clematis stems which must remain from year to year. Typically, the Type-3s start blooming after the main rose flush, continuing until late Summer. You'll have some overlap of bloom between the two (I don't know how much 'Renae' blooms during July/August).

Two Clematis that come to mind as possible companions are 'Gypsy Queen' and 'Negritjanka' -- I think they'd look stunning against 'Renae' and the pergola if you intend to paint it white (I think you mentioned that...). There are plenty of others in the purple range which aren't quite as dark but will also look really good. If you haven't already done so, look through Brushwood Nursery's website -- and check the box to show "out of stock items" to see their full inventory.

"Secret Garden Musk Climber" is relatively new for me. I first received it as a band in Spring 2013, but last year's horrid Winter was too much for such a young and only moderately cold-hardy (in NJ) rose. So this Spring I purchased it again, this time as a gallon plant. It has a few canes substantially more mature than what the first one achieved, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed that it makes it through this Winter. I have mine planted in a bed with limbed-up arbor vitae, in a bit of a tight spot but which gets plenty of sun. I know it will eventually spread wide as well as tall, and I already have one cane weaved into an arborvitae. I'm hoping that this provides a little extra protection as well as support -- and I look forward to seeing its white blooms poking through the evergreens. It's not overly thorny, but those it has are substantial -- large and hooked, perfect for snagging itself onto a support.

From what I've read here, 'Mme Alfred Carriere' can get rather large -- and I mean tree-climbing large. True, this might not be the case where you are, but I'd still consider carefully if you want it on your pergola. If you are able to train it against your house, that might be a better spot -- if you don't mind it reaching the second story. I was actually considering it for the Japanese maple in front of my house after my 'Jaune Desprez' didn't survive last Winter. Instead, I decided to use the 'Baltimore Belle' I already had instead of ordering another Tea-Noisette which might not be able to handle Winter here in such an exposed location.

:-)

~Christopher

Here is a link that might be useful: Brushwood Nursery

One thing I would definitely consider is Renae is totally prickle-free. Enjoy her anywhere blood loss might be a turn-off. MAC, though beautiful and nicely scented, has flesh-ripping, small, sharp, blood thirsty, nasty prickles. Secret Garden, though with significantly larger prickles, doesn't snag nor rip me as easily nor frequently as MAC did. If mildew is an issue where you are, MAC is the only one of the three which seemed addicted to it here. The other two have never suffered from it. If it helps, Renae and Secret Garden are still in my world. MAC went away. Kim

Yes. Sadly, MAC mildewed for me, as well. It's too bad, since it's a great bloomer, and so very vigorous ... but . . .

SGMC does not mildew here.

And another thing I enjoy about it ... birds nest in there, and bees are drawn to it.