In the seventies at uni, everyone (particularly the girls) had a copy of The Golden Notebook on their shelves, and said how wonderful it was (including me). However, how many people had actually read it was a rather small minority, I suspect....

She's been short-listed for the Booker three times, most recently in 1985 for The Good Terrorist.

Beyond that, I know little of her. I think I thought of her as a "women's novelist" and didn't have much interest.

I've only read one book by her, Mara and Dann, which is a futuristic dystopia that explores the widespread effects of climactic disasters (ice sheet covers Europe and draught plagues southern Africa) on civilization. I thought it was a compelling read, but is probably not one of her best. I've got several of her books on my wish list, though. I suppose I've been waiting for myself to be in the right mood and frame of mind to try them.

Correction: draught should be drought.

I was reading about her on the Internet and although she was appropriated by feminists when "The Golden Notebook" came out, she made a statement to the effect that she really did not (does not) consider herself a feminist author.

I just read the yahoo article on this and find Harold Bloom's comment a little insulting:

However, American literary critic Harold Bloom called the academy's decision "pure political correctness."

"Although Ms. Lessing at the beginning of her writing career had a few admirable qualities, I find her work for the past 15 years quite unreadable ... fourth-rate science fiction," Bloom told The Associated Press.

I enjoyed "The Good Terrorist" and gave it to my sister to read and she did not. I was never able to find anything else by her that I liked.

I am unqualified to comment on her longer works, but a standard short story in high school literature books (at least here in the US) is one of hers called "Through the Tunnel." It is wonderfully written, and has always made me think that I ought to investigate her other work. I would give her a try, definitely.

I'm going to find The Fifth Child to read in honor of her Nobel. I've always meant to read it, though she called it "a horror story."

>find Harold Bloom's comment a little insulting:

This should not be a surprise. This is a literary critic who approves only of books and writers written by men prior to 1900

Why is it that women like Lessing, who were pioneers in their field, often reject the 'feminist' label? The word simply means 'Belief in the social, political, and economic equality of the sexes.' Based on what I have read about her, what part of her isn't a feminist?

That being said - I tried reading her ages ago (mustve been college) and couldn't get into it. But I am willing to try again - any recommendations to start with?

I have not read any of her works. But this is what the Associated Press story had about her today:

"LONDON - Doris Lessing pulled up in a black cab where a media horde was waiting Thursday in front of her leafy north London home. Reporters opened the door and told her she had won the Nobel Prize for literature, to which she responded: "Oh Christ! ... I couldn't care less."

"I've won all the prizes in Europe, every bloody one, so I'm delighted to win them all, the whole lot, OK?" Lessing said, making her way through the crowd. "It's a royal flush."

Asked repeatedly if she was excited about the award, she held court from her doorstep and noted she had been in the running for the Nobel for decades.

"I can't say I'm overwhelmed with surprise," Lessing said. "I'm 88 years old and they can't give the Nobel to someone who's dead, so I think they were probably thinking they'd probably better give it to me now before I've popped off."

Surrounded by members of the international media in her flower-packed garden, Lessing was dismissive of the Nobel  calling the award process graceless and saying the prize "doesn't mean anything artistically."

She acknowledged the $1.5 million cash award was a lot of money, but still seemed less than thrilled.

"I'm already thinking about all the people who are going to send me begging letters  I can see them lining up now," she said. The phone in her house, audible from the street, rang continuously.
*******
*******

OK--she's old; she's grouchy. But couldn't she show some grace? Maybe the Nobel committee should spare her more problems by giving the money to charity.,

Actually, that made me laugh. Think about it - you're eighty-eight, you're tired, you're worried about your son who is in hospital, you've just come home from visiting him, and on your front door are loads of reporters shouting at you. You've been shortlisted so many times that you've given up. I think her reaction is quite understandable. And at least it's honest.

Here's a more considered reaction from her, from the Guardian, presumably after she'd got in, taken her shoes off and had a cup of tea and a sit-down.
I was coming back from the hospital with my son Peter who was sick. I stepped out of a taxi and there were all these cameras, a whole posse of photographers. As this street is very good for that kind of thing, I thought they were shooting a soap or an episode of Morse or something. But it was me. So I first heard that I had won the Nobel prize for literature from the reporters.

It is the most glamorous prize, and naturally it has got a lot of prestige, which none of the other prizes have, so it's the icing on the cake. At one point, sometime in the 70s, they [the Nobel academy] didn't like me - they said they didn't - but they seem to have changed their minds. Committees are like that. Of course I didn't expect to get it. I've been on the shortlist for 40 years. It is good to be the 11th woman on the list, I'm only sorry that one of the first or fourth or the fifth wasn't Virginia Woolf. But I don't think it is helpful to talk about writers in terms of male and female. A lot of British writers have won it, which is good. We produce a lot of good writers. I've been talking non-stop all day. I've spoken to my publisher and agent and old friends who rang me up, which was very good. There were lots of people who have wanted me to have it for a long time, so it is very nice that I have. I'm exhausted. To celebrate I'd have to go and buy champagne. I'm going to bed.

I enjoyed The Good Terrorist greatly. Next I picked up The Fifth Child and liked it well enough. I turned to The Golden Notebook and simply couldn't read it. Never tried another.

>Think about it - you're eighty-eight, you're tired, you're worried about your son who is in hospital, you've just come home from visiting him, and on your front door are loads of reporters shouting at you. You've been shortlisted so many times that you've given up

I agree with martin.

>So I first heard that I had won the Nobel prize for literature from the reporters.

I would have reacted the same way.

>I'm exhausted. To celebrate I'd have to go and buy champagne. I'm going to bed.

You go, girl

Remember when Tom Cruise and his wife had their baby, and the press accused them of 'hiding her' away, with all sorts of speculation with what was wrong with her? For crying out loud they wanted some privacy. Even public figures deserve that.

Thanks to Martin for printing the article from the Guardian, to balance matters. I found her honesty and candor refreshing! Also, many writers are very private people and do not react well to unexpected, in your face crowds. Bravo for Lessing!

I like to read Matt Cheney's blog from time-to-time. I find him especially well informed when it comes to speculative fiction, and even when I disagree with his opinion, I very much respect his opinion. Anyway... he gives a nice summary of Lessing's novels.

Here is a link that might be useful: Personal Thoughts on Doris Lessing

A link to a short video of her learning she won.

Here is a link that might be useful: Doris Lessing

I've read a couple of her short stories and The Fifth Child and my daughter has a copy of The Golden Notebook which I must borrow given to her by a then boyfriend who was trying to improve her mind and planning to live in a garrett, starve and write.
nb she now has a BF who earns a regular salary and is much more fun.

Here is a link that might be useful: Doris Lessing in the Daily Telegraph

I adore Lessing. Her earliest works had a great influence on me when I was a young woman living as an expat overseas during the sixties, and was learning to live independently in cultures not my own. That was what DL excelled at. These early works usually don't appear on lists of her work, since she achieved her fame later, with The Golden Notebook, which I also loved.

In her early Children of Violence/Martha Quest series, and her collections of short stories, she recounts tales of life in Rhodesia and South Africa, describing the complex cultures of those countries through the adventures of her many characters. Her writing style is beautiful, very accessible. The Children of Violence books are roman a clefs (don't know how to pluralize that) about herself. Early on, she was a Communist, as were many white southern Africans who protested the racist policies of S. Africa. These folks weren't Communists in the Stalinist sense, but more in the "just society" sense. She also had an exceedingly lively personal life, which may be why she doesn't identify as a feminist. She loved men, while being constantly fed up with them! IMO she has always considered herself to be sui generis and therefore won't identify with any movement now, and she certainly wouldn't feel close to today's gender feminists. Who cares if she thinks this way and if she dissed the Nobel Committee. She has always lived her life on her terms and that's what's most interesting, at least for me.

Some of her early works, which I purchased in Israel in the sixties, and don't know if they're available any more: Winter in July, a novel which critics raved about; Five, novellas about Africa, and my fave, African Stories. These are all about an Africa that has disappeared, but are invaluable in understanding that part of the continent, aside from the fact that they're so well-written. I may be prejudiced though, as exDH was a white South African who fled the apartheid regime, and he verified all that she describes. I never read anything after The Golden Notebook, as DL veered towards sci-fi, which is not an interest of mine.

Two other great African women writers are Olive Shriener (The Story of an African Farm) and Nadine Gordimer.

sable, thanks for that - I've been wanting to know more about her writing and you gave me a good summary

>She also had an exceedingly lively personal life, which may be why she doesn't identify as a feminist. She loved men, while being constantly fed up with them!

So feminists don't have a lively personal life? And they all hate men? Being a feminist does not make one a man hater, a lesbian, an outcast or a dim dull person. All being a feminist means is that you think that the genders should be equal in economic, political and social areas. Thats all. Any hate that comes up comes from individual people who do not know what the word means.

>IMO she has always considered herself to be sui generis and therefore won't identify with any movement now,

This I buy

sorry if I'm a little off topic, but I learnt that Lessing is her second husband's surname, she was born Taylor.
Miss Rodham met Mr Clinton, then they married and she became Mrs Clinton
Is still normal in the English speaking countries that the wife
drops her surname to take her husband's one? or the two mentioned above are a kind of excepitons?
or may be only "famous" people use to do it?
but just right now has come to my mind that also my English teacher uses her husbandÂs surname,(Ill ask her as soon as I see her)
unless that Piaggio is also a British last name
because here in Itlay not even my mother, born in 1936 has ever dreamt to use her husbandÂs surname
and she has always used and still uses her real surname.

grelobe

grelobe, that is so interesting. Is that the case throughout Italy or only in certain areas? In the US, many women now choose to keep their original surname rather than take their husband's, though the majority (in my experience) still take their husband's name. It was unheard of for a woman to keep her maiden name in the US until (maybe?) the 1960's/70's.

Cindydavid - When I reread my post, I figured that someone might catch me on that remark about DL and feminism. What you say is obviously correct and I should have been tidier with my words. Lessing of course supports equal treatment and opportunity for all. But, recalling her early writing, she was consumed, as were most white southern Africans of conscience, by the racial situation and little else. In S. Africa it was the overarching fact of life for all people of every race, no matter how one felt about it. IIRC, Lessing treated the situations that she found herself in with men as episodes of her own doing, rather than symbols of female suppression.

I hope that you'll have the opportunity to read her early writing - it is truly unique.

Hi sable! (btw call me Cindy, please :) Thank you so much for your clarification, what you say makes perfect sense. And yes I do want to read her, and plan to look for Fifth Child this weekend.

grelobe, that is so interesting. Is that the case throughout Italy or only in certain areas?

No, itÂs a matter of laws, I donÂt know why I wrote my mother has ever dreamt to use her
husbandÂs surname because as a matter of fact in Italy women canÂt choose. When a man and a
woman get married, each of them keep their last names, and thatÂs that. So my mother has got to
sign, official papers, cheques and so on, with her own surname because sheÂs not recognised by the
Italian amministration with her husbandÂs last name.
I found out that my English teacherÂs father is Italian (after two years, more or less) and Piaggio is her
own surname.
She told me that her mother usually gets angry when sheÂs in Italy, because here she canÂt sign with
her husbandÂs surname, but she must use her own, and sometimes they argue, in a friendly way I
guess, about the fact that in my teacherÂs mother opinion, my teacher should sign with her husbandÂs
surname instead with her own. Of course when she's in England , in Italy , I repeat she can't by law.
I donÂt know the grounds of this law, and for sure I donÂt think it is because women in Italy have
always been taken into a higher consideration than in other countries,(quite the other way around),
for instance women in Italy were allowed to vote in 1945, in GB they were in 1917, and in U.S.A.

Another peculiar thing is, that now parents can choose to surname their children with
the fatherÂs one or the motherÂs one or , with both, with an hyphen bertwen them

grelobe

grelobe, thanks for the explanation. Given the way women's names have been traditionally changed upon marriage in England and the U.S., I made the wrong assumption that it was the same throughout Europe. Keeping one's own name makes a great deal of sense, though I have to admit I was happy to take my husband's surname when I married since my maiden name was hard for others to spell and pronounce. I have one friend who kept her own name when she married and they used her husband's last name for their sons and her last name for their daughters. A bit confusing for the school, I'd imagine, but I thought it was a good way to use both names.

grelobe, here in the UK most women take their husband's surnames when they marry. The exceptions are usually 'professional' women doctors, lawyers etc and probably writers who keep their 'maiden names' for convenience.
I have noticed that many US women keep their maiden name on marriage and so have two surnames. Is this a traditional thing in parts of the country or widespread, or is there any legal reason for it?

My name is Benson; my wife was first married to a Mr Sumner, took his name, and had three children with him. When she divorced, she reverted to her maiden name, Greaves. When she married me, she kept her name. So the five of us used to cause confusion when we booked into hotels as Mr Benson, Ms Greaves and the three Sumner children!

My daughter's name is Benson, by the way - if she'd been a boy, she would have been Greaves.

(We seem to have got somewhat off the subject of Doris Lessing...)

grelobe that is interesting; here in the South West, we have a very large Hispanic community. Some use two last names, some hypenate the names, some just use the dad's name for the boys and the mom's name for the girls.....Makes record keeping and searching for files an absolute nightmare!

(veer) grelobe, here in the UK most women take their husband's surnames when they marry. The
exceptions are usually 'professional' women doctors, lawyers etc and probably writers who keep their
'maiden names' for convenience.
I have noticed that many US women keep their maiden name on marriage and so have two surnames.
Is this a traditional thing in parts of the country or widespread, or is there any legal reason for it?

Yes, itÂs the law; women canÂt take her husbandÂs surname. So they have to sign any official papers
with her own surname, and they have, on their personal documents, their own surname

(cindy) grelobe that is interesting; here in the South West, we have a very large Hispanic
community. Some use two last names, some hypenate the names, some just use the dad's name for the
boys and the mom's name for the girls.....Makes record keeping and searching for files an absolute
nightmare!

We could do it, but on my knolowedge almost nobody takes advantage of this; just out of habit and
perhaps cultural-tradition, children are surnamed with the fatherÂs one
grelobe

Thank you sable,you read her.

I found The Golden Notebook boring. However, I liked African Laughter (about four return visits to Zimbabwe), Under My Skin, Walking in the Shade, and The Fifth Child.

Grelobe, Italian law may not recognize the husband's name for a married woman, but do women use their husband's name in private life? I am wondering because an academic colleague of my husband's thanked us both in her Acknowledgments in a book along "Liane and Umberto Eco". (OT: Our friend is Italian-American, born in the original ghetto in Venice. She has a holiday home in the same village as the Ecos.)

A recent phenomenon in Sweden is the custom of some men to take the wife's name on marriage if the wife happens to have a more interesting name than any of the ubiquitous patronymics ending in -sson, such as Johansson. If the bride has a noble name it is not allowed for the groom to take it. I know one man with a Finnish surname who took his wife's name and has kept it after they divorced. In the Uppsala University electronic catalogue of employees there is even an entry for listing either maiden name or "bachelor name".

Most married Swedish women still take the husband's name but more and more keep their maiden name. I would have kept my name if it had been shorter, and if I'd known that my husband's cousin with the same name would become a famous writer and filmmaker. There are only two of us in Sweden with this name and we are always getting mixed up.

Mariannese
My mother has always been known, mainly as Mrs Garaventa and not as Mrs Ferrari, and most of the
time sheÂs used to introduce herself with my fatherÂs name. My wife , as far as I know, has never said
, I am Mrs Garaventa. But old habits are hard to die. I mean, my wife and I work together, so a few
client of ours (old) call me Mr Gualco , evidently they think my wifeÂs using my surname like they
are use to do in private life.

grelobe