I know our pond was discussed in detail on some koi forums, it was bought up by Roddy Conrad (many years ago) he discussed how we manage to successfully maintain clean and healthy pond practices with aggressive water exchanges and a separate biological pond. I read many of the posts with Roddy but unfortunately missed yours. Water changes and flow thru systems have of course been a cornerstone of fish keeping, from fish farms and hatcheries to backyard ponds forever. Many of the Japanese growers seem to have flow thru systems, but most of us don't have a stream/river in our back yards for that so we have to make due with water changes. Up until the last few years most of the discussion in Koi Ponds has been about how frequency relates to keeping fish alive. In the last few years it's changed by a very few people to frequency relating to other things like clear water. algae control, and increasing fish growth. It's new so interesting to me. What surprised me is that you are already basically doing the 24/7 drip thing except once a day instead of 24/7 and hose instead of drip. Your volume is right in the range of 10-70% per week (varies by goals). And you've been doing it for a really long time so that's good data. Not sure how long Andy Moo has been doing 24/7, he's been around a long time too. And of course you're also using your hose as a TPR and basically the same as vacuum. Whether dirt is pushed to suction or suction is moved to dirt the result is the same. And you're doing it often. Pretty much all the people I've dealt with who wanted a bottom system as a option (not required for fish load) wanted it solely as a convenience. They just want a pond for looking at fish after work and don't want to pick up a hose. I do not belong to any of these forums, ( I did try briefly, however they were beyond snobby) as they have very expensive Japanese koi and they have sterile ponds, (meaning no rocks on the edges) also their filtration systems cost many thousands of dollars and they are quite snobby about their koi and ponds. Hell they don't even consider butterfly koi to be koi. Every forum seems to have a single specific type of pond that the 20-40 dominating posters have. Every forum says they accept all kinds of ponds but that sure isn't true. They'll say "all ponds are different, and that's great" and then launch into telling people why their pond is all wrong. But that's forums, protecting their little world. I most read pond forums that sometimes have good info but I don't find much reason to post very often. I've learned a lot about that I might be able to adapt to other ponds and more importantly so I understand these systems. Aquarium forums are even better for learning but I never post in those since I've never even had an aquarium or are interested in one. But those folks sure know there stuff, lots of test data. I think the hard it is to keep fish alive the better the forum because they have to take everything more serious. Fish farming forums are good too. If it don't pay they don't use it. However, the main reason I won't frequent these koi forums is because with all their expensive and super elaborate filter systems -- many of them they still use PP to help clear their ponds. I don't get it, why subject your fish to dangerous chemicals? If you systems are so wonderful why do they need chemicals and uv lights? You can see the amount of trouble I could get myself into frequenting these forums. :) Besides, my koi are mutts. I haven't seen much in those forums about PP use for general maintenance in several years. Occasional use by few for a specific reason. Or maybe they just don't talk about it. There's been better filters developed since Roddy was talking about PP and way easier to use, and pretty cheap, oxidizers have become available since then too. They need those things because they keep a different kind of pond than you do. For example for me to do the kind of water changes in San Jose would have added about $80 per month to my water bill since they use a tried system. While $960 a year isn't a lot I kept the water clear enough for me using other cheaper means. It's just a choice thing. For my next pond I can design a pond specifically to include 24/7 drip so I can reuse the waste water for landscaping. Here in Phoenix we water the landscape all year, and use a lot of water for that. So the water from the 24/7 drip will be basically free. Free and completely automated me likes. I know Dr. Roddy Conrad from another forum that we were both members of. We got along well,( but I did disagree with his PP practices.) He knew our set-up that why he was able to explain to the koi forum members our set up and aggressive water exchanges. "Successful pond husbantry practices " he called it. I don't remember if the other forum members agreed with him. Probably not. The Doctor that lost all the koi in his pond (twice) was that from on overdose of PP? I don't think I've ever posted directly with Roddy but have reads hundreds of his posts. He may have taught me more about ponds than maybe anyone else, especially when I was first learning about koi keeping. I've just been interested in learning different techniques and don't really have an opinion on whether it's good or bad. Just a tool. A hammer is good for driving a nail, not good for opening eggs. The tool itself is neither good or bad to me. I don't find a lot applications for PP but when needed and useful it works fine. But I'm sure happy Roddy took the time to teach me how to use PP, it's effects, and it's downsides through his posts. I'd be happy to buy him dinner any day. Plus his explaining, experimenting and providing lots of early data on Trickle Towers was very important to the hobby imo. And he took a lot of crap from the peanut gallery to boot which taught me a lot about forums which has helped me in developing software. TT popularity may have been short lived in the Koi Pond world but lead to even better filters. So I take what I can from those forums and just try and stay out of the crap...as best I can.

Hi, Ladies-I received my box from Mary Ellen (mellen) yesterday & wanted to list all the great gifts received when I had the time to take it all in & didn't want to miss anything she sent. First, I love camels & sheep. Wherever & whenever I shop I always look for these items. I can find the sheep quite a bit but camels are almost impossible to find. This great lady found a magnet & a key chain with a camel on them. Also sent a sheet of stickers with I (red heart)camels on them. I was so pleased with each of these & can hardly believe she found them. I love them!! Now for the rest of the contents: a large hershey candy bar which my DH & I enjoyed tonight while watching Wheel of Fortune. With my love for chocolate it was quite a feat for me to share!, a darling inspirational Wind Chime, a Finch Feeder Magic Thistle Sock which the birds will enjoy,(I do intend to put thistle seed in it so they will enjoy more than the sock) character plant ties with frogs on them,(darling),a magnetic shopping pad, garden marking pen for outdoor use, (maybe this one will last on my WS markers),Turtle Sundae & Cinn Ful Nut coffee, a votive holder with my initial on it & lovely scented candle, lavender Hand Sanitizer, bath soap gel, & the following seeds: Cosmos(cosmic orange), Cosmos "Daydream", Nemesia,"Masquerade",Achillea "Summer", Sweet Pea (Lavender Flush, Pink Hyacinth Bean Vine, dark purple Delphinium, Delphinium, "Magic Fountains", Blue & Lilac-Pink, Giant Fuchsia Foxglove, Knautia (pastel), Dicentra,(I will be looking this one up) & Ornamental Cucumber. I hope I haven't missed anything. I am sure much thought was put into all the things sent as most were on my list of wants. It was such fun seeing each thing that was sent & Mary, I thank you soooo much! You made this RR so very special for me & I do so appreciate it. Sounds like all the boxes being received are just great & it has be a delightful RR, reading all the posts & getting to know each of you a little better. Margaret (Thanks Mariann, for the tag)

Thanks sassy for the frog pics. I just love them. I found a new site lately for picture storage and I think I may set up an account with them as you can make your own web address off of their site as well or so I've heard. flickr.com is the site ever hear of it. If anyone is really into taking pictures, like I am with my digital camera this would be a site for you to explore into. You can search numerous picture subjects and wow, what results all has there to share with the public. Some photos that I never thought I would have taken an interest into using as a subject has caught my eye and peaked my interest enough to say, wow, I'm gonna try that. Well worth your time to check it out and see what ya think,anyway. Just search whatever comes to your mind on what you would like to see and walllahhh, it's there in all forms. Beth, Hope your dog doesn't butcher up your lovely plants to much. I guess choppin them up with the tail is better than ingesting the foliage though. Better that end than the latter,huh or you could really have a mess on your hands. Do you have any begonias in your indoors collection, a couple kinda looked like it but I can't really tell as I'm just starting to get into the houseplants again. When my kiddies were wee little ones I gave up my houseplants for their safety but now that they're nearing graduation I felt, huh, I think it's safe now. I got a begonia plant from a garage sale and the leaves are gorgeous but I'm not sure exactly what window I should be putting it into. At the moment its in a north facing window, should it be in a south defused lighted window. Susie, did you run out and make snow angels or catch a few snow flakes with your tongue? Remember doing that as a child? Gotta keep the child spirit in all of us alive by nourishing it. May take a we bit longer to get up and down from making snow angels but just as fun as the very first time. I love all the photos everyone is contributing, this is so much fun. You gals really have some great shots to share with our group, Thanks Peace Char

Rosewitch, England was definitely one of my favorite places I have ever visited. My folks took me there when I was 14, and I remember bits and pieces the Crown jewels, walking amongst the Stonehenge stones (roped off now, vandalism), Stratford upon Avon. Time for me to take my own 14YO. Im trying to think how I can get over there for a whole summer, LOL. Dlynn, I could have worked so much more. I didnt really look at night time stuff and there was loads to do. Greece: cant help you, but shoot Yasou a line, she went a few years ago. LOL Annie! Teresa, well go together. I wanted to explore more cooking and food shops/stores but didnt get to. Terri, here is more a link to Pictures of England, a website pointed out to me by Denise. I started it on Bourton on the Water, where we stayed for a few days. Thanks Sharon, I was actually thinking how can I even come close to posting her quality of travel guides, I dont do the pictures she does LOL. We might have sat at the same table in the Cheshire Cheeses dining room! Sawdust still there, but we didnt make it to the cellar. I missed a lot of the British Museum. It has changed.check out the new atrium. I couldnt keep up with DH and DS16. Afternoons, when I planned museums, I crashed. Next time! Pam, lots of people did more than we did per day! Theater every night, more attractions, I cant imagine. Gina heh heh yeah I need another vacation like a hole in my head. Speaking of whichDH has another week off in August. Nooooooooo! Kathleen, DH says he took an average of 200 pictures a day. Yup. Me, I just buy the post cards or Google the images, same thing (DARFC from the photo bugs here) Cathy, thanks for giving me the War and Peace moniker heh heh. Next time I go with CF friends! LindaC, I know. Im still exhausted. Speaking of the V&A, did you know there was a Dale Chihuly chandelier in the entrance room?