no no no no~~ Shiny stainless steel is about the worst choice for a roaster! Something dark works so much better. My favorite roaster for using with a lid ( and I use a roaster for other things besides turkeys!) is an old dark blue enameled one that belonged to my grandmother....the brand name is "Savory" and they are still being sold on ebay and other places. I also have a roasting pan very similar to the one in the link below. It holds a really big bird....doesn't have a cover...but if it's browning too fast I can tent it with foil. And that dark pan makes nice crispy bits for gravy and goes very well over 2 burners. It has been said that if you cook your turkey with a lid, you are steaming it not roasting. Shiny stainless is not only a poor conductor of heat....but hard to keep looking like that. If you want a roaster to use to make wonderful roast turkey, buy a dark one. Linda C Here is a link that might be useful: roaster

I've made gravy after using an oven roasting bag with no problem. It isn't really pale if I remember right. You can always add just a drop of gravy master if you want it darker. Or make a roue, letting the butter brown slightly, then use the drippings and broth to finish the gravy. I've only cooked about 4 turkeys in my 53 years, so maybe someone else can help more. Happy Thanksgiving Tami

Flour makes gravy thick. Cooling gravy gets very thick too. However, what has been said is that floured gravy that is cooked at a high heat for a long period of time will eventually lose its thickness. The key is that the floured gravy is cooked at a high heat for a long time. Something happens that results in a breakdown of the flour's ability to keep the gravy thick. If you normally don't heat your gravy at a high heat for extended periods of time, you would never encounter this situation. It's similar to the idea that browned flour, such as is used for making a traditional dark roux, doesn't have the thickening power of a lighter colored roux. So boiling a thin, floured gravy may not result in a thicker gravy. Not unless it is boiled enough to actually reduce the liquid quite a bit. "Sauces thickened with starches should be reheated carefully, as they will lose some thickening ability if reheated to a full boil."

I have 3 turkey legs I just bought this morning. I'm getting ready now to cut 3 celery stalks into 1/4's; 1 large diced onion & 3 lg carrots cut into 1/4's. I saute them for a few minutes and add parsley, salt & pepper. Then I brown the legs into this mixture until brown on all sides. Then add water to more than cover the legs & veggies, add a hpg 2 Tbs of chicken soup base & simmer until legs are tender. I then freeze this mixture when cooled, until the day before the big day. (I also remove the meat from the legs & dice real fine & add to my broth for extra full flavor for the gravy.