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2littlefishies

Old World vs. Classic Kitchen--trying to figure out what I want

2LittleFishies
12 years ago

For the last several months I have been using the below pics as my inspiration kitchen. I didn't know what it was "called" but it seems it's Old World.

We plan to use a mixture of Danby Marble and Walnut countertops and wood floor. I love the off white look with the rubbed black island but also don't want it too aged. I want something adaptable. I did look at some old world kitchens using a google search and some are more Old World than I'd probably go for!

Anyway, I also fell in love with this Brooklyn Townhouse space last week on Houzz and it's the same colors I'm looking at. I think what I love most is the brick mixed in with everything. I love the ceiling also. The coloring is all what I love. SO, what style is this???

eclectic kitchen design by new york architect Ben Herzog

traditional kitchen design by new york architect Ben Herzog

My KD asks me: "Any further thoughts about old world (painted and glazed) vs. classic (no glazing, simpler molding style)?"

When looking at the above cabinetry I think the Brooklyn Townhouse may be a bit too simple for my taste. I tend to go a bit more formal. But I also don't want something TOO much in one direction.

Can anyone give me a bit more direction here? Maybe more pictures showing some differences between the two?

Also I LOVE the lights in my inspiration kitchen! (I actually already bought them- sshhh!) Could something like that even be USED in a more classic kitchen?

Maybe what I want is what's in my inspiration kitchen-- just taken down a couple of notches.. Less elaborate corbels, less fancy molding, no or minimal glazing?

Thanks!

Comments (60)

  • Mercymygft
    12 years ago

    Get what you like, it sounds like you are drawn to the more fancy/ornate style kitchens. I do like what cawaps said:

    In a nutshell
    1) Lighten up on the glazing
    2) Simplify some of the more elaborate detailing

    And then I think it will be fine. Remember you are the one who will be living with whatever you pick not the members here at GW... no one here will probably even see your kitchen in real life. Suggestions are fine, but don't let us dictate what you should and should not put in your kitchen. Just my 2 cents.

  • gr8daygw
    12 years ago

    Have you looked at Nini's kitchen? Her thread is still on the first page on the Kitchen Forum at least for now. It's called my new house is finished. I could easily see something like this in your house. It's one of the prettiest kitchens I have ever seen. In fact her whole house is gorgeous! Take a look and see what you think!

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  • francoise47
    12 years ago

    Dear 2littlefishes,

    Your gotten lots of good advice so far.
    (I do love that transitions-style CP kitchen posted by Marcolo).
    Creating some kind of happy marriage between
    what you love and what looks good
    with the style of your house should be possible.

    When possible, I'd tweak your design
    to look more classic colonial/New England than old world,
    with your style of house.

    I you google the Boston architect, Royal Barry Wills,
    who started the Cape Cod colonial revival craze,
    you should get some great ideas about styles of kitchens that look good with your house.

    Bob Vila (I know, I know) did a new kitchen
    in a Royal Barry Wills cape on one of his TV shows.
    It featured lots of the corbels and decorative details you like.
    You can view it on line at:

    http://www.bobvila.com/sections/tv-shows/projects/11-modern-colonial/episodes/131-kitchen-cabinetry-and-countertops/videos/1091398857001-installing-marble-kitchen-countertops

    Here is a link that might be useful: Cape Cod

  • Mercymygft
    12 years ago

    gr8day... Good call with nini's kitchen! Her kitchen is classic, not boring with enough design elements to make it really pretty and interesting, but it is definitly not over the top and I believe it will stay current for years to come. I know I love it!

    Here is a link that might be useful: Nini's kitchen

  • lavender_lass
    12 years ago

    Bob Vila is a misunderstood genius! (LOL) Okay, so maybe no one else sees it, but I did learn a lot, watching the reruns of This Old House :)

    Fishies- If you want old world in your home, then for goodness sakes, just do it! We can all give you advice, but at the end of the day...it's your home and it should make you happy, when YOU walk in the door. Maybe it's not what would be expected in your home, but as long as it doesn't seem completely out of place, then I think it will be lovely.

    What I like about your original pictures are the plants by the window, the arched window over the sink and the arch over the range, those beautiful pendants, and the window seat. The cabinets are very nice, but what I think is important is not so much the glazing, but the fact that ALL the upper cabinets have solid doors. This keep the eye from being distracted from the arches and other details, by the everyday dishes or odd and ends, seen in your second kitchen. Those glass doors by the range would ruin the look of your original kitchen, IMHO.

    As for the brick, it's very nice, but you also have a 'brick look' in your tile backsplash, in the first kitchen. It's a traditional element that looks good in both kitchens. Just stay with traditional off white cabinets, wood floors, maybe some black accents, a bit of topiary, your beautiful pendants and maybe a curve or two. It will be beautiful...but don't start displaying your cabinet contents. If you want to show off some fancy dishes, get a hutch or put in a plate rack. Stay with a more traditional vibe, not casual country. Hope that helps :)

  • palimpsest
    12 years ago

    The other thing you need to analyze is scale. All of your inspiration kitchens are probably one-and-a-half to two times the size of the kitchen space allotted in a typical cape.
    Too much detail will overwhelm a small space: you will need to simplify most elements shown in your inspirations. It doesn't mean you can't use versions of those elements though.

  • dianalo
    12 years ago

    Pal hit it on the nose. I was about to post that fancy kitchens need to be done to a certain size or they look even smaller than they are. Just like grander/large furniture should not be crowded into a smaller room.
    My part of the Northeast is full of cape cods and their kitchens were done small considering the scale of the house and the more common 4 bedroom layouts. Other styles, with 3 bedroom layouts, and presumably fewer occupants, had larger kitchens.
    To me, a cape cod has a more modest and charming appeal. It is warm and cozy as opposed to spacious and opulent. The decor does not work with the architecture if it is too modern or too fussy. The arched window would look lovely because that is a warm fuzzy kind of detail. The fancy carvings, columns, glazes and corbels are more appropriate in other style houses.
    While I think the plate rack is a nice idea, I also think that glass front cabs are entirely in synch with a cape. It is a working/homey look that you are after. Open shelves would fit in as well.
    I think if you think of the vibe of your house as charming that would serve you better than fancy.

  • lavender_lass
    12 years ago

    Fishies- Maybe you should post your plan, so they can see how big your kitchen is...and that you want to open it up to the dining and living rooms. Maybe some pictures of your furniture, too. It's easier to give advice, if everyone can see your entire plan and how it works with the rest of your home :)

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Thanks again everyone! Some great comments here that I will certainly take into consideration. I'm making eggnog cookies with my 5 yo so I didn't get to research all the responses yet..

    Love Nini's Kitchen! Very beautiful : ) I think part of what drew me to my original inspiration kitchen was that it had elements that stood out. I know the OTK is very "in" and in my area the last 5 new/newer kitchens I've been to have been white, with marble, soapstone, and black granites, marble backsplash. I don't want to get lost in everyone else's kitchen.

    Anyway- we are extending our house so I think our kitchen will be a pretty good size even though our 3 BR house is small. I will post pics. I would definitely say our house is more the warm, cozy, cottage type so that's important. However I don't care for country or open shelves in general. I think more of a traditional feel as lavender stated.

    Existing photos:

    I won't show my awful kitchen... lol

    Here's the existing vs. proposed plan

    A general plan. We're still working on it and deciding about dining room banquette. Perhaps just a table, but we like the banquette even though I've received mixed reviews here. I put a link to a past thread at the bottom.


    Here is a link that might be useful: My Thread About Layout, Furniture, etc

  • _sophiewheeler
    12 years ago

    Small "bumpouts" for a kitchen area are just about the most expensive type per square foot remodel that exists. You end up having to deal with redoing siding, roofing, insulation, HVAC, plumbing, electrical, flooring, wall coverings, and everything else. A more cost effective addition would be to keep the kitchen in mostly the same location and take over the dining room space to add to the kitchen space. There will be much less plumbing and electrical work needed for something like this. Then do a larger "plain box" addition to the rear with a new dining room and family room space. You'll still be dealing with all of the roofing, siding, HVAC, but the actual cost of the addition per square foot will be much lower, and you'll end up with a larger living house for the amount of money spent.

    And, while you can show up to a high school football game in an evening gown and diamonds, and no one will say anything to your face, you can bet they'll all be pointing and talking behind your back. A pair of jeans and a nice sweater would be so much more appropriate to that venue. You can still do a simple pair of diamond studs with the sweater and jeans and it will look great. But no visiting Harry Winston for replicas of the Crown Jewels.

    It's the same with that first kitchen and your cute little house. No one but a stranger on the internet will tell you the truth that it is completely ridiculous to put it into a Cape. You can still do a nice white kitchen---and still use those lights you've bought--but everything else needs to be almost plain. The lights, the pulls, the backsplash and a few other decorative touches will be the jewelry to the "little black dress" of a simple white kitchen in a little simple white house.

  • lavender_lass
    12 years ago

    Wow, that's a little harsh. Laughing behind your back...and comparing a tasteful traditional kitchen to an evening gown and diamonds at a football game? Sounds like you're trying to be Marcolo...but fell a little short :)

  • sis2two
    12 years ago

    Love the photos of your home. Really nice.

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    OK, well I think I mentioned in my OP that the inspiration kitchen should probably be taken down several notches "Less elaborate corbels, less fancy molding, no or minimal glazing". (Maybe to some of you- so much so that it is a totally different kitchen! ha) 4 or the 5 KD's I met said the same. They never were that dramatic about it and didn't mention it was based on the style of of our house but said it was too formal and a little over the top basically. Being we haven't hired anyone yet they probably didn't want to be too opposed to it so I wasn't turned off by them.

    I get the point.

    ..And that's why I posted the question to begin with so I can find a happy medium for our kitchen. BUT one I still LOVE and is beautiful. I know simple can be beautiful... "plain" OTOH does not sound so beautiful.

    holly- we can't do the renovation you suggest as we would be getting too close to our pool (and we already will be at the max for lot coverage allowed here.) The max we can do is about 7 feet along the back. That's why we're doing what we're doing. Our kitchen will be in the same spot (just losing the eat in area) and the dining area/room will gain some space b/c now it's only 8 1/2' wide. Pretty cramped! I think your comparisons were a bit much but I do like the one about the "little black dress".

    sis2two- Thanks : ) That made me feel better. I know it's not much but we love it. We came from a new construction almost 3x the size but we didn't like the area too much. SO, we moved to a very desirable area and this house is what we could afford. Amazing what location does for home prices. Anyway, this house feels more like "home" to us than our other house did and in addition to loving the area, I really feel a connection with our house as well.

  • mpagmom (SW Ohio)
    12 years ago

    I really like the last photo posted by cawaps (and I'm looking at cabinet style only - not the ceiling, light fixtures, etc). It gives you some of the details you are drawn to without being too ornate. I could see it fitting the scale and style of your cape. I also like the plain white finish without a glaze for your house.

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    mpagmom- Me too! How would that compare with the photo I posted below that one?

  • chris11895
    12 years ago

    I also think the glaze won't fit the home and if you keep it simple you can still add in some of the elements you're drawn to like the corbels, the arched window and the lights. I know you mentioned you like the brick in the townhouse photos. I once went through a cape style home and they had recently done the kitchen. They kept it simple with white shaker inset cabs and the white they used was a really nice cream but not yellowy. Turned out it was Behr Swiss coffee, which looks tan on the card. Anyhow, the house was all hardwood and the kitchen layout was very similar to your proposed plan. So in the area in front of the sink and stove, which was a long run in front of an island, they inset brick into the hardwood Floor in a herringbone pattern. It looked really sharp and it also had a warmth and charm that just clicked with the house. Anyhow, if you're drawn to adding brick or a stone you could come up with a creative way to bring that element in.

  • mpagmom (SW Ohio)
    12 years ago

    2LittleFishies - I think most of that works, too. You'd have to eliminate the too-fancy details like those corbels (the cawaps corbels are so nice, aren't they?), but I bet you could make that line of cabinets work for you.

  • cawaps
    12 years ago

    2LittleFishies, in your interior photos I see corbels on the fireplace and what looks like brackets spaced out in the crown molding. These would probably be a good place for you to start in figuring out how much and what kind of detail is appropriate for the kitchen. Maybe some closeups?

  • mpagmom (SW Ohio)
    12 years ago

    Cawaps, you are a good detective for picking those out! There is also an arch in the front door, so an arch in the kitchen would not be out of place.

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    mpagmom- Yes I love the cawaps corbels! They are lovely!
    Great picking up on the arch on the front door

    and cawaps- you're really good : ) I'll take pics of the fireplace tomorrow. However, I'm not sure if that will get changed in the reno.

    chris11895- Interesting idea about the brick! I'll keep that in mind. Does a brick backsplash ever work or are they fake bricks?

  • doggonegardener
    12 years ago

    Fishies,

    Love your house. Very nice.

    I think marcolo and pal have hit it on the head here. It's about scale and context.

    This is something I have to struggle with as well...on the outside of our house. Our house is a "folk Victorian". It's not a Queen Anne. While they may share some of the same types of details...scale and number of layers is important. I have to pull myself back in looking at the outside of the house when adding details and gingerbread and the likes so it doesn't look like lipstick on a pig. Knowing when to say "when" is the key. The principal is the same for your lovely kitchen.

    I like the option marcolo posted. It's scaled appropriately and the amount of detail is appropriate to your house style. You would walk into that kitchen in that house and feel at home, like it had always been there. Your photos of the Ben Herzog kitchens could work too, in my opinion. The lines are clean, the crown is simpler, the kitchen looks to be the right age and scale. Less frufru.

    When I look at the last picture cawaps posted, it's a lovely kitchen but when I look at the outside of your house I don't envision that kitchen living inside. If I look at that kitchen I envision it in a newly built McMansion type house. The scale is overwhelming. The corner posts on the island and the HUGE hood surround kill it for me in terms of scale and believability. The aisles must be 5 feet wide!!!!

    I think you can find a balance. The one thing I would avoid is the glazing. I just think glazing would be all wrong for the house. Whitewash or creamy paint but the off white glazing makes me thing of Cinderell's kitchen...like it's a lovely kitchen constructed of toasted marshmallows...yummy and edible but not real. Just my two cents. Take it or leave it.

    It's your kitchen and you should do what you want. You're the one that has to live there! I ignored a LOT of advice I was offered and even some I had solicited. ;)

    You must post progress pics. Can't wait to see what you do.

    Ne

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Here are photos of the dining/living room molding and the fireplace. We didn't put these up so I don't know if they "fit" the house. The moulding may be removed during reno.. at least in the dining area. We may build around the fireplace but not sure yet.

    {{!gwi}}

    The more I look at the Crown Point Transitional I'm kind of liking it !
    http://www.homeportfolio.com/PLUS/ProductFullScreenPopup.jhtml?prodId=201774

    Here is a link that might be useful: Crown Point Transitional

  • Bunny
    12 years ago

    I love the Crown Point Transitional kitchen! It just makes me want to fix pot roast and bake cookies. I'd take it in a heartbeat.

  • dianalo
    12 years ago

    The CP kitchen is full of charm and is totally believable in your house. It is like a breath of fresh air. Cheerful is a good term to aim for along with charming.

  • marcolo
    12 years ago

    Littlefishies, your crown and fireplace were both recently plopped in your house! The fireplace is Victorian and way out of place. However, I wouldn't consider it an emergency to do anything about it. It sort of works as if it were a separate piece of furniture, and it's now part of the history of your house. But if you were going to do some sort of major built-in on that wall, then I would take it out--in other words, it's quirky but charming as is, but definitely don't use it as a launch point.

    The more I look, the more I see the CP Transitional line in your house. Your house is so cute, and you really need to dance with the one that brung you. Don't be fooled by those fancy patent leather shoes.

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    marcolo-

    I figured that (that it was plopped in recently- I think the previous owner).
    Seems I don't know my design eras too well. Would you be so kind as to post some pics/ideas of molding/columns that would work well here. That was as we add new woodworking to the space we have a better idea. We will be putting new crown in the dining area and possibly the living area too. AND, if we build around the fireplace we'd need a good direction too.

    Being the space will be somewhat open (kitchen/dining/living) and is our ONLY living space we want it all to blend well. If we do built-ins in the dining/living would we use the same cabinetry/line as in the kitchen? Or just keep it in the same style at least I would suppose.. Also, if we do white/cream in the kitchen I'd want to bring in wood tones to the dining/living area... Maybe tie some of it into the kitchen as well to introduce it to the space.

    OK- I hate to ask this and open a can of worms, but how does our existing furniture work with the house? The sofa/loveseat may be moved out but how about the buffet by the front door and the secretary? The dining table? Arm Chairs? Window treatments? It's all from our other house but I thought it looked good together and I really like the pieces.

  • marcolo
    12 years ago

    Simpler is better in your house. But simpler doesn't have to mean stark or cold. I think that's why you don't like the OTK or "classic" look--it's my problem with it, too. It's just too sterile.

    If you need a phrase to stick in your head, how about "Simple but Feminine?" Because I think that's what you want. You're reacting against the severe rectilinear lines of the OTK and you want some curves in your house. That's why I posted the pic of CP Transitional cabinets.

    We're swooping into Christmas week, so everybody may not have time to respond. But to make a quick point, one that answers some questions about your trimwork plans as well as your furniture: When anybody sees your house from the street, they want to give it a little peck on the cheek. It's unpretentious, but adorable. Make sure you keep that exact same vibe going throughout the whole house.

    A lot of your furniture is kinda Victorian but it still fits, because it's not done in a stuffy or formal style, but sweet and cute. So it works. Plus, furniture is different from a built-in like a kitchen cabinet, and it can vary more from the era of the house.

  • Linda
    12 years ago

    Fishies, I'm glad you asked this question, because I find I'm also drawn to the "old world" kitchens, but I also realize that all of that glazing and frou-frou is over the top and not what I'd want to live with IRL(who mentioned looking like living in a model kitchen display?). Yet, those are the photos that end up in my inspiration file. While the CP transitional is a lovely kitchen, it calls out "cottage" to me. If your inspiration is "castle," will you really be happy living with "cottage"?? I do like Nini's kitchen and I also thought the picture you posted of the CP Victorian cabinet line was very nice. Both of those are much simpler than your original inspiration picture, yet more in keeping with that look, IMHO.

  • lavender_lass
    12 years ago

    Marcolo- That was a perfectly wonderful answer and helped me understand, why I like some arches and curves with my style, too.

    Legallin- Oh, you subscribe to the cottage/castle comparison, too? That's what I always tease Beagles about...her house is so beautiful, it's definitely in the castle category (well, at least French manor home) and mine is definitely the cottage/farmhouse! LOL

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    My head is spinning. Honestly. I hope to find a happy medium here. I think Marcolo has given some great comments here.

    Then I think about a home I've been to that is just a typical ranch... but has been decorated so beautifully AND has a glazed kitchen- and everyone loves it. It's not overdone. SO, is it that IRL no one is going to really know the difference? I mean, yes, going completely overboard might be bad, but if the original kitchen was toned down with more simple moulding, corbels, cabinetry (even with a glaze) would it really be all that silly to the typical person? Especially if the adjacent rooms (furniture/wall hangings, window treatments) are in a corresponding style?

    I'm not at all saying you are all wrong. I do see it and I'm glad I'm aware of it so I can be cautious. However, I want to love it and like legallin said "Will I be happy with cottage"?

    Please know whatever I decide it's not against you wonderful people! I really appreciate it!! I meet with a decorator tomorrow and hope to work through this a bit more. THANKS!!

  • marcolo
    12 years ago

    Actually my answer was confusing on one point. LittleFishes' furniture isn't Victorian--I was just trying to explain why it "justified" the anachronistic Victorian fireplace. It's actually all quite Frenchified, at least the case pieces, and I think those are the lines she's attracted to. The CP Transitional line is the closest I can think of to those lines without going all Beauty and the Beast and dancing candlesticks.

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    Looking at the CP Transitional line they show 3 door styles and I really don't love any of them. Of all of them, perhaps the Waterford, but it seems a bit stark in style. Can you use CP's other doors as well with this line?

    I really like the moulding, draped details and the feet but would like a bit more with the doors...

    BTW- Is CP considered low/medium/high end of cabinetry? Do they have a good reputation, etc?

    Here is a link that might be useful: Door Styles

  • marcolo
    12 years ago

    CP has a great reputation for quality. Also for being expensive, unfortunately, but sometimes people find that they work with you on price more than you might expect. You could also show the cabs to your KD and point out the details you like.

    On their door styles, I think what I don't like about the Waterford is the big bottom stile. But CP is a custom company and can do pretty much whatever you want.

  • mtnrdredux_gw
    12 years ago

    2LittleFishies

    You want to be an educated consumer, that's all. And GW is a good place for that, since no one here has ulterior motives (ie we aren't trying to sell you anything) and since many of us are TKO.

    Your house is charming. The dream kitchen you want does not truly fit its style or scale. It is nice to be aware of that, in as much as it could either change your mind, or even "tweak" your vision.

    But if you still want your dream kitchen, then you should ignore us. And I do not think it would be "silly" at all to a "typical" person.

  • mpagmom (SW Ohio)
    12 years ago

    I hope the decorator helps you out. You've gotten a lot of advice here, so of course your head is spinning. Whatever else you do, take Marcolo's sage advice and avoid the dancing candlesticks!

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    mpagmom & marcolo- LMAO! I'll try to avoid them but they tend to dance in my direction : ) Especially the sparkly ones!

    One more thing... when you all refer to scale, you are NOT referring to room size, correct? I feel like 16x15 is a good size kitchen (not huge, of course). You mean more the scale of the embellishments? Scale was mentioned several times and I just want to make sure I understand.

  • mtnrdredux_gw
    12 years ago

    I am, in fact, referring to room size. The average size kitchen today is over 300 sq feet, and first floors often have 9' ceilings.

    If you look at your dream kitchens, I think you would agree they are not in "average" homes, they are in upscale. So they are probably bigger than average kitchens.

    Your kitchen will be 240 sq feet, about 20% smaller than average. I don't know your ceiling heights, but I think they should be kept "low". The size kitchen you are planning seems like the right scale for your home. But it is a different scale than your dream kitchens. Just something to keep in mind when you are trying to get the same look in a different space.

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    My dream kitchen in photos 1 and 2 is 15 x 9 according to the magazine article w/ 8' celings. It was a galley kitchen and they removed a wall to open it up to the living space. However the island ends at 9' it seems. Without the little breakfast nook. It's probably more like 15 x 15 or 16 with the nook and open space before the LR furniture.

    This is opposite the sink wall.. Nook is on the side of the room. It is one big room but the kitchen is the top part of it.

    The Brooklyn Townhouse is 15x17. Ceilings look high.

    [eclectic kitchen design[(https://www.houzz.com/photos/eclectic-kitchen-ideas-phbr1-bp~t_709~s_2104) by new york architect Ben Herzog

  • User
    12 years ago

    I think it is very important to differentiate here - the average US home does not have a giant kitchen and a 9' ceiling. The kitchens in homes photographed and put online, yes, they are a totally different population, but they are in the minority when compared to the average house in the US.

  • mtnrdredux_gw
    12 years ago

    So the first kitchen is part of a great room? That makes a difference in terms of scale. Funny how the great room side looks so different! I guess the island base ties them together but I never would have guessed they were the same room. Is the Brooklyn one open to another room too? It's hard to tell from the photo. I love all the light in that one, too.

  • mtnrdredux_gw
    12 years ago

    Jenny,

    The kitchens posted are not "average", clearly. But I did look up "averages" anyway, because I know we here probably do have our biases and wanted to be fair.

    I didnt bother to look beyond the link below and I dont know if they spec'ed, new old or reno.

    Here is a link that might be useful: fyi

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    mtnrdredux- Yes, the first kitchen is part of a great room. Yes, that side of the room uses the black from the island. If we were to follow this idea we planned to carry it into our dining and living room as well around our fireplace.
    Here is a link to the designer's page where you can see 3 images that show the whole room.... Surprisingly It's not really a huge space.
    http://www.masterkitchenbathdesigner.com/

    The Brooklyn one is just one room. Here is the link to the houzz feature on it.
    It's a great space!

    Here is a link that might be useful: [BROOKLYN TOWNHOUSE[(https://www.houzz.com/magazine/houzz-tour-brooklyn-townhouse-full-of-light-stsetivw-vs~994522)

  • User
    12 years ago

    Mtn - I was thinking more along the lines of the Census Bureau's data from their housing surveys for all owner occupied homes on average across the US ....if you sample only new builds then yes, you'll find larger square footages on average. That is probably what the info from that link was drawing on. Sorry to veer off topic from the original post :-)

  • dianalo
    12 years ago

    New build kitchens in general have larger kitchens than existing homes, but the trend for new builds has been getting smaller in this economy, on average. The average new home will also have a higher than average sale price.

    In a cape, even with extending the kitchen, you don't want your house to feel life half kitchen, half everything else. You don't want your kitchen to dominate in grandness or size in its setting. The kitchen needs to be integrated with the interior, exterior and neighborhood. That does not mean every house or kitchen needs to be the same, but you know when you see one that sticks out like a sore thumb and when one is delightfully unique. The hard part is getting what you want in a dream home to work in your real home. Sometimes, they are one and the same and other times, one needs to lean toward budget and reality. I have seen many a house when a kitchen or bathroom is way better than everything else around it, and it makes it awkward for every room....Think of a casual party and a guest shows up in a ballgown. Now the ballgown can be gorgeous, and it can suit the wearer's style best, but it will feel out of place in the wrong setting.

  • mtnrdredux_gw
    12 years ago

    Jenny, I didn't dig but my guess would be they are using data from the Homebuilders Assoc, not Census Bureau, and i bet it is new homes.

    The national median existing home price is like $162,000. So I dont mind using new home stats with their upward bias, since it so clear neither of these dream kitchens are in $162,000 homes,

  • 2LittleFishies
    Original Author
    12 years ago

    dianalo- That all makes a lot of sense. Thanks! Hopefully the KD, contractor, decorator and I will be able to come up with a good balance for the whole first floor. I think that will be key. We wouldn't want 1/2 the first floor to be what the other 1/2 isn't for sure. Being it's a smaller home, we want to make the most out of every part of it and be 100% usable and user friendly. I think in smaller homes it can be even more essential to have a good plan.

  • dianalo
    12 years ago

    I used to get the magazine "Cottage Living" and loved to see what people did with smaller spaces. I loved the look of the charming and carefully done houses. Our house is not small as in cottage-like, but it is also not a mansion. I think seeing what can be done in a smaller space helps when designing for not so small. Your house is not small, but the look is more of a charming one that an exotic style. If you embrace how nice it is and what it can be, you will have a lovely place to live. When I was younger, I always wanted to be glamorous, but could never pull it off. I looked like the girl next door and wished I could be more grown up looking. Now, many enough years later, I am grateful that I look young(-ish) for my age and had never been at a loss for suitors before getting married, so I wish I could tell the young version of me to be grateful because if one is wishing for something else, they miss what they do have. I still can't wear red lipstick, but am ok with that now that I am wiser, lol.

    I subscribed to Cottage Living for the decor and appreciated the smaller scale once I started to read it. I also love the aesthetic of what were mostly charming homes and the variety of what could be done while also keeping their appeal. The nicer ones were not mini versions of big houses, but were their own proud more modest size. It was my one foray into house porn, so I can't recommend many others, lol.
    It is out of print now, but you may be able to see back issues at the library or if someone is getting rid of them such as on freecycle or CL. I finally parted with mine last year or I'd send them along happily. I tried their old website that was up past the magazine going under, but it directed me to another site, which looked cute too. Apartment Therapy may give you some ideas. You will have a larger amount of space to work with, but the feel may not be far off from what would work for you. My kitchen is fairly large now and yet it was done in a modest way for the decor. Its look fits with the overall scale of the house. If we had done fancy, there would have been a disconnect with the rest of the house no matter how much we updated it all.
    If you have seen a woman who is wafer thin where all the bones in her neck and ribs are protruding, and she is sporting double Es or more, you know what I mean. More is not always better.

  • orcasgramma
    12 years ago

    2LittleFishies,

    That Brooklyn Townhouse is beautiful. I have been following this thread with interest. It seems to me you are learning from the discussion while staying true to your evolving vision for your home. I hope you will continue to share as you make decisions and carry them out and that you have found a decorator who is a good 'fit' for you.

  • fayefit
    9 years ago

    Okay, I'm going to add my opinion to the mix. When I look at the pics of the existing home, I see a distinct preference for French country furniture. Assuming you're going to keep the furniture, have you considered pulling that theme into the kitchen? French country can be anything from chateau grand to cozy cute. I see a kitchen somewhere in the middle. You can go for the moldings that suit the scale of your home and do some subtle glazing, then add some flourishes with the smaller things, like wonderful French-inspired cabinet hardware, custom window treatments done with excellent fabric, counter stools, etc. etc. There are zillions of French country kitchens on this site, of course, for inspiration. Good luck with whatever you decide!

  • laughablemoments
    9 years ago

    Old thread from 2011.