floor above unfinished basement - radiant heat?
buildinginva
15 years ago
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neverdunn
15 years agobuildinginva
15 years agoRelated Discussions
floor over radiant heat in the basement
Comments (20)Insultarp appears to just be a ½ inch foam insulation with a vapor retarder and a layer of aluminum foil. IMHO itÂs just an expensive vapor retarder. I would use 2" of Styrofoam even under an unheated slab but I once discovered a contractor desperately trying to finish a pour so I wouldnÂt see that he had omitted it so IÂm not sure it has ever gotten into one of my projects. You donÂt need a PhD to know that more heat will move to the colder side of the slab and that "radiant heat" doesnÂt exist in a concrete slab or the ground or insulation for that matter. Where does this nonsense come from and why does anyone believe it? On the Insultarp website they claim (twice in two successive paragraphs), "In a heated slab, Radiation is responsible for 93% of the heat traveling downward." Heat energy in a slab doesnÂt know up from down and radiant (infrared) energy needs an air space to exist much less move anywhere so in reality 100% of the heat moving downward through a concrete slab is being "conducted". To slow it down add some insulation....See Morefloor above unfinished basement - radiant heat?
Comments (1)Is the basement heated? We have Nu-Heat under the tile in our M-bath. You can go to their site and figure cost per square foot for the product. It's easy to install. Your tile person can lay it under the tile -- easy to hook up the thermostat, but you'll need a designated elec. line. We also have hot water tubing under North-facing rooms in our house -- a retro-fit thanks to a stupid HVAC guy who didn't plan adequate forced air heat for those rooms. Had we known we needed the hot water heat we could have adapted a water heater for supply; we had to buy a separate tiny boiler. I wish we had the hot water heat under ALL our flooring. Those are now the most comfy rooms in the house!...See Morebest hydronic radiant floor heating for new 2-story with basement?
Comments (25)Since you have chosen warmboard over gypcrete, what was your reasoning behind it besides responsiveness? I am sorry for the confusion. I didn't build a house with Warmboard, I had it in a house where original owner had installed it. It wasn't a house I built. I used it in the sense that I heated the house with it. I looked at the Gypcrete system and somehow feels uneasy about it. Doing a concrete pour over first and second floor does not sound structurally sound to me. Gypcrete has positives and negatives but shouldn't be overlooked because of structurally sound. I think a competent and knowledgeable designer is much more important than which type of system you use. So if you don't have a lot of experienced local people, you have to find experienced people who can help design at a distance. I would start with Radiant Engineering (talk to many companies though). A long somewhat unbiased discussion of radiant: First, it should be noted that radiant heat isn't an efficiency discussion. As people have pointed out many times hydronic radiant systems rarely have a positive payback. They are simply too expensive to install and they never payback if you are installing central air. However, every decision in your house isn't about payback. There are many decisions, such as paint color, cabinet color, cabinet design, many fixtures, etc., that are about your enjoyment of your home. No one has a pool installed because they want it to add value to their house. Radiant fits soundly into that category. Next: A discussion of trade-offs between the different systems. It is important to note that ALL radiant floor systems will provide a comfortable environment to a home that other heating methods struggle to achieve. There are basically five considerations in radiant heat (1) installation costs, (2) operating costs, (3) responsiveness (4) allowable customization and (5) noise (as hot water passes through cold aluminum plates it makes noise). If we look at the different systems we can typically see how they handle each of these things. Warmboard is (1) very expensive to install, (2) it has a low operating cost as it is a warm water system rather than a hot water system, (3) incredibly responsive for radiant heat (able to heat a structure in hours rather than days), (4) low customization and (5) low noise. Underfloor transfer plate systems are (1) moderately expensive to install, (2) low operating costs as they are also warm rather than hot water systems, (3) are somewhat responsive (4) highly customizable and (5) have more expansion noise. Gypcrete overpour is (1) moderately expensive (still cheaper than the two above), (2) have low costs as,they too are warm water systems, (3) not responsive at all, (4) are highly customizable and (5) eliminate almost all noise. Staple up systems are (1) pretty cheap (2) high operating costs as they are a hot water system, (3) not responsive at all, (4) limited customization (they are more limited by physics than design), and (5) are pretty noisy. So looking at Warmboard vs. similar systems - the only real concern from using any aluminum covered plywood system is the noise. Warmboard eliminates expansion noise because of the "special" glue they use to adhere the aluminum to the wood. I can't really tell you how special their glue is, I feel confident they will say super special and their competition will disagree. Warmboard type systems vs. underfloor transfer plate systems - Warmboard is quieter but the loops are not really customizable. Loops are 8" apart with Warmboard, so you can choose not to put warmboard in places but you can't get the loops closer together. With transfer plate systems you can customize the heat of a room by simply moving the loops closer together. This means that you can make the floor right outside the shower warmer than the floor beside the toilet (not many people spend a lot of time standing beside their toilet), but there is more expansion noise. Warmboard is a bit more responsive than transfer plates. Warmboard vs, gypcrete overpour - Gypcrete overpour gives you almost unlimited customization without the noise associated with aluminum transfer plate systems. However, it is not at all responsive. Staple up systems - They are more expensive to operate than any of the above systems but are cheaper to install and easier to maintain. You are not likely to nail through a staple up system with a nice thick transfer plate. Also easier to remodel with staple up systems. TL:DR In the end, if I was ranking a radiant system today - I would probably rank it - underfloor transfer plates > gypcrete > Warmboard. But it is a three way photo finish so it wouldn't take a lot to change the order. Also noisy houses don't bother me at all....See MoreWorth heating/cooling unfinished basement?
Comments (3)If the unfinished part of the mostly is mostly below grade, then it will be naturally cooled by the surrounding earth. There should be no need to add any cooling. Where in the deep south are you located? For the finished section I would recommend adding a zone off the first floor system. In the winter it takes very little heat to keep a basement warm especially in your climate. In the summer it will help dry out the basement....See MoreBuehl
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