Please review kit design, cabinet layout

11 years ago

Well, hopefully I will provide the necessary info to get good answers. If not, let me know what I need to provide- I have read the post about what info is needed, but this is my first try at this type of post so I might miss something :)

I have a galley kitchen in a "rustic" ranch house built in 1976. As you will see in the pictures, I believe the kitchen to be original. Kitchen is in the SW corner of the house, the windows are all with backyard views. Directly E of the kitchen, through a cutout is the family room with a window on the front yard/street. There is also a little mudroom/utilities and side door to the S of the family room, behind where the washer/dryer closet is in the kitchen. N of both the kitchen and family room is the living/dining area. The dining is right off of the kitchen and has 2 sets of french doors to the back deck. The living portion is sunken and has a stone fireplace the entire height of the wall on the front of the house. The ceiling is cathedral with 4 rustic wood beams (cedar?) from side to side. Bedrooms and bathrooms are to the N side of the lr/dr.

We need to update the kitchen, but can't afford a complete renovation- so no tearing down walls or extensive electrical/plumbing. Trying to stick to around 15K or less. Generally, the set up of the appliances is pretty good in the current kitchen. I am going to change the location of the dishwasher to the right of the sink rather than on the left side where it is now. That will I hope give me room for tableware in drawers/cabinets to next to and above the dw, next to the dining room. It will also open up the counter across from the fridge for prep.

Options in town are basically HD or Lowes. I have been to both, and am strongly leaning towards Lowe's. I like the Diamond Reflections cabinets, style Gresham, painted in "Cloud". Here is my mood board so far:

Basically, I would like to know if the quick cabinet layout that the guy at Lowe's whipped up for me is missing something that I'll wish I had gone for. It is mostly drawers, but not completely. Will I want a regular cabinet for all my trays, platters and cookie sheets? Or is something else better? I'm not even really sure what I need to be asking, so I welcome all help. I just want some input before running down to Lowe's and ordering so that I'm not unhappy later. I've hopefully attached the Lowes cabinet plan, then the more detailed measurements of the kitchen from a different source- ignore the cabinet info.

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Comments (9)

jesshs
Original Author
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Why didn't my pictures load?

I followed the directions below for inserting pictures from the web- photo bucket account?

Here is a link that might be useful: FAQ pictures
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jesshs
Original Author
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Here is a link to the kitchen pictures.

Here is a link that might be useful: Click here for photobucket album w/ pictures
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Thanks, everyone! This is SO helpful! So, for using the baskets" ours is more of a "laundry traffic management" system. We each have our own (they are actually Bungalow Scout Junque Trunques - pretty huge!) - so Mom, Dad, Daughter #1 and Daughter #2 each have their own spot for laundry. We don't actively keep dirties there or sort with them, everyone keeps their dirty laundry in a hamper in their room and then it comes down to get done. Then when dry, it goes in their own basket, they take their basket to put the laundry away and the basket comes back to the laundry room home base. That's why the kind that sits in a pull-out drawer, or even the rolling wouldn't be as ideal (we have a three-story house so the laundry is traveling all over. rococogurl, can you send me a link or take pic of those baskets though? I'd love to see what those look like - and it certainly saves me on base cabinets since I don't have those?!) That SAID, I am now thinking that since Ikea has those handy cabinets with pull outs that are pretty reasonable, maybe I'll build in two of those for towels and sheets? A big hamper for those would be fabulous and they never fit in our "personal" baskets. Knowing that, what do you think in terms of where the baskets live? That's sort of why I'm focused on the folding, packing in basket, and returning, process. In terms of using a sink, we've had laundry upstairs for 12 years and the ONLY time I've soaked something is when my husband washed whites with a red sock and i was trying to white vinegar out the pink. So, wouldn't say we are big "hand washing people." It's more to have the option - and to have a place to wash your hands which I do want b/c of sticky soap, lint, etc. So, in light of that, thoughts on the sink? The think about our corner is that unless I put a giant lazy susan, it is a dead corner because of the window, so it's sort of why I considered that option? The idea of it by the big utility cabinet is interesting too through (again, rococogurl - thx) - it leaves me the MOST countertop space in one swoop. And, the big utility cabinet is actually for the mop, swiffer, vacuum, etc so there could be some value to it being there? rococogurl, any chance you could take some photos of your laundry room (I won't judge - it's about function!) The washer and dryer are going to be on a platform and then on a pedastal - I just couldn't do that in the IKEA rendering. I'm 5' 11" and my hubby is 6' 2 and our daughters are already tall, so the higher the better! I'm ok not having counter there as a sacrifice for not breaking my back. The only thing that occurred to me after is that I could have run a counter along the wall to the LEFT of the washer - that would have been handy, even if it was just width of a basket b/c I could have set something there and it's sort of dead space now. Hmmmm... I think the plumbing is already in though for the washer, does it need to be right behind it? mydreamhome, if I go corner, what brand is that? it does look like a nice size? Last question to toss out there, I've been struggling wth what countertop material. My contractor has a slab of soapstone that is pretty and could be used for a really good good price. I know soapstone is soft but I guess what I"m thinking of is making it a very CLASSIC laundry room - white subway, simplicity? My house is a 1917 Colonial, so while having a laundry room on the 2nd floor like this is out of period, soapstone is not?! Even if it gets marked up and "loved" over the years? Thoughts? THANK YOU to all of you - I have no one here to help me. No designer and my contractor just executes. My husband has a mantra: "I care deeply but have no preference." So, I really appreciate your thoughts! Alexa
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As requested earlier from Davidro who wanted to understand traffic flow, below is a whole house "sketch" which shows our first floor layout (upstairs is only a loft) and second diagram is where I'm at with regard to kitchen design after input from you guys and after Ikea consultant/designer who was at my home today gave as far as cabinets fitting. Also, from the earlier discussion, I had some confusion about whether I could relocate the washer/dryer to the hall. The contractor who visited today didn't have any problems with the relocation. It helps a lot that our foundation is "pier and beam". Moving plumbing around is a whole lot easier. New location of washer/dryer may be a bit claustrophobic in the hall way outside the bathroom but I only do laundry a couple times a week for short spurts. I'm in the kitchen a whole lot longer and since the relocation of washer/dryer is the only thing keeping me from having the kitchen layout I REALLY wanted from the beginning (barring the fact the pantry has gotten quite a bit smaller), I am a happy camper. I'm going to lie low a while and get our bathroom done and maybe a roof before I come back with any updates on the kitchen. And for anyone who is in doubt, the Ikea prices for all cabinets is half of what price was quoted for Innermost cabinets by Home Depot. And the Ikea quote includes several of the appliances though I'm not sure yet if that is how I will really go. But cabinets -yes - their prices are too good to pass up. The money we save can go for the bathroom we're getting that has a curbless shower, and several other expensive details which Ikea can't help us out on. I'll still be listening but hopefully everyone can see the aisles around the island are considerably wider (maybe even too wide with my feet problems). If I need more pantry space, I'm fairly sure that several of the drawers in the main part of the kitchen will not all be used so I can use them for pantry space spill over if there is any. THANKS AGAIN (though I will definitely be back - still need to pick out countertop/backsplash/flooring/hoodOverCooktop and make decisions about appliances..) And since I haven't marked it well, let me explain that there are upper cabinets on either side of the cooktop and also to the left of the fridge. No uppercabinets on the sides of the "cleanup sink" with the large 6 foot wide window. Think I may wait until kitchen is done and probably install some open floating shelves on either side of cleanup sink - more for esthetics than function but I think I can wait until the last minute for that. (Maybe even some art work...)
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I'm concerned that you are going to find that your deep drawers under the baking center aren't big enough for what you want to put in them. With our 36" high counters and frameless cabinets, we have a bit over 28" of interior height in the boxes - the rest of the 36" is toe kick, cabinet box top and bottom and counter thickness. With 30", you will have about 22" to play - or less if you have framed. Your picture shows 3 equal size drawers - that means 7 or maybe 7.5" drawer face height. It varies a bit depending on the exact drawer construction, but interior drawer height will be about an inch less than that making your deep drawers about 6" deep. We have an 18" wide drawer stack for baking supplies. Our flour and sugar drawer interior is 10" high and 15" wide (those pesky cabinet box and drawer sides take up the rest). We decided on that height after measuring convenient flour storage containers. At that size it can hold a container with the sugars and 2 5-lb flour containers and a few smaller bags and boxes or 1 5-lb flour container and more smaller bags and boxes. We have ended up doing the latter. Our bread flour (because challah gets made every week) is stored there along with corn meal, cocoa, flax seed and some specialty flours. All purpose and whole wheat have to be fetched from the pantry. I wouldn't want to go any smaller than that. BTW, that is in our bottom drawer - since the containers are mostly tall, it requires less bending to get them than having small stuff where you need to reach to the bottom of the drawer. A slightly shallower drawer (7" drawer front) holds other baking supplies like baking powder, baking soda, etc. A much shallower drawer can hold a lot of the utensils. Our main pot and pan drawers are about as deep as our flour drawer. One 36" x 11" (drawer front dimensions - interior about 33" by 10") drawer holds a pretty complete set of everyday pots and pans (we have one for milk and one for meat plus a couple of smaller drawers for parve). Therefore, rather than having three drawers about the same height, I'd suggest a deep bottom drawer (10" interior depth at least), a medium size (~6" interior) middle drawer and a shallow top drawer. That's if you are going frameless and your cabinet construction is similar to ours. For framed, it might be best to go with just 2 drawers per stack. One use for the 9" cabinet by the range would be storing flat pan items such as cookie sheets, baking sheets and cooling racks. If they are half sheet size laying on their sides, that would take up the bottom 13" of the cabinet. We have ours in a 12" wide cabinet and 6 of each plus a couple of muffin tins take up the bottom. We have a pull out for other cake pans above. It might be tight to do 2 levels of 13" high flat pan storage. If you had a fixed shelf in just the right spot, you could do it. Our cooling racks and muffin tins are less then 13". You might do the bigger sheet pans on the bottom and smaller ones like muffin tins above. Cutting board storage is another possible use. Our food processor accessories are in a custom insert that my husband made for a pull out in another 12" cabinet. I don't think they would fit in a pullout in a 9" cabinet, but maybe if yours is smaller they might. 16" is very deep for a bookshelf. Is the cabinet to the right of the range all bookshelf? We have 12" to the left of our rangetop. It isn't ideal, but it works for us. What is the rationale for wanting at least 16" to the side of the range "for safety" when 4" at the back of the range is okay with you? We have an island rangetop and really like having the rangetop and prep sink on our island. But I'd rather have a foot of counter behind the range. If you had the space, you could do 12" deep cabinets on the back of the range. Rather than looking for cabinet companies with nifty inserts, I'd look for how they use the space in the cabinet - how much interior space do you get for a particular size cabinet or drawer. I think that the microwave will be really difficult to use where you show it. It will have to be accessed from the side making the panel difficult to read. Perhaps you are taller than me, but you mentioned kiddie cups so I assume that you have kids. That height and sideways access will make it difficult for your kids to use when they are old enough. I'd put it under the cabinet to the right of the fridge in the snack area. You might at least have an outlet there for it in case you find the other location inconvenient. The open shelves to the left of the sink would bother me. They will interfere with use of the counter to the left of the sink and you have minimal counter to the right of the sink. I'd suggest getting rid of them or doing only one shelf for more clearance between the counter and the shelf.
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The cabinet boxes are 24" but you have to add for the doors/drawer fronts which typically stick out another 1". Then you also have to add an additional 1/2" to 1" for the countertops beyond the door. You have to do that on the cabinet side of the island as well. For example, my counters are 25 3/4" from the wall. If my math is correct, I'm getting an isle of 44" to 44 3/4" at the most on the main sink side. On the fridge side, it will be a few inches less because even with a counter depth, it will stick out passed the countertop in order to open. This brings that isle down to maybe 40" or 41??? I am sorry, but I see no way you can fit seating on the sides of your island. If you skipped the seating and make the island about 48" wide, then you would have very nice sized isles!
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sjhockeyfan325
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Two comments:

If at all possible (I realize it may not be), move the dishwasher and stove so they are not across from each other. Ideally, you'd want someone to be able to open the dishwasher door completely while someone else is standing at the stove (it was a major annoyance in my first kitchen).

Re the trays, platters and cookie sheets. I can't tell where it is you plan to store those, but the best place would be a lower cabinet with dividers so they can stand vertically. You can have the dividers installed by the cabinet company, or can buy dividers (at Lowe's) after-the-fact.
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suzanne_sl
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
If I could help out?

Current kitchen:

Mood board:

Lowe's quickie cabinet plan:

Another cabinet plan:
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suzanne_sl
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
I can't tell from the cabinets plan(s) if the cabinet over the fridge is full depth. I would recommend it as a handy place to store trays and such. This is ours using Rubbermaid vertical dividers:

Have you considered the issue of faceframe vs frameless cabinets? You have a small space and frameless cabinets may make a valuable storage difference to you.

What are you doing about the floor? I love that floor BTW. Our 70s cabinets had a larger footprint than the new ones we installed 2 years ago. This left a 2-or so inch gap between the existing floor and the new cabinets. You may run into the same issue.

One of the things I really like about our new kitchen is the decision to put the dishes in a lower drawer vs in an upper. So much easier! Our drawer is at 90-degrees to the DW, but you get the idea:
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sjhockeyfan325
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
We also had (in our last kitchen) and will have (in our to-be-installed new kitchen) our daily dishes in a drawer, in our case, at slightly less of an angle when standing at the dishwasher than suzanne's because that particular drawer pulled out in the direction of the sink, which was to the left of the dishwasher. Loved the arrangement.

We also had a tray cabinet above the fridge, but I put less-often-used items up there, and more-often-used items in the divided lower cabinet. If you could build out the fridge cabinet to full depth, it would not only be more functional than a recessed cabinet, it also looks great.
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annkh_nd
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Folks here are big believers in drawers (and rightly so!), but sometimes there are good reasons for a standard cabinet. It all depends on what you need. I love the drawers in my new kitchen - but I had custom cabinets built, so I could specify the height of drawers to ensure that my stuff fit (canisters in one, cake pans/pie plates stored vertically in another).

I agree with the suggestions about full-depth storage over the fridge.

How wide is the aisle? I wonder if you would have room to pull the base cabinets out a little, to give you a deeper counter, maybe on both sides. You might even be able to put in 15" deep uppers on the fridge/range side.

The thing that helped me the very most in my kitchen remodel was figuring out what needed to go where, long before I ordered cabinets. Potholders, cooking utensils, dish towels, cereal, rice cooker, cast iron frying pans - you get the idea. I measured everything, and made sure that there was room in my desired locations to put the things I wanted.

Good luck with your project!
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jesshs
Original Author
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Thanks so much for all the input so far!

sjhockeyfan-

I think I mocked it out and the dishwasher opening will just miss the stove. But even if it doesn't totally, I would rather have it be there than its current location right across from the fridge. That causes conflict on a near daily basis, whereas there would be less conflict between dishwasher and stove.

Thanks for your input on dividers in lower cabs, that is kind of what I was thinking also.

suzannesl-

THANK YOU for posting my pics! I will have to experiment somewhere to figure out what went wrong.

As to the cab over the fridge, it is not currently counter or fridge depth. I do not want the wood walls on the side of the fridge. I think that I would feel more closed in then with just the fridge. Plus, as uncouth as it is, I actually put stuff on my fridge on all three sides with magnets. I have hooks with potholders and recipes on side close to stove, kids art on the front and a couple of pics, and calendar and kids school notices on the side by the door. It may not look like a magazine picture, but it is very functional for me. The other reason is that we may not upgrade our fridge right away and I don't want our little fridge to look silly in a big hole. And I don't want to make it hard to pick a new fridge due to size limitations because of a wood box. So because I don't have the side pieces, I think that I am stuck with a standard depth wall cab above the fridge.

I will have to look up what it means to be frameless. I do know that there is no wood strip in the middle of the front of the cabinet.

We are keeping the wood floor.

Love the dishes in the drawer! That is totally my plan- we currently have dishes in the lower cabinets so that kids can empty the dishwasher and put them away themselves :). I was hoping they would fit in the drawers to the right of the dishwasher. Glad both you and sjhockeyfan like the arrangement. Do you guys have special dividers in the drawers?

annkh-

The current aisle width, from countertop edge to countertop edge is 53". It would be less from the fridge to the opposite countertop.

And thanks for the advice on figuring out what would go where. I definitely need to do that, and then see how deep the drawers are in the different configurations and layout what will fit where. Hopefully more will fit then does now. If you look on the far left countertop you will see my dishdrainer, behind it is my toaster oven, then there is a Pampered Chef wooden dowel rack thing with my stones and cookie sheets, cooling racks and cutting boards. They do not fit vertically in any cabinet in my kitchen as the shelf is too low. I want them off my countertop!
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jesshs
Original Author
11 years ago
last modified: 9 years ago
Would love some more input.

I'm toying with the idea of one of those pantry pullouts next to the wall at the end of the run with the stove. How much filler needs to go between it and the wall? What is the minimum width that would be useful for that type of pullout?
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Please review kit design, cabinet layout

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Please review kit design, cabinet layout

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