Hmmm......it honestly does not feel like part of the kitchen to me. It seems like the only reason you would want water there is because the coffee maker is there? I would be inclined to move the coffee pot closer to the main sink and not bother with a sink in that area at all.

by the way....I LOVE your mock up with the drill and baking dish.

I haven't been following your redesign, so maybe you've already addressed this. Is that spot staying as a desk? Because I think a breakfast area with coffee maker, sink and perhaps a mini-fridge is cool, but a coffeemaker next to a sink next to a desk is sort of odd. Do you have a trash spot over there for the used grounds and filters?

I remember this plan, I guess in the planning stages, I remember I liked all of the connecting spaces. it's good to see it all in fruition... Congratulations! I think a small sink would be nice over there. For one reason for quick handwashing or drink of water coming in from outside. It wouldn't work well as a prep sink , but could be a good beverage center when entertaining... & keep all away from main sink. I also think it could be a good selling point. I like that it's so far away from main sink and leaves your island free. So many times people will put veggie or prep sink so close to main sink area, that seems useless.
I know $$ could be tight, but when you look at the big picture- what's another $200 ? Heh, heh..... Don't tell my husband I said that.....

Here is a link that might be useful: granite countertops

Tough call.

It is a great location to fill the coffee pot and keep that out of the way of the main kitchen space. For resale, decking the little nook out as a full "bar" area would (I think) get back the $250 outlay (although I really think you could do it for less).

Having said that, it is kind of nice to keep it clear as an office nook as well (and you wouldn't have to fish crayons and marbles out of the drain).

Geesh, I'm no help ;P

The most useful spot for a prep sink in your layout would be on the lower part of the island just across from the fridge. As it is, you'll be standing in the corner between the sink and the range and the island will get very little use for actual prep. If the island had a prep sink, it'd be convenient for the planned coffee spot as well as keep the prep on the island and the cleanup at the cleanup sink.

What will the counter be? Maybe you can add it later if you feel it's missing.

I think I'd be inclined to skip it unless I really wanted it. It's not really convenient to anything (that I can tell). Of course, you've BEEN there, so you know better.

I sure do like what you've done so far, though!

I think I see the microwave there, too? That pushes me toward a 'yes' on the sink. I could never, though, have a desk and sink on the same counter. I am in the midst of cleaning my desk, which is 42" between 2 walls and has papers from wall to wall at the moment! If there was a sink, they'd be in it.

I like the sink if that is going to be a snack and breakfast zone, but if it is going to be a desk with a computer, printer or other electronics, I'd take the coffee maker back to the kitchen keep the electronics away from a water source, spill potential, etc. One use or the other.

I think it would be really handy for everyone coming in from outside. Also, I know that I would want a place to rinse paint off brushes and other staining things - I wouldn't want to stain the marble where the main sink is. I agree that it would also act as a great beverage center.

I agree with the other posters. If it was going to be used as a "butlers pantry" or bar type area, I'd put the sink in. But not with the desk there. However, maybe you should do all the plumbing and just not install the sink. That way, when you sell, you could always add a sink/faucet, eliminate the "desk" area and say it's a working pantry area.

I guess I'm just not understanding why you want the coffee pot all the way over there when DH has to go to the frig for milk anyway.

Stacey, I was confused at first because your title says "prep sink" so I kept looking at your island. That's really not a prep sink since it's far, far away from where any prep will be taking place.

Where is the microwave going to live permanently? I agree with others that I would absolutely not want a sink next to a desk area. Do you have room for a coffee station where your microwave is set up now?

Your kitchen is already looking so terrific. I am so jealous of you talented DIYers!

Erika

Wow, 10 replies already... you guys are so great :)

Well--- way back when in the design phase, when we decided to move the kitchen from where it was (now the new mudroom and pantry) to the middle of the house where it is now, DH was bummed because he would have to give up his morning coffee-making ritual at that window (east exposure). Moving the kitchen and creating the new mudroom left this "nook" and we needed more storage for food. We didn't want to enclose itentirely since the light and view from that window are valuable to us. So, we made this combo panrty/coffee center/desk area. The "desk" part is not my main desk (I have an office area) and will be used mainly for the kitchen computer, looking up recipes on line or in cookbooks, DH surfing while keeping me company in the kitchen. Nothing too spready, and no other peripherals like printer, etc. Just that laptop and the kitchen phone. We're planning two skinny "pencil drawers" in the knee-space under the counter, too.

So, I'm not terribly concerned about splashing the computer, it's far enough away I think. And I doubt the sink would be used as a prep sink, except possibly at holidays when someone wants to help out. It really would be mainly used for coffee prep (yup, the microwave will be in a cabinet next to the coffeemaker. DH heats my milk for coffee in the morning :)). And-- as hestia_flames pointed out-- a great place for washing really dirty hands, paintbrushes, etc instead of at the main sink with its marble!

So---- knowing its not a main desk area, and won't really be used for prep, just coffee and an extra sink.... do you think that the functionality it offers makes up for the less-pleasing aesthetics (I guess it will look more cluttered and "kitchen-y" with it there rather than a big swath of counter?) by the way- the pantry doors will all be painted white shaker panel (same design as the cherry kitchen) with glass-front doors on the top for china/glassware display.

Thanks to you all for your ideas and kind words!!
Live Wire Oak, the island would probably be the key place if it was a prep sink, but I dont see it used that way, and we also went to great lenghts to keep any fixtures/appliances off the island as we want it to be more table-like.

I still worry a bit about the computer, but really like the reasoning for the sink. Hestia Flames made a great argument, and if necessary, I imagine maybe it's the computer that can find a new location.

erikanh- we cross-posted sorry.

You are right-- the title is totally misleading. I keep calling it a prep sink just because it's small... but really I guess its a bar sink, for the coffee making and simply as a second sink for whatever. (I have never had 2 sinks in a kitchen, so its all theoretical to me!)

The white microwave is just set there temporarily... it's sort of in the traffic path right now, and I dont think I'd want anything permanently there. The new MW is that silver one in the first picture of the pantry shelving. It will be behind a cabinet door, since we pretty much only use it to heat milk for coffee and occasionally defrost something or for DD to make popcorn (kept in the pantry).

Do you guys really think its bad/weird to have a desk next to the coffee center? Even if its just for the phone and one small laptop? I swear we debated this way back in March during my design phase and thought it would work OK with the dimensions I had. Sigh--- there's absolutely no other place for the MW and coffeemaker in the main part of the kitchen. I am adamant about not having them on the counter (that toaster's gotta go soon, too) and the rest of the kitchen is like, all counter and no cabinets to hide stuff in...!!!

idrive65-
I forgot to say, yes... I have planned both a small trash can under the sink for coffee grounds, popcorn bags from microwaving, etc.

I also agree that a sink & desk don't mix...

I also agree w/Live_Wire_Oak...the best place for a prep sink is on the island. Right now, you have very, very little prep space b/w the range & sink where most of your prepping will occur b/c that's where the only kitchen water source is located. The island has no water so it will not be the #1 prep spot w/o you forcing yourself to use it. I foresee conflicts b/w the cleanup & prepping/cooking...not just for space, but for the sink as well. If there are two of you in the kitchen you will be bumping into each other & both trying to use the sink at the same time.

I speak from experience regarding the conflicts, btw...our old kitchen had 24" of linear space b/w the sink & range and my DH & I were constantly bumping into each other as he cleaned up and I prepped or cooked. Yes, we had additional space on the other side of the sink...where the dirty dishes went b/c otherwise I wouldn't have had any space for prepping or cooking. But, that meant I couldn't easily prep on the other side either; plus, the DW was in the way of the other side of the sink. On top of that, we periodically had to fight for the sink b/c even though there were two bowls, there was only one faucet! You have maybe that much space, but it's not linear so you really have less. These issues, btw, were two of the biggest driving forces of our remodel.

Do you plan to keep the MW over in the Pantry area? Do you use it a lot for prepping/cooking? If so, you will find it inconvenient in that spot. If, however, you rarely use it, then it will probably be OK there...but I would still rather not have the sink over there...

On the island it will still be very convenient for washing hands....actually it will be more convenient on the island as the Mudroom door is right there... If you have someone at the desk frequently (I see a laptop there), I'm not sure how convenient it will be to have the sink there...you'll be getting in each others way... Ditto for the MW in that location.

Now, seating at the island. How wide & deep is your island? What are the dimensions of the post?

Unless your island is at least 5' wide (preferably 5'3") OR at least 3'3" + width of post deep, you will not have room for that 3rd seat around the corner. If it's less, then both seats in the corner share the same leg space...so it will not be possible to have 3 people sitting at the island at any time...either the two seats on the back or the lone seat on the side + the "top" seat on the back will be useful. Unlike the layout, the pics look like you may have accounted for that, but I'm not sure since you don't have the counter installed. I hope your counter will have a much bigger overhang than it looks like the plywood counter has...

This is what we had...the corner of the range is in the bottom left hand corner. ...

Stacey, I like to watch DVDs and Netflix shows on my laptop when I'm home alone and working in the kitchen so I often have it set up near me on the island when I'm washing veggies at the prep sink and chopping away. I do keep it well away from any splashing, but I agree that laptops are at home pretty much anywhere in a kitchen. It turns out that sinks are not dangerous to my laptop but my glass of iced tea is! ... I knocked it over onto my laptop keyboard and fried it 2 nights ago! =(

It sounds to me like you and hubby have carefully thought through how you'd like to use that space. And if you call the sink a bar sink and the desk a message area, then the rest of us will probably stop worrying about it. =)

no, i wouldn't do it. I'd have a pitcher of water ready to take there to make coffee. and keep some hand wipes there for popcorn fingers and coffee drips. that's it.

"The island has no water so it will not be the #1 prep spot w/o you forcing yourself to use it."

I have to disagree with Buehl in your case. In our last kitchen we had the fridge, stove, and sink in an L layout with exactly the same spacing except we only had 11" between range and fridge. Our island was a little smaller and turned 90 degrees to how yours sits. Even though the island had no sink, we always used it for prep...no forcing myself necessary. It had the counterspace and the elbow room, and was 33" tall, which was most comfortable. If someone else was using the island, that's when I used the corner between sink and stove, which was decently sized, and since it was a space no one else fought for, worked fine, too. We often had 3 or 4 workers in that kitchen...1 cooking, 1 prepping salad, and 1 or 2 clearing dishwasher/ setting the table. :-) Do I like my current roomy space and my prep sink so so many of us can work together more comfortably? Yes--love them. But you don't have the luxury of that much room and I think it'll be a very functional kitchen for your household. I think a prep sink would fit and be OK if you want it, but I agree that it sounds like you've worked this out very well for your use, and an island sink won't suit all the purposes the other one will.

And I'm loving how your kitchen is turning out! Your island will be gorgeous with the wood top.

Laptops can go anywhere. If you really want a wet pantry, I'd probably put an under counter fridge in that space and use the laptop at the island or in the chairs in front of the fireplace and give it a parking spot on a shelf under the table between the two chairs, slid into a drawer or tucked away in another spot -- possibly a narrow shelf or slide out under a white shelf to the side. I've seen too many leaking or overflowing coffee pots and too many mishaps around sinks to park a computer over next to one. And it seems that just increases the chances of having a glass or cup to get spilled near the computer. And it's not just the computer that could get fried -- a person using it when the spill happens or trying to lift it out of the way could get quite a jolt, especially if it's plugged in.

I do think that a second sink could be handy and that either location could work. I'd probably prefer the island so that it is a true prep sink, but that is with 2-4 people often working in our kitchen. If your need is more to keep the hand washers, paintbrush washers and coffee makers out of your way while in the kitchen, put the sink over there and just know that you'll have to be neat and keep your wood floors dry when you pivot from the main kitchen sink to island or back whenever you want to prep at the island.

Is there any reason why the "desk/message" area couldn't be a wall mounted system on that narrow wall where the Microwave is now (in your picture). That leaves the pantry/bar sink area to be part of the kitchen without the computer.

Something like this (I am sure you can do a much better job)

Here is a link that might be useful: comptuer message center

Would a pot filler work there vs taking the counter space for a sink?

I got more confused reading the thread, so I'm going back to the original questions:

I wonder if the kind of sink they have in travel trailers and boats would work, where the faucet folds down into the sink, and there's a piece of counter top fitted as a cover. That way you could have both, you could seal away the wet when you want to, use the sink when you want too, etc. And not have the faucet blocking the window when it's folded down.

{{!gwi}}

As for the rest, since you say it would take about $25 an a couple of hours to plumb it, why not put in the plumbing and fit the cabinet as if you're putting in a sink? And leave it. Maybe Santa will bring you a sink if you're good. :D

As to resale, I don't think a sink more or less is going to affect it. The window with the lovely view, yes. The recently done, pretty kitchen with newish appliances, yes. One sink more or less in the pantry? It might attract someone who's sink obsessed, or repel someone who's counter obsessed, but it's the general appearance that will have the greatest effect on the most people.

I'd vote no sink. Your countertop is so narrow - will a sink and faucet even fit there? Maybe it's just the photo but it looks like it's not more than 15" wide.

I like it as a desk area, but the sink is going to be so small it's not going to really be functional for anything other than filling the coffee pot. You can walk the short distance to the main sink for that.

I like the window there for sitting and looking out while working on the computer, but don't see you using that sink very often.

thank you!!!

i love pplog's idea... we lived on a boat for two years and the i cooked some of the most amazing meals in my life in that compact galley.... I have seen the fold-down faucets on some new Euro boats (I have been a judge for Cruising World magazine's Boat of the Year contest for the last 3 years) but I think they are quite pricey :(

runyfig- ikea has some neat solutions, too. I think we'll live with the coffee/desk zone a few more days and get a feel for how splashy a sink would be there. it's actually a fair amount of space -the desk is 43" from sink edge to wall... if I need to move the laptop I guess that is easier than finding new homes for the coffeemaker and MW!

buehl- much as I respect your opinion I have to say that the island/prep zone layout is working extremely well for us! The aisles are plenty wide, I have a lot of room between the range and sink but I have been using the island more because I am trying to baby my marble. The trash pullout is on the island just opposite the sink-right under my prep zone- so it is great for sweeping debris into (though I also have a door-mounted compost bin under the sink that I LOVE!). There has never yet been a time that as island prep sink would have been useful. Again- the title of my post was wrong... this sink we're debating is really a bar sink or second sink, not a prep sink. Sorry about that!

caroleh- The base cab is 18" so the countertop is about 21" deep. I can fit a small sink the hotdog way or a medium one the hamburger way :)

I did not go with a second sink and I do not miss it. There have been a few times when it would be nice to have one,
but it just wasn't worth sacrificing both the countertop space and storage below for something I would probably
only use on holidays. When I look at your kitchen plans, it seems to me that an additional sink would take away
from space you might wish you had in the future.

I think a little sink would be fine there, although I think I would center it in that cabinet. That would still leave you room for the coffee maker, give you more desk space, and look less obtrusive. Put some art on that wall above it, and you'll never even notice the faucet there. It is not that far to the kitchen sink to fill the coffee pot, but it would obviously be far more convenient to be able to do it right there. I think that should be the main deciding factor--whether your husband finds it inconvenient to walk across the kitchen to fill the pot.

Can you get a cheapy faucet now and replace it with something more sleek when you recover financially from this remodel?

I understand StacyNeil...we all do things differently and different things work for each of us... We don't drink coffee so if it were me I wouldn't even be worrying about water for a coffeemaker...but I know we're in the minority!

Is it possible to get a coffeemaker that can be plumbed directly into the water & drain...like the ones in our office?

Of course, that wouldn't give you a place for handwashing...

Regardless of what you decide for now, I would do as Plllog suggested and plumb for it while it's so inexpensive...if you decide not to do it now you'll still have the option of doing it later...

Thanks all...

holligator, it can't be centered in the base cab because then there would not be room to make coffee, unfortunately. It has to be centered on the right half of the cabinet.

After another day of making coffee there, DH thinks he WOULD like to be able to rinse/fill the coffee pot right there, and loved that we'd have a sink for the messy brush-rinsing and stuff (of which we have LOTS upcoming) so now HE's voting FOR the sink, while I am now worrying about aethetics and second-guessing it. Sheesh!

I'll go look on line and see if I can find a reasonable, good-looking faucet.....

Will your refrigerator have running fresh water? If yes, that's a second source of water in your kitchen.

Our kitchen is about the size of yours after remodeling. We didn't add a second sink and I don't miss it.

If that area is plumbed, could you put in a cabinet that easily could be access/modified for a future homeowner to add a sink is that was important to them?

My thoughts when I first read this were the same as most of the others--the desk and sink don't mix. However, after looking at the pictures of your kitchen and reading again about how you will use everything, it becomes clearer that this is really an extension of your kitchen more than it's a desk area. Because you have the microwave there, I would want a sink next to it.

I remember your original post as you worked through this plan, and I thought then that you'd come up with an excellent use of that corner for the mudroom and the pantry area and preserving the natural light. It looks great! And it seems like putting the computer on that COUNTER (don't think of it as a desk!) will not be much different from most people using a computer at an island or peninsula.

I don't drink coffee, but DH does, and I made a special large area next to the cleanup single sink (my second full sink instead of a smaller prep sink) for him to have his coffee stuff. I also put our microwave where we both prep our morning oatmeal next to the large window that faces SE (with a double sink--my prep sink--under it) so we can enjoy the morning sun coming in.

If your DH enjoys that area so much, and it functions well for you, it sounds fine.

Anne

Yeah Sink! Have the drinks ref, too. If the laptop is for recipes, its too far away - plus, its always good to have more beer room.

Sounds like the sink is a plus for you. If you might not park a laptop there, think about the other options you have for the sink -- including centered in that cabinet or under the window. You can easily move the laptop around (we're turning our study into an exercise room for the same reason), but you won't be able to move the sink or the hole in the counter as easily.

Well my mom just came for a visit and she's strongly against the sink. She likes that little nook to read as "desk" rather than "countertop".

And- I have to say- I agree with that, it was my whole issue with aesthetics but I wasn't articulating it very well. Something about the kitchen sprawling over there doesn't appeal to me aesthetically, but I guess that is at odds with the actual use of the space, for coffee and snacks. Sigh. I'm being so wishy-washy about this!!

I also spent about 3 hours on line searching for an affordable, unobtrusive, decent-looking faucet and came up totally empty-handed. That right there might make the decision, at least in the short term.

I guess we'll live in the space a while longer and see how we feel in a bit. You're right, we don't have to do anything right away. I can waterlox the counter and install it, and cut a sink in it later if we decide to, right? Maybe after the doors are up and everything it will be easier to figure out. I'm glad it's a wood counter and easy to cut into later!