Kitchen Plan--Please critique NYC small kitchen.

10 years ago

First time posting. Thank you for reading in advance.

I am planning on renovation a NYC small kitchen 11Ã¢ÂÂ x10Ã¢ÂÂ second floor 1200 sq ft apt. I am thinking of changing peninsula to an island, as shown below. And also like to put in refrigerator/cabinet/pantry against the wall in the dinning area ( in front of the bathroom) for storage. We use the small dinning room extensively, as well as all part of the apt :)

I couldn't figure out how to post several pictures. But there is a 40" hallway on the picture below leading to 2 bedrooms ( between the refrigerator on the left and the cabinet/ ventilation hood on the right).

We are a family of 4, children age 8 and 12.
Appliances I plan on having:
Ã¢ÂÂ¢ free standing Rangetop with Oven
Ã¢ÂÂ¢ MW: ? built-in, on the island
Ã¢ÂÂ¢ DW: Standard
Ã¢ÂÂ¢ Refrigerator : French door Counter-depth (CD)
Ã¢ÂÂ¢ Ventilation Hood: Modernaire 36Ã¢ÂÂ

This layout was done 12 years ago when I moved in:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/xfipekc7c8ivz4r/FloorPlanFull.2001.pdf

new proposed layout:

https://www.dropbox.com/s/cx66glexk0qjgzg/1.png
https://www.dropbox.com/s/cy9aj7sin67uljm/6.png
https://www.dropbox.com/s/of7h3m837dgqs63/7.png

Here is a link that might be useful: old floor plan

Comments (6)

springroz
10 years ago
That is a HUGE kitchen! Very nice.

Nancy
ppbenn
10 years ago
Looks like a great use of the space. How much room is left for the dining area? Will you have overhang for bar stools at the island?
Related Discussions
Kitchen Lighting Plan - Please Critique!
Q
Comments (1)
Most lighting designers will want to put the 5" cans over the edge of the counter top to prevent shadows. Many prefer to have two over the sink which is an area that requires high levels of illumination and two overlapping beams of light reduce the possibility that your hands or dishes will block the light. The general idea is to light up your work areas and let spill light take care of where you walk. However, you can do what you drew since you have under cabinet lighting. It is just not optimal. The location of the ceiling joists will have a major impact on where you put the lighting unless you are willing to re-frame the ceiling.
...See More
Critique my kitchen plan please. :)
Q
Comments (19)
We used to have a double oven range like that (small on top, large on bottom) and used the small one all the time. With the amount you cook I imagine you'd use both. but you really have plenty of space so I don't think you need to get rid of the oven stack all together - imagine that your range / cooktop could go on the garage wall where you currently show the ovens next to the pantry. The pantry gets moved to the other wall so that space where the pantry currently is becomes a countertop corner, and you end the run of cabinets with the oven stack next to the door into the school room. This puts a nice run of counter top between 2 stacked elements at either end (fridge and oven stack) which I think would further visually encourage pass-thru traffic to stay on the far side of the island, but would still give you lots of prep area (for baking / oven based items I'd imagine) on the school room side of the cooktop. Basically you'd be almost flipping the positions of the cooktop and ovens (sliding them slightly to the right so they line up with the end of the island.) As for exactly which ovens, I think you've got lots of options - it's just the question of which combination works best for you / your family. From your description it seems like you might be best served with 2 larger ovens. In my Mom's kitchen she has a double oven with the microwave above it and it works out fine although it does put the microwave at a slightly awkward location, though that may work for you if you only rarely use the microwave. If you want the microwave to be lower instead for kid access you could do one oven and a microwave in the oven stack, and then put in a range rather than a cooktop to give you that 2nd oven. This could be a great solution for 2 reasons: (1) allows you to have the primary oven in the oven stack at a comfortable height, (2) gives you a second full size oven for larger items / etc, while allowing that oven to be under the vent hood for cooking items where that is beneficial. And a further option you could consider if you really simultaneously cook a lot of items at different temperatures would be to make the wall oven something like the GE Single/Double - along with the range this would give you 3 ovens of different sizes, with 2 fairly large size ones.
...See More
Floor Plan--Please critique NYC apt.
Q
Comments (8)
I am so sorry that the pictures are so confusing. Let me try again. Here is the current floor plan to give you an overview of the apt. Two bedrooms in the back, 2 bathrooms adjacent to the bedroom , then kitchen, dining room, and finally, living room in the front. Big window that I am referring to is in the living room by the front. This was the drawing done about 14 years ago when we first renovated the apt. The more specific areas that I like to change in the apt this time: completely renovate the kitchen, take out the closet in the living room by the staircase, and put up cabinet /shelves by the front window. This is an enlargement of current layout of the kitchen and dining room ( again done about 14 years ago). I like to replace the kitchen to this (drawn by the cabinet guy). This is essentially the same layout except I asked for the peninsula to be removed closer to the wall with oven and fridge, so that the living room will be 3 ft bigger. Currently there is 7 feet between the wall with oven/fridge and the counter. So I will make it 3-4 feet instead. This is the current area by the window on the right sided ( left sided is similar). Note that the heating panel in the second picture under the window, above the floor. It is our only source of of heat. I like to replace the area adjacent to the big window with cabinet and shelves ( shown below, drawn by the cabinet guy again). I actually like to get rid of the closet adjacent to the stair ( the cabinet guy left it in the picture below) Since the heating panel above under the big window is the only source of heating in my apt, is this arrangement going to compromise the heat or cause damage to the wood cabinet/shelves above? here is another view of what I like to achieve with next renovation, except I want to get rid of the closet in the living room shown below " view E" Please critique the layout and give me advise about the heating panel. I hope this is a little clearer. Thank you so much, Nancy
...See More
Floor Plan--Please critique NYC apt.
Q
Comments (5)
I had a corner sink in the last place I rented an it didn't bother me at all. It was a tight U shaped kitchen, which I found extremely efficient. I actually like a smaller kitchen rather than a larger one. (I find it ironic that most suburban homes have kitchens larger than what you find in the average restaurant.) Also, in an older galley kitchen in an apartment in Chicago, there were 42 inch cabinets that ran the entire wall, including above the sink - or rather in front of the sink. I gotta say, I didn't even notice or realize the difference until I started measuring for my current cabinets and reflecting on all the rental kitchens I have lived in. Shelving is often 12" deep and counters 24" so I guess having a foot in front of me before the cabinet started didn't make me feel like my head was in a cabinet while at the sink. I am curious about the dining table layout, though maybe this is not anything you want to change. Do you spend much time at your dining table other than to eat and would you like to spend more time there? I have adored having an eating space and sofa close together. I find that I use the table so much when they are paired together. And it is nice to be able to sit and eat close to somebody who is lounging on the sofa. So for that reason, if this were my home and space permitted, I would move the new double desk area to where the dining table is. I would push the sofa and living room set up along the entire front wall, over into the area that you have designed currently for the desk. And, I would put the dining table in front of the bookshelves that are going to be on the other side of the kitchen, so in the area where you are planning on putting the arm chair. I have no idea if this meets your needs or how you would feel about the desk area being where your table is, but I would so much rather have a big open flow between eating and lounging space, and have my workspace more cordoned off. Keep us posted. It is so refreshing to see a city space posted here. And, I love your drawings.
...See More
rosie
10 years ago
Hi, Nancymark. To start, you don't say what needs all these changes will meet. What functions are you hoping to improve over the original layout?

Very importantly, is there no way to work within the original footprint to get a kitchen that will function for you? What kind/amount of cooking does your family do?

Why do you want to move the refrigerator to the back wall of the dining area?

What will an island do for you that a peninsula would not? Or, why do you want an island?

Regarding your current proposed layout, on first glance it seems to miss achieving improved functionality, not only because the refrigerator is now back in the dining area, but because of the positions of the potential work surfaces in relation to the work triangle.

An efficient triangle would normally be defined by your movements from refrigerator to sink to stove--working within that triangle, but the island surface is outside that and so is that really nice counter space to the right of the sink.

It would be helpful to examine, right in the beginning, any assumption that a sink should/must be placed in front of a window. Why? What makes rinsing lettuce and dishes so much more special than drying lettuce, chopping onions, measuring spices, beating eggs, and so on and on? :)
nancymark111
Original Author
10 years ago
Rosie,
Sorry for MIA. Thanks for thoughtful questions. You got me thinkingÃ¢ÂÂ¦.. Here are my answers:

Hi, Nancymark. To start, you don't say what needs all these changes will meet. What functions are you hoping to improve over the original layout?

I wanted to create more cabinet space, so I moved the refrigerator and add pantry to the dining room.

Very importantly, is there no way to work within the original footprint to get a kitchen that will function for you? What kind/amount of cooking does your family do?
Good point. I cook dinner daily from scratch. So I do use the kitchen extensively and we love to eat. We have friends over for dinner but nothing fancy.

Why do you want to move the refrigerator to the back wall of the dining area?

That was my way of creating more cabinet space. I also want to get CD refrigerator which means I donÃ¢ÂÂt have enough space where it is now. My vent hood is going to be 36Ã¢ÂÂ instead of 30Ã¢ÂÂ ( what I have now).

What will an island do for you that a peninsula would not? Or, why do you want an island?

Currently there are 6 feet inside the U. I think I am wasting space there, I usually cook alone. With the island, I can move it closer to the range and create seating on the other side. In addition, I thought I can possibly put refrigerator at the end of L, ie sink, then DW, then counter depth refrigerator.

Regarding your current proposed layout, on first glance it seems to miss achieving improved functionality, not only because the refrigerator is now back in the dining area, but because of the positions of the potential work surfaces in relation to the work triangle.
An efficient triangle would normally be defined by your movements from refrigerator to sink to stove--working within that triangle, but the island surface is outside that and so is that really nice counter space to the right of the sink.
It would be helpful to examine, right in the beginning, any assumption that a sink should/must be placed in front of a window. Why? What makes rinsing lettuce and dishes so much more special than drying lettuce, chopping onions, measuring spices, beating eggs, and so on and on? :)

GOOD POINTS.
rosie
10 years ago
Well, bump mostly, for some new input.

Just for a start, how about, assuming keeping the island,

1. Doing your idea of putting a counter depth refrigerator, paneled, at the living room end of the long counter? Its bulk would help screen and "define away" the sink mess from the living area.

2. Turning the island so that it could be a bit longer and people sitting on the outside would not have their backs to the main living area? The shorter island gives nice work space, though, so this would mainly be extra counter and storage and more seating.

3. If you need storage, do some nice built-ins in the dining area, or even a furniture piece such as a sideboard holding canned goods instead of the holiday silver?
nancymark111
Original Author
10 years ago
Thank you so much for the feedback.
I will talk to KD and get back for another round later.

Kitchen Plan--Please critique NYC small kitchen.

Comments (6)

springroz

ppbenn

Related Discussions

rosie

nancymark111
Original Author

rosie

nancymark111
Original Author

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

Kitchen Plan--Please critique NYC small kitchen.

Comments (6)

springroz

ppbenn

Related Discussions

rosie

nancymark111Original Author

rosie

nancymark111Original Author

COMPANY

BUSINESS SERVICES

GET HELP

CONNECT WITH US

nancymark111
Original Author

nancymark111
Original Author