If she tries to put you on the spot, I would just say "Sorry, we just dont have the time tonight."

If she keeps up trying to guilt your Dh I'd just let him handle it. Guilt is a wasted emotion, your DH has no reason to feel guilty for this situation. Hopefully he won't let her make her problems yours.

I would just say "no", i am too busy. no need to feel guilty, you and your DH have a life. he can say "no" in front of his daughter, no problem. so what she puts him on a spot, who cares.

I would have asked if there was something wrong with her car so that she couldn't drive her own daughter home. With $1200 in support for a girl she rarely sees, I think she could cover the gas. If put on the spot, I would ask mom in front of the girls why she expects someone else to do all the driving. Tippy toeing around this woman does not work, and SM will always see her as the victim otherwise.

Poor parenting peeve #3 - using your kid to do your dirty work.

So, wait, I'm confused..this is BM's other daughter--who has a different dad, right?

I don't understand how or why she could expect you guys to add 2 hours to your already-long drive to do that???

So rude!

JNM, I agree: making the kid do the asking is crap. Classic "stuck in the middle and d**ked over by divorce" predicament.

So, in light of that, the only things I would offer in the way of opinions/suggestions on the question at hand are these:

-First off, try to exhaust all other possibilities before having to commit to it. Even if the other parents involved aren't using their thinking caps, if it's that important to you to avoid doing the extra driving, it's in *your* interest, too, to spend some time & energy seeing how you can get out of it. If all of the other adults involved say that there is NO WAY they can do it, and you still would rather save the time, maybe in this case it's worth suggesting a cab, to be charged to whoever is technically responsible for that leg of the driving. If that party doesn't want to pay for it, put it on your credit card (to make sure the kid gets home & to make sure your payment is documented) and hit them up for reimbursement later. The kid will have to form her own opinions and feelings about parents & extended relations who, between all of them, cannot be bothered to drive her where she needs to go.

-Above all, make sure that the two kids don't get penalized or put in a bad situation b/c they are caught in the middle of their parents' little battle. If the other daughter gets stuck and has to miss school, that's not good, and you wouldn't want to see it happen to your daughter or your daughter's friend from school who's spending the night. Responsibility is responsibility, and sometimes things just have to be done whether we want to or not, especially when it concerns parental (or even just adult) responsibility for minors who cannot drive themselves. I know I don't need to tell anyone on here that. It would be a real shame if the only reason the responsibility didn't get fulfilled was because of post-divorce power struggles between the parents. Bear in mind that if it were a bio-kid needing a ride, it would simply have to be done, by one driving adult or another, no matter what. It's not the kids' fault that the parents are seemingly being intractable about the driving, so remember not to take it out on them or make them feel guilty if it's you or DH who ends up having to schlep.

-That said, though, if you are the ones stuck with the unplanned extra responsibility, don't let the favor go un-repaid ***by the parents***. That's just decent tit-for-tat adulthood. BM and half-sister's parents need to be made very aware that each time you have to go out of your way to assist them, that they owe you one. And if they don't repay favors, you have a right in good conscience to tell them: "the last few favors have not been repaid when I needed YOU to do something for me, so I'm letting you know in advance that I may not be willing to grant any more, so I'd suggest having plenty of backup/alternate arrangements." If you have a nice calm discussion about these types of scenarios at a separate time, ***before*** these things may occur, and open it up for discussion like "how should we handle it when any of us needs a favor from the other? what terms should we agree on to be fair to everybody?", then it hopefully won't become a battle or breed too much resentment.

-Maybe in this case with the extra driving, have the parents pay you back the cost of gas and a nice big fancy coffee to keep DH awake for the extra time.

-make sure the girls, too, learn to make proactive plans, develop alternatives and always try to give as much advance notice as possible to people they are asking favors of. That is, to the best of their ability per their age.

-remember that sometimes it's impossible to plan everything in advance and something will always come up. Everyone ---adults too!--- needs to prevail upon someone else at times, without any advance notice. It happens. So it's also good to model to the kids how to be flexible & adaptable, how to graciously give an on-the-spot needed favor..... and how to return favors too!

with the price of gas and driving every day 30 miles one way just to get to work I personally cannot afford driving anybody anywhere unless I really have to or it is my dear family or friend. Also with over 100 000 mileage on my car I cannot put anything extra unless I must. Extra 2 hours of driving is a lot nowadays. those times are over when people could drive back and forth. he could say not only he has no time but he also cannot afford it. he could also say he has leased car and he cannot go ovet the limit. But actually he does not have to say ANYTHING. I am not driving, period. not his job to explain. It is her job to explain why she cannot drive. It is not like they have good cooperative relationship. It seems like BM refuses to pay CS and overall has rather strained relationship with her X-your DH. In this case doing favors for her is strange. agree with lovehadley: this is just rude.

I would not mind driving DD's brother anywhere. But that's different. My X is not nasty or lazy like BM is and he does favors for me too. BM does nothing nice to anyone and yet demands favors. And by the way her older DD does not even live with her. i still don't understand why.

Agreed, it's not Ima's DH's *primary* responsibiltiy in this case to do the extra driving. Yes, it is on BM to explain why she can't. Yes, ideally there would have been more advance notice (if possible). Yes, there are other adults not even being mentioned who should be asked to drive the girl home. My main concern is what happens if, after all this bickering between the adults and everyone giving a reason why they can't drive the girl, the girl is S.O.L. It's not fair to her, and my point is that this type of scenario happens all too often to kids of divorce (people often focus on the way they may be 'spoiled', i.e. potentially two sets of X-mas presents, but there's also a lot of waiting around for the adults to be done fighting and deciding your fate and it really stinks.) So the way I see it, the only way for everyone to be fair to everyone else (including the kids!) is to have agreements in place for how it works when inevitably one of the parents will have to go out of their way for the other, and (hopefully) vice-versa. Because it can't be avoided entirely... especially if one or more of the parties is *TRYING* to make it hard or inconvenient (which also happens way too often & sux for the kids). It will have to be dealt with, for the kids' sake, but the trick is to find a way of doing it that doesn't make you a chump. This kind of thing comes up all the time, so obviously it ain't easy... and it's inevitable, like death & taxes, apparently....

Serenity, I agree with you, however your answer assumes that we are dealing with a normal, rational person. BM had four vehicles sitting in her driveway when we got there. She didn't WANT to take her daughter home because she is used to everyone else doing HER favors. She NEVER returns a favor. But, to tell her that is pointless.

There was an incident last year, the day SD was to go with her for her half of Christmas vacation. She was supposed to pick up her daughter at 6pm that day. She told DH that she had a party to go to that night so can she pick her up early? DH was going to be at work so he asked me if that was okay. Well, I work from home but I also spend a lot of time in my car, doing my work. I can get a call to file papers at the court and have to jump in the car and go, I cannot always guarantee where I will be and I cannot always sit around and wait. There had been several incidents (I vented my frustration with that on GW) where BM would call at the last minute and change the time. She was supposed to pick up her daughter from school on Fridays and I would be out working or running errands on Friday and get a call at 1:30 or 1:45 (SD got out of school at 2) that BM can't be there, can she ride the bus and BM will get her from the house? It wasn't really a question, BM would call and say she won't be there and if I didn't go get her, the school would call me because the kids have to be picked up by 2:10. It got to the point where I had anxiety on Fridays until 2 because I never knew if I could get in my car to run errands and then I'd have to race to the school to get SD because if she isn't told soon enough, she won't know to ride the bus and BM would always wait until it was too late, instead of calling the school to tell SD to ride the bus, she'd call DH that had to call me and that wasted time. Anyways, you get the point? I was frustrated with her doing this all the time, so when DH asked me if it would affect my day to let her pick her up early, I told him that it was fine, as long as she gave me a time and stuck to it. I told him I had things to do and she said she'd be here at 11 so I said fine. I planned on doing my errands after she picked her up at 11. Well, BM sends me a text message at 10, asking me if it's snowing. I tell her no and ask if she is going to be here by 11. She says that she woke up to 4 inches of snow and had to shovel her truck out and just left. She says she'll be here at 12:30. So, I was upset. I had to get my work done, the courts close at 3 and I had to go into two other counties. I could not wait until 12:30 or later... since I didn't believe she would be here when she said. I told her that she might as well come at 6pm because I can't wait around all day, I have work to do. Then she says I'd "better not be taking HER daughter on serves" with me. and she calls DH to yell at him how she does him all kinds of favors and this is BS and he can forget about her doing him any more favors. What favors? She has told him no, every time he asked her for anything, which is rare. He'll usually figure something out.

The ONLY favor that I know of, she agreed to was letting him pick up SD at 4 on Sundays after she moved, because he wanted SD to be home earlier so she can get ready for the next day at school, make sure her homework is done, unwind, etc. She let him do that a couple of times but revoked it when she didn't get her way in taking SD out of school early. Favors my husband has done for her? He used to pick up her other daughter in the mornings on his weeks and drive her to school, he's taken SD on BM's time when BM had other plans, he didn't prosecute her when she stole his credit card and charged several thousand on it, he's loaned her his $5,000 video camera and when he tried to get it back, he was yelled at by her and her mom. When her car was in the shop, she called him for a ride. When she called him to leave work and go buy band aids for her because her band aid fell off, he finally said no. He's told her no a few times since then and she gets irate when he won't do what she wants. He is finally seeing that she expects him to do things for her but she isn't willing to do anything for him. (I told him he should have figured that out years ago, but he doesn't like confrontation and she is intimidating. She tried to intimidate me, but I didn't back down so now she acts like a victim and acts like I'm bullying her)

On the way home, SD tells us that her sister's birthday party is next weekend. (it's DH's weekend) Then, when she gets home, SD calls her mom and puts her mom on the phone to ask DH if she can pick up SD next Saturday. Well, my uncle's wedding is on Saturday so he tells BM that she can pick her up but she also needs to drop her off because we are going to be at the wedding. (the last time she was supposed to drop off SD, DH got a call and BM made up a reason she couldn't bring her back and told DH that he had to come get her. It was during a Christmas party that we were hosting and we ended up having to leave the party to pick up SD)

I would have your husband ask to speak with the ex directly whenever she has the kids call. If she isn't with them when they call, have him tell the kids he is going to hang up and call the ex and work it out directly so they are not in the middle and he isn't put on the spot. Have him stick to the facts and tell her that he has obligations with other family in setting up this wedding and that she can ask a friend or someone else in this case.

I forgot to mention the part in the above story, regarding the "four inches of snow", when I checked the newspaper for the town BM lives in, the newspaper had a story on the snow (because it's rare for them to get snow) and it said they had a light powdering of snow and kids were making snowmen from patches of snow and there was a picture of the ground, all muddy with a few patches of muddy snow here and there. It wasn't that BM got 'snowed in'. and I was also correct when I didn't think she'd be on time, she arrived in town after 1pm. I had left to do my errands and ended up meeting her in town when she called to say she was there. If I had waited at home, I would not have made it to the courts in time. She didn't see it as an inconvenience to me, she berated me for not waiting instead of thanking me for trying to do her a favor. She did not consider it a favor. (btw, I also sent with SD that day, a bag of Christmas gifts for all the kids, her other daughter as well as her BF's three kids. That was never acknowledged either)

I can tell you what Jonathan would of said,"Sorry...not my problem." Click.

this child isn't even your husbands kid! What brass of this woman to ask this of you two considering the cost of gas and frankly time is money!!! I would of laughed at her Ima.

I think this is a clear case of give an inch......

I so feel your pain! I'e gone through similar situations with my husband's ex. She once asked him to pick up her parents from the airport in town for their daughters graduation because it was snowing, and she was afraid to drive. I had the SUV and had to leave my works Christmas exchange to drive home and meet my husband to switch cars. Had I known all the facts I wouldn't have done it. i would have suggest a shuttle service or alternative. And to make it works she was on Christmas break from her job at school and had the time to do the pick up! She never acknowledged what I did either. I have learned not to expect acknowledgement moving forward and have learned to take the high road, and find balance with not going out of our way too often anymore unless it is urgent or involves the kids. I know, it sucks but she isn't fooling anyone including her kids. Everyone will know you are taking the high road. I have learned to treat my relationship with her in the way I would a coworker I may not like - stick to the facts and don't let your feelings get in the way of reality.

"Poor parenting peeve #3 - using your kid to do your dirty work."

YUP! I am constantly disgusted with FSD's BM. She actually had FSD ask us to leave her house just because it was messy! The bad part was that it was FSD that asked us to come in because she wanted to show me her room. BM calls and tells FSD to tell us "if you are done you can leave now". How sad is that? I gave FSD a hug and walked right out the door while FDH stood there shocked. She could've sent FDH a text or called us directly, but she made FSD do it because she knew we wouldn't take our anger out on her.

On the topic of the OP, we've been in this same predicament before NUMEROUS times. When BM had her daughter (with the stepfather), BM asked him to bring FSD up to the hospital every day so she could see her and the baby. Talk about uncomfortable for FDH! Here his X-wife is having a baby with another man, and he has to be there (for the sake of FSD, of course). Another time, BM's job changed their rules and started to prohibit children from being on the property (safety concerns). So for like 3 weeks, we kept FSD's half-sister on Sunday mornings. BM didn't want us taking her to church. I'm not sure why because we are all the same religion. So FDH granted her request twice before I put my foot down. I said we are doing her a HUGE favor, she's not paying us and we should not be inconvenienced. So we took her to church. The next weekend they had it all worked out so we didn't have to keep her on Sunday's anymore.

To be honest, if it was my FDH and his daughter, he woould've done it. Just for the sake of his daughter. BM would've had FSD ask for it so it would make it sound like he would be doing it as a favor to FSD and not BM. Basically, I would have no say-so in it. I think I would've just stayed home and let FDH deal with the consequences.

Ugh! I just don't understand parents who don't think about their children's welfare.

Ima, from what I understand, BM lives 3 hours away from you in one direction, and BM's mother and other daughter live 1 hour away in the opposite direction? I would have offered to bring sister as far as our house, with grandma picking her up for the rest of the ride home. No way would I have made a 2-hour round trip. It's thoughtless that BM would want you to have to do this for her other child, and unforgivable that she made her 9 year old daughter call to ask.

This so reminds me of my stepsons' BM. A couple years ago when SS18 was 16 and acting out, he stayed out 2 nights in a row, he disliked me and my rules and couldn't live in our house because of them, and told dad, "It's me or her," and wanted to go live with his BM. BM wanted to "save" son from this horrible, wicked Stepmom. DH asked her, since she lived outside of school district, if she would be able to get son to school. She said, "Of course I'll be able to drive my son to school." This was Saturday. On Sunday, son calls our house to ask if he can sleep over since BM cannot drive him to school on Monday. DH says, "Of course. How are you going to get here?" We hear BM in the background suggesting that dad pick son up. I felt terrible for my SS, since he had just said some mean, hurtful things about me, to have to call and ask if he could come back to our house for a night. But I couldn't understand how his mother would put him in that position.

Now that BioMom has moved back east, SS18 goes out to visit her twice a year. We live about 40 minutes from Chicago O'Hare, so DH has always just taken son to the airport and picked him up. The last time, she booked his flight out of Midway, to save on airfare, and still expected DH to do the driving, despite the fact that it is a 3 hour round trip each way. DH called BM and explained he didn't have time to do this driving, and suggested she book a limo for son. She asked if he could do it, pay for it, and she would pay him back. He told her she could do it, and give them her credit card number.

I could not imagine putting my kids in a situation where I wouldn't make sure that all the travel arrangements were done, and I would never leave it to someone else to take care of these things for my kids if I could do it myself.

We've also learned to not fall into the trap 'can you pay it and I'll pay you back?' Then, DH becomes the bad guy for asking for it and she starts complaining that she has no money. He told her last night that the bus pass is 195 and she said she'll pay half in a few weeks but she's broke right now. (he didn't ask for half, he asked how much she can contribute) but seeing it may be a whole other story. I'd like to believe that she will hand him the money in a few weeks without him asking her again, but she's likely hoping he will forget or not want to ask her... or if he does ask her, she'll have some reason or another to say she just can't right now.

Tamar, that's an excellent point... that it was probably worse for your stepson that he had to eat crow after talking about you that way. (but I think it's also a good lesson for kids to think about what they say before they say it because you can't always take it back and hopefully he realizes that now and something positive came from that experience)

The point is that BM has done very little transporting herself, she lets her mom do it for her. I imagine that she (BMs mom) is getting tired of the long drive. she's 73 years old and it's a six hour drive, round trip. Now that school is in session, picking up SD from her school and taking her and the other daughter to BM's house on Fridays and then going back to BM's house on sunday to get her is a lot for her, besides the cost of fuel. If DH agrees to do it once, I'm pretty sure it will become protocol. Sure, we go there anyways and it would save BM's mom time, but it would be an inconvenience to do it all the time, just as it is for BM's mom to do it. In a way, I feel bad because it's not the other daughter's fault and yes, she is put in the middle because grandma doesn't want to get her, mom doesn't want to take her and then DH says no, so I care about how it makes her feel, but I also think she should go live with her mom and go to school there. I don't see why she has to live with grandma and if BM doesn't want her daughter there, then she should have to deal with it herself and stop expecting her mom to do all the driving and now us. (btw, I feel worse about it than DH (for SD's sisters sake, not BM's) He says it's not his problem and he is done doing her any favors. I have to agree but still feel bad BM is doing this to her other daughter) Once probably isn't a big deal but if he gives an inch, she takes a mile.

"gives an inch, she takes a mile"

Don't fall into this trap! It does really happen. My ex has mastered it, with the abuse of-
Poor parenting peeve #3 - using your kid to do your dirty work.
Just this weekend our daughter turned 13-my weekend his year for birthday. 9-5 day according to our plan but my current husband and I agreed to allow her to stay until 8pm because her SM's family hs multiple birthdays they celebrate together and we know it's a pain to leave the party early to deliver, besides we had no big plans that evening. So, my ex has my daughter call at 7:30 she politely thanked me for letting her stay late and told me her dad and step mom really want her to stay the night, but she told them she wasnt going to push it (then why bother calling? she could have said thank you at 8 when she walked in). He puts her in uncomfortable situations frequently. We have a mostly "friendly" divorce and coparenting situation (it's been 10 years nobody is bitter anyore) but often we'll give in to accomodate events he wants to include her in. Once I say yes he just keeps asking for more! This goes on for months, then the one time I say no, he's angry and saying "it's not going to hurt you to let her go" Then I take away any extra time for a few months and we go at it again.
So, anyhow the give an inch take a mile is a nasty dance that never ends!

As for your particular issue, if you have helped out with transpo for SD's sister in the past and you were already making the trip, I agree with the suggestion of bringing the sister as far as your house and let Gramma come and get her. I know it's not your job, but it's nice, makes the girls both feel safe and wanted, and I'm sure Gramma would appreciate the help.
OR..if BM can't be inconvenienced to keep her visitation maybe she should just skip the weekends she doesn't have the transpo figured out. I know not exactly ideal for the child involved but after a missed visit or two -- might motivate mom into participation?

"if you have helped out with transpo for SD's sister in the past"

When DH transported SD's sister in the past, it was when BM lived with grandma and he'd swing by to give her a ride to school, about a mile out of his way.

DH is upset enough with having to drive to go pick her up. He regrets agreeing to it and thinks that BM should do all the driving since she moved. Personally, I think BM should drive BOTH of her daughters to grandma's house and we can pick up SD from there. It would save us time and gas too. Then her daughter could be home early enough to unwind. AS it is now, we get back close to 9, then she has to eat & take her shower and her usual bedtime is 8:30. If grandma had to come get the other daughter from our house, she wouldn't get her home until 10. It's really not fair to both girls because their mother wants to sit on her butt doing nothing, while we all scramble to make sure her kids are taken care of.

As for missing visits, BM has no problem canceling time with her daughters. She has pretended to be sick so we'll keep SD and then found out that she was actually out at the baseball field, coaching her BF's kids. Her priority at the time was convincing her BF that she was 'mother of the year' to his kids. The fact that he didn't notice or acknowledge that she was kicking her own kids to the curb to do things for his... what does that say about him? Meanwhile, DH and I were left to comfort and pick up the pieces when BM cancels time. She wouldn't even do her own dirty work then either, she'd send DH a text to say she's not going to be able to make it.... tell my baby I love her.... BLAHHH

I agree since BM moved she should be doing more of the driving. When my husband's ex and son lived across the state their agreement was to meet 1/2 way at a gas station and if someone was ever more than 20 minutes late they'd be responsible for all future transportation. Of course, now that his ex has moved back to this area (12 miles) she says she's done her part of transportation, and we now do 100%

Since your SD's BM moved can you go to court to modify the terms of her visits? I agree it isn't fair the BM is so uncooperative. I often times remind myself that many parts of our situation are unfair, and that is why they are ex's.

an hour one way is A LOT of driving. maybe people who do not do much driving do not understand. I drive 30 miles one way IN TRAFFIC every day to work. It takes me over an hour to get home every day, up to 90 minutes in traffic. I absolutelly do not drive an hour one way for anybody who is not particularly important for me.

i had to watch my niece today, I had to pick her up at mom's work which is an hour away. In this heat, even with air conditioner on, it was endless drive (in trafic), not only I was exausted, 6-year-old looked she is going to pass out. She could not wait to get out the car. If i would have to drive an hour one way in this heat for anybody other than my dear brother's daughter (or any similar person) i would simply NOT drive. period.

I do not care what BM says, if she is upset who cares. why would your DH care I do not know. It is nice to help others but not under the circumstances wiht crazy BM, price of gas, no CS, and relatives having wedding at your house. Just no.