ANOTHER Sunrise vs Marvin quote Michigan
afireinside7444
10 years ago
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mmarse1
10 years agoafireinside7444
10 years agoRelated Discussions
Restorations by Sunrise, Integrity/Marvin, Jeld Wen, Andersen
Comments (12)I wouldn't dismiss the well respected local "handyman". You'll most likjely get a better job from this guy than you will with a large window company. They might send a large crew of inexperienced laborers with one experienced guy overseeing the job. The larger company will most likely be significantly more expensive than the local guy too. Most experienced contractors would consider window installation as handyman work anyways. I can buy a nice window at the local lumber yard and you'll get all the benefits of the warranty. In my area you'll rarely see homeowners using "window specialists". They simply jack up the price of the window as well as the installation. They need to cover all their advertising, salesman's salaries, and executive bonuses somehow.... Don't get to hung up on the performance numbers. If you like the look of the Anderson or Marvin and you're saving a nice sum over the Sunrise, buy what you like. It's like comparing an ugly car that is more expensive over the car you like because the "better" car gets 27.8 mpg, while the one you want gets 27.7 mpg. I just looked up the Sunrise "authorised dealers/installers" in my area. Looks to me from their sites that they are nothing more than small "handyman contractors"....See MoreMarvin Ultimate Clad vs. Marvin Infinity
Comments (4)The quotes are for a full replacement on my windows. I guess what sticks in my mind is the clad still has wood and has the potential for rot down the road. As for the Infinity it does not seem there is anything to rot on these windows although I am not sure which finish will holdup better in the long run. Another positive for the Infinity is the outside can be painted if necessary down the road not sure that is true the clad. So not sure what is best longevity. Both appear to be solid windows. I am more impressed with the clad dealer who has communicated installation procedures and what happens to minimize damage to the area surrounding the windows on the interior which will leave paint and wallpaper in tact when the job is done....See MoreOkna or Sunrise versus Andersen or Marvin
Comments (26)Please tell me what other aspects that I "side-stepped"? You posted about IGU failures and I posted the warranties relative to that from Andersen and the manufacturer (Okna) that you reference in your link back to another forum. The 20 year or lifetime reference was something that you pointed out. What am I missing? Do you wish to read the entire warranty? Here it is: Vinyl Frame And Sash Members The vinyl extrusions and vinyl components used in the windows and doors are warranted to be free from defects that might result in blistering, peeling, flaking, corroding, and fading of the window or door for as long as you own your home. This war- ranty is fully transferable to the next homeowner. Factory painted standard or custom colors are warranted for a period of ten years. Insulated Glass OKNA Windows Corp. warrants that the insulated glass units, including internal grids, will be free from obstruction between the glass, including film formation, including moisture on the internal glass surfaces caused by seal failure and including small marks, dust, and scratches. This Warranty is fully transferable to the next homeowner and covers glass imperfections as de- scribed in Federal Government Glass Specification DD-04516. Condensation may occur on interior and exterior of windows as a natural result of humidity within the house or build- ing area and changes in outside/inside temperature. This does not indicate a manufacturing defect and would not be included in this Warranty. Hardware OKNA Windows Corp. warrants that the hardware shall remain in good operating condition, for as long as you own your home. Warranty on hardware is also fully transferable to the next homeowner. Specified Metal hardware for coastal applications is limited to a ten year warranty. Exclusions and Limitations The following are excluded from coverage under this Warranty: A. Any damage caused by wind, hail, lightning or other acts of God, intentional acts, accidents, negligence, or exposure to harmful chemicals or pollutants. This warranty excludes damage related to harsh or corrosive cleaning products, application of paints ( non factory applied ), and uniform fading or color change due to weathering. B. Any damage or malfunction caused by improper handling or installation of the windows, or any damage to the windows or components of the windows caused by settlement or structural defects of the building in which they are installed. C. Any defect, malfunction or failure to perform, which has occurred because of unreasonable use, improper application or failure to perform reasonable or necessary mainte- nance - see section " Maintenance & Cleaning." D. Any window, which has been repaired or attempted to have been repaired or modified by any person other than an authorized representative of OKNA Windows Corp. E. OKNA Windows Corp. liability is limited solely and exclusively to repair or replace, at the discretion of OKNA Windows Corp. and under no circumstances will OKNA Windows Corp. be liable for incidental or consequential charges such as, but not limited to, labor cost for any purpose, inconvenience, damage, or injury to persons or to property or any other expense. Procedure And Conditions Of Warranty Remedy The Owner must notify the Dealer/Distributor within thirty days after the defect has first appeared. OKNA reserves the right to inspect any window or door that a warranty claim has been made. Such notification must contain the following: A � Name and Address of the Owner. B � Date of Installation. C � Description of the Defect. If a product meets requirements of this limited warranty, OKNA Windows will at its option, supply replacement parts or product. Labor or reinstallation costs are not covered by this limited warranty. Commercial Application OKNA products installed in a building operated as a multi-family dwelling or used for commercial purposes or rental properties such as schools, churches, apartment complexes, government owned structures, etc. will limit this Warranty to ten years. Product Changes OKNA Windows Corp. reserves the right to discontinue or change any of its products or the parts utilized in any of its products at its sole discretion. If any window product or component originally installed in the building is not available at the time of any claim by you under this Warranty, OKNA Windows Corp. reserves the right to substitute any other model or component as a replacement. During warranty period replacement parts will be supplied at no charge to dealer upon return of defective part. Maintenance & Cleaning A mild solution of household cleaner such as liquid dishwashing detergent may be used to clean windows. Do not use harsh abrasives. This Warranty shall be null and void if harmful solvents are used. You are referencing "pressure equalization" and I reference that in the other post that you made. What additional scientific developments do you think need to happen. Is the fenestration industry going to "UN-INVENT" the law of partial pressures? There is no development needed in "pressure equalization" just better and better sealants and gas impermeable sealants to whatever the inert gas fill is. Andersen learned a valuable lesson with this and did a fine job of warrantying items after the fact when it was discovered that their IGU were gas fill permeable but impermeable to the larger molecules of atmospheric air. There is not much science to develop here. While vacuum IGUs are interesting and exciting developments, they are several years away from reaching mass distribution and acceptance. If you think that gas permeability presents challenges, vacuum presents far more challenges. Temperature shifts do present sealing issues to IGUs but if we can make sure the windows inside pressurized airplanes and vehicles that go outside the earth's atmosphere stay together, something in Desert Valley doesn't seem that tough. In applications where windows go above a certain altitude, breather tubes are inserted for equalization if they are not made near said altitude. The are certain aspects of the window industry that are pretty tried and true and I am not sure you layman's review of their cycle testing is accurate or based in any observable fact. I have been through several factory were they life cycle test these materials and they are comprehensive to say the least. No laboratory can ever truly duplicate a real world environment but they compensate for this most times by making the extremes more extreme to simulate worst case scenarios. The engineers at Pella, Andersen, and Cardinal would probably take umbrage with your less than factually vetted review of their testing and materials developments. Do they have failure rates, surely. This is why you get a warranty. Even in those situations where materials are manufacturer robotically, there is a human hand and potential for error at any number of locations in the process....See MoreMarvin vs Andersen, help me decide? Quotes are very closed
Comments (27)orveusz, You are welcome. I89 is an exposed surface 4 coating. What it does is reflect heat back into the room rather than having the glass absorb that heat. Reflecting back into the room does two things: 1) it makes sitting next to the window more comfortable because the air in front of the window is slightly warmer. This also results in improved U value performance (less heat loss through the glass) 2) because the glass isn't absorbing room heat, the glass is colder than it would be otherwise and this can potentially lead to increased condensation on the window glass if its really cold outside...you know like mid january in Minnesota. Some windows companies are more concerned about this potential than others, and some add disclaimers about this possibility. As I recall, testing by Cardinal has shown that I89 is going to lower edge glass temps about 4° or so, and center of glass about 9° or so versus not using the I89 coating. Is that a problem? The simple answer is...it depends. Primarily it depends on how cold it is outside and how much moisture there is inside. If someone is in a moderate climate then it simply won't be an issue. If you live in Minnesota in January then you might notice an increase in window condensation on the coldest days. Keep in mind that using a warm-edge spacer helps a lot at the edge. In fact, using a warm edge spacer with I89 results in edge temperature that is still higher than using an aluminium spacer without the I89 coating. As to center-of-glass, 9° does sound like a lot, but even with that much potential glass cooling, with a LowE coating and argon fill the center of glass temp is still higher than it would be if all you had is a plain uncoated dual pane glass package. And even in the coldest days (bathroom windows excepted), how often does anyone see condensation over an entire window - assuming that the inside of the home isn't really humid. So will I89 cause your windows to be wetter than they might be otherwise? They might where you (and I) live. But even if it does, it might not be an issue more than a few days during an entire winter. Make sense?...See MoreHomeSealed_WI
10 years agommarse1
10 years agoHomeSealed_WI
10 years agommarse1
10 years agoHomeSealed_WI
10 years agoWindows on Washington Ltd
10 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agoafireinside7444
6 years agoafireinside7444
6 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agoafireinside7444
6 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agoafireinside7444
6 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agolast modified: 6 years agoafireinside7444
6 years agoSteve J
6 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agoSteve J
6 years agoDavid Milford
6 years agolast modified: 6 years agoSteve J
6 years agoDavid Milford
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6 years ago
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