How are you planning to use the nook? Do you need a table and the island seating?

I think you're right, this does look like it would work best for one person. I think I would take out the butler's pantry and move the dining room door to the left side of your picture. This would give you an L-shaped kitchen, with the island...so less traffic through your work space.

If you don't need the wall ovens, I'd reconfigure the kitchen. If you don't need the nook table, I'd keep the french doors, but move the fridge over by the nook window, then have the range (between windows) where you have it now...with the clean up sink and one dishwasher on the wall to the dining room. Dishwasher on the family room side, trash between the sink and range.

Then, I'd put a prep sink on the island, so it's handy to the fridge and range. The second dishwasher could be on the island, so you can have two people cleaning up, after a big party. I'd also have a trash on the island, since this will be your main prep space. The microwave might work well in the island, too.

Last thing...with that many kids, I would make the path between the perimeter and island 4' wide. And if you don't need the nook table or butler's pantry, the kitchen perimeter and island can both be a bit bigger! :)

Here's a picture I like, with windows on each side of the range. There wouldn't be a window over the main sink, but you could add a plate rack, or even a pass through to the dining room, if you like. Hope this helps :)
{{gwi:1434537}}From Farmhouse plans

I agree with lavender_lass -- you can't fit a multi-person kitchen in there without stealing some space from the nook area or the pantry/dining room. When you move towards the nook, are windows and doors fixed or movable?

Draw a bigger room!

I wouldn't put the Range on the Fridge wall.. You will put in the traffic path from the FR and have so little counterspace across from it then. I like it across from the long side of the island. I also wouldn't give up that nice Pantry and think you need the nook with the table for the swarming kids and their friends.. everyone always ends up in the kitchen.

That cleanup sink needs to come off the island and onto the right or bottom wall.. right now your zones are all jumbled up and the cook will be bumping into the cleaner who will be bumping into kids getting a drink or snack.

Cleanup sink on right wall:
If it's important to retain symmetry, you can leave the range centered and cram the cleanup sink and DWs all the way at the bottom of that wall, but that does not leave a lot of room for dish storage by the DWs. Personally I would do something like this (from top to bottom): 24" drawers, 36" range, 39" drawers, 24" DW, 36" sink, 24" DW, 3" filler next to wall so DW won't hit door trim. I would then change to a 36" regular french door fridge, then scootch it to the right on the same wall, and put the wall ovens to the left of it. Also, Prep sink on bottom corner of Island with Trash next to it.

Cleanup sink & DWs on bottom wall:
Cleanup sink becomes a 24" or 30" single bowl so it and the DWs fit. Wall cabinets go above for dish storage. Put a drawer cab across the aisle in the island turned to open towards the DW for additional Dish Storage. A small Trash goes under cleanup sink. Right wall (from Top to bottom): Counter, Range, Counter, Fridge down at the bottom. You have enough room to keep the DOs and Fridge/Freezer combo on this wall - up to you. Prep sink on bottom corner of Island with Trash next to it.

Personally I like the second option best :)

Try moving the fridge to where you show the ovens, and the ovens at the opposite end of the stove run. Move the main sink, dishwashers and dish storage to where you show the fridge. This should leave about 2 ft to each side of the stove, but the full island across, which with the addition of a good-sized prep sink will give you room for your worker bees. ;-) Of course, a bigger space might help, but reconfiguring this one could do a lot.

You could also consider widening the pantry and putting the fridge across the aisle from the pantry door. It uses your butler's pantry space between kitchen and dining, but gives the kitchen more workspace... Trade-offs.

Thanks for the suggestions. I'll draw them out tonight when I get home and post different options.

I'm not tied to the nook. We don't need 3 areas (island, nook, and dining rm) for eating so I can definitely go down to 2 areas.

The window in the nook can be be removed or moved. That wall hasn't been framed yet.

I definitely do need a large pantry with my 3 teen boys. I should have put that on the non-negotiable list.

The other option is to move the range to the pantry wall. I'd still switch the butler's pantry and walk in pantry...so you have space for an L-shaped kitchen with island. The less traffic through your work space, the better!

Here, the main sink has dishwashers on both sides and there's a trash by the island prep sink. You might want to add a trash under the main sink, as well. The range being on the pantry wall...will give you one prep space between the main sink and range...and another on the island. The fridge is over by the nook and the microwave is in the island. {{!gwi}}From Cottage house plans

I'm always in favor of not maintaining 3 dining areas right by each other, so whatever is done here not including a table and chairs right next to "nonnegotiable" island seating.

That said, a dining set wouldn't have to go in that area. Maybe save a few feet for a couple of comfy easy chairs instead, on swivel bases with a little table between so you can enjoy the back garden and send comments over to the FRM area? If your FRM is like 99% of them, it'll present the back of a couch or pair of chairs to the kitchen, making the only seating close to the kitchen those perches on a high stools--reciprocally presenting one's backs to the FRM.

In any case, if you do raid the breakfast area for kitchen space, I'd do a good job of it, shifting the whole kitchen down, etc., and centering the main part on the FRM opening.

BTW, how large is your dining room? When those children are bringing their own for dinner, plus friends, in-laws, whomever, will you be able to put the extra leaves in your table and dine in there?

Also BTW, if you have another exit to the back garden in the family room, you could always put the kitchen-side door to the back garden on the side wall where the window is now. The French doors are very nice, but this would free up that back wall for different use. A couple of ancillary benefits from this: One, you could create a view looking across from the FRM on out a glass door to...maybe just a close vine-covered wall (if your side yard is narrow) with a piece of sculpture or fountain mounted on it, or? This would be much prettier than the gaze stopping at a built-in cabinet aqnd make the room feel airy and spacious, with a relationship to the outside in two directions, and the path leading around could be a very charming walk with just a little good design.

Second would be the opportunity to create a lovely view out windows where the doors are drawn in now, different from what you'd have outside the FRM doors because you wouldn't have to do paving instead of plantings outside that wall. All assuming there are FRM doors, of course.

The dining room is 13'6" by 15'8" -- not really big enough for a large (10+) meal. I'm planning on seating for 8 in the DR.

I will post the main floor tomorrow. I don't have the software on this computer to resize my main floor pic without it getting blurry.

Here are some different options using your suggestions. My sketches are rough estimates. I'm just trying to get the basic layout right now and then I will fill in the rest. Let me know what you think.

Plan A:

Plan B:

Plan C:

I think I like aspects of each plan. Plan A gives me more room for dish storage and keeps the kids out of the interior of the kitchen...unless they need to get a glass and then they will traipse through.

Plan B gives me a larger pantry and the full size refrigerator and freezer. This also gives me more upper cabinets on the stove wall, but the trade off is that the refrigerator and freezer are positioned out of the kitchen.

Plan C is DH's favorite. It keeps the refrigerator on the periphery but close to the sink. There is 3'6" of counter space on the sides of the rangetop.

I tried to graph the suggestion of the L shape with the oven on the short wall, but didn't have enough space for a 6 burner.

In plans A & C, I am deciding between refrigerator drawers or a built-in pantry cupboard to maximize dish storage.

I'm feeling relieved after drawing these out. Thanks for the help.

I agree with your DH. I like plan C best with B a close second. It has good zone separation, the BP right near the DWs will make it easy to put away glasses in what will become a great entertainment zone.

I'm just talking out loud - maybe some stuff applies and maybe it doesn't.

I'm looking at the 42" aisles - they are less than the recommended minimum of 48" for a multi-cook kitchen. Some people are sensitive to stuff like that and some aren't. But I think about what cooking with each other AND the swarm in the aisles would be like ...

People take the shortest route all the time - its not necessarily the same as the route that would make you happiest. So, there is a certain pile-up of stuff that clogs the route to other stuff - again a little uncertain of "The Way of The Swarm". BUT the ref and the drinks ref create a pile-up on the dining room side, clogging that aisle. The same clog might explode through the work area if DW doors are open and get in the way of table setting operations.

People setting the table would need to be under extreme duress (aka, parental intimidation) to walk the dishes around the outside edge of the island instead of cutting through the work zone to the informal dining.

It makes for a challenge. I'd be tempted to go more like the below (just an idea). It sorta shows two island shapes, one dotted, one solid - and it certainly would need more thought.

So - instead of butler's pantry, I'm thinking scullery. Dish storage can be in wall cabinets above the sink and in one section of the pantry if you've got a lot. The ref moves back out into the perimeter and becomes twins with a nice fat aisle in front - complete with micro for reheating leftovers or melting sandwiches.

It has 3 decent work areas plus a 4th in the scullery. It does not solve the cut through traffic to the informal dining, but takes away some of the strain in the aisle. The scullery can be devoted to a bar without impacting the main kitchen. The pantry area can certainly be enclosed and either look like this or push the doorway back over almost to the dining room wall and have one wall of regular cabinets and one wall of 12" deep shelves.

It might help start some other thoughts.

I'd also try an "L" shape with the leg on the dining side (runs away)

bpmorepanic: Thnx! There are multiple aspects of your layout that I like. The kitchen sink is somewhat hidden from view of the GR.

I really like that the sink gets a window and then an additional window next to the range. I can give up the double ovens if I upgrade my range.

bec3b1g, I don't have anything to add to your layout plans, but I am watching it closely. I, too, am planning a kitchen remodel, and, like you, have 4 kids, 3 of which are boys, but none of which are teens, YET :) So, I think what you are describing will be exactly what I am dealing with in 5-7 more years.

So, I'm thinking I'd better push for 2 dishwashers and a big pantry, huh? As well as a 6 burners and a prep sink.

I wouldn't have thought I'd need 2 DW's if you asked me now. ...do you currently have 2?

Thanks for sharing, and good luck!!

In the house we just sold, I had 2 dishwashers. They were always in use! I'm renting a house now and it's really hard to only have one. BUT, I work outside the home 40+ hours a week. I'm sure I could manage if I had more time at the house.

We typically used 1 for dish clean-up and the other was used for cooking clean-up. Quite honestly, my kids eat a lot..constantly..there are always dishes.

And I'm really looking forward to the double washers and dryers that we are putting in the house. I probably need those more than the dishwashers.

I really like Bmore's plan above. I don't know for sure, but I think I'd consider moving the island sink closer to the fridge edge of the island.

We have two sets of washer and dryers. It's very helpful. Only one DW though. Our children haven't reached the teen years, so I haven't experienced the onslaught of dishes yet.

Are the kids good about loading their own dirty dishes into the dw as they finish using them? If not, the landing space in the skullery might be a little tight for piling dirty dishes. Overall, though, I think that's one very nice plan. : )

bmorepanic: So would you include the wall separation to the left of the dishwasher to distinguish the area?

I love the idea of a scullery area. We had something sort of similar in our last house. I called it our working pantry. It was fairly large and housed an extra full size refrigerator and freezer. It had open shelving for food storage, dishes, etc. and on the counter we kept the microwave, toaster, and blender. The area was open to kitchen and it functioned as another work zone.