what you will like to know? I can probably answers because is my job and I only deal with modern italians.. of course I'm italian too :-)

Well, I'm so glad to hear from you, giacomo. Please tell me: How do the cabinets of these companies differ in quality from one another? Are some of these companies better than the others in how they deal with problems? Are some of the companies' cabinets likely to last longer than the others? Are these companies' cabinets in different price ranges from one another? Also, I saw that one company's cabinets have melamine interiors and, I think, metal sides; do the other companies' cabinets have plywood interiors and dovetail joins the way high-end American cabinets do? And what else should I have asked you if I had known enough to do so?
Thanks,
Barbara

Hi Barbara,
For my experience, depend how technical you want to know, but in general no matter which company you pick you will have a good product.
I have to say that here in USA some company are over rated, pedini is good example... in italy is an avarage low end, but here in USA they spend a lot on marketing... so go figure ;-)

But the main thing is the people that will design and order your the kitchen... I remember people order interior doors and don't even go to take a measure ... this is extreme but I know people that doing that.

where are you located?
I will write later more.

Hello again giacomo --
Thanks for the info, and please do write more.
I am in northwest Connecticut, where hardly anyone does modern kitchens. But I am close enough to New York City to look at the showrooms there.
With regard to Pedini being "average low end," are you saying that prices for Pedini cabinets ought to be lower, for similar cabinets, than for those of the other makers I mentioned?
And I have another question for you: Do you know if Rossana cabinets are distributed in the U.S.?
More thanks,
Barbara

ok I give you and example... about pedini.
a client in NY was design a pedini for 68k I did a kitchen with more expensive line with all the accessories for 41k and in glossy lacquer (the most expensive).
Pedini in italy is consider a normal line of cabinetry.
Rossana I don't think anybody has it, I was supposed to contact them 3 years ago but then I chose other lines.
Barbara in Italy are more the 500 kitchen companies is hard to know all of them ;-) but I sold kitchen from $7,000 to 220,000 euro so I know a little bit :-).
...............
why a price from Boffi kitchen is more expensive then a gotti? well because Boffi spend also in research ,in architects so... you don't pay also for good quality but also for the unique design and all the effort that those top companies put in to it.
Also all the material used..the one that you see and also the one that you don't notice. go to home depot and lift a base cabinet.. then go to an italian cabinetry line and try to lift one of them!

all cabinetry in italy are made in particular board but some use E2 E1 E0 (Emission=0) and that mean on the emmission of "Formaldehyde "

follow more detail :-) or is engough?

petlady, thanks for that info, which I needed to know. Did you wind up buying Italian cabinets?

giacomo, what you're telling me is exceptionally helpful -- many thanks -- but please do give me more detail. (I am astonished that there are 500 kitchen companies in Italy. If I were really obsessed with this project I would take a trip to Italy next week just to take in all the kitchens.) What I hope to have is a minimalist kitchen in almost-black oak, nothing more than one ell-shaped island in a large white room with at least one glass wall. I have to keep the cost of the cabinets, and of everything else, to a minimum, but I also intend for them to be beautiful and of high quality. Of the cabinets I have seen in person thus far -- and I have not seen very many -- the ones I thought were the best looking were the Pedini, so I am very dismayed to learn from you that they are likely to be over-priced and not so very high quality. I have seen Maistri cabinets on the internet and liked them very much, but thus far have not succeeded in seeing them in person; do you happen to have anything to tell me about Maistri? Are there makers you can suggest to me that I might be able to track down in New York City? Do you yourself still sell cabinets?
I do realize that in buying a kitchen one is paying for the unique design, and for years I have lusted after Boffi and Bulthaup kitchens, and more recently the Minotti kitchens, but I have accepted the fact that I cannot afford them. At the same time I have a lot of confidence in my own taste, and I do succeed in buying beautiful things at low prices (but usually at auction), so I am hoping to pull it off this time as well. But please do tell me everything you can that might help me do it.

Barbara

I'm sorry if I put down pedini soo bad .. but is just my opinion... mmm you know Minotti cucine? I'm the one that was selling them from Chicago (all over USA)... then I start my own company.
P.s. sorry for my English, I work and I'm try to write also... and this forum we cannot edit the messages...anyway yes I design for different showrooms but I also design and sell cabinets and other products strictly from Italy.

Maistri I never hear them... sorry, but I can make some phone calls and find out who sell in NY area, (it's easy for me because I know many peoples on the design industry).
... regarding boffi or Minotti I have something to say.. .but I cannot write here.. maybe you want to write direct.

ok now is time to have a good italian pizza!! talk to you later.

Henrybuilt are American and they do some beautiful modern kitchens. Do check them out for ideas, Barbara. They seem to be well-loved by those who have them. I don't think they're inexpensive, though... :)

Here is a link that might be useful: http://henrybuilt.com/

giacomo, you're not supposed to apologize for telling me about Pedini or anything else: your informed views are very valuable and it is kind of you to take the trouble to share them, and I thank you for doing so. I know what pleases me aesthetically, but I know nothing at all about cabinet quality or construction or the reputations of the kitchen firms, so your views are especially valuable to me.
Was it terrific to be selling Minotti Cucine? I came across those beautiful kitchens at the Tsunami web site.
I know that Maistri is sold in New York City by NYLoft, so no need for you to phone to find out about that, but thank you very much for the kind offer. I am thinking of going to NYLoft's showroom next week. But I saw NYLoft's display (not of Maistri) at the International Contemporary Furniture Fair in New York last week, and I would not be surprised if they turned out to be too expensive for me.
I very much want to hear what you have to say about Boffi and Minotti. I will try to send you an e-mail to give you my e-mail address.
And now your good Italian pizza's all gone.

fori, thank you for the info and the link. I had no idea that Henrybuilt had a New York City show room. I have admired their cabinets but didn't seriously consider them because I thought I couldn't get to see their actual wood. Now I will be taking myself to their show room. Thank you again.

Barbara

Really, if you're interested in a modern kitchen look, check out Ikea. They'll be many $$$ less, and be of just as good a quality as you're likely to get with anything Euro. Their biggest limitation is the sizes they come in as well as the limited door styles. For the money, they can't be beat.

Tsunami is the showroom in london, I never see in person but looks good!
Selling Minotti was great... but again a lot depend of the clients.. something you find people that really appreciate the product and sometimes is just because they need to have the most expensive kitchen in the world.
I also value the people behind the company.. so some company I like more than other not only for the cabinetry it self but also for the history of the family business or the philosophy.. but again is just my point of view.
I was supposed to go at ICFF but I was busy after be in Italy for 3 weeks and visit last month the Milano Fair "salone del mobile".
regarding your project depend what look you are looking what kind material etc..
One big different between companies is how they build your kitchen (and also they price is different)
this is good example live wire oak suggest IKEA... ok you go to ikea you buy your kitchen and you pick your wood doors.... instead this picture show why your kitchen is "tailored": (no comment to Ikea) :-)

has you can see from the picture your kitchen will be unique and the veneer will go from one door to the other. make sense?

do you want more details? ;-)

I ended up not going European. Part of the problem is that some, including Scavolini, are modular and don't really allow customization in terms of cabinet sizes. Then there's the lead time. And, as gorgeous as they are, they do tend to be way up there cost-wise in comparison to domestic cabinets. We ended up going with a Canadian company to approximate the look. There are widely available American makers starting to offer this look. Check out Woodmode at the link below.

Here is a link that might be useful: American contemporary cabinets

Giacomo, the kitchens and baths on your site are awesome. Are the kitchens done with Minotti cabinets? Do you know if they have a retailer or kitchen designer carrying their line in New York City? Thank you in advance.

emfny no I don't put any picture that I done with minotti a specific reason. The picture that you see are from other companies.
I'm pretty sure at this moment there is not a dealer in NY, accually if I want to move in NY, I can call Minotti Owner and pretty sure find a space ;-) ...anyway I used to work in the chicago Store and then I decide to work by my own. For Minotti a start point of a small kitchen can be $80,000 easily (not appliances). depend with look are you looking I can suggest something else.

So *that's* how it's done, giacomo! (matched veneer). Excellent visual.

Giacomo, thank you. I would very much appreciate, as I am sure many others would,to have your suggestions. There are so many Italian cabinet brands available, all--of course--claiming to be high end, that it is very hard to know which are the better ones. Your recommensations will be much appreciated.

I am watching these posts with great interest. Being half Italian and half Sicilian, I am interested in anything from Italy/Sicily. The cabinets are just beautiful.

Hi --

live wire oak, I did take myself to the ikea web site and maybe I didn't hunt hard enough, but it looked to me as if they didn't have dark oak and as if they didn't have any wide cabinets with just two drawers, two things I really want. They do solve the money problem, but so far I am hoping I will be able to get what I really want at a low enough price.

giacomo, I think you probably didn't miss anything not coming to ICFF. For me, much of the best at ICFF is the Italian display, "I Salone," and I think in essence that that is just part of the same display at the Milan fair, which you saw. Also, this year I got the impression that the Italian display at ICFF was smaller than in the past, and with fewer kitchens; I wonder why.
Thanks for the photo showing the matching of the wood grain in quality cabinets; it was very helpful.

petlady, a Woodmode dealer, with a very good reputation in our small-town-y area, was the first place I went to. It turned out that his ballpark price was about twice the price I got from two Italian cabinet sellers and that I liked the finish on the Italian cabinets better than the finish on the Woodmode cabinets. But I haven't yet reached the point where I feel I fully know what I'm doing. I think maybe what I have to do is make a precise plan and have it priced by the dealers I am considering so I can be sure that I am comparing apples with apples and to be sure what's being priced is the exact thing I want. (I did show them all the same inspiration picture.) But isn't the cabinet dealer supposed to make the precise plan?
Anyway, perhaps you would tell me what company actually made your cabinets?

This is an amazing web site and you are all so very helpful and knowledgeable; thank you.

Barbara can you post your "inspiration picture" here?

I am glad you started this thread, Observer1.

Curiosity question only, but what kinda of reputation does Marchi have? They are not modern - altho I'm not sure what to call
the ones in the link below. I really like them and other italian cabinet makers like the ones mentioned above right now. Infatuation mostly, but might blossom into love.

Thank you, giacomo for the picture above. it was very informative. I have drooled at veneer matching across cabinets. Your photo album is a delight.

Here is a link that might be useful: Post Punk? Romantic grunge?

Posted by bmorepanic (My Page) on
Sun, Jun 1, 08 at 11:59

I am glad you started this thread, Observer1.

bmorepanic: Okay!

Curiosity question only, but what kinda of reputation does Marchi have?

I have no idea, because I never heard of them. Your finding them indicates how gifted you are.

They are not modern - altho I'm not sure what to call
the ones in the link below.

One might call them "idiosyncratic" or
"eccentric," like the often weird but still creative
and interesting interiors one often finds in "World of
Interiors" magazine. I had no idea any kitchen
manufacturer would do any such thing. I admire these
things in magazines, but my own taste is nowhere near
so forward: I am mired back in the Bauhaus style (with
antiques thrown in but probably not in the kitchen).
Actually, the kitchen we are tearing down bears
some resemblance to the kitchen in the first 8 of the
Marchi pictures. It was put in place by the POs, who
were far from well-to-do after the farm was shut down
by the Board of Health or whomever -- I'm not kidding.
We bought the property in 1972 so we think it's time
to do something about the kitchen -- and again, I'm not
kidding.

I really like them and other italian cabinet makers like the ones mentioned above right now. Infatuation mostly, but might blossom into love.

I am thinking I will be able to make a really
beautiful space with these Italian kitchens, and that
will be such a great pleasure. I wish the same to you.

Barbara

Observer1, we are going with a company called acorn kitchens, out of Canada. I would give you their website, but it's under construction (and has been for months!). I can only hope they're faster with their cabinets! I brought in inspiration pictures from various European manufacturers as well as NY kitchen stores, and we matched them as closely as possible with what was available. We had priced Culina Blu and Scavolini, as well as Arclinea and Moda Cucina (all in Boston). New England is not a hotbed of Euro kitchens, so not a lot of choice, and nothing at all in my state. Acorn was the best construction for the money. I will say that working with a KD over an hour away is a royal pain. I hope you can find someone closer.

petlady, I don't believe. I would never have heard of Acorn were it not for you, but according to their web site they have a dealer 9 miles from my house, and another one 19 miles away! (I am in New England too, and no one is doing modern kitchens in our part of New England either.) Thank you so much for the info. So was Acorn's price substantially lower than Scavolini's, from whom I have a quote? Also, is what Acorn is doing for you close to what Scavolini would have done?

Observer1, while I initially went to our KD because they were the closest Scavolini dealer, we frankly were not that impressed with the quality for the cost. Also, the modular nature of their cabinets meant I'd have to sacrifice some storage that a custom solution would offer. All that coupled with the increased lead time (and the fear of that same time in a delay mid-remodel if there were any problems with an initial cabinet order) gave us pause. Even though we decided against Scavolini, the KD gave us a fantastic space plan, far better than the 2 other KDs we'd visited, so we stuck with her.

Unfortunately, Acorn, one of the lines she carries, has an outdated brochure and the previously mentioned non-existent website, so we were dependent on her to help us find the right styles. We were able to find the finishes and features we wanted, plus the ability to get a lot more in our space because they're custom. We did not actually get a Scavolini quote because, after seeing them in person and getting the info on them, we decided against them. It didn't help that we were coming from a Culina Blu showroom, which turned out to be totally unaffordable, and found Scavolini to be not as well-made, so we were immediately turned off. I can tell you that Acorn was 1/3 the cost of the Culina Blu!

We are in RI. Where are you? It would be a hoot if you ended up with our KD.

Hi Flyleft!! that picture of the "tailored service" doen't apply to all the italian companies, some they do and most of the time are the one that cost more... but again price here in USA doesn't reflect all the time quality.
Company like Pedini, Scavolini they spend a lot in Ads their ads are everywhere .. and those ads has to be paid!! :-)

Mustbnuts, unfortunately I don't know companies from Sicily, all the companies that I have contacts are mostly north italy.
I noticed that a big problem is the "link" between the final client here in USA and the company in Italy.. meaning that sometimes the sales person, the KD, the dealer that work and sell italian cabinet doesn't understand how companies in italy works and cannot "translate" what the client want.
For example make custom cabinets is possible but all depend of the collaboration of both part the design in the store and the italian company... so for me it's easy because I'm italian and studied architecture in Florence.. (so I have strong technical skills) but also need be open minded to find the solution and usually I spend a lot of time on the phone with the tech. guy overseas to accomplished what the client want.

BTW not all the companies in Italy understand the american sizes (appliances etc..) and if you ask them to custom one single kitchen custom they said no.. they say yes only for quantities.. at that point I don't work with them and can be that some dealer it's hard to satisfy the clients.

petlady, I hope you can tell me a bit about the quality differences between Acorn and Scavolini, because I don't know enough to judge quality for myself. (I think I don't need custom because we are creating our kitchen from scratch so there are no pre-existing dimensions, and I am too disorganized thus far to care about lead time.)

I am in northwestern CT; I guess I live about two hours away from you. Did you go to the KD in Farmington CT? If so, she is about an hour from us so I will take myself to the place in New Preston.

Frankly, Observer1, I can't technically compare Acorn and Scavolini, since I didn't research box construction for the latter. I just know that I pushed a fingernail into a lacquered cabinet and made a dent (oops!) in the Scav, while the Acorn had none after the same treatment. Also, the overhead door hydraulics in the Scav didn't impress us. But I don't know how old that display was. After that, we did research the Acorn construction and decided to go that route. Have you checked to see if anyone here has a Scav kitchen? I didn't find one, but then I didn't find an Acorn kitchen here, either.

While I know NW Ct and have actually spent some time in Litchfield Cty, including New Preston and New Milford (gorgeous area, esp this time of year!), I live considerably East and South of you, so ended up going to a KD in Wellesley, MA.