When the tile work warranty really, truly won't be honored

18 years ago

Our tile guy died on us. No, not simply died, but committed suicide 9 months after our project was complete. That was really disturbing. Moreso because we were very impressed with his work and his artistry. However,

we've had a failure in one of our bathrooms. Both bathrooms were "mud" jobs. That is, no backerboard, but a build up of concrete to which the tiles were adhered. This was done the "old-fashioned" way. The wainscotting, shower pans & floors were all concrete with the tiles tiled on top.

Now, one of the walls has cracked tiles all the way up from where the showerpan surround (tiled) meets the wall to midway up the wall. Luckily, none of the hand-glazed deco tiles were cracked. Something shifted and I need to get this repaired. I think there's a concrete problem. I don't know, but since the crack is pretty straight through all the tiles, that's why I think so.

Does anyone know about the work which would be involved in this kind of repair? The cracked tiles are out of the direct path of the water from the shower, but it needs to be fixed. We've lived with it for a little over a year and there hasn't been any more cracking. Maybe it's a seam between concrete batches, I have no idea.

I want to understand more about what might be the cause of the failure and what it would take to repair before I begin interviewing tile contractors for the repair. This is not a project where I want to walk in from work one day & find some fast-talker has dismantled my bathroom. I'm gonna need to be able to tell an expert from a fly-by-nighter. References / licensing / bonding & insurance will not be good enough. The deco tiles can't be reproduced. The subway tiles, at least I've got spare of those, but those won't be able to be matched either. I have to be able to tell whether or not the person I'm interviewing is feeding me a line of bull or knows what they're talking about. I'd also like to know what kind of costs I could expect to see.

Thank you for any information you might have about what I should know or how I should interview future "Tile Guys". It's my ignorance which has kept me from getting this work done. Time to take care of step #1.

Thanks,

-a

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Comments (9)

Michael_H
18 years ago
You should contact Bill Vincent. I'm sure he has some ideas on how to resolve it.

Michael

Here is a link that might be useful: he's in this thread
joed
18 years ago
The problem is likely not the tile job but the structure under it. If the floors, wall, etc are moving the concrete will crack.
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andrea345
Original Author
18 years ago
Thank you Michael. I'll see if he'll come join us over here.

joed,
I don't disagree, however, the house shifts a lot and this has been the only point of failure. Actually, I'd be relieved if it was a matter of the cement curing, the house shifting so that 6 months after installation it had cracked. I didn't notice the crack when it happened. Heck, I just thought one of the tiles was a bit smudgy. It took a while for me to get interested enough to examine the tiles closely and see that there was a run.

Thanks guys!
-a
bill_vincent
18 years ago
If a mud shower is properly constructed, slab movement shouldn't affect it, unless a crack in the slab is exactly where two walls meet. Even then the wire lath should wrap around the corners, anyway, reinforcing the corners. The only thing I can come up with, without physically inspecting it, would be moisture somehow getting thru to the framing, swelling it, and causing pressure on the back of the mud, causing it and tile tile over it to crack. I'm assuming that when this guy put your shower together, he put tar paper or polyethlene up before the wire lath?
andrea345
Original Author
18 years ago
Bill, there was a thick rubber membrane applied in the pan. Then he painted some stuff on top(?). We're trying to remember. It was thick. We think the wire lath went first. Then concrete. Then the rubber membrane and then the coating. We think this was the sequence. However, I can't specifically remember if the membrane was pulled up & over the top of the pan tread, or if it was just up to the top edge of the pan. The crack is in the joint between the wall and the edge of that pan tread.

So, someone who really knew about mudset installations would be able to figure it out without ripping everything apart? What kind of qualifications should I ask if they've got besides the usual L/B/I & references?

Also, I posted this question over in the John Bridges forum along with very bad pictures. When I got to your webpage, it was very helpful to find those other locations. Thank you. It's been interesting reading today.

Thanks,
-a
bill_vincent
18 years ago
"So, someone who really knew about mudset installations would be able to figure it out without ripping everything apart? "

They may or may not be able to. Again, That's something that would have to be decided upon physical inspection. One thing you might think about. Over at John's site, there are atleast 3 or 4 people in Washington, and any one of them would be qualified to look at it.
andrea345
Original Author
18 years ago
Bill,
Thank you so much. Davestone brought that up and I'm open for it. Those links on your website were very helpful. It was wonderful to read about the details of the work. It's always that "qualified" bit which gets me. I've fallen for "lines" before and with this job, I don't want that to happen. It's too important. You've opened up resources for me I hadn't found on my own.

Thank you again for your efforts.
-a
bill_vincent
18 years ago
Not a problem. If you end up going with someone other than one of the pros at John's either email me, or go into John's forum and let us know what the installer's had to say about what's got to be done, and how he intends to do it, and we'll make sure this guy knows what he's doing.
andrea345
Original Author
18 years ago
Thank you, Bill. I'll do that. I was afraid I wouldn't be able to tell baloney from lobsters, but having a backup system of people who work with the stuff would relieve my mind. Besides, this'll be an interesting learning experience. Tony would be mortified. Sometimes I think, "If only I'd called three weeks earlier...". He was very proud of the work. I was sorry to see this happen.

I really appreciate the time and effort you guys have spent educating us non-professionals. The first job I had Tony on was to finish laying a slate landing. I ended up having him pull up my own slate installation after I saw what a pro could do. It made my work look like p**p. heh. He just laid the Pennsylvania slate out on the floor and the design was just incredible. He used color and shape to create such a pleasing pattern. Plus, his slate didn't "pop up". heh. I never could get my mortar the right texture. I kept mixing too dry. I loved reading that one thread, "A little more water. A little more mortar. A little more water. A little more..."

Thanks again,
-a

When the tile work warranty really, truly won't be honored

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When the tile work warranty really, truly won't be honored

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