I thought everyone knew what dirtballs builders are. I think this is the typical business plan:

Build a great looking model house.

Sucker people in to offices w/ low prices.

Charge rediculous additional fees for basic things like electric outlets and air conditioning.

Create a legal subsidiary like "Anytown Building Inc" to do the actual project.

Use the cheapest labor and materials to actually construct the house.

Close "Anytown Building Inc" when everyone starts complaining and threating legal action.

Repeat as necessary.

New construction should be sold at a discount due to the large amount of effort it takes to commission the house.

I'm sure there are tons of horror stories about builder by readers of this board.

My builder has been a treasure. He is expensive and worth every penny and then some.

QUOTE: I thought everyone knew what dirtballs builders are.
I think this is the typical business plan:
Build a great looking model house.
Sucker people in to offices w/ low prices.
Charge rediculous additional fees for basic things like electric outlets and air conditioning.
Create a legal subsidiary like "Anytown Building Inc" to do the actual project.
Use the cheapest labor and materials to actually construct the house.
Close "Anytown Building Inc" when everyone starts complaining and threating legal action.
Repeat as necessary.

I SERIOUSLY TAKE OFFENSE TO THIS!

However, as angry, hostile, prejudiced, and distrustful as you apparently are of home builders, I can spot "YOUR TYPE" from a mile away. It's also why my services will at times become way to expensive for certain individuals who approach me to build for them. (namely those with your attitudes)

If I'm forced to deal with their constant rage and malice (not to mention multiple threats of lawsuits), I'm going to make sure they pay through the nose for my months of suffering.... or they can find someone else to build their home.

Whew that felt good!

Now on a lighter note, I checked this site and am very pleased with my rating! :-)

Here is a link that might be useful: See My Rating

"I think this is the typical business plan:
Build a great looking model house.
Sucker people in to offices w/ low prices.
Charge rediculous additional fees for basic things like electric outlets and air conditioning.
Create a legal subsidiary like "Anytown Building Inc" to do the actual project.
Use the cheapest labor and materials to actually construct the house.
Close "Anytown Building Inc" when everyone starts complaining and threating legal action.
Repeat as necessary.

You know why that is, don't you Chrisdoc?

-- Customer meets with several builders to get "ballpark pricing," then eliminates any builders who quote higher prices, forcing every builder to quote rock-bottom "cheapest case" prices or lose even the opportunity of a sale.

-- Customer wants to 'tweak' the floorplans, so that some rooms, which originally used standard-sized, economically-priced materials, now use over-sized lumber with custom-angle cuts and special truss framing. Not to mention the need to re-engineer the floorplan and re-draw all the drawings.

-- Customer wants to change out a few windows from "builder's boring" (inexpensive) to something more interesting, which isn't part of the window company's lower-priced Builder's line. Sounds like that should be an inexpensive upgrade, but it isn't.

-- Customer wants just a few more financial quotes "to make sure he isn't getting screwed". So a few more builders drop out of the bidding process and any remaining ones are feeling squeezed.

-- Since the builder's profit has been eliminated up front, he HAS to use the cheapest subcontractors. And since he can pay so very little for construction labor, he's not getting the most qualified guys available. In fact, many of the best guys have left the building trades altogether because you just can't support a family on the $15/hr an illegal immigrant will work for.

-- Since his price was driven down up front, he can't afford to upgrade any construction materials. And since he's afraid of being sued, he better stick EXACTLY to what the contract says in terms of materials.

-- Again, since the builder has had to eliminate his profit on the core house per contract, extras and changes are the only opportunities he has left to make his profit on the house.

So Mr. Customer -- Do you really want to pay more for better-trained workers? (Because you can get the work done "to code" for less... And how much do you think that guy is really worth anyway? After all, you don't need a college education to swing a hammer.) Do you really want to pay more for better framing lumber, energy efficient HVAC systems and higher-quality infastructure? Things that you'll never even see in your home... Upgrades you'll certainly never see reflected in your appraised value or selling price? After all, the value of your home will be determined to a large extent by the value of your neighbors' homes, and theirs were built inexpensively... Do you really want your construction cost per square foot to be higher than anyone else's?

Oh that's right -- It's those Builders out to get you.

Here's the bottom line, if the builder doesn't take steps to turn an unhappy customer into a happy one, they are the most inclined to complain at some website. Either that or if the customer is extremely happy and loyal but that would be tough ddue to the nature of the business.
It has also been my finding that both mass home builders and the one guy construction co both are often greedy and frugal and it pays to speak with several of their customers before buying in addition to checking the state to see if there any any complaints on their record (if applicable)

This was in our Newspaper today and is a good guide for someone wanting to build.

Nine ways to help the home construction process go smoothly
By SHEILA J. NEVINCZENKO
Special to The Gazette Special Sections

Somewhere between buying a car and having plastic surgery lies the experience of buying a new home from a home builder. Every day youll wake up to, come home to and go to sleep with the consequences of the buyer/builder relationship. The result can be contentment and pride or it can be six-digit regret.
What follows is a list of nine things builders wish buyers knew about home construction. Learning from their experience and expertise is literally money in the bank.

1. Do your homework. Literally.
"I really encourage people to do some research before diving into it too far," said John Bridges, owner of Canaan Company, who has been building custom homes for 22 years. Research starts with carefully choosing your home builder. "People move faster than they should. You want to truly be satisfied with who youÂll be working with in a longterm relationship. This is not like buying a car. It could take two years. ItÂs imperative you like who youÂll work with. Talk with them to get to know them."

2. Be prepared.
Once youÂve decided on your builder, learn as much as possible about the building process.
"Know as much as you can up front," advised Randy Reynolds, marketing director for Acuff Homes. Make your selections early so that if desired items are out of stock, that can be addressed early. Acuff Homes provides a checklist up front to home buyers. The list includes things such as having the home loan in place early. A builder doesnÂt want to spend seven or eight months building a house then find out there are financing problems at the end, said Reynolds. This costs him hundreds of dollars per day in charges on the construction loan.
"Ask questions up front," he said. "(Such as) how much does it cost to make changes? Some builders charge a change fee plus the cost of the change."
Acuff Homes also gives home buyers a flow chart that shows the building process so they know when they can expect framing to start, understand that a foundation takes a couple days to cure and that they have to wait for inspections, etc.

3. Communication is key.
You need a central point of contact, and try to stay in constant communication with that person. DonÂt take your questions and requests to various people such as subcontractors. Take them to your builder or to the person designated by your builder.

4. Be patient.
Patience is a great asset throughout the building process.
"Be patient through the start-up process. Take time with the design phase," said Bridges. The most important time is when the team is doing their job development before starting construction. Patience and thoroughness pay off. "The more time spent up front, the better the project will go and, 90 percent of the time, the less conflict youÂll have. If everything up front is all on paper, everything is smoother," he said. Bridges encourages three to four months before breaking ground on a custom home.
Reynolds, too, stressed patience.
"Know the end result will be worth waiting for. Buyers like to rush toward the end of the building process. There are sometimes unforeseen things that happen. Let the builder do his job."

5. Know what you want.
Know what you want and be as clear and organized as possible.
Bridges said buyers should shop around and go see houses they like. "IÂd make sure I pack my digital camera everywhere I go. As a buyer, IÂd go see homes that I could afford."
Reynolds said, "Diagrams help. ItÂs hard to read a buyerÂs mind." Take photos for changes. Be very organized. It helps the builder to schedule.

6. Be realistic about changes.
Discuss desired changes as early as possible in the building process and be realistic about the extra costs theyÂll incur.
"Communicate any changes you want made as soon as possible to your representative," Reynolds advised.
He stressed that those changes should not be made to a subcontractor or "trade" on the building site. Sometimes a home buyer will talk to a trade on-site about a change and this can cause misunderstandings.
"When you communicate changes, realize costs are involved . . . because other trades come in (to factor). If a builder has to pay for it, thereÂs a good chance the buyer will have a cost increase," Reynolds said. The builder has to make money to stay in business.

7. Get involved.
Stay actively involved throughout the building process.
Buyer/builder interaction naturally should increase with the higherpriced homes and with semi-custom or custom homes.
"Be involved. I love people that are involved," said Bridges. "Clients being involved has saved me money. Clients catch errors."

8. Safety first.
Talk to your home builder about visiting the site before you go. Different builders have different views on this. They may be concerned about you having an accident.
"For safety reasons, abide by the builderÂs guidelines for visiting the property. You need a hard hat. Go through the sales rep first," said Reynolds.

9. The Golden Rule rules.
Trust that the builder will do a good job. "Keep a good positive relationship along the way. DonÂt be adversarial," said Reynolds. "Treat them like you want to be treated and youÂll get a better product. No trade likes someone looking over their shoulder."
When a mistake is made, a reputable builder will step in and work through it.
"Make sure you always remember that I work for you," Bridges said. "IÂm not your enemy. IÂm your employee. WeÂre entrusted with peopleÂs money and theyÂll go into debt (for a house). We should respect that in a fair, ethical, honest way. IÂve been blessed with good clients. I try to make it my goal that when weÂre done weÂll invite each other over for dinner." And they do.
Canaan Homes builds two to five custom homes per year ranging in price from $300,000 to $1 million but the majority are in the $400,000 to $600,000 price range.
Acuff Homes is building in the Spires Broadmoor, Cathedral Pines, Northgate and Forest Gate developments in addition to semi-custom and custom homes in other locations.

QUOTE: This was in our Newspaper today and is a good guide for someone wanting to build.

That's a really good article. When I have good communication with my home owners, things always go so much better.

But seriously, if I sense the buyer approaching me is going to unreasonable, I will purposely take myself out of the running upfront. It doesn't matter if it's building a home or entering a marriage... it's never healthy to be in a relationship where you're never going to be able to please the other party.

Dach, on a slightly different subject...did you ever get that house sold? I remember that you started a thread a few months ago entitled "Why won't this house sell?" or something along those lines.

Just wondering if the advice here was helpful, or if your market has slowed.

Dach - congrats on the positive feedback from your customers. I was looking at your website and noted the disclaimer about severe weather conditions that result in excessive rain or wind may result in infiltration of moisture in areas which are normally free from such conditions. What would you consider severe weather? Maybe once or twice a year my home gets a little water (i.e. if I inspect the basement some of the sheathing may be wet; small amount of water gets past windows) if I get 3-4 inches of rain and 20 plus mph winds. Would you consider this severe?

3-4 inches of rain in an hour or two can be considered severe if it is combined with wind, but I wouldn't consider 20 mph winds combined with 3-4" of rain over a couple of days severe.

We specifically put that clause in due to the volatile weather we get here in the midwest. Severe thunderstorms can often produce straight line winds of 60+ mph with heavy rains, even when a tornado or microburst does not physically form. When that kind of weather moves in, it's comparable to hurricane conditions, even if it only lasts an hour or so.

It could be your specific situation is more of a saturation point. If that is the case, diverting water and moisture away from the foundation may take care of the problem. Soil will settle around the foundation and often pulls away from the house when it gets dry. This gap allows water to pool right next to the basement walls/windows, especially if you've had 3 or 4 inches. Try bringing in some top soil and sloping the grade away from the home so that water runs out into the yard rather than pooling.

Divamary - the market has slowed to a crawl with most listings barely receiving any traffic. We've been very lucky, our agent and my wife pulled out all the stops forming an aggressive marketing strategy. So we've had quite a bit of traffic. Several repeat lookers/those bringing family & friends in, etc. Yesterday we were presented a contract on one of the two homes we have sitting. The offer was totally bogus, but we countered by throwing in another 20K in upgrades, so we'll see how they respond to that offer tomorrow.

Bottom line: I'm prepared to work with buyers, but I'm not carrying an additional 30K to closing, throwing in another 40K in upgrades, and then buying their home from them at 50K over what it should be selling for.

Sorry, but I just can't get used to the idea of having to pay someone to buy my homes....