Yes, you need to have your structure anchored into the ground. Wind, and possibly snow-load, will be the issues causing this effort. How unfortunate that you will need to excavate part of the patio first.

When building our patio, I installed concrete footings onto which I later installed a pergola. I attached the support posts to the concrete using stand-off post anchors. Our posts are 6 x 6 which have been wrapped with cedar.

Very nice design you are working to build. Good luck. Here are a few pictures of ours including the install.

Here is a link that might be useful: Pergola

Need more to go on. A simple quick question but to reply would take much effort.

Thanks Martha! I will try and be more specific!

Plan on putting the pergola on the raised paver area.

Using Belgard pavers to build a column which the 4x4 pressure treated lumber will go inside...I am using stone glue to adhere the columns to the base of the raised paver area and then gluing each paver to the layer above it.

The hole that exists with the columns I want leaves almost a perfect 4x4 hole...the posts of course are actually 3 and 3/4" so there is little room to pour concrete..but I guess I could grease them up with that concrete adhesive as it goes down.

I plan on facing the 4x4's with cedar and using a large precut stone cap for the tops of the columns...just curious if I build the columns 36"-42" high..is that enough to provide a good anchoring for the posts...we just had F5 tornadoes come through here...I doubt even concreting them would have kept those posts in...so just looking for something that will be stable under 'normal' conditions!

Thanks!!
Tara

Bite the bullet and anchor the pergola to the ground, with a proper footing.

Your idea will most likely not last.

Dooer, out here (Calif). A Simpson bracket mounted in cement a couple feet down is typical. Are you recommending sinking the posts as well?

That's where I am confused...I have some post brackets but they were designed to be screwed to the concrete pavers...the paver layers did glue the outer edge of my raised patio to the lower levels which were also glued...but I'm just wondering what the strength of the glued paver column would be in holding the posts securely...is there no way I can build a higher column or thicker column? I am sure if I pull out my old physics books I can figure out the ratio of force/work/friction that could yield me the greatest security...just wondered if someone else had accomplished this..

I see pre-made pergolas at Sam's Club and such that are not concreted in and are 'up'...here are my thoughts...

1. build column with a wider opening...so that I can pour quikrete into it and stabilize it....

2. stick to the 4" opening in my columns and just glue the whole thing together.

3. dig up the pavers and dig down to cement the posts..but I worry about it messing up the stability of the corners of my deck..there is a load of crusher run/sand under neath all that and it would be a messy mess...

I'm just wondering guessing the winds necessary to knocking down either option one or two would likely knock bring down a cemented structure and then I would have a messed up deck...yeah yeah, I know, I'm trying to rationalize my laziness! :)

Thanks!
Tara

I'm in Calif., and from 30+ years of experience, I'm pretty sure that no building official here would buy into that without extensive engineering.

We either sink pressure treated posts, down into conctete, 4' to 5', or concrete footings around 3' deep, with a wet set column base. The column base method will require some bracing of the structure.

You can still wrap the posts and hide whatever you did to the patio below.

In theory, it might be possible to do what you are thinking, but I doubt it. I'm not sure that any glues that you used would hold in that situation. Somehow you would need to anchor those column surrounds to the slab below.

Kit pergolas are usually smaller and possibly even disposable. Here 120 sq. ft. or less, don't usually require a permit.

We don't need permits for these structures in our county....so not much help there as far as code. At least I've got someone thinking about my theory! :) I can still drill into the pavers and put the 4x4 anchors onto the deck...it may help a little with stability...my Dad is coming Sunday..he built our first home (tri-level with basement) so I'm hoping he will help guide me a bit..just hoped someone here had attempted something like this without sinking them down..

Thanks!!
Tara