Pavilion/pergola. What is a good size? Uses?

16 years ago

Hello all,

We are in the middle of a new house and pool build, and I would like to add a pavilion or pergola (have not decided which yet) at one end.

The pool is a rectangular 14' x 45' and borders a line of trees and is on a sloping lot. The house and pool are both of formal design.

What I would like to accomplish with the design is something that can be used as an outdoor living space, but I already will have a large screened in porch that the pool is alongside, and a wooden deck that overlooks the pool, so I was trying to figure out a way to make this space different.

I don't want an outdoor kitchen (although I think they are very cool), and I will already have a dining table and seating group on the screened porch, another table and chairs on an ipe deck off the bedroom overlooking the pool, and lounge chairs on the pool deck.

I was thinking about maybe one of those hanging beds or a platform bed with mosquito netting and a ceiling fan above which would make an inviting spot for a nap after being in the pool?

But I also like those outdoor fireplaces I have seen. Pretty neat. Do they run on gas or real wood? Do people find that they use those?

The pool equipment is going to be about 10' to one side of this structure, and I was thinking a fireplace on the same side might help to block out the sight/sound of that. Thoughts?

I sometimes get something thinking it looks neat, and then do not use it. I want to avoid that. Seems like either the bed OR the fireplace and some seating would be good, but not both?

What size are your outdoor structures? What do you use them for? Pictures? Ideas would be most helpful.

Thanks so much!

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Comments (5)

smbnobles
16 years ago
We're having a pergola built and ours will be 13x18. We're having a polycarbonate cover put on it, to waterproof it. I'll be putting a conversation seating area under it. I want to use it as an outdoor living space. I work from home, so this will also be my outdoor office.

Honestly, if had a screened porch, I don't think I would have built the pergola. We don't have enough shade in our backyard, so we're installing it, but we'll also have a new area for sun too.

Just be forewarned, the pergola prices will give you a coronary.
tresw
16 years ago
We have a 12' gazebo just off the pool. It and the pool have only been in a month, but so far we love it! We also have a covered patio (just to the right oh the photo, can't be seen) and a large patio extension (where the table and chairs are) plus decking around the pool that holds some furniture. The gazebo is a hang-out spot, we have a bench swing and a couple of air chairs in it. But it's also a flex-space, the chairs are suspended from hooks and can be removed in seconds in case we want to put other furniture there temporarily. For example, our daughter wants to have a mock seance on her birthday so we're going to set up a table & chairs in the gazebo for that. We also see it being used for birthday parties with overflow seating on the patio. It ran us just over 5k for the gazebo and it was money well spent in my opinion!

Quote: "But I also like those outdoor fireplaces I have seen. Pretty neat. Do they run on gas or real wood? Do people find that they use those? "

Most of the ones you've seen around pools run on natural gas or propane although you can put one in that burns firewood too. It's a lot more convenient to just turn a knob to shut it off when you're done though. A fire should never be left unsupervised. The chimenea in the above photo between the yellow chairs has a propane gas log setup in it. It's really great, looks just like wood burning but can be shut off instantly.
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Warren- That's a complex design and it would really be hard to answer that from the info given. I don't know if I can give you a good answer even with more info, but a photo of your design would help. For one thing, you don't say how many posts you have supporting the structure, and what their spacing is. For another thing, you don't say if this is free-standing or is attached to a structure. My main concern with the info you provided is that I would have planted the posts deeper and used more concrete. That's a pretty tall load supported by posts planted 2-1/2' deep. I'm not going to say it will be a problem, but it is often a good idea to over-engineer on these structures. Finally, it's always a good idea to start a new thread with a new issue, rather than piggy-backing on an old one. You might get more replies that way.
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Since there is minimal disturbance of paving units and sub-grade, the steel rod approach your link described, is an easy method for securing the pergola posts to an existing paved surface. However, if a typical system of horizontal beams and stringers are used, and support posts are sized sufficiently, a 12' x 12' pergola is on the large side and quite heavy. I personally don't think the 3" bluestone is capable of supporting that dead-load - without potential failure. Cracking could occur and without diagonal bracing at the beam to post connections, there may not be enough lateral resistance to prevent the whole freestanding structure from racking. Consider setting concrete footings such as tsmith recommends. I would however, approach it in a different way. Remove the paving stones at each proposed post location to provide enough clearance for digging holes deep enough to go below the frost line of your area. Choose a method of digging, either with a manual post-hole digger, or a rented, gas-engine post hole auger. I imagine your posts will be at least 6 x 6s - perhaps even 8 x 8s. If you elect to use posts embedded directly into concrete for maximum stability - accept the fact that regardless of using PT pine or cedar, the posts will eventually rot - even with a canted concrete top for water drainage. Consider this method as an alternate: Dig a hole at least 10" in diameter, and set each post over a compacted bed of gravel or crushed stone below frost. The use of compacted crushed stone poured into the spaces around each post, allows ground water to be irrigated down past the posts before it has a chance to rot the wood. Add the stone in 6" lifts, compacting each layer with a tamping post. Fill the holes up to the sand base, cut each paver and reset as necessary. Another proven technique is to cast round galv. steel fence posts, or flat steel plates into each concrete footing, with at least 18" extending above finish grade level. The round posts would extend into holes drilled into each post bottom - then secured by through-bolts, countersunk and plugged. Flat plates would equal the width of each post, with plate thickness determined to oppose bending resistance (3/8" to 1/2" might be sufficient). The plate ends extending from the concrete footing would fit into slots cut into each post bottom, then through-bolted such as with the round post method. This sounds like a fun project and will enhance the great job you've already completely on the patio. But in my opinion, there is no easy way out for securing the pergola, for ensuring the longevity of the structure and the safety of your family and guests who may enjoy it.
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oakrunfarm
Original Author
16 years ago
smbnobles,

We really weren't planning on the pergola, but we have 4 really nice columns currently on the porch that are being replaced by boxed columns for the porch to be screened (no one could seem to be able to figure out how to screen with the round columns).

The builder would not take our columns back, and they were going to go to waste and were $$$, so that is really the only reason for doing this.

The cost of everything so far has been astonishing. I think we are becoming immune... ;)

tresw, your pool is really lovely. Maybe I will go with an LP chimnea first and if that is a hit, we can get one of the fireplaces. Thanks for sharing!
tresw
16 years ago
Yeah, columns are pricey! If you've got extras you might as well put them to good use!

Quote: "The cost of everything so far has been astonishing. I think we are becoming immune... ;) "

Hahaha! I think we all know that feeling! I'm still trying to get my arms around the fence pricing, ouch!

Quote: "tresw, your pool is really lovely. Maybe I will go with an LP chimnea first and if that is a hit, we can get one of the fireplaces. Thanks for sharing!"

Thank you! On the chimenea, Home Depot sells one (link below) or you can get a conversion kit off of eBay from seller "lakehelenwrangler". We already had a chimenea, so bought the conversion kit. The only thing I don't like is having an ugly propane tank sitting there (the hose is 10' long, so the tank has to be within 10'). I plan on building an enclosure out of redwood or cedar for the tank.

Here is a link that might be useful: Propane chimenea
smbnobles
16 years ago
I'd put the columns to use too then! I love the look of a pergola. I just don't like the price! Right when I'd adjusted myself to the sticker shock, I got the stain quote in.

I'm seriously in the wrong business.

Pavilion/pergola. What is a good size? Uses?

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smbnobles

tresw

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Pavilion/pergola. What is a good size? Uses?

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