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Water-softener problem.

12 years ago

I have a 'Kinetico' (I think) whole house water softener which does not seem to be working. There is salt in the brine tank. The motor is warm to the touch and it has a 'healthy hum'. At irregular intervals (and inconvenient times) the tap water just trickles. I would put the system to "Bypass" and all would be well again. Later I would switch back to "In-Service" and things will continue to be good until the next episode.

The water level in the brine tamk is high and I tried to set the process going by manually operating the system starting at 'Regen'.

Nothing happens. Not a sound!

What could be the matter with the system?

Thanks for any suggestion.

Comments (10)

User
12 years ago
If the softener has an electric motor is it NOT a Kinetico.

Can you post a picture of the control valve here?

How old is the softener?
ronalawn82
Original Author
12 years ago
justalurker, sorry, I cannot post a picture.
The softener is 8 years old.
I got it to regenerate etc. etc. by repeatedly going through the manual operation. Now, there is no water in the house when 'service' is selected. I have to switch to 'bypass' to get running water.
Anything else I can do?
Thanks for your help.
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One of the disadvantages of pre-built box store softeners is that there's no expert local service available. I understand that Waterboss has an 800 tech support number but you can't move the softener close enough to the phone for them to see it. The Waterboss warranty on a new softener is for parts only, NO LABOR so even new you have to bear the labor cost if warranty repair is required.. We can't blame the rat damage on the softener and if a "long cold night" means freezing temperatures you very well could have damaged the resin and internal parts that are made out of ABS. ABS can become very brittle at low temps and is grossly inferior to the Noryl used in industry standard softeners. As far as "It's just frustrating to replace parts per Water Boss's advice and not have it work", I agree. That's a poor diagnostic approach... unacceptable and costly. The bitterness of less quality and no local service lingers long after the sweetness of low price is gone. I suggest you contact a local water treatment professional and get a FREE quote to replace your Waterboss with an industry standard softener using a Fleck metered control valve as a cost point to compare repair costs. An industry standard softener will last decades longer, be easier and less expensive to get parts for, and be repairable by more local pros than your Waterboss. Tell Mom if she wants soft water this will cost some, but relatively little over the long haul, if you make an informed decision.
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Your softener started out with a capacity of 48,000 grains when the resin was new. In order to maintain that capacity you would have to regenerate your softener with an obscene amount of salt. As a lower salt dosage is used to regen, softener capacity decreases, salt efficiency increase and water efficiency decreases. There is a sweet spot where we get a good balance of salt and water efficiency at about 6 lb salt per cubic ft of resin. However, you have iron and manganese in your water. They are more difficult to strip off of resin than hardness ions (calcium/magnesium) so you need to use at least 8 lb salt per cu ft of resin. Since your capacity was set too high - yes, your settings have caused the hardness bleed from your softener. Good rule of thumb: If you don't understand what the programming means, don't change it without verification from someone who does. Your resin likely has some fouling. Fortunately, the SST-60 will be easier to clean than a standard resin if it is fouled. If you regen with 8 lb salt per cu ft, once sodium and hardness capacity corrections are made, you have a capacity of 23,275 grains. Your hardness needs to be set at 53 (39 calcium/magnesium hardness PLUS iron/manganese compensated hardness). BF (brine fill time) of 14 means you are regenerating with 14 lb salt/ cu ft of resin, which is high. Leave it there for now, until you've run a couple of regens with the correct capacity setting. You may need to go through a resin cleaning procedure to get your softener back to correct operation.
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User
12 years ago
You obviously have a problem in the softener but without knowing the brand and model of the softener how can anyone help?
ronalawn82
Original Author
12 years ago
justalurker, I will obtain the required information and post it.
Thanks for your forbearance.
User
12 years ago
Sounds like the control valve may have a problem or the resin is fouled.

Need to know well water or municipal water system?
Need to know softener brand and model and HOW OLD?
Need to know water conditions... hardness, iron, manganese, PH, TDS?

You might hit the Yellow Pages and look for local independent water treatment professionals and invest in a service call.
ronalawn82
Original Author
12 years ago
justalurker, OK, it is an "Autotrol 5600". It was installed just less than 8 years ago.
Last August a new motor and some gears were replaced.
Now this.
We get Municipal water and they tell me that the pH is 7.4 and the hardness is 11.7 grains per gallon.
I will have to call them tomorrow to obtain the other figures.
What is the life expectancy of a machine like this?
Do you think that I would be better off replacing the whole unit?
Thanks in anticipation.
User
12 years ago
Ok, That's a little confusing... Autotrol is a control valve company but a 5600 is a Fleck control valve.

The Fleck 5600 is a tried and proven valve.

Before just replacing the unit I'd get a local pro in there to give you an estimate to repair.
ronalawn82
Original Author
12 years ago
justalurker, a service company tells me that the resin (filter) needs replacement ($300.00). They say that 7 years is the average life expectancy. A new installation will run me $800.00!
Is the repair a worthwhile option? Will I have the same problem within the next 10 years?
Thanks for your considered opinion.
User
12 years ago
Needing the resin replaced is a possibility but without an on-site inspection there's no way to be sure.

Water that is high in chlorine and iron can kill resin in 7 years but it's more common to see resin last 10 or 15 years on municipal water in an industry standard softener.

My considered opinion is to find a local water treatment professional who is a professional and get them out to your house to see what equipment you actually have and diagnose the problem instead of listening to someone who will guess at what's wrong on the phone and who may or may not be correct.
ronalawn82
Original Author
12 years ago
justalurker, you have been a great help. You have given me enough information to make sensible decisions about this.
Now, if ever you have a problem of a horticultural nature, meet me on the 'Garden Forums'.
Cheers!!!

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