I appreciate the extra costs associated with drawer bases so I am wondering why having the one on the other side of the fridge rather than a drawer bank with deep drawers near the stove where it could hold pots and pans worked out better. A lot of product have 6" wine cubbies that you could introduce around the stove to get those cupboards down to 18" and replace the wine rack on the other side.

Wow, lots of great feedback!

-Making the back door swing outside would help with the dining area when the door is open, but my deck is small also and we wouldn't be able to put a screen door on an outward-swinging door.

-To address the suggestions for a framed pantry to the left of the garage door and possibly switching peninsula and fridge walls... This absolutely scares the crap out of me (and DH)! The layout is fantastic, but I just don't think we're confident enough in our DIY skills to build the framed pantry. And I agree completely that switching the peninsula helps traffic flow stay out of the cooking area, but I think it would drive me crazy to always have to walk around the peninsula when I want to get to the garage. We have no kids, by the way. Overall, I love the idea, but I think changing the layout so drastically by this point might make me cry!!

-haha, the counter to the right of the fridge will definitely always be covered in a pile-- that's why it's there!! It will (hopefully) keep the piles from taking over the rest of the counterspace, like they do right now. :)

-Right now it's 24" pull-outs on either side of the stove. I originally had drawer bases there (wider, before the pantry situation changed), but someone convinced me to do pull-outs because people who don't frequent this forum aren't used to the idea of having drawers for pots and pans. Also, there's not a lot of storage space for small appliances, etc., so people would be able to use them for that. (We're probably selling in a few years, so resale is a consideration.)

-I tossed around pantry ideas FOREVER-- Yes, the narrow pantry is a pullout, so it will be very useful. I thought of having one on each side of the fridge for symmetry, but they're too expensive! Originally I had the 12" on the left side of the fridge and the 24" on the right. That left more counter space on either side of the stove, but again, people didn't like the asymmetry. Argh.... I'm so frustrated with this pantry thing. I think we'll still just stick with what we have, unless people agree that its just awful.

-The dogfood cabinet will have pullouts, but do you still think it will be too difficult to access? I actually feed our dogs twice a day, but I don't think it will be too terrible... I don't know if I really need another super susan because I already have one on the other side of the sink.

-That's a really good point about the wine rack-- I think I just wanted something that looks really "pretty" right when you walk into the kitchen, you know? Plus I use the wine quite frequently. :) I think I was figuring I would put bar and drinking glasses in the glass cabinets, then liquor and any other glasses in the middle.

-The drawers in the peninsula would be for utensils, plates, and bowls. I guess I don't need as many wall cabinets, because I was planning on putting those items in the base...?

-Good point on the door-swing... I'll have to see how high the knob is off the ground to see if it would hit the cabinets! I hadn't thought of that.

-The OTR microwave does not vent outside.

Did I get everything?? I feel like I'm knocking a lot of these great suggestions down or just being argumentative, but I want you all to know I really do appreciate the input. I also realize though at some point I need to stop planning and actually DO this!

I guess my two major questions at this point are:

If you were considering buying this house, would the asymmetry of the fridge wall be a deal-breaker?

Would the lack of counterspace on either side of the stove be a deal-breaker even though there's lots of counterspace elsewhere?

Keep in mind this is a $155K house in a lake/golf gated community with homes that go up to $700K. It should be nice, but not TOO nice, otherwise buyers will just move up to the next price point!

If you were considering buying this house, would the asymmetry of the fridge wall be a deal-breaker?

Certainly not. Would it be if you were the buyer? A house of the right size in the right price range with the right general layout isn't going to be tossed aside because the fridge isn't centered. :-) It'll be a pretty amazing kitchen, I think, for a $155K house.

Okay, here's the fridge with the side panel-- I think it looks better!

I don't see you as being argumentative - you have spent a lot of time and you will be the one using the kitchen. If the area on the other side of the fridge is for "stuff" my Mom has this area though hers has some use as a landing spot for her fridge I really think you are not getting good value for the drawer base - hopefully you only need one junk drawer so why not make it just a one drawer one door base and switch the drawer base to somewhere handier in your layout?

Thanks, rhome. Your feedback (as well as many others on here) means a lot to me. I'm so glad you approve!

caryscott, you're probably right-- I haven't run the numbers on this layout yet with the cabinets to the right of the fridge, so your suggestion of making that a regular base will probably be the first budget-cut suggestion to be heeded!

Here's another insecurity-- While I love, love, love my 12" pull-out pantry, I'm not entirely convinced I should keep it. It is the most expensive cabinet, and it seems like a lot of people think it throws off the look of that wall. Maybe I should just chuck it and put one in my dream kitchen one day...?

It functions like the one in loves2cook4six's kitchen, although mine only pulls out on the bottom-- the top is for baking sheets:

I completely get the need to keep clutter to one spot. I just wanted you to be aware that that little counter would inevitably become that spot, whether you intended it or not.

I don't think the asymmetry is a problem at all. In fact, I prefer asymmetry, as long as it looks intentional, and yours does. What bothered me about the fridge wall was the lack of a side panel to the right of the fridge, and I do think it looks much better in the more recent pic. Without that, the cabs over the fridge looked like they were floating (a lot of cabinet lines actually require side panels to support full-depth cabs over the fridge).

The pull-out pantry sounds and looks great, but if I were you, and if it's even possible, I would reverse the functions, so that the top part pulls out instead of the bottom. Reaching down to get a baking sheet is a lot easier than bending over to find whatever you need on those pantry shelves.

I agree with others that, if you're going to pay for drawer bases, put them in a more useful place than in your junk nook. People may not be used to using drawers for pots and pans, but once they try it, they almost universally love it. It's so easy to explain to a skeptical potential buyer the benefits of drawers over pullouts (nothing falls off the back, one motion to open, etc.)--they'll think you're a genius and snatch your house right up. Small appliances can be readily kept on your susans. That's what I use mine for and it works very well.

Yes, it would bother me to have the dog food so difficult to access. But, then again, I have four dogs to feed, and they also eat twice a day. In fact, I'd better go feed them now...

You have a lot to think about! I have to say that I agree w/LaxSuperMom...I think her alternate plans work better for protecting the cook while also keeping the refrigerator easily accessible from both the kitchen & the rest of the house. It also gives you more space for the table.

I also like her idea of a drywalled pantry...it will most likely be much less expensive than pantry cabinets plus it provides more storage room as you have the entire height to work with...floor to ceiling. Overall, it will probably be fairly easy....it's just the drywalling part that's an issue...at least for me!

We do have a Pet Center similar to yours, but like Holligator mentions, we have no overhang on that peninsula. It may still work for you if you don't have the top drawer...only you can determine that. You don't appear to have a very deep overhang...12" maybe? Thinking about it, I think that I would probably go ahead with it b/c it can be very useful in that location, just be sure you have a full extension pullout there...and I would get a roll-out-tray (ROTS)/pullout shelf rather than a pullout attached to the door since the overhang would block access to anything inside a pullout attached to the door.

Regardless of the layout you ultimately choose, I would leave the garage door swing the way it is.

The workspace around the range in your layout is limited...something I hated in my old kitchen. If you have at least 24" on each side, you'll probably be OK, but 36" would be better (I had 24" on only one side b/c the other side ended up being the "drop zone" for everything from keys to mail...which may happen to you since it's so close to the garage door...Or, it might end up on the counter to the left of the door...a better location, I think...so maybe plan for it there?)

Refrigerator...definitely make it look built-in. Surround the refrigerator w/3/4" finished end panels to cover the carcass/cabinet of the refrigerator completely. (The doors will stick out past, but they have to to be able to swing open fully.) Then, either get a full-depth cabinet over the refrigerator or pull a shallow one forward so it looks full-depth. It will not only give your kitchen a more "finished" and "high end" look, but it will give that wall more architectural interest.

Pet Center

Will you have full overlay doors? If so, you will definitely need filler. This is what our KD & carpenter did.

First, we started w/a 27" cabinet, but it turns out a 28" to 30" would have worked better, but the 27" did work with a little extra filler. That "extra" width provides the "filler" needed on the other side (kitchen side) to be sure cabinets on each side of the corner will clear the handles of the other side.

Here are some pictures to show you the filler needed:

Overview of the Pet Center cabinet (on the left) from "outside" the kitchen. The "doors" on the right are purely decorative):

Closeup of Filler b/w Wall & Cabinet:

Filler is 1/2":

Overview of corner "inside" Kitchen:

Filler On the same side as Pet Center...4" worth of filler needed...for us, the first 3-1/2" was from the 27" cabinet + the 1/2" filler...so 3-1/2" more than 24":

1-3/8" Filler b/w the Pet Center Cabinet and the next Cabinet along the wall:

Yet again I did not refresh b/f submitting! Oh well...but I wanted to get my 2 cents in anyway :-)

Take what you want from it...

buehl, thanks for the info on the pet center! I wonder if this will just be too difficult for us to DIY... I didn't even think about the fact that the pet cabinet itself could be the filler. I guess I would have to make sure the back is finished though. Why did you need 4" on the pet center side? See I'm so worried that the pet center might cause more problems than it's worth...

holligator (or anyone), how wide would you say the drawer bases need to be if I'm going to use them for pots and pans? I'm afraid 24" would be too narrow, and that would cause a whole new set of problems!

If you have two 24-inch drawer stacks devoted to pots and pans, I can't imagine that you wouldn't have enough room, unless you have a lot more pots and pans than most people. I think I have kind of a lot of them, and I'm able to fit all but my biggest stockpots (12 quart and bigger) into two 30-inch drawers. There's enough room in them that I could probably get by with 24 inches for all of them, but since it's only one stack, I'm happy to have the 30 inches. With two 24-inch stacks, I'd have plenty of room, maybe enough to use one drawer for something else.

Here are my two drawers for reference...

holligator, thank you for the pictures!! That helps immensely. I definitely don't have more pots than you! How deep are your drawers? 6" width could make a huge difference, though-- Yes I'll have 2 stacks, but I'm not sure if I could comfortably fit two pots across like you have, so would it be practical?

Dang you people for being right and making me spend more money!! :)

The pot drawers definitely look better:

You will LOVE them. Drawers are the best. --Be sure you're getting full extension. :-)

I think that, except for your fattest dutch ovens or biggest frying pans, you should be able to fit two across. You can be sure, though, just mock up a drawer to whatever the interior dimensions of one of your 24" drawers would be and try fitting your pots and pans in that space.

The interiors of both my drawers are 10" deep. While I was measuring that (as my husband rolled his eyes--he quit asking long ago what I was doing, now he just knows that someone on GW must have asked a question), I also looked at what 24" would include, and I could easily fit almost all my pots two across. I have a lot of extra room with 30" wide drawers.

As cool as your pull-out pantry would be, I think it would be worth losing that to be able to afford drawers by the stove. Of course, losing that would also allow you to get wider drawers, so all this talk about fitting your pots and pans would be irrelevant. If you do get the pantry, be sure to get the pull-out part on the top, not the bottom!

Yes, you will need to have the back of that cabinet finished. And, one other thing, you will need to order it with a toekick on the back as well...b/c the 3" or more will be on the inside of the kitchen where the toekick is for the rest of the cabinets.

Are you working with a KD at all? If so, s/he should be able to help you with this. All you're getting from me is what was done in my kitchen to get it to work.

You may be OK with just a 27" cabinet plus 1/2" filler if you don't have an appliance within "drawer depth" distance of the corner. Your DW may or may not be an issue. If that cabinet to the left of it is 24" (b/w the DW and corner), then I think you'll be OK since most drawers aren't quite 24" deep. However, if that cabinet is less than 24" wide, then you may have to do the same thing we did...but you'll need to measure the DW handle to see how far out it sticks.

Note that your peninsula length = whatever size Pet cabinet you use + filler b/w wall & Pet cabinet + filler b/w Pet cabinet and other cabinet on the peninsula + other cabinet + 1-1/4" counter overhang or so.

If you're limited as to what the length of your peninsula can be, then the final width of that drawer base on your peninsula will depend on the Pet cabinet width + all the fillers.

For example, if you have 60" to work with...then that drawer base will be what's left over from:

60" - Pet Cabinet Width - Filler b/w wall & Pet Cabinet - Filler b/w Pet Cabinet & drawer base - 1-1/4" counter overhang on end of peninsula.

Thank you!! I thought I had worked out the filler kinks with the pat cabinet, but I hadn't thought about a) using the cabinet itself for part of the filler; b) needing filler between the pet cabinet and the wall; or c) the fact that the diswasher handle might get in the way!! You quite possibly just saved me from a huge headache. (No, I'm not working with a KD, so this is our ONE SHOT to get it right!)

I'm still undecided about the pullout pantry... It's my favorite part, so we'll see. It would be nice to have that extra drawer base space, though. I'm not sure about switching the top and bottom (although I don't think that's even an option)-- I don't mind bending down to get my stuff, and since the whole thing pulls out (not just the shelves, but the entire unit), I don't think it will be too much of a pain.

ThankyouThankyou for measuring your drawers! I feel much better about it now... I think that 9" and 10.5" deep will work for me, but I'll do a mock-up just to be sure. I'm pretty sure they're all full-extension, but I'll double check. Oh, and I completely understand about the hubs rolling his eyes-- it's been a permanent state for my DH since we started this whole process! :)

I thought of one other consideration to factor into your decision about the pantry. If you don't get the pantry and end up with wider drawer bases, the accompanying uppers will also be wider. That means they will likely end up being two-door uppers instead of one-door uppers, since a 36" door isn't really practical (or even possible?). Two-door cabinets are often more expensive than one-door cabinets, so factor that into the cost difference with the pantry. You may end up breaking even or not saving very much, in which case, I'm sure you'll want to keep the pantry.

About which part of the pantry pulls out, I don't see it as minding bending down, I see it as why struggle to find things if you don't have to? If you're like me, you'll use that part of the pull-out every day, several times a day and you'll only pull out baking sheets once or twice a week. Why not make the stuff you use more in the most accessible place?

Things are much more likely to be put away properly and found when you need them. In my old pantry, that was a floor to ceiling, my bottom two shelves were always the messiest. In my current kitchen, all the pantry items are thigh high or above, and the bottom section is used for baking dishes with seldom used platters below that. If having the top part be the part that pulls out is an option, it wouldn't even be a question to me.

You're to the point where you need to go through your layout and figure out where everything you have will be stored. Make a list of everything that needs a place (there are sample lists on here). Then, label each cabinet, drawer, lazy susan, etc., with its purpose. This isn't a drastic change from your previous layout, so it should be fairly easy, but there may be some important differences to consider.

You're really, really close! :)

I just had a few suggestions. They have nothing to do with the cabinets, since I think you are in good hands with all the excellent advice you have gotten so far. What I noticed was:

1) The pot lights are all in nice straight lines except the one over the sink. If you did this it would look very odd. Is this how you were going to actually place them or was it just to get them in the plan and figure the placement out later?

2) Have you ever considered building a banquette along the back wall to push the kitchen table away from the peninsula? I think it would improve flow - especially for your "perchers" and to the back door. It is a relatively easy DIY project - certainly easier than installing a whole kitchen.

Okay sold, I'll keep my pantry! :) Still don't know about switching it though... I'm only 5'4 and I don't think I could reach anything on the top shelf(s) if I had the pullout way up there. It shouldn't be a struggle to find things because it's only 12" wide and the whole thing pulls completely out-- It's the OTHER pantry I'll probably lose things in! On another note, I've already started that list as part of this whole design process, although you're right I should probably go back through everything before we order!

About the lights-- that was mostly just for picture purposes, because I have NO idea where they're supposed to go. I figured we'd ask the electrician, but if anyone has any ideas, I'm game! Right now there's just a fan in the middle of the room, a recessed light over the sink, and one off-centered recessed light over the peninsula.

What a great idea about the banquette! I never really thought about it because my husband and I have never "built" anything like that before. The cabinets are all coming assembled. Do you have instructions on how to make one?

THis is great - boy do I wish I had known about this place before "planning" my kitchen. I say planning in quotes since I am afraid I did not do enough ;-)

I planned my work stations pretty well and new what appliances and where - which is half the battle - but I am certain everyone on here could have helped me maximize the use of my odd shape and some difficult corners. I have one completely dead corner that we will use to hide the silver I guess;-)

Your kitchen will be lovely.

On the pantry - now that you have fessed up to your short stature I think it does make sense your way. You said you plan to use it for cooking and baking - so I imagine things like oils, spices, flour, sugar that are not replaced often and would be fine at that height as they will always be where you put them. Also flour and such can be kind of heavy to hoist any higher than that anyway. I will have one on either side of my cooktop the same lower height - seen a lot and it will hold all the things I use for cooking - I will use one side for oils and spices and the other for utensils.

You need to keep the things you are most excited about - that is what will give you a little thrill every time you are in there.. I am really glad to hear - after reading through all the posts - that it is staying.

I'm only 5'4 and I don't think I could reach anything on the top shelf(s) if I had the pullout way up there

"Aha! Now it makes sense," says holligator, as she gazes down from her five-eleven-ness. ;)

haha! 7" certainly makes a difference! ;) In this new kitchen I'd like to climb on my counters as little as possible! Right now I'm practically a monkey..

My first thought was- are you right handed? If so, dishwasher should go to the right of the sink...

Actually I'm left-handed. :) But either way we're not moving the dishwasher or sink from their original positions because we don't want to mess with plumbing!

I looked into doing this before at our old house but do you think I could find any info now?

Anyway, I searched the web and found this website which appears to have lots of good info. HTH.

Here is a link that might be useful: Banquette info

I know you're not changing it, but just a warning to others: Don't use handedness to determine what side you put the DW on...it's more a matter of how it fits into the kitchen work and traffic flows as a whole. You will adjust to whatever side it's on with regards to handedness...but if you put it in a poor location functionally you'll always be annoyed!

All else being equal, then you could consider handedness...

Kmgard: This is great! I still owe you tips on DIY cabinet installation - which I'll do this weekend. Here's a couple of things to consider:
- laxsupermom's suggestion to switch the fridge & pennisula would put your prep area next to your stove - which would be nice. Otherwise you'll be walking across the kitchen to the stove from your prep.
- I couldn't get my pots & pans to fit into the 24" drawer - we have all-clad and the handles are too long - so they went in the super susan instead. So you might want to just make sure...
- We built a banquette too and there's a thread on it. It's worked great. The drawer inside the bench is our "pet center".

Are you still concerned about fillers etc? Did you get all of your other questions/concerns addressed?

luluemon, thanks for the link and the idea! We're probably not going to take another project on right away, but a banquette is most definitely something we'll keep in mind.

Well-said, buehl. Even if I were right-handed, we'd probably still keep the DW to the left because that is the side where we plan on storing most of our glasses, plates, etc. Since one of the peninsula drawers will hold plates, they will be able to go directly from the DW to the drawer without taking a step!

Beth! I've started to freak out a little bit about the prospect of ordering online-- especially the fact that we have to give $600 to join the "wholesale club" just to get them to look at the drawing and get the official quote, and then we'll have just a week to order and get the full 70% discount. The customer service has been fantastic, but I still feel like it's a huge commitment without being sure what it's going to cost! We have an appointment with a local cabinetmaker (travis alfrey who posts occasionally on GW) on Sunday, so we'll see how that goes... Either way, we'll still be installing ourselves to save $$ so I would still love your tips! If we go with travis, I feel pretty confident he'll help us with the filler issue, and he's working hard to convince me to compromise either my 12" pantry or my "mail plop zone" to get wider than 24" drawer bases. We'll see!

Did you order your cabinets as of yet? Where are you located?

Not yet, we have an appointment with a local cabinet maker this weekend-- want to weigh our options before we commit anywhere. It's definitely less scary than ordering online...

We are an/around Fayetteville, NC. Why?

What 3D program did you use? I have plan3D, but I HATE it. It's very quirky.
Your layout is somewhat similar to what mine is shaping up to be-- except that I have a door between the cooking area and fridge that leads into the DR, and we don't want to close it in.
I love your design of having one pull out on one side, and mail landing zone on the other. Too much symmetry and boxy cabinets can be a boring look. I was told "no one puts those small counters in anymore." And, I was told a large pantry next to the fridge was the better choice, giving us more counterspace elsewhere, including by the cooktop. But, you have to go with what you really think will work with the way you live. I don't think future buyers will back off at that area. The pull out would seem totally cool to me.

That's so good to hear! I find that I'm slowly letting myself get talked out of the pull-out pantry (other people think I need more counterspace by the stove), but I really do think I want to keep it. If nothing else, I'd probably end up getting rid of the space to the right of the fridge, but I want that too! I know clutter will collect there, but I'd rather it be confined to that one space than scattered across the kitchen like it is now. :)

I'm using Better Homes & Gardens Home Builder right now-- I got this from a friend, and my only complaint is it doesn't seem to want to label the cabinets. It's supposed to, but that option isn't available on mine for some reason (probably a glitch). BH&G has another one called Interior Designer, and that one would more than do the trick for a kitchen. Aside from setting up the outside walls (which I found kind of tricky), it is very easy to use!

kmguard,

Wow- it looks like you're getting pretty close. It will be interesting to see how the meeting with Travis goes. We just ordered a bathroom vanity from a custom cabinet maker, and even with something simple like that, the cabinet maker pointed out things we hadn't thought of (and we're totally DIY and DH installed our whole kitchen!). When you get to the installation phase, it may be worth your while to hire someone to give you a hand for one day. It is fairly complicated- I am surprised at how many things have to be considered. We still haven't finished off the side of the peninsula where it had to be shimmed up to keep the counter level. Guess I'll have to find some type of molding... but then do I carry that molding around to both sides...

Feel free to post questions here when you're ready for that part- DH should be able to answer almost anything about installation.

kmguard, thanks for the info on BHG. I'm following this closely because our kitchens have so much in common. It will soon be just me and DH too.

Still liking your pull out and the asymmetry - but....

I also like laxsupermom's drawing, especially the pantry part - except I'd have a right return louver door. I would rather more counter next to the cooktop, which is why I'm moving my pantry from that very spot! But, I'd leave your pull out fridge/dumping zone as you have it planned.
I know the thought of doing the dry wall pantry seems like a huge thing - but honestly - I had a carpenter put in a small drywalled walk in closet for $1200 - and that was with a celing and upper cabinets above that. You could just get someone to do the drywall and you guys finish it out - framing, etc.
Just an idea -- you could consider going cheaper somewhere else to have the pantry walls put in. If you are going to sell, you might consider doing laminate counters instead of granite. Don't gasp -- if you'll be selling it could work FOR you. Your house is a $150K house surrounded by expensive homes. Mine is too (so many similarites). I figure if I save with the laminate but have beautiful cabs, floors and layout -- potential buyers can be told that you didn't want to do the expense of granite just to have someone rip it out because they didn't like the color.
Trust me, your less expensive home will shine like a diamond among those super high priced ones, especially with a redone kitchen. I would be so happy if all I had to do was replace the laminate with granite!

Thanks for more great suggestions! We will have some friends helping us out with the install, but I'm really really hoping we can get away without hiring someone because we only have so much money to spend on this! Of course, if I see it looking bad, I'm not afraid to stop everything and hire a professional-- the last thing I want is for it to end up looking shoddy.

southernsticher-- I completely understand what you're saying. I really like laxsupermom's drawing as well, but I still feel like the pantry would just be too much for us to take on. I have no clue who I could hire for such a "small" job-- it's hard enough for us to even find an electrician to come out! If I could do that pantry, I still think I'd leave our peninsula where it is because I think I'd get annoyed walking around it to get to the garage.

Believe it or not, we've been planning on laminate since the beginning! I've used that argument this whole time with my husband-- he wanted to slap granite on our cheap cabinets (which I don't even think would've held up), but I convinced him that it's much better to spend the money on the cabinets because counters are easy enough for someone to change later. They actually have some pretty decent laminates out there right now, so we'll see how it all turns out...

Well, you certainly will have enough counterspace on the other side. Actually my 1st priority was more counter by the sink - to move the micro from there. The possibility of extra by the cooktop came after I realized DH might actually be game for more reno.

But I will have the same situation when it comes down to it -- I can't have it all due to budget and things we just can't move/close in, whatever.

Great minds with similar kitchens think alike!

Okay here's a mock-up with the pantry you like. It looks really good I think, but adds some measurement complications with the cabinets next to it that I'm not sure we're up for... Not to mention we'd have to get the pantry measurements just right. But if the pantry itself didn't cost too much, it would certainly save us money in cabinets!

I also varied some cabinet heights/depths because this is what travis was suggesting...

Does this make the fridge wall look too unbalanced with my pull-out pantry? With the varied wall cabinet heights, we'd have to make the cabinet above the fridge (and panel to the right of it) even a little deeper.

Just curious, did you consider making your pantry pull-out just under the counter instead of full height? Since you're planning to use the top part as a cabinet anyway (and since you're short) ;), perhaps it could solve two problems. You'd end up having the additional counter space and save a bit of money at the same time.

Here's a nice one (I think this belongs to nomorebluekitchen):

{{gwi:1633803}}

holligator, that actually occurred to me just the other day-- I played around with it though, and do you think it completely throws off what little symmetry I had on that wall? It does give me a 33" drawer base on one side and a 21" on the other side...

If you're really going for symmetry (something I don't worry about myself), this actually looks more symmetrical to me. I think the equal space on each side and the same sized uppers more than compensate for the differences in the bases. You might consider flipping it, though, to put the pull-out pantry next to the big pantry. It just seems like less trouble for finding things or for unloading groceries to have all the pantry items together.

Scratch that-- It'd be a 30" drawer base on the left and only an 18 drawer base on the right if I'm to have room on the right side of the fridge for that 15" counter. That 15" counter isn't especially important to me, but I think it adds a smidge of balance...? The low pull-out DOES help my "short" problem. :) Just not sure if it looks right...

I agree about the convenience of putting the smaller pullout next to the big pantry, but when I did the mock-up, it looked weird for some reason...

I think it looks fine with the pantry switched. Not sure why you think it looks odd other than that you had become accustomed to it on the other side.

You probably don't want to hear this, but I still think you should consider laxsupermom's plan with the framed-in pantry and switched peninsula. That plan gives you, by far, the least expensive but most functional and attractive kitchen for your space of all the options in this thread.

I would scoot the stove down a little closer to the peninsula and put a susan in that corner to avoid dead space, but other than that, I think it's almost perfect. Besides protecting the cook and putting the prep area next to the stove, it's a much more pleasant view into the kitchen from the adjoining rooms. Of course, eliminating the pantry cabs saves a lot of money and gives you a much more useful pantry space (a 24" cabinet will become a cave where it's hard to find anything).

It also gives you enough space by the garage door to have a message center right there. I noticed in one of your photos that it's already where you drop your purse, and it seems like the most natural spot for keys and other doodads. I like the fact that it' s not visible from the living room, which is what bothers me about the little counter in your plans. To keep it contained and keep from creeping down the counter, you could put an appliance garage door or taller pocket doors there. Leave it open most of the time to make it easy to keep your junk in there, and close the door when company comes.

I know you had a concern about walking around the peninsula, but I think you would get used to the two or three extra steps really quickly, and the trade-offs in looks and functionality would make it more than worth it.

Is it really too late in the process to consider a plan with so many advantages?

It's definitely not too late to consider this plan-- however, I'm still not entirely convinced it's the right plan for us.

a) This pantry is a fantastic idea-- in theory. However, DH and I feel we lack the DIY skills necessary to pull it off. We'd have to be very careful to bring it out close enough to the garage door that we have room for a bi-fold pantry door. Also, it would be very, very difficult to get the measurements just right so that the rest of the cabinets line up correctly with the window and wall. It would also be very difficult to find a reliable professional who would come out for such a small job! Once I pay someone to put in that pantry, the money from less cabinets is no longer saved. (And that's IF I can find someone to do it.)

b)It still doesn't really allow me to have my pull out pantry near the stove-- it's in laxsupermom's drawing next to the 24" pantry, which I would no longer need with the drywall pantry. I don't think I'd want to put a pull-out pantry next to the wall so it pulls out in front of the garage door. I suppose I could do a short one on either side of the stove. I have no idea how to set up the other wall/base cabinets...

This:

vs.

This (only withOUT the short pullout):

c)I don't think it would be nicer to look at from the living room. In fact, all you can see is the dining area from the living room, but when you walk in the front door and head for the kitchen, there is a hallway on the left (not portrayed in my drawings). If you're walking directly into the kitchen from the living room or hallway, the first thing you'll see is the wall directly across from you, which is where the fridge is in laxsupermom's drawing. I don't think that's nearly as attractive to look at as the wine wall with the glass cabinets...

This would be the view walking in:

This:

d)I lose some of the functionality I wanted, which is even more important to me than the counterspace by the stove and the pathway from the garage. I would lose my pet center and my peninsula drawers would be narrower (because of the lazy susan), and the peninsula is where I wanted to store my plates/bowls.

Argh, I feel like my head is going to explode!! :)

I like "vs. This" better as an elevation. I wonder if that tiny bit of counter on the far side of the ref should be either a pull-out or a tall piece facing the dining area.

It doesn't work as landing space so I wonder if it could be better used as tall storage. Other ways I think it could work well is as a small message center/charger station or as just plain wall - light switches gotta be somewhere.

It sounds to me like you're most comfortable with the cabinet pantries and the fridge on the stove side. I can see the traffic pattern advantages of protecting the stove and the advantage of the framed pantry, but it not for you, then it's not for you. You don't have a big family streaming through, and I don't think it'll affect resale. Compromises for looks are OK, as long as you realize what you're trading and are happy to do so.

I'm not a big fan of the up-down-up-down look on the stove wall...But if you do vary heights, and if you do keep the tall pullout beside the fridge, I would make it the same height as the fridge cabinet, keeping those 2 cabinets also the same depth. I would vary the height only by about 3 inches, rather than by about 6, like the renderings above seem to show.

OK, you've justified all your choices well. I just wanted to make sure the plan that looked the most functional had gotten enough consideration. That one seemed to get skimmed past quickly in the discussion above. As rhome so eloquently said, "Compromises for looks are OK, as long as you realize what you're trading and are happy to do so." You sound like you've thought it all through now, and you are the one that will be living there. There is little chance that any potential buyer will be TKO enough to pick apart zones and traffic pattern like those here, so it shouldn't hurt you there, either. What will matter in resale is if it is attractive, and it certainly will be!

Of all the elevations you posted of the stove wall, I like this one best (except that it needs panels on the sides of the fridge)...

I'm not particularly fond of staggered cabinet heights, mostly because I'd prefer they were all tall for the additional storage space. It is a popular look, though, and it looks nice in your plan.