Water Main Shut off and Electric Hot Water Heater

14 years ago

I have a question regarding turning off the main water supply to the house but leaving the hot water heater on. The water heater is a Whirpool ELECTRIC water heater. I think it is 40 gallon.

Here's the backstory: I came home last night to find that the supply line to my basment utility sink had worked its way loose, dumping a few inches of water onto my basement floor.

Needless to say, I am now a bit paranoid about leaving the house and coming home to find a pool in my basement.

So, I was thinking that when I leave for work in the morning, or go away for the weekend I will turn off the well pump switch and close the ball valve at the bottom of the well retention tank....thereby if I do get a leak, only what is in the lines will come out...

But, I remember reading somewhere that turning off the water supply, but leaving the hot water heater on could cause a problem. Something about evaporation in the water heater tank??

So, here are my questions:

1. If I decide that everytime I leave the house, I will turn off the main water supply to the house, should I turn off the breaker to the water heater?

2. How long can the tank sit powered on, but with the water supply closed?

3. Would I need to turn it off daily when I leave for work or only when I go away for a few days?

Thanks.

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Comments (6)

live_wire_oak
14 years ago
YOu just need to do some home maintainence and inspect your individual fixture shutoff valves and flexible supply lines. They aren't "lifetime" products and occasionally need replacing. In fact, not using them is one of the direct reasons the shut off valves tend to corrode. Going around and shutting off shut off valves and inspecting the lines should be part of an semi annual maintainence schedule, but most people don't undestand maintainence and end up having to deal with repair instead. You should flush your water heater semi annually as well.

If you shut off your water supply, you'll need to shut off your water heater as well. Depending on the age and insulation level of your hot water tank that can lead to some long lead times to get hot water when you return. If your pipes are in good shape and you do periodic maintainence of all fixtures and valves, then this is an unnecessary inconvenience to you to perform every day. Now for vacations, that might not be a bad idea.
brickeyee
14 years ago
If anything happens to allow an electric water heater to expose a heating element the element will be destroyed nearly instantly.

Gas units are not as likely to be damaged, but can still overheat without a full tank.

Maintenance is less work than paranoia.
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Kaffine is correct. A circuit breaker will trip if there is excess current draw - meaning an overloaded circuit or a short circuit. It doesn't trip if a high resistance connection heats up unless that causes the surrounding insulation to break down and results in a short circuit. What you saw isn't all that uncommon on heating type appliances or anytime a circuit is cycled at near its max working ampacity. If there is a loose connection, the connection heats up and the wire expands a little. Because the wire is expanding, it also deforms slightly - as does the terminal. When the power shuts off, the connection cools and is now a little bit looser than before because all of the mating parts have deformed slightly. In addition, the heat causes the wire and terminal to oxidize. The oxide isn't a good conductor of electricity and also increases the resistance of the connection. This cycle is repeated every time the heating element turns on and off. As the resistance of the connection increases, it becomes the "heating element" performing basically the same function as the element that's in the tank. To prevent this type of failure, it's important to make sure that electrical connections have good surface area contact and that terminals are tight. On larger connections and aluminum cables, anti-oxidant compounds are used on the wire to prevent the oxidation cycle. In larger installations, preventative maintenance involves scanning a bus, breaker panel, etc. with an infrared thermometer to check for "hot spots" that would indicate a deteriorating connection. This is also why all electrical splices must be in a box. My guess is that there was nothing that would burn near that connection - and that's by design. BTW: There are new breakers out that detect arcing - not just excessive current flow. They are more expensive, but will interrupt this type of problem if it gets bad enough to arc. Any parts that have shown excessive heating should be replaced. In addition, trim the wire if you have some additional length so that the connection is made with wire that isn't damaged with oxidation.
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Saltidog, Dude, chill. I was respectfully saying you had a different opinion - not what your opinion was or that it had anything to do with the heating elements. You can disagree without being disagreeable. I do understand thermodynamics very well, thank you. There is no "trend" and no misrepresentation. Yes, the units have resistive elements as backup, for high demand situations, and when the ambient temperature gets low enough that enough heat can't be extracted using the heat pump (for geospring unit that's 45 degrees F) Saltidog, I don't know what you are getting your panties in a bunch about... yes, I understand your heater works well for you. I would expect that. It's installed in a basement that's at least 700 cubic feet of space. Because it's underground it will maintain a temperature of around 50 - 55 degrees or more if there are other heat sources in the basement. That's enough to allow the heat pump to work just fine. The water heater will work in almost all situations / applications where one would normally install a tank heater. It will even run on the heat pump in most situations. The question is when you have the water heater in a fully conditioned space (not basement) and that space is being heated. At that time, one is shifting the heating load of the water heater to the furnace - which may or may not be more cost effective. I think the water heaters are great - esp if they can work out the reliability problems (which I think are teething pains, not inherent problems). I stick by my assertion that there are three applications whereby they produce the most system efficiency / cost effectiveness.
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You've probably got it shut off - the dripping will stop. Look at it this way - do you think they make houses with partial house shut off valves? Now an uncoded remodel could do something like that but someone would be crazy to have a separate shut off for part of the house. Just turn the valve on and see if water comes out....
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mrmichaeljmoore
Original Author
14 years ago
Actually, after futher review of what happened, it was maintenance that possibly (kinda sorta) contributed to the water leak.

The day before the leak, I was doing maintenance on my washer and dryer. I was cleaning the lint from the dryer vent. Also, I was cleaning out the washer tub.
I think I must have moved the utility sink a bit and caused the pex supply line that goes to the sink to move a bit, maybe causing it to loosen and then the heat and water pressure built up and popped the hot water supply line out of the bottom of the faucet connection. Either that or the rubber o-ring just gave out from the heat and water pressure.

So, I changed both lines to the steel braided type that I have on my washing machine supply lines. This should hopefully prevent any further issues.

And, yes, live wire oak, although you seem to assume I do not do maintenance around my house, I do indeed regularly perform maintenance around my house, to include: flushing the water heater twice a year, cleaning the dryer vent, cleaning the gutters, cleaning and servicing my water softener, changing the carbon and sediment filters for my well water, prepping and staining my deck, lawn/landscaping maintenace, maintenance of lawn equipment (riding mower, trimmer, blower), maintaining and cleaning of pellet stove, maintenance on two automobiles....etc...etc...etc...

I guess I have to add inspecting supply lines to that list.

And, yes, brickeye, I could not agree with you more. Maintenance is less work than paranoia......that is why I try to do as much as I can around my house to avoid the catastrophes.....

thanks.
mm
joed
14 years ago
As long as the water heater doesn't drain you will be fine.
kkwaring_earhtlink_net
12 years ago
The water company shut the water off today to do repairs in my subdivision without notifying anybody. Last year this happened and fried my heating elements. This time just today 5/4 they did it again. I turned off the hot water heater. I then turned it back on when the water came on. No hot water again. Did it fry them again. We live in a 1997 oakcreek mobile home and just replaced two heating elements in a 40 gallong tank last year. Help could this be the problem AGAIN. Thank you
stirlerobert_gmail_com
12 years ago
I was putting a new sink in my kitchen last night I shut off all water to my house and water heater in the basement because the hot wouldnt stop leaking at the sink after I was through installing the faucet I turned all water back on only to discover I have no hot water throughout the housr any tips on how I might get the hot water flowing again

Water Main Shut off and Electric Hot Water Heater

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live_wire_oak

brickeyee

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Water Main Shut off and Electric Hot Water Heater

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live_wire_oak

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