Oh boy. I've got something to say about all this, but need to get my son to school and run an errand first. I have a walnut island top finished with Osmo, and I have that exact same walnut Boos block with their board cream. I have years of experience with the cream also.

Be back later!

I'll leave it to those with more experience of both to address the main question, but as for this:

Not sure about cutting on it. I know if we cut we have to have oil. I've read so many threads and articles on the pros and cons of both.
The 8.5' x 4' island will be where we eat many meals with the two kids and I'm sure they will be coloring/doing homework there.

Do you really want to eat meals on your cutting board? I sure wouldn't.

Breezy- great!

Writersblock - well if we cut on it it would just be a small area on the opposite side of where we eat. Thanks for the thought : )

Another thing I thought of. How is rolling dough etc on an oiled countertop. Another GW member said she does it all the time on her Waterlox. I will have marble too but was just wondering.

That is interesting how the wateloxed board looks lighter...I guess you probably didn't see your Boos board before they oiled it, so we don't know if the oil makes the walnut darker or if they just happened to be different aged trees or goodness knows what! I hope someone knows! I am still planning to get my walnut waterloxed, but I definitely don't want the color to lighten...I love the color of mine. Oh, and I haven't had oil on clothes...but definitely on newspapers, homework, and cereal boxes. Not life or death, but since my kids like to do homework on the island, it is aggravating to have to get a placemat out for that.

My response is taking much longer than I'd planned. DH is home sick today so I'm taking care of three kids. ;)

Pics and narrative later...

nini- I emailed the woman at Craft-Art who I've been dealing with to see if I can get some answers. (I attached pics)
Also, yes, you're right-- I didn't see the Boos Board without the cream so it's hard to compare. I guess what I should have done (or should DO) is get another Craft Art and treat it with Boos Cream or Mineral Oil! Then we could compare apples to apples! : ) (Between my marble testing and this wood testing) I'll be broke! lol

why not treat the back of the craft art you have? Or did you already do the whole board after taking the pic with the unfinished back?

quirk- Great idea! It's still unfinished : )

I have some experience with this and might be able to add a some insight. We have a Craft Art BW top. I ordered it unfinished and was planning to finish it with mineral oil because I wanted to cut on it and I like the soft/matte finish of mineral oil. When I put the m oil on (the underside to sample) it had a very orange cast to it. Here's a pic:

I wanted the top to be darker, so I decided to stain it. After staining, the mineral oil was not an option, so I decided to finish it with Water Lox. Here's what I want to share with you that I've realized since... Our island gets A LOT of use... if we had finished it with mineral oil it would inevitable have had water rings all over it and I would be driving myself crazy trying to watch all the glasses, etc. that might get left on it. I know it would bother me if I had to look at water rings all the time right in the middle of my kitchen and I don't think they can totally be sanded out. Also, we leave papers on the island ALL THE TIME! I would not want to have to worry about oil stains on them. The mineral oil finish is beautiful, but with three kids and with our island being right in the middle of our kitchen, it was not the right choice for us. We finished it with waterlox and everything wipes right up. I don't have to worry about stains. Hope that helps!
-Jill

jill- Thanks for that info. So do you think Craft Art's BW is lighter? Black Walnut is usually dark (I think!) so it seems odd you'd have to STAIN it, right?

Your info on oil from your standpoint IS very helpful. I have read that water stains can be an issue and then after several oilings they don't seem to occur anymore.. Maybe when the top is VERY seasoned? Part of the reason our island is wood is b/c we are doing a marble perimeter and that has it's own maintenance (avoiding acidic foods, etc) so we hoped our island would be somewhere a bit more "safe" especially with soon to be 4 and 6 year olds. Sounds like I should go with Waterlox but there's something about the oiled wood that really is becoming to me... The WL I did this weekend is certainly beautiful but I'm not happy with the color if it-- that being said I think it may be the WOOD and NOT the waterlox.

Thanks again!

OK, I just applied a huge amount of Boos Board Cream to the underside of the Craft Art board and we'll see what we end up with after leaving it overnight. I have a feeling it's not going to darken to the same level as the Boos Board is.

Lots of thoughts.

Boos board cream:
Are you considering treating your countertop with this if you decide to cut on it? As I mentioned, I have the same walnut Boos board, and it lives on my walnut counter.

I used a maple Boos for years, and I cook a lot with lots of fresh produce that needs to be cut/chopped so use my wood board many times daily. I applied the board cream on and off. More off than on so it did dry out. Never bothered me.

When I use the cream following the directions, I rub it in with my fingers at night and then wipe the excess off in the morning. I've never had an issue like you with the cream leaving marks on anything paper after even a day. Maybe because I'm wiping it with a sponge during the day while cooking? In any case, I personally wouldn't use their board cream as a whole countertop finish.

You can see my board already looks a bit faded and dried out here after my last oiling on Wednesday of last week.

Waterlox:
I've never seen a Waterloxed wood product. I've read many people here have had issues with applying it correctly so that it leaves a smooth finish. I'm hoping to see a friend's WL Doug fir island soon, but our schedules keep changing. Seems like a great lasting finish if you can get a final coat you like.

Osmo Polyx Oil:
This is my island's finish in Satin-Matte.

I love how natural it looks and feels, like there's nothing on the top. It glows. My woodworker put a coat on a few weeks ago after a light sanding. It doesn't really have a drying time per se. You start wiping Osmo on one end of the island. When you've covered the whole top, you go back to the end where you started and lightly rub any excess in. Done! It's not oily at all after that.

From my limited understanding, every Black Walnut tree does not look identical. Some may be slightly darker or lighter.

My Boos board arrived darker than my walnut top, which was not stained.

Did you see my answer to your question on my not-finished reveal thread about cutting on my walnut?

Here is a link that might be useful: Osmo Polyx Oil

There are several here in GW who have waterlox on their island. Rhome and Elizpiz come to mind. Also Pirula's amazing wood countertops

There as one guy who posted amazing pictures of a large wood island where he does cut directly one corner.. It looked used but quite terrific. Maybe someone can remember this kitchen.

breezy- Thanks for the info! Sounds like the board cream may not work for an island. I, too, notice it dries out really fast. I wonder if their oil works better?

So, originally I thought your finish was an oil but I see it's not. It seems similar to Waterlox maybe? I have to read more about it : )

lalitha- I know the post you are referring to about cutting on one corner. I saved it and have read it a few times. Looks great! I wonder if oiling might work better at a surface you are not sitting at for meals, homework, etc.

nini- What are you using to oil your island? I forget if you mentioned it already!

Here is a link that might be useful: Island Top Used as Cutting Board

I have a Craft Art black walnut island top. I have also tried a number of products before doing what I finally found to love.

I have used Osmo Polyx on my floors, and can't imagine using it on my island- doesn't hold up as well as I'd like it to on the floors, and wasn't as easy to apply (granted that was oak and not a smooth walnut).

I have used Boos Cream on my previous island, and was disappointed at how greasy it was. Even letting it sit overnight, I still found it to come off too easy and having to continually reapply was too much work.

I found the thread linked to above, and made my own mix of 1/2 lb. beeswax (from a local bee company), and 1/2- 3/4 cup mineral oil. I gently heated the beeswax and added the oil to it once it was off the heat. I have applied it both as a paste and as a liquid fresh off the heat (it solidified pretty quickly though). It was a bit of work to rub it in, but I rubbed it in with 0000 steel wool, in a circular motion and then a second coat with the grain. It took a good amount of steel wool, but it feels like glass. I actually found this technique on line, and it worked really well. A bit of work initially, but now it's holding up like a champ. Interestingly enough, I used the leftover Boos Cream on my Craft Art cutting board that they sent me, and it doesn't last very long with use. I have found my wax mixture not only lasts quite a while ( I haven't needed to redo it since early January and my island sees a lot of abuse for all the prep work I do in the kitchen), but the island cleans up easily, water continues to bead up on it, and it's much easier care than I thought it would be.

The one thing I've seen with this mix, is that it's really even. It doesn't seem to get those matte spots where it's been used. Perhaps it will in time, but thus far I'm really happy with the finish.

Slightly OT - we want to do something similar to the picture below. The wood used for the seating area reminds me of the beautiful wood counters on this forum - so I think the same product would work - do you agree? IKEA no longer sells wood counters - right? Where are all of you buying your beautiful wood counters and would you recommend them for a DIY project like this?

Thanks! :-)

jeri- John Boos, Craft-Art, Grothouse Lumber, Devos Woodworking are some names. Or, there may be a local woodworker in your area. Check out the websites to the above.

>IKEA no longer sells wood counters - right?

Yes, they still sell them, but they seem to be having problems keeping them in stock.

Crap.
I couldn't afford a countertop and tired of my 6 years of plywood.

I built my own butcher block countertop. The thing is that it's about 17' long.

Now I read you can't stain your counter and use Waterlox.
Then I read that about everything has to be redone or retreated so often it's not worth it.

What do butcher's do?
Hack on it, chop on it, slice on it? Beat a patina into it? But when it's all finished and done, do they treat it?

I'm beginning to think that if you don't use it for food prep, a 1/4" epoxy is a good finish?

Signed,
Frustrated with all kinds of conflicting info,
Christine

They just gave me mineral oil to put on it. I just squirt a bunch on and rub it in with a paper towel. It is just like baby oil, but unscented! I like the sound of that cream, though...wonder if it lasts longer and if it is less "oily" on my papers?!

nini- Who made your top? (which company?)
Unfortunately it seems the Boos Cream (breezy mentions it above) does dry out pretty fast and also oldhousegal didn't love it. It's also oily on my papers.

Devo's Workworking uses a Tung Oil/Orange product for oiled boards and it sounds really nice They recommend it over mineral oil. Also I read on one of the other linked above discussions that some people love tung oil and it doesn't need to be reapplied nearly as much! I think Devo's uses the Milk Paint Co. product.

Below is the link and then also click on Care & Maintenance...

Here is a link that might be useful: Devo's Finishes

CE - You can use Waterlox or other tung oil finishes with stain. In fact , you can mix the stain in with the sealer coat to make it easier. Many of the tung oil finishes come with stain in them.

OK, I put the Boos Cream on the back of the CA board overnight.

This morning...

The Top of the CA again (waterloxed) next to the Boos Board:

Mmmm, walnut, yummy walnut.

Christine, you can use Waterlox over stain. Waterlox is really not an oil finish in the sense of Osmo, Rubio, beeswax or plain mineral oil. It's a cooked polymerized wiping varnish and behaves like oil-based polyurethane in that it helps darken the wood with a slight amber tint (useful for bringing out the depth of walnut; water-based finishes alone can make walnut look gray.) I like Waterlox and it's behaved nicely on my wooden bathroom floor, but find it a bit too shiny for my taste.

If you've reached the color you want via stain and want to lock it in and protect it with a cover coat, I can warmly recommend water-based Polywhey as a finish. Nontoxic and food-safe when dry. Dries in about an hour. Wears like iron. Unlike Waterlox it barely has an odor when wet.

Better review the MSDS for Polywhey

DIPROPYLENE GLYCOL MONOMETHYL ETHER 34590-94-8 N/E N.E 0.4 77F
TRIPROPYLENE GLYCOL METHY ETHER 25498-49-1 50PPM 50PPM 0.7 68F
TRIETHYLAMINE 121-44-8 10PPM 15PPM 54.0 68F
DIPROPYLENE GLYCOL BUTYOXY ETHER

Looks like a nice marketing gimmick.

Here is a link that might be useful: Polywhey MSDS

Brickeyee, I'm not sure what you're talking about? Those solvents (used in virtually all coatings and many household cleaners) evaporate after application, thus nontoxic and foodsafe when dry.

I've switched to using Polywhey for virtually all applications where I'd formerly use some kind of urethane. The odorlessness and very quick dry are huge, plus the stuff wears like iron. Did my wooden stairs with it 3 years ago, heavy daily use and they look just like new.

RESPONSE FROM CRAFT-ART REGARDING COLOR OF TOP:

The variation could be from where the lumber is sourced and the actual quality of the boards used.
Our Black Walnut comes in two different options:

1. Standard Black Walnut (what we use for cutting boards and standard Black Walnut countertops)
   2. Rustic Black Walnut
   Standard Black Walnut is selected to have the least amount of variation, fewest knots and burl wood, and have the "cleanest" look. This can also result in an overall lighter tone.
   Rustic Black Walnut is selected to keep variation, dark knots and burl wood which can have a darker overall appearance.
   Because your cutting board is standard Black Walnut, you are seeing a lighter tone. We offer our countertops in both Rustic and Standard. So you can actually choose to have a darker board (more reminiscent of the Boos photo) by selecting Rustic Black Walnut as your species.
   We have customers that like both looks so we decided to offer both.

Black Walnut:

Rustic Black Walnut:

Christine, jillandmatt (above post earlier in this thread) stained their Craft Art black walnut countertop, and then used waterlox, and seem very happy with it, so I think circuspeanut is on target...from my reading, I don't think it's a problem...?

2LittleFishies, very helpful thread, and I appreciate all the work you've done in posting pics, contacting Craft Art, and posting their reply. I'm hoping to consider Craft Art's DIY walnut for our kitchen. DH was concerned it would be too dark, so color/finish will be part of our decision. Thanks!

Making notes about investigating Polywhey as well...

Yes, thank you, 2littlefishies! That was so interesting, lots to think about.

Oh, and we had JThomsonTops out of NC do our top. They came down and installed and finished it.

More random thoughts.

I think you're right in deciding not to have an island finished with the Boos cream. That's A LOT of cream, rubbing, and wiping, and you would have to do it very often. I don't like how often it dries out, and the oil on papers, etc thing doesn't sound appealing.

The Osmo is very, very easy to apply and only takes a few mintues. Rub on, rub in, and you're done. I'm surprised Oldhousegal had a hard time with it. Perhaps applying it all over a large surface at floor level is more difficult than a smaller counter at, well, counter-height.

I don't usually give a strong opinion, but here's my advice. Take it or leave it. After my "clown threw up on it" comment the other day, I'm not sure my opinions count for much anymore.......

Don't cut on your walnut. If you want to do that, inset an end grain actual butcher block chunk and do your cutting there. With a marble perimeter, you've got an elegant look going. To me, having a marked up wood island from knife blades doesn't go with that look. If you decide not to cut on it, be sure to get some rubber pads under your Boos board like I showed in my first pic above. Water always gets trapped under my board, but the walnut doesn't do well with that scenario when there's a wood board on top.

How can you resist something as beautiful as this?

End subjective advice. :-)

Oh wait....I have something to say to Christine re: her comments above.

Christine, it's wood. You must seal/finish it with something. It's not care-free. Slap some WL on it and be done, or use a product like Oldhousegal or I do. It doesn't take very long or need to be done very often. It's wood.

OK. I'm done. Not only is DH sick, but now so is 6 y.o. DS. And now I'm starting to feel a little off. Maybe I shouldn't post while coming down with sickness? ;)

Thanks everyone for your comments! Maybe this thread will help some other people too : )

This thread will definitely help those considering wood! I know it would have me when I was making decisions. Thank you for the great visual experiments and posting your knowledge!

By the way, the more I'm looking at my boards, although the Craft Art board was definitely lighter, I do believe the Waterlox gave it a more amber color to it (albeit slight). When I look at one side and then flip it -comparing with the Boos- it does seem a different hue on the Waterloxed side...

One of the woodworkers that was mentioned on another thread uses this Sherwin Williams Lacquer... Thoughts? It comes in dull rub. Here's part of an email he sent to me. (This surface is not for cutting on)

"" It is used for restaurant tables, counter tops and islands where the primary use is for service purposes and not for direct cutting. It is available in matt or what sherwin calls dull rub, semi gloss and gloss. 99% of all our blocks using a hard surface finish use the dull rub laquer. The catalyst adds hardness. It is water and stain resistant like waterlox but unlike waterlox it is hard and clear. Waterlox yellows the block. Most people who have hard surface finishes use a cutting matt or block and store it under the top or in a drawer. "

Sounds good. I wonder how it wears and also if you can do small repairs by sanding and refinished or if you'd have to do the whole top. I'll call again next week. Maybe I can get a sample piece. I like that it comes in dull rub and supposedly doesn't yellow the block.

Here is a link that might be useful: Sher-WOOD Catalyzed Lacquer

I really don't understand that, 2LittleFishies. Catalyzed lacquers are generally not great for anything that's going to come into contact with water, so I'm not sure about what they're saying. If you set a damp glass on a lacquered table, it will leave a ring if it sits there long enough. It's water resistant, but it's water resistant the way a nylon windbreaker is water resistant.

So unless they're talking about something pretty different from normal catalyzed lacquers, I'd stay away. I've used other lacquers for other purposes and I can tell you they take a lot of rubbing out to get the finish really smooth. They say it's similar to a nitrocellulose lacquer in how it behaves. I'd use those for cabinets but not for a countertop, myself. I see they don't say "countertops" in their list of applications for it.

(Thanks, writers block. I'm seeing what I can find out...)

*To follow up with my above posts regarding Waterlox. Here are a couple of pics that show where it dripped around to the unfinished side. You can see the color changes a bit. I don't really like the amber hue it gets.

My husband used a new tomato knife on our cutting board (which is fine) but with regard to using countertop as a cutting board, the marks it left made me question ever wanting to use it that way. It was also very bumpy from the marks.

For the heck of it I sanded the marks by hand with 320 grit sand paper just a bit. With a few passes it was so smooth again. I re-oiled and it looks great : )

Before:

After:

That is exactly what I meant when I recommended that you don't use your counter as a cutting board. You gotta really like that scratched up kind of look. IMHO, that doesn't go with a more elegant, marbled kitchen.

The WL ambering is interesting. Now I'm even more glad to have my Osmo. :)

breezy- I see what your saying but once I sanded and oiled it the look doesn't bother me- especially as it would be on a small area of a 9' island. I think marble is an interesting material as it can be elegant as well as give a very homey, worn-in look. I know my marble certainly won't stay perfect so I don't think my wood would necessarily have to look perfect either.

I totally get what you're saying though : ) Thanks!

does anyone know if Matte, Satin or Semi-Gloss finish is recommended for acrylic urethane finish? what looks the best?