That's just crazy!

We had breakfast at the Cracker Barrel this morning...
Denny left a tip on the table.
As we left and went to pay at the counter outside the dinning area...the cashier as us if we left a tip at the table or if we wanted to add one to our bill.
It made Denny mad..

Is this the normal now? I used to think it was to thank the waitress for a job well done.

Which our waitress didn't do a very good job.

I ordered a combination breakfast of french toast and scrambled eggs with bacon. and choc. milk.

I got white milk and pancakes.

I had her exchange the milk, because it was in a little carton. But the pancakes would probably go to waist, so I kept them.
Then for three pancakes they give you a teeny bottle of syrup that might hold two tablespoons of syrup. I ask for more....later we had to remind her of the syrup and much later after I was done and the remainer of the pancake were cold, she finally brought the syrup.

I didn't think she deserved a tip. It wasn't busy in there either.

Patti, my husband asks for extra syrup when ordering. He has gone so far, as telling the waitstaff, if they don't bring plenty of syrup, they don't need to bring the pancakes. LOL

Moni

Funny how the tip is expected, I know what you mean. We always give the tip directly to the waitress, with all the people around I'm not so sure someone doesn't walk by and pocket it, then it looks like we didn't leave a tip.
Bad waitstaff shouldn't expect anything, sorry, pattico, about your lousy breakfast!

If the service I receive warrants a tip,then its given,graciously..but if not,definitely not,whether its "expected" or not

In Europe tipping is not expected and in many countries offensive.
Donna

We too will sometimes give the tip directly to the waitress as we have seen occasionally people (even customers pick up part or even the whole tip. It depends on what we see and how we feel. But I agree, the waitresses, cooks, and bus people really do need a fair wage. I understand that many of the restruarants do make the waitresses/waiters pay tax on what they thing (owners) should have collected in tips--no proof required. wonder how much longer this will go on.

My DD is taxed on the tips the state feels she should have earned.....it doesn't matter if she doesn't get tipped, she still gets taxed.
I wish we could do away with tipping here in the USA. Seems like it is expected no matter what service you get....meaning newspaper delivery, pick up food at the counter, the hair dresser.....

Not just the low paying jobs but also higher paying ones expect tips these day, like postal workers, school teachers, garbage collectors, etc. This whole tipping/gift giving thing has gotten out of hand and makes a mockery of its intention.

Tipping is just another form of income. If you don't tip, the minimum wage the establishment has to pay will go up and then prices go up to cover it. Either way, tip or no, whatever you call it, the consumer is going to cover the cost of payroll.

I think with the way the economy is going, people making minimum wages who rely on tips to help feed their families are struggling.

If the restaurant is actually turning away people (most only have 2 turnovers at lunch and maybe 2 for dinner) then perhaps they are trying to seat people who leave tips rather than someone who doesn't and is taking up the space.

Back to the original story--I don't blame the restaurant for choosing not to serve someone who is notorious for failing to leave a tip or tipping very low. She must be quite a cheapskate.

How can we render an intelligent opinion on the original story if no details were given as to how much this woman tips? What is the total price of her average meal ticket? Was is the amount of the tips she has left? Has she demanded extra attention or items when she's in this restaurant? We need Paul Harvey to give us the rest of the story...

The story has no details, so there is no way to tell if it was justified or not. I usually tip about 18% (and more like 25% for my hairdresser), but I have also (rarely) left no tip if the waitress was truly awful (where it was the waitress' fault, not the kitchens). I was brought the wrong meal once and she argued with me about what I ordered.

DH and I used to spend weekends in a rural town with a great Chinese food restaurant. They added 18% to all tabs because they had issues keeping waitstaff. Not a very busy place, and people tended to be cheap. But the policy was prominently posted. The owner, who is very nice, told us that the cheap people started getting takeout once the policy was posted.

In many countries they do not allow tipping at all.

Why do we have to be forced to tip them? Its not our fault.

And also putting that extra percentage on, add another tip on top. I was furious first time seeing that.

Also you have every right to leave what you want for tips.

There are tons that don't leave anything at all and others leave tiny bit and others are really good tippers.

I do tip but won't with very bad service.

They say if you dn't pay your server, then all the others in the background don't get their tips either.

What? Why do we have to pay them all?

I understand about the tiny bit that they earn and they do survive on their tips.

But that isn't up to us to supplement all of them?

"And for these places that automatically add 18% or more "gratuity" to the bill, they should be investigated. That's trying to evade some tax or something IMO."

Well, your opinion is wrong.

"Investigated"? Investigated by whom????

Lets just stick to the facts OK?

Gratuities that are invoiced are easy to calculate the tax on and the records are right handy for audit. This goes the same for all gratuities that are put on credit cards.

In fact in some cases the gratuities are double taxed. There are instances where 'service' and the gratuity can have sales tax added. An invoiced gratuity can be classified as income for the house/owner and taxed as such. Then when the gratuity is distributed to employees, the usual personal income and SS tax is taken out.

"I understand that many of the restruarants do make the waitresses/waiters pay tax on what they thing (owners) should have collected in tips--no proof required. wonder how much longer this will go on."

It is not the restaurants that decide to do this. It is the rule of the IRS. Income taxes on tips are calculated from the sales the server rings up, not what they actually receive. So in effect the server is taxed on a tip they did not receive if you do not tip.

"Funny how the tip is expected, I know what you mean."

You do realize that servers do not make minimum wage right?? (Although there is at least one state that has recently enacted legislation changing this.) Many servers work for TIPS ONLY. Some receive the lesser 'tip wage' of $2 per hour of which 100% usually goes to taxes. The $2 per hour which some employers pay servers is not because the government is being "nice" and think the servers deserve "more". It was created so that the IRS can collect the income and SS tax on tips every week rather than at the end of the year and have the employer do the bookkeeping and accounting. The whole tip thing is a paperwork nightmare for restaurants.

"Not just the low paying jobs but also higher paying ones expect tips these day, like postal workers, school teachers, garbage collectors."

It is against the law for a government worker to solicit tips or any other sort of gratuity or compensation. If your postal worker is accepting payments - report it.

-------------------------------------------

BTW, do many of you know that when you use your credit card to add the tip for the server that many restaurants charge the server receiving that tip a handling charge? It's legal.

Not only that but unscrupulous owners don't give the employees all the the tips put on credit cards. Sad but true.

Per the article in the link:Covington has started a petition demanding fair treatment.

I don't know about you, but after causing such a stink, I'd be afraid what might happen to my order, that I would never know about.

Fro those who had questions about how much she tipped the answer is here in this article. Cynic's title for this thread "Banned for bad tipping!" should have read "Banned for NOT tipping!"

From article:

At the time, Mrs. Monica Covington was a frequent customer. On many separate occasions, a server of our establishment attended to Mrs. Covington. Each time our server waited on Mrs. Covington no gratuity was left. Shortly after this incident, Mrs. Covington returned with a party that was originally composed of six people, which later turned to five. The same server waited upon this party and added the 15% gratuity to her bill without the manager's knowledge. When this case was pointed out to the manager, the problem was soon remedied and the gratuity removed from the bill. Even after the gratuity was removed, Mrs. Covington and her party left no gratuity. What followed shortly afterwards, on a separate occasion, Mrs. Covington returned with two or three other diners. Our Servers and even Chefs told the manager that they refused to wait on their party. The manager, in hopes of appeasing staff and customers alike, formally asked Mrs. Covington if she would mind a 15% gratuity added to her bill and was explained in detail as to the reasoning why. Our compliance with North Carolina Law, and our stated intentions in protecting our staff members and allowing Mrs. Covington to dine with us, was clearly stated and in an appropriate manner. Absolutely NO discrimination occurred whatsoever.

I have to wonder what this woman does for a living. Would she be willing to work for free and just rely on whatever coin her customers dolled out. Amazingly Ms. Covington has not mentioned any flaws in service at the restaurant in her complaint. She just feels that people should work for her for free.

Here is a link that might be useful: Link to Article

" She just feels that people should work for her for free."

You make it sound like she is supposed to pay the
wait staff their salaries just for the privilege of
buying her meals from the Owners.

Sounds like you are saying that the wait staff is not
getting paid by the Owners of the restaurants to Serve
people who the Owners expect to eat at their establishments.

My DH owns his own business - should his clients pay
the people who work for him, do you think? Wow - what
a great day for him - have his clients buy his
services AND pay his employees for him.

That being said, I always tip for good service. I appreciate
it, and from my college years know how hard that work
is. BUT - I do it because I want to - not because the
owners expect me to pay their employees their salaries.

This thread has obviously gone haywire. And, it wasn't
my post, but I am offended that you think that someone's
opinion is WRONG - just because it wasn't yours.

On many separate occasions, a server of our establishment attended to Mrs. Covington. Each time our server waited on Mrs. Covington no gratuity was left.
hmmm...it sounds like it 'might' have always been the same server. It makes me wonder if Mrs. Monica Covington only tipped for good service and for one reason or another was not pleased with that server's service.

Shortly after this incident, Mrs. Covington returned with a party that was originally composed of six people, which later turned to five. The same server waited upon this party and added the 15% gratuity to her bill without the manager's knowledge. When this case was pointed out to the manager, the problem was soon remedied and the gratuity removed from the bill.
hmmm...seems that that same server must have stepped over the bounds in taking it upon him or herself to add a tip, 'maybe' without it being stated up front that it was a requirement.

Even after the gratuity was removed, Mrs. Covington and her party left no gratuity.
I wonder if that same server again provided bad service or not up the the standards of those customers.

What followed shortly afterwards, on a separate occasion, Mrs. Covington returned with two or three other diners. Our Servers and even Chefs told the manager that they refused to wait on their party.
hmmm...I wonder if they thought they too might not be up to the 'standards Mrs. Covington expected if she chose to leave a tip (or not).

The manager, in hopes of appeasing staff and customers alike, formally asked Mrs. Covington if she would mind a 15% gratuity added to her bill and was explained in detail as to the reasoning why.
Unless I was with a large party that 'required' a tip as some places do, I certainly would not agree to that, if other customers didn't have to. One could just about bet that her service would not be too good after this ordeal.

Our compliance with North Carolina Law, and our stated intentions in protecting our staff members and allowing Mrs. Covington to dine with us, was clearly stated and in an appropriate manner.
Huh??? What does the law read...you have to tip in NC? That's a strange one and new to me. Seems they would have been adding it all along then to everyone's bills. I wonder why the establishment then broke the law earlier by removing the 15% that the server had added to the bill.

Something is just not right about all this, imho.

Now, now dilly_dally, calm down. I thought we'd hear from you and was looking forward to seeing the response but never intended to set off such a rage! Set aside your torch and pitchfork for a minute. You mentioned let's talk about facts? OK, how about what YOU conveniently or erroneously left out. You state as if it's fact:
"Each time our server waited on Mrs. Covington no gratuity was left."
Now come on. Even in the article YOU linked, this is disputed! You and I don't know all the facts but your own link goes on to state:
"As for Covington, she says she always left a good tip at the restaurant, even when she got what she calls "less than honorable" service."
Can you state for a FACT that is is not true? If not, then it's your opinion that she didn't tip at all. It's not likely that the employees will say yes, she gave a 5%-10% tip but we wanted 35%-40%. There's a lot of things we don't know and there is the devil's haven.

I think while you were gassing up your torch you missed something. Essentially we're in agreement on at least several points. I too wondered what, if anything she did for a living and what her background included. You don't like the add on tip for the restaurant. I don't either. LOL But it seems that where we must really disagree is the definition of a tip. As I stated, I feel a tip is a gratuity. Are you suggesting it's an entitlement? Let me ask you dilly_dally, what tip should a person give for terrible or non-existant service? I don't see you leave room in any of the posts so far for the possibility that some waitstaff are less than spectacular and I'd be interested in knowing if you feel a tip is earned or entitled.

It's interesting that people rush to the side of people earning tips as part of their income but you never hear them talk about people who work on commission. Slow days, bad weather, economic fears can kill a person's income easily and when I traveled, I had to pay my vehicle expense, motel, food, clothes, plus my home expenses and I had days of zero to one or two sales! Nobody cried for me, Argentina.

I'm surprised that your postal workers don't look for Christmas gifts. Most everyone I know get hints of various strengths from their postals. School teachers too cannot technically accept cash, but, and again if you read what I said, it's still expected. AFAIC it doesn't matter to me if they give the person $50 in cash, or a "gift" that cost them $50, and possibly had to pay a tax or a tip on top of it! ;)

You certainly cannot argue that many (possibly most?) people don't look at the itemization of a bill. Often bills are poorly itemized. But you cannot truly be trying to suggest that the automatic add on doesn't often result, possibly intentionally, in a double tip. Normal practice for many people is to give the tip to the waitperson or leave it on the table. Then they go check out and get hit again.

Of course I don't begrudge people from making a living in an honest manner. Let's not be totally silly. I maintain this tipping thing is out of hand, and of course prices will go up if they pay the employees instead of relying on them getting tips, but that's more of a conventional manner of income in this continent. Now it's going to stick in somebody's gullet, but if people don't make enough in tips, maybe they're not doing a good enough job? People who work on commissions... should they expect equal pay with others? Both tips and commissions should be incentives, not the bulk of the payments. That's the point several of us have maintained and somehow it's been misconstrued into an attack on the service industry.

Oh, and yes, I realize that employees get charged handling charges. I also realize there are unscrupulous businesses and unscrupulous employees. But what you didn't mention is that the charge to the employees is (if the employer is honest) only the charge the store gets charged by the credit card processing company. You must be aware that card processing centers take a percentage of the proceeds on each transaction and often has a monthly charge on top of it. So it's hardly fair to ask the company to give the employee, as an example, $100, if they get credited $95, right? And guess what? This simply backs up even more, what I said all along! LOL

If you don't want to tip then don't go out to eat, period (and I have never worked in an occupation where tipping ocurred, so I am not biased). That is the way the system works. In other countries they pay the waitstaff directly, but it is built into the price of the meal. Here it is not built into the price of the meal. If you refuse to tip even for good service then eat in restaurants in other countries. Or get takeout. Yeesh. I can't believe how cheap people can be.

I am sure the "compliance with the law" means that the laws requires that people be notified ahead of time that a gratuity will be added. Or perhaps to explain that their action was not discriminatory based on the cheap person's race.

"If you refuse to tip even for good service then eat in restaurants in other countries."

What a silly comment! Is the pendulum allowed to only swing one direction with you? Who is saying it's OK to "refuse to tip even for good service"? What point are you trying to make with such an irrelevent exaggeration? To me, giving a good person the same tip as a poor one is like rewarding a spoiled child. You wouldn't happen to be union would you?

And while you re-write how the system works, keep in mind that there is no law against giving a large tip, nor is there a law against giving no tip. THAT'S how the system works.

sue36, I'd appreciate your comments and opinions. Usually you have thoughtful insights but I don't understand this irrelevent hyperbole. Hope it's just a misunderstanding or a bad day. In any case, hope you have a great weekend.

When I was in Europe, the tip was often included as part of the bill at a set percentage, not an option.

This isn't Europe or any other country where tipping is considered rude. We know when we go out to a restaurant at which we have a serve we are supposed to tip. If you don't agree with that practice and don't want to tip, you are cheap and should go to Burger King.

Is that blunt enough?

We all know servers are paid less than minimum wage and are expected to make up the difference in tips. We know that's the way our restaurant industry works on this side of the pond. Whining about it, or protesting it, is futile. Refusing to tip the server b/c you don't agree with the practice is not only cheap, it's cowardice. If you want to protest, don't take it out on the girl (or guy) trying to do their job.

I agree your tip amount should reflect your satisfaction with the service. I don't like when it's automatically added, that's more like a surcharge than a tip. I'LL decide what I want to tip. It might be less, it might be more, than your 18% gratuity.

DH used to work for a restaurant chain in the offices writing programs for accounting and payroll. At that time, taxes were automatically taken from the servers' checks based on the assumption that they were tipped at the rate of at least 10% of the sales. The restaurants had to report sales per server. If the table ordered alcohol, the server had to give the bartender his/her share of the tip for prep of drinks. This was an upscale restaurant and most servers were tipped well over 10%, whether they reported cash tips over that or not was left to the server. So there are no doubt servers out there not paying income tax on their full tip amount, especially when the tip is cash and there is no record of it. On credit card payments, they restaurant tracked and reported the full tip. But people would under report cash tips. That's how it was done. It was DH's job to write the computer programs to make those records calculated with the sales. I was curious and asked DH a lot of questions. ;o)

I honestly did not think DD was "enraged" at all. She certainly wasn't as combative as someone else on this thread was, someone who is more popular with some of the forum members, IMHO.

Anyway, I do not have the heart to have people wait on me without me leaving a reasonable tip. Given the reality of the wage/tip structure for servers, I just couldn't do it. I go out to dinner a lot, and sometimes we run across some sort of problem with the server, but we always communicate it politely and it always gets sorted out. If I was extremely unsatisfied, I would leave a smaller tip, I suppose.

I don't think Mrs. Covington is an innocent victim at all, nor has she been subjected to discrimination. She was certainly happy enough with the service to keep going back and to bring friends with her. And the restaurant did not take that action lightly either, I would bet. I've no doubt that she was so cheap, she was WAY out of line.

Every single time I dine out, I think about the server I have and how they such a difficult job to do, often working undesirable hours while I am enjoying a nice evening or lunch. We often go out to one place and there is a much older woman serving us at night while we are relaxing and having fun. I always wonder if she would rather be home relaxing at this point in her life, rather than be working at this difficult job. I have made sure to teach my kids to be sensitive in this way. They've mentioned that their friends have commented on their thoughtfulness on this issue.

I just want to add the definition of gratuity:

"A favor or gift, usually in the form of money, given in return for service."

If a tip is defined as a gratuity, then it should reflect the service provided and not be mandatory. When we go out to eat, we are expecting to have not only great food, but also great service (or we would have just stayed in and served ourselves, lol!). If our servers do a bad job (like pattico's), why should they be rewarded?

I know being a server is a tough job, but like any job, if you can't do it well and put some enthusiasm into it, then get another job.

I think meals actually taste better when you get a great waiter or waitress. Enthusiasm is contagious:-)

dilly dally, my comment about expecting the tip....yes I do know, my SIL was a waitress for awhile, yes they paid her very little, but she was a good waitress. I was commenting on how tips are expected even when service is bad. Knowing part of your pay depends on good service I would think you would treat customers well.

My comments were in regards to the person mentioned in the article and those that rail against tipping in general ("we shouldn't have to pay them, their employers should pay them). The person in the article obviously refused to tip even for good service because she never tipped at the restaurant but continually went back, with friends. If the place was so awful she presumably wouldn't go back.

All this discussion about tipping being rude (somewhere else), tipping being not required or expected (somewhere else) is irrelevent. Here, in the US, people tip unless the service is very bad. Average service gets a tip. Excellent service gets a tip. Somewhat bad service probably gets a tip. Only truly horrible service justifies no tip.

Now, I am talking about restaurants. I am not wading into whether we tip the person at Dunkin Donuts, the oil man, the delivery mail, the mailman, the trash man, etc.

I agree, Sue!

Remember this incident? Back in November, 2009?

Here is a link that might be useful: Arrested

Monablair, I remember that incident well and the discussions here about it.

It's interesting. I don't even set the bar at "great" food and service. Especially since food taste is quite subjective. I don't have a palate of Gordon Ramsay. I know what I like and what I don't like and I often order conservatively. I want good food and good service, whether from a drive up window or a sit down restaurant. Basic service to me, essentially includes timely greeting and seating which becomes moot once seated. If it was too long, I'd leave. I expect a reasonably prompt greeting by somone and an offer of water or perhaps a drink order. When things are busy, I'm reasonable and very flexible. If I'm tremendously thirsty I might suggest they save a trip and bring me 2 glasses of water. When I'm with others, often there's some conversation but I expect a menu either on the table or by the time the drinks arrive. These are pretty basic and pretty dang reasonable. To not meet this is pretty bad.

Once an order is taken, I expect to not be totally abandoned. Check the drinks as you go by. I go the extra mile and set the glass by the edge of the table for a hint. If I have to yell across the room, you lose points. When the food arrives, drinks should be checked and I expect someone back in a timely fashion to see if all is right. You may know that person A gets the t-bone and B gets the chili melt but you don't always know if the steak is rare when ordered well-done or vice-versa. Otherwise, do you job with other tables and be observant if I have to flag you down. Lastly, when finished, don't abandon the drinks. Might want some more water. This is not asking much and would qualify for probably at least 10%-15%. If you make my experience more pleasurable for whatever reason, it only goes up and little errors are easily forgiven. I look for someone to TRY. You may not always do everything perfectly but that's not being required.

Places that I frequent, and consistently receive outstanding service, get more, even if they slip this trip, short of being terrible service. I was at the diner today and the regular waitress was having a tough day and spending a lot of time on the phone, forgetting things, etc. But she has otherwise ALWAYS given me fast, efficient and great service. I won't penalize her for a slipup. One of the other waitresses was trying to cover for her mistakes which is what a team does. I had my normal great turkey dinner and kind of dawdled a bit. Couldn't eat too fast today but I was checked on, not only by both waitresses but also the owner herself, which isn't unusual. Even with problems you can't expect more than for them to make it right. My bill was less than $7.50, and I enjoyed myself, had a delicious meal and left a $2.50 tip.

However, there's also times when service has been so abominable I left the penny tip - the ultimate insult.

All too often, people are sheeple. Gas stations went from full-serve to self serve and maintained the prices. Then the losing lawyer gets paid the same as the winning lawyer and we put up with it so some restaurants think that they should have the same income from "self-serve" as "full service".

My comments on this entire thread are pretty straightforward. Having been in the Hospitality biz for over 45 years, the tipping issues have changed immensely.
Used to be you tipped according to the service you received-there wasn't a percentage based custom. My staff was always just darned happy to get any amount as a tip! But as the decades have rolled on...as our economy has proved...GREED set in..by everyone.
Purveyors, restaurant owners, cooks, waitstaff, etc. Everyone wants a bigger 'cut'. I do know-even back in 1984-a big Victorian restaurant I hosted for-at evening's end-I had to tally each waiter/waitress' checks-food & beverage totals-sans tax. Then I had to deduct 8% and that amount I had to report to the government.
Busboys were given a % of each waitresses tips-(she didn't have to tell him how much-gave what she wanted)..and bartenders got tipped from their customers only.
Just 6 yrs ago, when I hostessed at a local beach place..I was amazed at way things have changed! Bartenders have to tip their backbar person, waitresses have to not only report whatever the % is to the IRS but also a cut is given to their busboys and a cut to the bartender who fixes their dining room beverages.
Customers need to be wary of the small print on the menu at the bottom-it must, by law, state that groups over a certain amount of people seated (usually 6 or 8)..an automatic 18% tip will be added to the bill. Can't tell you how many patrons left a hefty tip at their table- only to find the tip was added when they reach the cashier's register!
Me? I still tip the way my mom taught me so many years ago..I tip for the service I receive. Owners need to pay their backbars, buspersons better wages & keep them out of the servers' cut. The only person that should get a cut of a server's tips should be the bartender who fixes her drinks as it's added to the dinner tab.

"I honestly did not think DD was "enraged" at all."

Thanks Sue! No, I was not "enraged". I have no idea where that came from nor the allusion that I practice witchcraft with pitchforks and whatnot. :eye roll: I was merely trying to convey some information and facts.

The custom of tipping varies regionally. I myself have had to be educated about it when traveling. For instance.........Remember the old days when gas stations pumped your gas and washed your windows? I was surprised that in Mexico the guys that pumped gas were working for tips only. That was not the custom here in America. Here the service was included in the price of the gas. I am surprised that no one threw a brick at my window when I was driving away without paying them for the service. I was subsequently informed of the proper way to do things at gas stations there.

I recently learned when shopping at a military base that the women who bag your groceries are working for tips only. My friend who I was shopping with had to nudge me and explain the system telling me to toss them a dollar. I wish they would have just put up a sign telling shoppers this.

I also learned after YEARS of accidentally stiffing pizza delivery guys that they work for *tips only* and that the $5 *delivery fee* that is tacked on to the bill does not go to them as I had assumed. I wish I could go back in time and find all those pizza guys and make it up to them. I did not know! I thought they got the *delivery charge*.

When people inform me of these things I am grateful to receive the information. I don't consider them to be "enraged".

"Essentially we're in agreement on at least several points........... You don't like the add on tip for the restaurant."

Uh, I never said that. Nope.

"I too wondered what, if anything she did for a living and what her background included."

Well wonder no more! It appears that Ms. Covington is the "ministry coordinator" for the church she and her brother started. Click in the link below if you wish to contribute to their plea for tithing. ROTFLMAO.

I did a lot of reading on her and it seems this new incident has incited discussion on a lot of boards. It is proven that the newscaster who did the article is a member of her church and also a "special friend". If is said that the 300 signatures gathered to support her were garnered by having her brother order it from the pulpit and congregation members are angry about being duped to sign and embarrassed about the whole matter.

She is being investigated for using church credit cards to buy groceries and clothing for her family and used the credit card to buy a house for herself.

Contributors on some discussion boards say they recognize her as coming into their restaurant and never tipping. Yes, of course I realize that anything said on a discussion board should not be taken verbatim as fact but the posters seemed credulous when the whole thread is read. One poster said that Ms. Covington comes into restaurants with a "doctors note" saying the restaurant must break their rules for her and sell her the lower priced 'childrens portions' since she is trying to lose weight. LOL.

Seriously, for this restaurant to have not only the servers, but the CHEFS refuse service to her, it sounds like she liked to complain a lot about everything - and yet kept going back.

If you would like to practice tithing to support Ms Covington and her brother, The Reverend Sir W. L. Mack, Jr. in the lifestyle to which they have become accustomed just click below. I wonder if they perform weddings and funerals without expecting the usual "tip" a reverend usually receives for such a service? Anyone with a wedding coming up? Save money by using their ministry services without having to pay! No tipping the minister right?

http://www.unionbaptistwsnc.org/staff.html

Ms. Covington is now trying to start a lawsuit. I hope her lawyer is going to ask for payment in advance because I am sure she is probably one of those people who think they don't have to pay their lawyer if they lose the case.

Here is a link that might be useful: Tithing for Ms Covington

Christians are supposed to , " ... give good measure, shaken, pressed down ... and running over".

I may be frugal ... but not cheap.

I wouldn't countenance anyone having done such things in my church ... sorry, " ... in a church in which I served as clergyperson".

Here's my tip of the day - "Have yourselves a great week, everyone".

ole joyful

I know it would wind up as religious discussion, but "churches" and the misuse, abuse, etc is a great topic for a discussion thread. But alas someone would find a reason to be offended and complain so I shan't begin it. And I suppose someone would interpret it as saying nobody should donate anything at all to a church! LOL