What kind of insulation is this?

19 years ago

I recently bought a house built in 1925. The bathroom was pretty dreadful- all the walls were covered with some kind of fake gold/beige marble plastic-y paneling. After taking down the paneling, it got very cold in there. I figured there was no insulation- would have been typical for that time period.

I started taking down the old sheetrock (also original- from what I can tell) since I was going to replace it anyway because of the panel adhesive, and then I could insulate at that point, and I found that there was indeed insulation- but what the heck is it?

It's called "paper tite builders insulation".

It's very old paper-faced something- it looks like shredded wood inside the paper to me. The paper is extremely brittle- you can't touch it without it tearing and the fibers of the insulation going all over the place. I stopped quickly when I saw that and haven't touched it since. I'm tempted to just put new new drywall on the one panel where I already pulled the old stuff off- I really don't want the mess and safety concerns if it's old crumbly fiberglass instead of wood shavings. I did have someone with asbestos background there for something else tell me he didn't think it was asbestos based at least, but that it was probably not wise to disturb it without using the same sort of precautions used for asbestos or mold or other nasties that can be released into the air.

Anybody run into "paper tite bulders insulation" from the mid 20's when renovating? Anybody know what is in it?

The next question is : should I try a blown-in insulation to supplement the one inch or so in there since I can't remove it without a huge mess? Or just wait until I can afford to have someone come in with the right equipment to deal with the messy removal safely?

thanks,

d.

Comments (9)

housekeeping
19 years ago
It's probably a material called rock wool. Try googling for that and see what you find. I have a little bit of that in between the interior and exterior panels in the walls under some of my first floor windows. I believe it was a forerunner of fiberglass.

It would probably be a mess to take out, though. My advice would be to slap up sheet rock, for now. Since you just bought the house, it might be a good idea to concentrate on figuring out the big picture of what really needs doing, first.

When you get around to assessing the insulation needs, you can decide what, if anything, to do about it. BTW, unless your exterior cladding leaks, it's probably not a mold issue.

Congratulations on your new house!

Molly
sharon_sd
19 years ago
If the room was not especially cold before taking down the panelling, maybe what you need most is not new insulation, but a good air seal. Seal up every crack that could allow air to penetrate. It makes a huge difference.
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deore
Original Author
19 years ago
Hmm...hadn't thought about rock/mineral wool. What color is really old mineral wool? This stuff is brown- almost a old redwood color, and looks like coarse sawdust or wood splinters.

I will definitely be sealing it up well- you're right about needing to do that and I bet it will help a lot. There's *no* tape on the joints in the sheetrock- guess it was built before tape and joint compound came into use. I found traces of some kind of black joint sealer in the living room when I was removing old wallpaper- guess that was also pre-tape. The wallpaper that was there when I moved in was pretty ugly- blue speckles on a white background. The room is now SW Hubbard Squash :)

I had no idea what was under the most recent wallpaper- and when I started removing it, it was fun to see remnants of the earlier papers. They had removed most of it in areas, but I could still find traces of an ornate embossed red paper, and under that, an interesting one printed with trees, water, houses- looked very 20's to me. The colors were that kind of muted vegetable dye looking colors they used then.

I'm enjoying the archeology of finding traces of what was originally there. Wish they had left more of it around. I'm very much looking forward to pulling up the icky gold carpet to expose oak hardwood next:)

d.
brickeyee
19 years ago
'rock wool' or 'mibneral wool' looks very similar to fiberglass, but typically has shrter strands. It is a glass type product made from slag on metal furnaces by about the same process used to make fiberglass.
A number of paper and wood products have been used over the years for insulation (including chipped wood). Many of the older cellulose products of this type have poor to no fire retardent, and if you have a chance should probably be removed.
You can take a small sample outside and see if it is flammable and decide from there.
housekeeping
19 years ago
House archeology is fun, isn't it? I hope you're keeping samples of the various wall papers and paints that you find. Save future owners the trouble and put sample cards of your paint chips in the same scrap book. Think how fab it would have been if you had found something like that done by previous owners and passed on to you!
deore
Original Author
19 years ago
That's a good idea. That would have been fun to have. Though like other stories I've read here, the previous owners didn't care much at all about what was there. They were the sort to cover hardwood floors with ugly carpet, put on vinyl siding and windows, put up shiny vinyl wallpaper and semi-gloss paint everywhere, and did just about everything as cheaply (and shoddily in some cases) as possible. It was a rental house for many years, and I think they didn't want to do anything too nice to it- and made it as maintenance-free as possible.

I've been taking pictures- unfortunately, the really old wallpapers were too thin and brittle to try to get any off the walls intact. But I'll have a photo-diary.

And luckily, the only thing that needs immediate work in this house is the bathroom. Besides the ugly paneling which was already barely attached to the walls, there was water damage and mold on/in/under one wall where the plumbing is, so that's got to be cleaned and repaired and some old galvanized pipe replaced before the bathroom is really usable.

The rest of the house needs TLC, but it's just cosmetic stuff for the most part.

D.
naturelle
19 years ago
I do not believe there is any rockwool that has a colour like sawdust. It's usually a grey, and in its loose form a "cottony" texture, as brickeye says like batt fiberglass.

The description seems to indicate a wood product.

Ted
drywall_diy_guy
19 years ago
If this is rock wool (which it sounds like it is), wear a very very good dust mask and wear long sleeves etc. This stuff is worse than fiberglass. I took some out this summer and the dust was terrible!
tudor_1931
17 years ago
I have the same stuff! I don't think it's rock wool because I don't think rock wool is paper backed. I read something about "Balsa Batt" which would be saw dust backed with paper. But I would assume this is flammable and my stuff doesn't seem to want to burn.

Here is a link that might be useful: Balsa Batt article

What kind of insulation is this?

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housekeeping

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What kind of insulation is this?

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housekeeping

sharon_sd

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brickeyee

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deore
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