Heat Pump vs Gas Furnace: Which should I install?

12 years ago

I am building a new 2400 square foot house in lower Alabama. I have the opportunity to have my heating be either electric or gas. My builder is providing these options:

1. 13 SEER AC unit; natural gas furnace; natural gas water heater (I am not sure of the specifics of the furnace & hot water heater, but fairly basic models I think).

2. 14 SEER Heat Pump (air source) and Marathon Electric hot water heater.

The builder is offering the free upgrade (option #2) because of the offset from the electric company to hook up our house to the grid if we are using more electricity by installing more electrical systems in the house.

I met with the electric power company and they provided documentation that for a home in our area we can save about 25% of our utility costs by installing the heat pump and electric hot water instead of natural gas systems.

Is this a no-brainer decision? I should go with the free upgraded system since we are in hot climate and the AC will be more efficient? Are there any other questions I should asking before making this decision?

Other facts: There will just be two of us in the house. We just moved out of an all electric home and are used to the performance of a heat pump/electric hot water heater and did not dislike what we had, but we were in a milder climate (North Carolina).

I haven't checked into a geothermal heat pump as I am assuming that it would be a budget buster.

Featured Answer

david_cary

12 years ago

That close to the gulf, I doubt you would need both. Really the best would be NG hot water and straight heatpump but I'm guessing that would negate the deal.

Go with the heat pump.

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Comments (9)

weedmeister
12 years ago
North Carolina is a milder climate than southern Alabama? You mean you think it will be cooler in Alabama?

To answer your question, a good heatpump will run great in southern AL.

How close to the coast?
Is your kitchen to be gas or electric?
What is the cost of gas and electricity in that area?

The more important thing, comfort-wise, would be to get a variable speed blower that works with a thermostat with 'dehumidify on demand'.
morgulrat
Original Author
12 years ago
Thanks for the reply. I am sure Alabama will be much hotter in summer for us.

- 13 miles from the Gulf
- Gas kitchen range, option for gas clothes dryer, gas log fireplace
- the documentation I have shows a kilowatt hour is $.12 and gas is $2.1 per cubic foot for the amounts we would be using in a house this size
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You should definitely be pricing with just heat pump. I live in NC which probably is a bit colder in the winter. We get down to the teens but only 15 nights a year maybe. Our winter average low is about 30. Under 10 degrees is definitely a news story. I have 5000 sq ft. I'm looking at my NG bill of $30. I have dual fuel and seer 16 heat pumps. Last winter was very cold and I spent about $700 with $200 being gas. This winter is going to be $120 in gas. My electric rates are similar to yours without the first 1000 discount. What is my point? Your gas usage will likely be $100 a year. Even if that were replaced with all heating strips, you'd be saving $200 a year or so. Since it would probable be 80% heat pump still, the dual fuel is only saving you $40 a year. So a $2500 furnace to save $40 a year seems a little crazy (on dollars alone). Turns out for me, it is probably worth it but only marginally so. I have a 90% (which you should be able to do as mine is basement with horizontal PVC exhaust). It probably saves $60-$70 on an average year. Probably cost $2000 (new house - I can't remember). What is that a 30 year payback (or never if you count interest or NG rates increase)? You do get some flexibility and you can setback at will with dual fuel. That is worth something.
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The DOE has worksheets that can help you calculate the relative cost of heating and cooling with different systems using your current energy costs. Of course you need to predict the relative costs over the next decade or two to really tell what is best. How is your crystal ball working? I would like to clear up a couple of common misconceptions. One type of heat does not dry a house in the winter any more than another. Leaky house envelopes dry houses. Heat by flame of some sort might dry a house more because they draw more outside air in if there is not a source of outside combustion air. That would be the only mechanism. There is nothing special about heat pumps in poorly-insulated, leaky homes. No heat or air conditioning source works as well in that situation as well as they do in tighter, well-insulated homes.
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It depends on where you are located geographically. I have what is called a dual fuel system--heat pump and natural gas. My heatng bills are about the lowest in my subdivision of 64 custom homes (the gentleman with radiant floor heat and two other guys that burn wood pay a little less). Folks in our subdivision that use natural gas furnaces only have much higher bills than mine. Folks that don't set their heat pump balance points have heating bills higher than mine. I set mine so the natural gas furnace doesn't kick on until about 25 degrees outside. I am well insulated with great windows, energy efficient and have a 3.5 tone HP for 2,981 sq. ft. 1.5 stories. Depends on your home envelope, too. Check your electric and natural gas rates which includes delivered price (i.e. total cost you paid for electricity including service charges divided by total KWH and total cost for gas including service charges divided by total therms or Cubic feet used to get your real world costs. In my case, natural gas needs to come down about 35 cents delivered price before it breaks even with my electric. Your rates will likely vary.
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Hi weedmeister, We are in the central, western part of the state - Eugene. Our climate is not nearly as extreme as the eastern part of the state, however, this week - we're sitting below the 20s! This is not typical. Our winter weather is normally 40's day and 30's in the evening. Luckily, the windows were one of the first items we've tackled - those have all been upgraded to dual pane, vinyl, low-E milgard windows. That was quite the task, and prior to the replacement, it was EXTREMELY cold in the home. So now that the windows have been tackled, and we've replaced insulation as we've remodeled some rooms (not all, but many of our exterior walls have been upgraded), we're desperate to have some normal, even and comfortable heat. We're more concerned with heating in the winter, but with a HP system, we're liking the idea of having AC during the summer.
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junkmailhold
12 years ago
Why not do BOTH? It's what they call hybrid heat and then you can choose which you use whenever you want so you can pick the cheaper of the two whenever you want.
tigerdunes
12 years ago
morgulrat

I would go all electric with high eff heat pump.

these are my minimum specs for a new HP system.

15 SEER, 12.5+ EER, 9 HSPF
best matching Var Speed air handler
full BTUs in both cooling and heating for your rated size
R-410a refrigerant(same as Puron)
scroll compressor preferred
electronic demand defrost preferred
thermostat with "dehumidify on demand" feature
staged backup heat strips
new and correctly sized refrigerant lineset

Because of your close proximity to the gulf and harsh coastal environment, I would recommend Trane's XL15i or sister company's American Std Heritage 15.

if you want to use gas for cooktop, dryer, hot water, logs, then you have that option.

accurate equipment sizing, good ductwork system including returns, and install by dealer are key to a successful new system.

IMO
thull
12 years ago
Where milder/less mild matters is in the heating season with a heat pump. The AC functions about the same, but if it's too cold out the heat pump BTU output may not be enough to keep up. Even if you have plenty of AC capacity in the summer.

I assume you're on NG and not propane. Also, $2.1 per hundred cubic feet (ccf) would be more normal. Ours in ATL is around $1/therm (therm = ccf), and it might be $2.1 once you add on the administrative costs.

It might make sense, if you're already paying the overhead on your NG account, to go with a dual fuel system. The extra use spreads that admin cost further, if your system is set up to do it when it makes sense. A dual fuel system will run the HP until it can't keep up (or the controls lock it out based on outside temperature), then kick on the gas furnace as the 2nd stage.

This takes advantage of running the heat pump most of the time without needing electric heating strips as backup heat. The HP will put out about 3X as much heat as the energy it uses- that's what makes it cheaper to run than a NG furnace. But the backup heat strips are 1:1 on energy to heat, which usually isn't competitive with NG.

Also, I kind of like the idea of having a standard efficiency gas water heater. Offends my drive for efficiency, but as a kid on the N end of AL, the power went out enough during hurricanes, ice storms and the like that it was nice to still have hot water (and a fireplace) when that stuff happened.
tigerdunes
12 years ago
OP does not need dual fuel for this location.

IMO
zippyhvac
12 years ago
FWIW, consider scrapping the regular electric "marathon" water heater and using a heat pump water heater. I use an "airtap" unit and the savings are amazing.

Here is a link that might be useful: airtap
neohioheatpump
12 years ago
all electric would be fine, but if you already paying for the monthly gas service charge for you kitchen and range I would go with dual fuel.

The heatpump hot water tank sounds cool.

zippyhvac - how do you like that heatpump hot water tank? I saw the website from you link. Did you do the retrofit? Was it an easy install?

Heat Pump vs Gas Furnace: Which should I install?

david_cary

Comments (9)

weedmeister

morgulrat
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Heat Pump vs Gas Furnace: Which should I install?

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morgulratOriginal Author

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