In our household, we will be discussing the issue with each child, both for and against, and they will be able to make the decision for themselves, either when they are adults or when they choose to enter into that part of their lives.

ETA: I should note that this will apply to 3/4 children. For the other child, it is hard to say as he is autistic and his ability to reason on such matters is hard to gauge at this point so we will take a wait and see approach with him.

This post was edited by tishtoshnm on Tue, Sep 2, 14 at 16:56

Son and daughter were given a thorough explanation of the vaccine and what it prevents. Son said yes at the mention of STD (he's 13 and has recently caught girl fever...ugh!) and daughter said yes after asking a bunch of really good questions (11 and really smart). For vaccinations that are considered necessary for herd immunity (protects folks like me, who have to limit what vaccines I can have due to existing medical issues), they have no say. It is a yes from dad and I and they get the poke.

Well, here in TX we didn't have a choice. If we wanted to send our kids to public school, they had to show proof of the vaccine. My pediatrician was in favor of it, and given a proper amount of time to research it a bit, I may have made that decision anyway. But this was early on, right after the vaccine came out, and I really resented the force from the governor's office. Surprise, surprise the manufacturer was a big Rick Perry campaign contributor.

My daughter got the vaccine....probably about 6- 7 years ago. I never heard that boys should have it... I guess too late for my boys now at 30 and 26.

My SO made sure his daughter got it - she's >21, but he paid for it.

His sons declined it, and he's not happy about that.

========
If I had male or female children in that age group, I would DEFINITELY make sure they got it.

martinca, why would you not?

DD received the vaccine years ago. DH is a Hematologist / Medical Oncologist and he is definitely in favor of it. However since the vaccine was new he researched it thoroughly before recommending it.

Olychick - the NPR article was interesting but cursory and 3 years old. Are you aware of any current studies on the topic?

Cancer is not the only reason to have the vaccine. HPV is highly contagious and causes genital warts. A woman who has HPV can spread the virus (and warts) to children during pregnancy and complications for the child can be life-threatening. From a PBS report: "Health experts estimate there are more cases of genital HPV infection than any other STI in the United States. At least 20 million people in this country are already infected. Approximately 6.2 million new cases of sexually-transmitted HPV infections are reported each year, according to the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC).

About 50 percent of sexually active men and women acquire genital HPV infection at some point in their lives. By age 50, at least 80 percent of women will have acquired genital HPV infection."

If that isn't reason enough for both boys and girls to be vaccinated, I don't know what would be.

My daughter got it when she was in her early 20's.

FWIW, it is possible for the body to eliminate the virus over time.

I read the NPR article linked above and found no compelling reason not to vaccinate. The major concerns over the vaccine listed in the article are political (we don't want the government telling us what to do) and emotional (don't tell me little boy/girl is having sex), not medical.

67 million doses of the vaccine have been administered, so clear evidence would exist if the vaccine was not safe.

When this vaccine fears first released, my insurance provider would only pay for female immunization. I have boys, but will investigate both with their physician and my insurance company.

The fact that the vaccine doesn't protect against all strains of HPV is no more a reason not to get the vaccine than is the fact that the flu vaccine doesn't vaccinate against all strains of flu. If it protects you from the one you would've gotten, you're better off.

There is a group of girls that have had ongoing, debilitating side effects from this vaccine. They are a small percentage of the total vaccinated but the percentage having serious side effects is much higher than other vaccines that we give children. The cause is not known but there is evidence that children who already have allergies might be reacting to an additive in the vaccine.

Unfortunately, I don't have time this morning to wade through all the anti vaccine hysteria to find the particular numbers. I'll try to post more later but I encourage people to THOROUGHLY research this vaccine before they allow their children to get it.

I'll have to think about it. And soon. But, for those who are balking over the young age, don't wait until you think the child is sexually active. Something about a barn door and a horse come to mind here.

My 25 yr old dd was vaccinated.

I haven't decided yet about my twin sons (12), but I don't think so.

I have read the literature. I am a retired health care professional. So I am not uninformed.

Not that long ago we prescribed lots of hormone replacement therapy to post menopausal women because we were all sold a bill of goods that it would protect women against cardiovascular disease and a host of other ailments. If you were post menopausal...you were offered hormones.

Oops.

I am not saying this is the same. But I think the jury is still out.

My children are all grown adults now, but I would have gotten them the vax had it been around when they were young. Boys too.

One thing I made sure of, for all the kids, was to discuss STD's-it's not just intercourse that spreads them-so we had the difficult (for all involved!) conversations about them. DH is prone to cold sores, a form of herpes virus (not the STD) and that helped give a visual to the kids that they could relate to prevention. Of course, most show no outward signs, but that was a good remimder.

Sorry-OT, but yes, I would have gotten them all the vax. Kids have a tendency to not think about what sexual activity includes, and as a parent, we have to remember that should our children get sexually involved, the kids might not get their partners full history. I had 'the talk' with the kids early on, but when they actually began having sex, I have no idea-they certainly didn't tell me.

I believe pediatricians in our area recommend this vaccine for both male and females. I know several who have had their sons vaccinated. Most I know have had the vaccine around the tween years. I recently saw in a magazine an ad recommending this for boys also, so I would imagine their is a campaign going on to educate/support having boys vaccinated also.

Shee - I have never heard the virus could be eliminated??? Interesting, but how long does that take? Damage could be done before it is eliminated I would guess? To be honest, since I don't have children to have vaccinated, I have not read up much on this.

My friend is dying from throat cancer, one of the cancers this vaccine offers some protection from. He is on this 3rd battle and while still fighting, it is not looking good.

In a heartbeat I would say yes.

When the vaccine first came out, my kids were younger and I was glad. I wanted to wait as long as possible since it was a new vaccine and there was some negative reaction to it (side effects). I was though, annoyed that in certain states, kids were being required to have the vaccine. I would have fought that if my kids were of the age it was being required - I think 11 y/o? And no, I'm not a fundamentalist Christian - I think they were the most vocal opponents IIRC, believing that support of the vaccine meant they were somehow giving approval to their kids to have sex.

My oldest two have had the vaccine - my 15 y/o dd and my 13 y/o ds. Well, actually, I can't recall if my son did get it - there was some discussion b/c he was needing other shots and we didn't want to do them all at once. If he didn't get it at his last visit which was in July, he will get it at his next. My 15 y/o just got the first shot at her well visit in June. While I still have some lingering doubts, mainly about any possible side effects that may not rear their heads until many years from now, I decided the benefits were worth it. I did consult with several friends who are pediatricians, as well as one who has three teenage daughters who all had the vaccine.

I only heard recently that the vaccine was now offered to boys. Our pediatrician told me last year and gave the example of throat cancer as a reason why boys should be getting it too as girls aren't the only ones affected by HPV.

I am not sure if this is what shee is referring to, but another reason to wait until my kids are older for them to decide is because I need to research the possibilities of loss of immunity. While I was fully vaccinated as a child (according to the standards of the time), I lost my immunity to the MMR and had to receive another 3 shots (I think) before I regained the immunity. If it is a possibility with this virus, I think it would be better to wait until a time a little bit closer to the onset of risk.

Yes!!! Wish this vaccine was around years go.

I am also in Texas, so no choice (f$#ing Rick Perry aka idiot) but to vaccinate our daughter (she is 21 now), but I would have anyway because her pediatrician was so in favor of it. At the time, his daughter's best friend (who was in her late twenties) was dying from cervical cancer. Our boys are 23 and 25 now, and there was no recommendation for boys to have it, so they did not get it.

I would not. I also do not do the flu shots.

So yeah, going against the grain, did not and do not have plans to get it for my 13 & 15 yr old. Somewhat opposed to unnecessary vaccines, did not get HepB either as they are at very low risk at this point in their lives. Have the philosophy that they need to be aware of risky behavior and if at a point later in life they are engaging in those activities they can choose then to get the vaccines. Maybe it's head in the sand but we do have a celibate until marriage expectation.

I also have an acquaintance who came down with HPV throat cancer three years ago. She is a fundamental Christian, very straight-laced (won't even say "damn"), married since age 19, mother of two, grandmother of three. Her husband contracted it on one of his business trips.

I didn't get it for either of my dd's. If my oldest ever decides to marry or become sexually active (I know, TMI), then she can get it.

Unfortunate but true, a lot of girls and women don't have a choice about becoming "sexually active". There are enough potential STDs and STIs one can acquire from rape without also acquiring something that was preventable. About 18% of US women face a lifetime risk of rape or attempted rape, and 15% of sexual assault and rape victims are under the age of 12.

I am glad you brought this up.

Originally, I was all for it, then wasn't so sure due to side effects.

I don't really understand the age thing-- if they missed the 11-12 window for the 3 doses, then what? Through age 26 as long as they weren't sexually active?

This post was edited by anele on Wed, Sep 3, 14 at 23:51

* More than 40 types of HPV can infect genital, mouth, throat areas of males & females
* Most who become infected with HPV do NOT know they have it
* HPV is the MOST COMMON sexually-transmitted infection in the US
* Nearly ALL sexually-active will get at least one type of HPV at some time in their lives
* ~79 million Americans currently infected w/ HPV; 14 million newly infected each yr
* Health problems caused by HPV include:
-----Genital warts
-----Cervical cancer
-----Oropharyngeal cancer (back of throat, tongue, tonsils)
-----Anal cancer
-----Vulvar/vaginal cancer
-----Penile cancer
* Every year ~17,500 women & 9,300 men are affected by cancers caused by HPV.
* About 1 in 100 sexually active adults have genital warts - at any given time
* People get HPV from another person during sexual activity
* Most get HPV from vaginal, anal sex; can also get HPV from oral & other sex play
* Can get HPV - even if partner does NOT have signs/symptoms of HPV infection
* Can have HPV even if years have passed since sexual contact with infected person
* Most do NOT realize they are infected & do not know may be passing HPV to partner

Here is a link that might be useful: HPV info

My son and I began the discussion last night. I will talk with the pediatrician with whom I work today, and next, we'll do whatever son decides at his office visit we were already going to. I'm glad you started this topic. I had no idea guys should also get it. He's 14, but I'm pretty sure he's still not active and it won't be too late.

Here are some stats on the side effects:

According to a report in the Japan Times, 8.29 million people had received the HPV vaccine as of December 2012, and there were 1968 cases of concerning adverse events reported as of March 2013. Of these adverse events, 106 were described as "serious cases of pains or body convulsions, pains in joints, or difficulty in walking."

Those numbers translate to a rate of 12.8 serious cases of adverse events per 1 million inoculations, according to the report. This compares unfavorably with the 0.9 serious adverse events per million influenza inoculations in Japan and the 2.1 serious adverse events per million inoculations of inactivated polio vaccine. However, the rate seen with the HPV vaccine is lower than that for the Japanese encephalitis vaccine, which is 26.0 serious cases per million inoculations.

Here is a link that might be useful: Japan HPV vaccine girls

I didn't know it was recommended for boys. I did not get it for my daughter when it was offered at her last physical exam a couple months ago. She is 12. I was and am concerned about side effects and putting anything unnecessary into her body. We don't even get flu shots and only take medicine when absolutely necessary. I know, I'm in the minority. We may change our minds as she grows. Please, no lectures.

Thanks for that info Mdln. Very helpful.

I cannot stress enough that STD's are very, very easily passed on, and not just through intercourse. Far, far too many young people don't consider that even digital contact can spread STD's if there is a cut in the hands or they touch their mucous membranes. Oral sex is often NOT considered sex by young people, and be honest, how many have 'the talk' with their kids and discuss oral sex?

And again, as I noted, young people, especially young teens, are not going to ask their partners about their past partners or past sexual activity. The virginal girl or boy your child (even as an adult) has sexual contact with COULD be infected with an STD and not even know. Just the facts of life these days.

Thanks for further info, Mdln and Annie.

Two more perspectives (one linked here, one below):

http://health.usnews.com/health-news/news/articles/2013/03/18/parents-worries-about-hpv-vaccine-on-the-rise-study

I don't know. Everything has a risk. Getting it has a risk, so does not getting it.

ETA: One more. The fact that it only lasts 5 yrs concerns me. http://www.cbsnews.com/news/gardasil-researcher-speaks-out/

Last one! Two sides: http://www.womenshealthmag.com/health/hpv-vaccine-facts

Here is a link that might be useful: 49 Deaths/213 Disabilities

This post was edited by anele on Thu, Sep 4, 14 at 10:59

I was part of a study here in Canada. We were vaccinated with it then had regular checkups and paps tests, blood work done, urine tests for pregnancy etc etc. every few months.

If I had kids I definitely would want them to get the vaccine. Prevention is key, and cervical cancer HPV is one of the top cancers.

Not a scientific article but interesting.

Here is a link that might be useful: Forbes article

A healthy dose of skepticism is a good thing when the degree of marketing of a drug or vaccine outweighs the prevalence of what it's treating. 10x as many women die from breast cancer, 2x from endometrial cancer, and more than 3x from ovarian cancer, as do from cervical cancer (U.S. figures). And this doesn't even bring in the statistics from other cancers and non-cancer related deaths. The National Cancer Institute notes that most HPV infections will resolve on their own. Moreover, it's still not clear how long the vaccine lasts. I ran across a statement that it's not yet been demonstrated to last more than 5 years (this research is, obviously, ongoing).

This isn't to dismiss those who have or know someone suffering from cervical cancer. Nor does it discount the value of pharmaceutical research in this country.

Any vaccine or drug given to a developing child should be researched thoroughly from many different sources, and not just discussed with a doctor, whose sole information may only be from the drug company's rep or a quick review of a recent study. A more holistic examination of all available information is certainly in order.

"Have the philosophy that they need to be aware of risky behavior and if at a point later in life they are engaging in those activities they can choose then to get the vaccines."

Do you really think a child has ever not had sex because they're not vaccinated for HPV? Really? Do you think a hot-and-bothered teen has ever said "Stop, I'm not vaccinated for HPV"

This doesn't affect, or have anything to do with risk taking. You're putting your kids in danger for no reason.

As to some people having bad side effects, thats the risk of anything. People die from aspirin a lot more often than people die from vaccines.

One article said the quadrivalent vaccine efficacy began to wane at four years. Another said the bivalent vaccine was still effective at 8.4 yrs.

But who really knows? I think it will be a few more years before we really know how many years the patient is protected. The drugs haven't been available that long to really know.

I think most of you are talking about young children. I think I need to explain that both my girls were over 18 and out of the home when the HPV vaccination became available. At that point in their lives, I could suggest, but couldn't require them to do it. I did ask them to discuss it with their gynecologists, but that was as far as I went with it. Dd#2 may have gotten it, but I'm pretty sure dd#1 did not as she was barely making ends meet at the time and had no insurance.

Marti8a, then you'll want your daughters to research (not just talk with their doctors) about the vaccine for young women in their child-bearing years.

Our discussion has turned into, I required him get the vaccine

:(

It's better when a child can make up their own mind, but it was really hard to get him to understand that even though it didn't matter much right now, it could on down the line, and the earlier (before it mattered) the better. I could tell the physician really wanted to defer to his decision, and typically I do, but this time, I put my foot down. Oh well. Maybe he'll thank me for it later? We're off to the 2nd of the three starting innoculations today. I feel like a slug!

Having been through a colposcopy or two, and having had the vaccine (was also a part of a trial up here in Canada) -- I would far rather take the vaccine. Getting even a low grade abnormal test result is no picnic mentally, physically or emotionally.

I would also point out that even if your kid waited for marriage, the odds are not good that their partner has also waited for marriage since 95% of Americans do not wait for marriage. So even if yours waited, they could still be quite at risk from their partner...even if their partner only had even one other partner.

I think the best thing the government could do is normalize the vaccination program regardless of parental perception of how likely their kids are to be active early.

Of course many do not like to think their kids could be sexually active early, and some will be correct in that, but the data show that on average, you can't bet on teenagers following that progam (70% are active by age 19, and abstinence only sex ed continues to be positively correlated not with abstinence, but with teen pregnancy, which is lamentably high in the US although it has been dropping quite nicely in the 2000s due to uptake in contraceptive use).

If you "wait until marriage" it will probably already be too late, if only because the average age of first marriage is higher than the highest age (26) you can get the vaccine. And that's not even taking into account the increasing number of people who don't ever get married.

Thank you, IloveRed, to the link of Forbes article. Here's an excerpt from that Forbes link:

https://www.forbes.com/sites/matthewherper/2012/04/04/americas-gardasil-problem-how-politics-poisons-public-health/3/#4978b3012389

"They looked specifically at the ­terrible neurological disease called Guillain-Barré Syndrome, because it’s known that a swine flu shot given in the 1970s caused it. The rate of GBS reported for Gardasil was half what it was for other vaccines.

In the U.S. the number of cases of cervical cancer is controlled by the fact that women get regular Pap smears. Among the most effective cancer screening tests ever invented, they catch precancerous growths before they turn into tumors. "

THANK YOU, anele_gw, for the CBS news link, see excerpt https://www.cbsnews.com/news/gardasil-researcher-speaks-out/

"A new study in the Journal of the American Medical Association found while the overall risk of side effects appears to be comparable to other vaccines, Gardasil has a higher incidence of blood clots reported.

Merck also says it's looking into cases of ALS, commonly known as Lou Gehrig's Disease, reported after vaccination. ALS is a progressive neurodegenerative disease that attacks motor neurons in the brain and spinal cord.

Merck is also monitoring the number of deaths reported after Gardasil: at least 32.

The risks of serious adverse events including death reported after Gardasil use in (the JAMA article by CDC's Dr. Barbara Slade) were 3.4/100,000 doses distributed. The rate of serious adverse events on par with the death rate of cervical cancer. Gardasil has been associated with at least as many serious adverse events as there are deaths from cervical cancer developing each year.

Dr. Harper says the side effects reported so far call for more complete disclosure to patients. She says they should be told that protection from the vaccination might not last long enough to provide a cancer protection benefit, and that its risks - "small but real" - could occur more often than the cervical cancer itself would.

Parents and women must know that deaths occurred. Not all deaths that have been reported were represented in Dr. Slade's work, one-third of the death reports were unavailable to the CDC."

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/gardasil-researcher-speaks-out/

From StrawChicago: I am a victim of horrible-suffering with the flu-shot in Dec. 2015. The pain was many times worse than childbirth, I had vertigo & bleeding nose & ears and could not drive for 2 months, in addition to pneumonia & paid near $800 from my own-pocket (after insurance paid thousands). My neighbor died of Lou Gehrig's Disease, I witnessed her going from a vibrant mid-30's woman to being paralyzed in a wheel-chair .. then a vegetative state in a nursing home for 6 months. She could not talk and answered questions by blinking her eyes. She died after 1 1/2 years of immense suffering and financial cost.

Google Gardasil and you'll see the below:

INFORMATION ABOUT GARDASIL 9GARDASIL®9 (Human Papillomavirus 9-valent Vaccine, Recombinant)helps protect girls and women ages 9 to 26 against cervical, vaginal, vulvar, and anal cancers and genital warts caused by 9 types of HPV.

GARDASIL 9 helps protect boys and men ages 9 to 26 against anal cancer and genital warts caused by those same HPV types.

GARDASIL 9 may not fully protect everyone, nor will it protect against diseases caused by OTHER HPV types or against diseases not caused by HPV.

GARDASIL 9 does not prevent all types of cervical cancer, so it’s important for women to continue routine cervical cancer screenings.

GARDASIL 9 is a shot that is usually given in the arm muscle. GARDASIL 9 may be given as 2 or 3 shots.

Thank you, anele_gw for the link below:

https://www.womenshealthmag.com/health/hpv-vaccine-facts

But how much immunity-boosting staying power the vaccines have is (almost) a shot in the dark. Early research shows Gardasil and Cervarix are both effective for up to five years (the latter after just one dose).

But thousands of women have also reported more worrisome issues, including crippling fatigue, paralysis, blindness, or autoimmune complications, and some have even died, according to CDC and FDA data.

"I was 19 when I got the first shot, but my arm hurt so badly for the next three months that I didn't go back for the second," says a 21-year-old who asked not to be identified. "Even now my arm is considerably weak, and I have vertigo and other health problems. I used to run almost four miles a day. Now I spend a lot of time seeing doctors.

More than 100 strains of HPV exist, and 30 of them are associated with below-the-belt cancer. Gardasil and Cervarix target two types—numbers 16 and 18—that are thought to be major root causes of cervical cancer, says vaccine developer Diane M. Harper, M.D.

"It's critical to note that more than 70 healthy young girls have died from a neurological reaction that occurred soon after getting Gardasil," says Dr. Harper. So if you're really concerned, she says, "you can avoid the risks by opting for a lifetime of Pap smear screening rather than vaccination."

https://www.womenshealthmag.com/health/hpv-vaccine-facts

I am glad I didn't have to make this decision. I can't help seeing the effects of DES (diethylstilbestrol) given to women to prevent early labor or potential miscarriage in the 40's - 70's. So many of the female babies have infertility and birth defects on the 3'rd generation.

Pharmaceutical companies don't tell the whole story. CDC is funded by many pharmaceutical companies. When I was sick with flu-shot reaction from 2015 to 2016, the vertigo was so bad that it was sheer pain to get out of bed (ceiling rotating & felt like vomiting). One comfort from that horrible and costly ordeal: I won't subject my only daughter to risky HPV vaccine.

When I was sick with flu-shot reaction for many months, I spent time to find the truth: A group of scientists decide on 4 to 5 flu-strains that might afflict the public, then develop flu-shot that DOES NOT protect against common cold, nor pneumonia, NOR THE OTHER hundred strains of virus. Flu-shots are made by several different pharmaceutical companies, and in different mediums and compositions, thus different side-effects.

For the flu and cold, It's easier to cut out sugar, which suppress immune system up to 5 hours after eating. I haven't caught a cold since that awful flu-shot reaction in 2015. And prior to that singular flu-shot, I didn't catch any cold for 7 years straight, just by avoiding sugar.

https://healthfree.com/nutrition-sugar-immune-system-foods.html

I should had known better NOT to get that flu-shot, after my neighbor and daughter (a nurse), both complained about their ears hurt & ringing after the flu-shot. Husband actually caught a cold when he got the flu-shot. I asked my sister, an internal medicine doctor about that, and sis-the-doc told me that flu-shot DOES SUPPRESS the immune system temporarily.

Same with HPV vaccine, the risks are worse than HPV itself. I know a friend who has genital wart, it's not bad as being paralyzed or crippled with the vaccine's side-effect. Pap smears are safe & effective in stopping cervical cancer. Even if a teenager gets HPV vaccine, it won't protect her/him from the other 100 strains that ARE NOT INCLUDED in the vaccine, nor gonorrhea, nor other sexually transmitted diseases. The best protection is to avoid sex before marriage, HPV vaccine is only recommended prior to 26-year-old. And HPV 3-shots-series are effective for only 5 years.