Regarding anti-depressants; I've had 3 experiences with short lived situational depression that warranted medical intervention. After my mom died, the whirlwind of taking care of her stopped and I could focus on my (then) young boys and husband again, I spiraled slowly into a depression, no motivation, no sex drive, barely functioning. My doctor put me on Paxil and within a short time I was very much back to normal with the exception of sex. One of the common side effects of many SSRIs is inability to climax (sorry if this is TMI for anyone!) so there you are, suddenly feeling happy again, back to normal, wanting some intimacy with your mate ....... and you get all revved up but can't shift out of park!!!! It's the ultimate frustration, to say the least. For that reason alone, I don't recommend SSRIs unless other depression meds are not working. The next time I needed some help my doctor put me on Wellbutrin because I refused the Paxil and had no side effects from that at all. But I totally agree with trailrunner that that should not be the first line of medication for menopause symptoms. It makes me feel you're getting a pat on the head, being told to run along now and not bother the busy doctor with your silly symptoms. There may be strong medical reasons that show SSRIs as effective for hot flashes but something about it just rubs me the wrong way.

leahcat, we're already on a low carb diet. I'm not overweight and generally like to exercise (not with the instant hot flashes).

I eat a California/hippy type diet though I'm not an extremist by any means.
(I hope I never have to give up my monthly bacon binges).

Luckily my Dr is a female. She isn't old enough to *really* understand but still...

I'm not expecting a pat on the head, though I've had plenty pats on the head from Drs in my life. I swear, some Drs will evolve without any ears because they do not use them.

Well, I want to say this without offending anyone, but, bioidenticals aren't known for any cancer-causing side effects. Bioidenticals (mine are creams that I rub into my forearms) only go through your bloodstream once, whereas, HRT's go through twice, which is more harmful to your liver. Anyway, that is what was explained to me, and what I have read about.

trailrunner, I KNOW! My favorite one is the testosterone-it is amazing what a little of that can do for you! My fibroid tumor has shrunk to very little now. Thank goodness! I am going through perio-menopause also, so, hopefully it will be gone for good soon.

Drs. are so quick to prescribe anti-depressants, I know, they prescribed me some, and I just didn't like the way I felt on them. I want to feel like ME. I really do think some people need them, but, I would let them be the last resort.

TRAILRUNNER (I'm trying to get your attention. lol)

I had the total hysterectomy, and like I said, ever since I've never gotten my energy back. It's bad. Really bad.

Do you think my lack of taking tetesterone is causing it?

If I go on it, what are the benefits of taking it? If I understand correctly I shouldn't be taking estrogen since I don't have anything left. lol.

It seems the patch they put on my which I took off was for testerone.

Thankfully I don't have a mustache. :)

I'm so tired of being tired all the time. :(

I just turned 47 last week, but for the past year or so I've suffered bouts of the most horrible hot flashes (I never even knew a person could feel like this) and my periods have become most irregular. While they had been coming just like clockwork, I've only had one this year. I know that I need to speak with my doctor about the changes I'm going through, but just haven't made a point of doing so yet. My DH has just been diagnosed with lower-than-normal testosterone, and is seeing an endocrinologist on Monday. DH is very interested, having done his own research on the subject, in trying biodentical replacement and is encouraging me to look into it as well. Olliesmom, did you find it fairly easy to find a doctor that was willing to go this route?

As for antidepressants, I know that they do help a lot of people in different circumstances, but I consider the best thing I ever did was getting off Effexor. Many of you know what a nightmare that was for me, and I would never consider going back on them. I think I'd rather suffer (and yes, it most definitely is suffering) through the hot flashes than put an antidepressant back in my body, but that's just me.

I love hearing such profoundly successful outcomes. I sure do hope that all of this info leads others who might not want to post to at least look into all this info.

I am definitely going to look into the creams and the bio-identicals. I am never averse to learning new things. THANK YOU olliesmom for the info.

As for the antidep. and the s/e. My son wouldn't take them , he is very depressed at times and treats it with exercise. He is a microbiologist and after reading all that he could his main reason for not taking them was "lack of climax". So no it is not TMI it is a reality in many cases and sure does need to be talked about. The most frightening s/e though is the electric snapping feeling in the brain that many people feel. It is not a made up s/e. there is a lot of documentation about it especially Lexipro. The other real fear is the huge problem of getting off the drugs.

oakleyok. It sounds like you need a good workup with bloodwork to check fot thyroid and for anemia and Vit deficiency and hormone levels. Usually what they do it immediately place a patch for estrogen only right before surgery so you don't have traumatic menopause. No reason that they would put testosterone at that point. At least I have not heard of that.

After a thorough workup it would then be time to decide what to take or not to take. I don't know why you think you don't need the estrogen as well. With no ovaries or uterus you have zilch being released in your body. estratest comes in a 1/2 dose size. I have always taken the full dose. You could always try it after your checkup and see how you feel...checkup first. Caroline

I found a wonderful web site called power-surge.com. I kept getting yeast infections and wondered what was up. I don't have any hot flash symptoms but would get other symptoms such as dryness. This site has a great message board. Hope that helps!

Oakleyok, have you told your doctor how tired you are? Have you had your thyroid functions tested? Does s/he have an explanation for your fatigue that makes sense to you? You shouldn't have to go through life feeling so tired.

In women, testosterone is produced in both the adrenal glands and in the ovaries, both about 50/50. So after menopause, women still have about half the testosterone they had before. Estrogen drops off more.

I have been intrigued by reports of great sex drive, good muscle mass and energy on testosterone, but it also decreases HDL and mine already tends to be low, and it tends to aggravate acne, which I still have trouble with unfortunately.

And yes, SSRIs need to be tapered both up and down. So do other drugs, like thyroid replacement and beta blockers. I had no trouble tapering zoloft and it helped my symptoms a great deal to where now they are pretty mild. I don't currently take anything and don't feel like I need to. With both grandmothers who had breast CA, and a mom who had it premenopausally and died from it, I avoid all hormone therapy like the plague.

The main point is that every person has a different and unique set of factors that needs to be taken into account. Learn all you can, and find a doctor that you can trust to see you as the individual you are, and will tailor therapy to suit your needs. Modern medicine can really improve quality and in some cases quantity of life, but they all have side effects and not one is a panacea.

My mom had terrible trouble with hotflashes/menopause symptoms until she started seeing her new doctor.

He's an Eastern alternative medical doctor, he did detailed lab hormone tests and prescribed natural hormones and Chinese herbs according to her personal levels so he could balance her out. He also did acupuncture as well and now she doesn't have any issues with it.

He also treats her for Fibro, which she is really improving from. Prescription drugs never helped and usually created some sort of side effect as a bonus.

In his medical office he has Eastern and Western medical doctors on staff. Most of the patients he treats are western medical doctors, which I find funny.

Unfortunately this kind of detailed care for symptoms/syndromes that aren't life threatening, is not usually covered by insurance.

It's good your going to see your doctor about this, hopefully you can find out what works for you best, to give you some relief.

In fits of PMS in my 40s I went from an easy going person to a crazed maniac. One day my husband asked me if he should hide all the knives in the house. After a doctor visit I took hormones for close to 10 wonderful years. I fought giving them up but my doctor convinced me to 'wean' myself off of them to see what would happen. I was fine. I am now 60 and have never had a hot flash. For me, hormones saved my sanity AND my marriage.

trailrunner, I found a gynecologist pretty easily, surprisingly, who believes in bioidenticals. She also prescribes HRTs, but, she has jumped on the bandwagon as far as bioidenticals. I would call around and ask if certain doctors are privy to bioidenticals. If they are really up to date, they should have no problem with them. You may find more doctors that are open to the idea now. Of course, pharmecutical companies are totally against them, because they want women on HRTs.

There is a book titled "The Wisdom of Menopause" by Christiane Northrup, M.D. that everyone should read. She knows her stuff. She is not against HRTs, but, leans towards bios. I have also read Suzanne Somers books on the subject also, which are very good.

Problem is, most insurances, won't cover bioidenticals. But, my creams are about 50.00, and they last 2 months. Totally worth it to me. The test (saliva) was 150.00 that you have to have before you are prescribed bioidenticals.

I just read that the AMA isn't behind bioidenticals. I may be open to lots of things but alternative meds, not so much. I am a science based gal. I am so confused.

Back to research. I can not believe how excited I am about getting treatment. I have never taken *anything* on a regular basis before Estroven and I'm giving up. I just have to figure out what is right for me.

Golddust, thank you for posting this fascinating question!!!

The discussion has been extremely interesting. My contribution to this discussion isn't directed to Golddust because she said she isn't depressed. These comments are to add to the discussion about depression and menopause.

I just turned 59. I've been in menopause for about four years. I have hot flashes (flushes is probably a more correct term), but thankfully not to the point of excess sweating, and brain fog.

Because of severe PMS, I started taking Zoloft about 15 years ago. I also had depression; I turned into a resentful doormat (not the correct word, but I also can not remember words LOL) whenever I got my period. I felt it wasn't fair to DH or DD to have to live with that, so I requested an antidepressant.

A couple of years ago, I told the PA at the gynecologist's that I had self-diagnosed myself with fibro. She switched me from Zoloft to Cymbalta. Cymbalta is helping me. I'm also leary of taking HRT because of much breast cancer in my mother's family.

Life as a woman is interesting!! LOLOLO

Well, I may be a better candidate for progesterone/testosterone treatment since I still have all my parts. I read if you take it for a couple years and stop, there isn't much risk.

That said, breast cancer doesn't run in my family, as far as I know. My mom died of Lymphoma, my aunt had kidney cancer but I don't know what kind of cancer my grandmother died of. I was only 3.

MAN, I am so happy I can finally log on! I wasn't able to for a couple of days -- amy knows what I've been going through...but anyway, I am SO there with you, golddust, and I'm not even 49 yet (in September). If your misery can be alleviated by company, feel free to think of me fanning under my hair.

It's been HORRIBLE this summer, just kicked in FIERCE. Since I was 40 I was on progesterone cream (Emerita) for PMS and it helped immensely (I'll always wonder if it could have helped me when I couldn't keep a pregnancy for lack of progesterone...but Noooooo, the mainstream docs I saw all up and down the east coast never told me about it -- had to hear about it from a friend's mom)-- it really kept me sane and able to function this last decade.

But since these horrible wrapped-in-plastic-wrap moments have started, I decided to add phytoestrogen cream (also from Emerita) and I've been also adding Maca and avena sativa -- I think the avena sativa really helps, as does not eating sugar. Sugary stuff starts me up, I'm finding in my tracking, so I was quite interested to read leahcate's testimony on the same point.

I exercise a lot, and it doesn't seem to make a difference whether I have a hot flash or not.

I really don't want to go to straight HRT, given my myriad bad experiences with mainstream ob/gyns. I don't trust them, unfortunately. I'd rather research things myself and do what I can with what I can find on my own. Heresy, I know. But if you knew my history I don't think anyone would really blame me.

What's hormones got to do with it? I thought I made a post here about the show but doesn't look like I did.

Bruuuuther, can I ever relate to what most of you have written here re; those blasted 'symptoms' of that glorious rite of passage...menopause.
Several instances of Breast cancer with close family members so hormones are out at doc's suggestion.

Sleep with my Clip-on fan directed right at me, 4 inches from my face, 12 months out of the year---- check.
Light clothing---check.
Half a roll of paper towels in my purse----check. (waiting in check-out line at those warehouse stores where the humidity is so thick you can cut it like a knife)

A couple of you mentioned the sweating during the day....that's me!
Not little glistening, tiny pearl beads on my upper lip.....
more like a cow pi$$ing on a flat rock,
coming from the top of my head, down my whole face.

Even on a cool day here (73 degrees), if I lifted a couple of 8" clay pots from one table to the other, dumped them over to remove the plants inside to transplant to larger clay pots, I ended up not being able to see because of the sweat in my eyes. It no longer takes much exertion to get the face looking like I just dove in a pool.

I've learned to work in the back yard with my warehouse fan close, very close.
Seriously......I move to one side of the yard, my mug of ice water and my fan go with me.
I plug it in (50 ft. outdoor extension cord to garage), direct it at me on 'High' and I can work with almost no sweat.
Otherwise, my head and face look like I just stepped out of a shower...dripping wet.

I did find something that makes the sweat in the eyes a bit more bearable.....
I found online a thick headband made of terry cloth, with velcro at each end so it can be adjusted on the head.
Well, anyone who knows me knows I'm cheap......errr......thrifty, so I made my own.
They've been a lifesaver!

I used some of my more worn out towels, cut them in strips, (long enough to overlap at the back of my head). folded the long cloth in half/lengthwise.
Sewed them inside out like a wide tube, turned them right side out and then hand-stitched an inch strip of velcro on the ends.

I even made some to match some of my nicer tops. When I go to the big box stores or warehouse stores I can match my forehead band to my outfit. *smile*

I'm surprised nobody has mentioned that other little nuisance of a symptom that seems to happen with a lot of women (me!) going through this wonderful rite of passage.......
Cough/Sneeze/Laugh/Talk = wet yourself!

{{gwi:1519569}}

It goes where I go:
{{gwi:1519570}}

Gosh, maybe I just haven't gotten to the worst point yet, but, reading some of your stories are heartwrenching. Especially, when you don't HAVE to go through it like that.

Please read all the books you can on the subject. I'm not going to try to sell people on bioidenticals, I just think women should read all they can and educate themselves on menopause. Believe me, I would much rather take a pill everyday, instead of remembering to use cream 2xday and which day and all that. But, there are alternatives out there.

I am feeling like I may have slight hot flashes during the day, very slight, not what some people describe. I am going back to see if I can get something for that. It seems to only come on when I am a bit nervous or anxious. Don't know if that is a hot flash or not. I just sweat a little on my face. The pharmacist I went to said we may have to try things to get them right before being 100% successful.

I know how you can let time go by, we get busy and all. I have been on progesterone and testosterone for about 7 months now, which has helped my moods, sex drive and periods tremendously. But, I should have already gone back when these somewhat hot flashes started, but, instead, I endure them. I just need to take out the time and go. I think I need estrogen now.

I finally had a minute to read through all of this. I can relate to much of what is being said here.

I am 45 and have been going through symptoms for a couple of years now. Jan, like you, I had been on BC pills for years. I went off off only to conceive but then, that's a whole 'nother post. I decided to go off of them last December and have not had a period since then. My symptoms got really bad at first. Mostly the dizziness, fogginess, dryness and memory issues. I did have some night sweats here and there but not consistently. I still don't feel quite like myself sometimes. My Gyn suggested I go back on the pill but I really wanted to be done with them. I have an appointment next month and I might be interested in trying the drug Trailrunner suggested.

In the meantime, for anyone who is interested in natural herb remedies. I did have some success with these vitamin packs I've been taking. It didn't solve all my troubles but helped a bit. They are kind of pricey and alot of pills to take (12 per day) but can help with some of your symptoms.

Here is a link that might be useful: Women's Balance Pack Vita Logic

Today is my DR appointment and I'm going to talk to her about testing to see where my hormones are. I intend to ask her to start me on Progesterone while we're awaiting the test results. (She can always adjust or change the meds later.)

I spoke with Sandy (my best nurse) and she said hormonal imbalances can also contribute to cancer. She had too must estrogen in her body and had pre-cancerous cells, so her Dr started her on testosterone. Her next pap was clean. So, I guess as women, we're dammed if we do, or dammed if we don't. LOL!

Regular check ups is the key to survival!

You guys are scaring me! LOL

I'm on bc pills as I have PCOS. My gyn plans to keep me on these until the *big event*. LOL I have no symptoms at this time (I'm 47). My doc said I may or may not, if I do, it will probably only be the week I am off bc pills.

Regular check-ups, educating yourself and taking charge of your medical need is the key.

Let us know what you find out golddust.

tina

My Dr started me on Prempro 0.3/1.5MG. She said it was a low dose. I took it in the pharmacy parking lot with no water. LOL! The pharmacy cashier took a look at my medication and smiled. "I hear this is going to change my life." The lady behind me said, "What is it, I want some." We were all post menopause and we started sharing stories while waiting for the Pharmacist to give me a "consultation" because it's a new prescription. (Like *he* has any clue.) I told him I'd research it on the internet.

After my insurance kicks in, my monthly bill will be $63.07. $2.00 a day. Sounds cheap if it works.

I have to get a sonogram on my left ovary (the reason I made the appt.), get a chemistry panel done, made another appointment for my pap and must schedule my mammogram.

I weigh 128 pounds, with clothes and shoes on. (I did set down my purse. LOL!) At 5'5", the Dr thinks I'm doing great, weight wise. I gave my scale to Lord Daniel when he got out of the hospital so I hadn't a clue what that scale was going to say.

Well I was excited to read about your medication but after googling, think I'll pass. Let us know it works. I can't find if it is natural or synthetic. Do you know?

Conjugated estrogens increase your risk of developing endometrial hyperplasia, a condition that may lead to cancer of the uterus. Taking progestins while using conjugated estrogens may lower this risk. If your uterus has not been removed, your doctor may prescribe a progestin for you to take while you are using Prempro.

I found a site, linked below that talks about hormone replacement therapy. I haven't done more then scanned it; hopefully it's a decent site. It has this information about Prempro

In July 2002, a federal study revealed that long-term use of Prempro leads to increased risk of breast cancer, heart disease and strokes. This study, called the WomanÂs Health Initiative (WHI), showed doctors that virtually everything that the pharmaceutical companies had been telling them about the benefits and risks of Prempro was wrong! The WHI study concluded that the RISKS of Prempro outweighed its benefits, and urged woman on the study to stop taking Prempro immediately.

Here is a link that might be useful: Hormone replacement therapy info

rose, thanks. I decided I wanted to start on *something*. I can always change the medication in a month, KWIM? I reminded her I had an intact uterus and she (so knowingly) said, "Yes, you need a combination therapy.", as she was pulling out her prescription pad and writing... No, I don't trust Drs.

I'm going to research the crap out of this issue and then call the Dr. and see if she will work with me. She seems like she is more than willing. I just didn't give myself enough time. I'm hoping they won't kill me in a month. LOL!

I'm already feeling better. Can't believe the improvement in such a short time. Last night? Only two night sweats. Today, so far only one hot flash. I can't believe the difference in my day. I woke up feeling rested have done laundry, vacuumed and cleaned out my storage cabinet in the bathroom. With *only* one hot flash.

Sorry, didn't see that you replied.

Glad to hear you're feeling better.
We're damned if we do, damned if we don't.
Everything seems to cause cancer these days.

Be sure to check out the link I left for "What's hormones got to do with it" - Dr Phil has some of them on youtube; the episode was very enlightening.

I've been dealing with my issues; internal temperature going up, hot flashes, heavy bleeding. I am not as bad as a neighbor; if I was, I'd be doing something as well. The GYN wants to put me on Mirena (hormone IUD); I think I'm just going to deal with things for now.

For night, I've been going to sleep with a cold pack on my back; plus I have a light-weight couch comforter I made years ago that has been perfect.

rose, that is what Sandy was doing! Bleeding wouldn't stop. She had too much estrogen, not enough testosterone and that was causing pre-cancerous cells.

I have been known to miss my annual tests and not go to Drs but I have made a new commitment to step up to the plate regarding my health.

Still not sure what I'm going to do. Didn't see a link to Dr Phil but I'll do a search. Thanks everyone! So far, I'm about as clear as mud on this issue.

It's a few posts up - What's hormones got to do with it?

I think you'd identify with his wife from what I know about you here. The show made a huge impact on me.. lol

Bleeding is horrible; huge clots (sorry if TMI) pretty heavy. By the 3rd day I'm exhausted. If anything I think I'm looking into ablation.

If things get worst I'm going the bioidentical route, if I had to take something like what you are doing temporarily then so be it, but right now I've been dealing with it.

The thing that stinks is it affects my back problems; and I'm wondering if my period stopped if the back would be some what better, so it's something I have to look into.

fwiw, I'm not good with the GYN. My old one took months to get into. I ended up going there right before we moved in 2008 because I ended up in the ER with pelvic pain. I had a pap that came back bad, he scheduled me for a biopsy (cervical) and when I went to the office that day, he told me sorry, we're not doing anything today, you're pap came back abnormal; I have to do 2 biopsies, one higher and it can't be done in this office. Stupid me didn't ask what was abnormal so for a month I worried. We were in the middle of moving & I kicked myself for putting my health 2nd.

So, I've had my scare as well. I changed GYN's recently, filled out paperwork to get my records transferred, they wouldn't do it until I paid them $10. The lady in the new office assured me she'd get them without charge; the old called and said they wanted payment 1st. I ended up at my last appointment with no records. Thankfully she was able to get my ultrasound & vag probe report; she said they shouldn't have ignored it & sent me for new ones; those came back fine last week.

I called my old GYN last week telling them to send the record & bill me, I didn't appreciate them holding them hostage. Apparently it worked, my records were sent.

It would be one thing if I changed GYN's due to not being happy but I moved. I will leave a review on google; so they'll pay for it that way.

Resurrecting this thread, as it looks like at 47, I've joined the party and am trying to figure out what to do next.

I've been treated for Graves (hyperthyroid) for a couple of years with anti-thyroid meds, and I was blaming my symptoms on that and stress. Saw my endo on Friday and my thyroid levels are good, but he also ran my other hormone levels, which appear to put me in peri-menopause.

I'm not having night sweats, but am experiencing mood swings, including some crying spells, tiredness, headaches, dizziness on the days I get my period, and overall "fogginess."

I wasn't thrilled with the GYN I saw last year, so am trying to find one more versed in these issues. I'm not really interested in traditional HRT, as unfortunately I don't know much about risk factors from relatives. I've done a little reading about bio-identicals, which seem equally controversial - folks seem to think they're either a miracle or just as risky as traditional HRT.

This is so confusing!

Well, golddust, I thought of you, and I'm glad the thread was resurrected. I tried something because of DD's flute teacher who has similar issues to mine (fibro) who was recommended something by her naturopathic doc that has turned out to have an amazing effect, not only on fibro but on energy and hot flashes and all the other unpleasant menopause symptoms too, esp. the most unpleasant one (not hot flashes...).

Raw adrenal cortex supplement.

I'm not saying it's right for everyone, but WOW it's made a difference for me.

Might want to look into it. It's gross when you think about it, but it's so amazingly effective I am willing to take it anyway.

Fly, can you give a good source for info on raw adrenal cortex supplement? I'm desperate. My life feels like it's being turned upside down by hot flashes, which I assumed the natural progesterone cream I was taking had been helping. Actually, it seemed to for awhile, but the hot flashes have returned with a vengeance, and are really a problem for me. I do have an appointment scheduled with a new doctor who was recommended to me by a friend who knows that I am interested in natural treatments over standard HRT, but I can't get in to see her until mid-December. I'd really appreciate hearing more about how the supplement you've mentioned has helped you, how much you take, how long it took to work, etc.

Hey jen,

Sorry to hear about your state. If I go off this for a few days (which I've done from time to time just out of concern for taking it without break), the hot flashes come back and it's horrible again. After a day or less back on it, I feel better again.

Dosage: After some experimentation, I find if I take 2 250-mg capsules in the morning, two in the afternoon, and one in the evening, I have energy, no hot flashes, cessation of associated menopause issues, and even better sleep. Even though it's supposedly a corticosteroid. I am not hyped up on that dosage. DD's flute teacher's doc told her to start low and work up, so in your case maybe one in the morning and see if you notice a difference. Then build up from there (adding earlier in the day first and then only after you notice a difference early in the day and notice it fading off and your symptoms recurring in the afternoon, try adding one in the pm). I'm taking Nutricology Adrenal Cortex (pure adrenal, nothing else--they have two very similar formulations) get it at Vitamin shoppe, just since it's available easily.

Re research: to be honest, I just went out and got some after what DD's teacher said, because of how similar our situations are and desperate *I* was too (I don't have an understanding doctor, so I'm kind of on my own with this), and took them and felt better after the first dose. BUT when I came home and researched it, there is quite a variance of info and opinion on it. Sahalian, for example, will have none of it, doesn't even believe in the term "adrenal fatigue." Not that I always trust him; he's been wrong for my body on a few occasions. Many mainstream doctors don't approve.

Regardless, I've often found myself on the outside of recommended white-jacket-approved science (viz. colloidal silver, raw food for cats, even breastfeeding past age 1), so I'm using it now, having great results, but I'm going to keep researching to see if there's anything else better/alternative/etc. The "adrenal support" herbs I see are things I can't take because they make my BP rise. For some reason, this doesn't seem to. I have also googled "adrenal cortex menopause" and I see that women have used this successfully *specifically* to get rid of hot flashes and other symptoms. I can tell you that this, and nothing else, made a significant difference almost immediately in an aspect that had been really troubling and depressing... I felt alive and young again, iykwim. Again, just anecdotal.

You could try the link below, that ties to thyroid *and* adrenal...but again I'm not saying any of that should definitely be taken as medical advice from me. I haven't done the testing the site recommends, but maybe I will, to get more of an objective handle on my experienced symptoms.

Here is a link that might be useful: just one of many sites

I suffered for years, then I found out I was pre-diabetic. So, I started eating low carb and my hot flashes, night sweats, etc. stopped! I could always tell when I didn't eat correctly because they would start up again if my blood sugar levels got borderline. Just a thought.

Also, I felt a need to warn anyone that may be thinking of taking an antidepressant to help with these. DS is on the newest antidepressant, Pristiq, and now he can not get off! There is no smaller size pill, you can't cut them, and the discontinuation symptoms are enough to put him in the psych hospital, so I don'tknow how we'll ever be able to get him off. Maybe by tapering an hour or so a day - that will take years for him to get off! They are easy to get on, but I wanted everyone here to know how bad they can be if you ever want to get off.

Good luck to everyone. Hope this helps one or two of you.

Fly, thank you so very much for that information! I read a bit online, then called a couple of local Vitamin Shoppe stores to see if they had the Nutricology supplement in stock, and unfortunately they didn't (they had some other brand of adrenal stuff). So I ordered online - and felt desperate enough to spring for next day delivery! I'm really looking forward to trying this stuff to see if it'll help.

This week I received "Nidraa" sheets that I had ordered online. They have super-duper wicking properties that are supposed to make those sweaty nighttime hot flash episodes more bearable. So far, they do seem to be helping me sleep a bit better. Before, when I was just using regular ol' cotton sheets, they'd get positively drenched in sweat, and I'd spend much of the night uncomfortable due to the soggy, clammy feeling of the bed.

Thank you, holleygarden, for sharing your experience. Wow, I would've never associated hot flashes with being pre-diabetic! Did that diagnosis come as a result of seeing a doctor about the flashes, or was it discovered when you were tested due to other symptoms?

OMG holleygarden I just google a bit about Pristiq - what a mess. I had not heard a thinga bout it before your post, or about the problems with Effexor, either. This is your son who is on it? I can't imagine the feeling of helplessness wanting to stop taking a medication and fearing for your health and safety if you do. And to be obligated to continue pouring your $ to a company that did not publicize the known problems?? That's not right - something has to be done. You'd be doing many people a service by starting a new post and detailing what you know. My heart goes out to you and your son.

dlm, I don't know if you remember my Effexor saga. Getting off of that sh!t was one of the most horrific experiences of my life. I can completely understand how the withdrawal symptoms would be severe enough to force hospitalization. I had to take a 2-week leave of absence from work as I went through the excruciating process, and continued to have episodes related to the withdrawal for the year after I got off the meds.

I certainly should have done more research into possible side effect, but I didn't know enough to know. I remain convinced that the doctor I was seeing at the time didn't know enough to know either ... she only regurgitated what the pharmaceutical reps told her.

It's beyond scary. Holleygarden, I wish your son all the best.

Jen I do remember but had fogotten the particular medication. I don't take any medication lightly and I know you don't either. Things have changed and not for the better - it seems that even when a trusted doctor recommends something, we have to do our own research now.

Those of you interested in bio-identical - find a compounding pharmacist in your area.

They are able to do the saliva test there

Re the hot flashes - has anyone heard of this stuff? If so, any first-hand knowledge to report? I'd have to compare the ingredients against those in the Remifemin and Estroven that I've tried, neither of which seemed to help me much at all.

Here is a link that might be useful: Gem drink

The problem with being tested for bio-identicals is that hormone levels are *always* fluctuating - hour to hour even. Being tested at 2:00 PM doesn't tell you what your hormone levels will be at 2:30 PM so getting tested doesn't really mean much. If you are taking hormones from the vitamin/health stores, they aren't compounded and no one really knows how much you are getting, pill to pill. The best plan is to take the smallest dose possible of anything you choose to take and know what and how much you are taking.

The alternative med field is a high dollar money making scheme. Buyer beware because the alternative med industry doesn't have to prove anything with science. If they call something food or supplements , the industry can get around lots of laws.

If you are going to take hormones from a health food store, please understand the contents of the supplements can (and do) vary wildly. Hormones are hormones, whether they come from a health food store or the pharmacy. At least when one takes hormones from the pharmacy, you have the benefit of knowing that every single pill has the same dosage because they are compounded.

Holly and Auntjen! How awful! Yes, we need to research everything, it seems. Holly, I had never heard of that drug. I just goggled it too and it sounds terrible. I am so sorry.

The alternative med field is a high dollar money making scheme.

It all is. Alternative meds, big pharm ... it's all about making money. If there are regulatory laws in place, you can bet that corporate interests with deep pockets lobbied to get them enacted. I am convinced that we as the consumer are secondary to the money-making endeavors of those who produce the medicine, be it conventional or alternative. We have to be highly educated consumers, as in no other time in history. I find that thought completely daunting and at times depressing, but still - we press on. What other choice do we have?

Yes, I completely agree with you, Auntjen. If it doesn't make sense, follow the money. It is depressing. In some countries, drugs can not be advertised on TV. Here, they just shove the pills at us. Sometimes the disclaimer side effects on these TV ads make me shake my head and wonder who is taking them?

Then again, my plumber told me that fluoride in water is the reason for so many shootings lately. Fluoride makes people crazy, according to him. Oy! He also told me his hearing aids gave him allergies so he stopped wearing them. I asked if his allergies went away after he stopped wearing his hearing aids and he said 'no', with a straight face! LOL! He's a *great* plumber, honest! He is a bit deaf though.

Unfortunately, I agree w/auntjen. My family has doctors in it back several generations (including one ancestor who treated people in both the Union and Confederate armies, believing that people are people no matter what), but they'd all be spinning in their graves/urns to see what's become of "medicine" and associated industries today.

Big pharma doesn't feel it really has to "prove anything with science", either, as evidenced by the rampant cheating, misreporting, ignoring side effect reporting, balancing how many lives they can lose before the damages payments become overwhelming, before they have to do a recall, etc. Or maybe they feel the right to prove anything they want with 'science', is another way to look at it. Basically, as auntjen said, profit conquers all. Kind of funny to be warning against alternatives when some big pharma products have *just above* been revealed to be horrendous and decptively advertised.

If I had waited for conventional medicine to address my hormonal issues adequately, I'd probably be in a mental hospital by now. Geting a friend's mom's reference to Emerita pro-gest when I was about 40 was the best medical thing to happen to me next to having cancerous moles taken off and a heart attack stopped with incredibly high levels of nitroglycerine.

OH, and last month my pharmacy which has known me for about 5 years once again messed up my prescription for something I take every day, giving me a yet-cheaper generic rather than the somewhat-less-cheap generic they had been giving me before, even though I've told them every single month to order the somewhat-less-cheap one for me because the yet-cheaper one just *doesn't work*. Did I check this last month? NO, because I was harried and I guess I trusted them. I know them all by first name, one mom's daughter is on my daughter's XC team...but I was miserable for a MONTH because of human error in mainstream medicine, and because the so called generic "identical" meds, with loads of "science" stats behind them, are anything but.

I don't trust any of it anymore.

Auntjen, I found out I was pre-diabetic on accident. My mother is diabetic and she decided it would be fun to take my reading. After she took it, I knew it was high. My parents looked at me and said "well, you probably just got through eating." I had not eaten in 8 hours. Diabetes is one of those diseases that you can't 'feel'. I was glad for the wake-up call.

Thanks to all that mentioned my son. He is having a very rough time. I wanted to mention the Pristiq by name because I have learned that it is now being given to menopausal women. I can't imagine anyone else going through this h_ll. BTW, this is the medicine that is being advertised all over tv with the lady and the wind up doll.

golddust, I lol'ed at the story about the hearing aids...

auntjen, the bio-identicals, FROM THE PHARMACIST, that I used, said ESTROGEN, not progesterin, is used for hot flashes. I didn't have the hot flashes, which means I have high estrogen probably, so I don't take the estrogen cream.

I did the saliva test, whish you do numerous times during the day for days, so I think it is more accurate than getting some hormone cream over the counter. The pharmacist sat down and went over everything after she got my test, for 1 hour or so. I thought it was very thorough. Anyway, works for me.

I just wanted to add that my gynocologist supports bio-identicals. I haven't been to her yet since I have been on them, but, she is in the same building as the pharmacist and the pharmacist had to call her a couple of times. Made me feel good she was on board, too!

So, auntjen, are you not on estrogen at all? Because that is what controls the hot flashes/night sweats. The progesterone controls your mood, which is what I really needed!

Since my time is probably coming soon on this, I've been researching a bit on the bioidenticals. I'm still on the pill (I have PCOS and this controls the cysts. I'm due for my girly physical in February and my doctor will check my hormone levels (done I believe on the week I am off the pill). From that she will determine if they are dropping and if it's time to start lowering my pill dosage. That's what she plans to do. Because of my PCOS, I will need to take some sort of hormone after I am off the pill. I'm not sure what, but she didn't refer to it as replacement hormones. The replacement hormones worry me of course because of the breast cancer risk, and that's a worry about the bioidenticals too.

I read that a blood test is better for testing the hormone levels than a saliva test. Anyone have any thoughts or knowledge to share on that?

tina

Has anyone here just stopped having menstrual periods without any other problems? I'm asking this seriously. I don't remember my mother showing any obvious signs of distress at the age when she would have been going through menopause and I'm wondering if either that was a delusion or if it was true, and if so, if I'm destined for a similar experience.

Olliesmom, I've never taken estrogen. I've read Dr. Lee's book on supplementing with natural progesterone (wild yam) cream and his belief is (ok, I guess was - he passed away a few years ago) that doing so will reactive estrogen receptors. I've been using the prog cream for two, almost three, months now and I'm not yet ready to give up as I understand it can take awhile to have an effect. I guess I'll keep using it up until I see my new doctor and go from there.

Tina, I have actually heard just the opposite -- that saliva testing is more accurate than blood testing for hormone levels. I tell ya, this stuff is all so mind-boggling and there are so many different, conflicting opinions - even among those who practice alternative methods, which is what I'm most interested in. It's overwhelming. :-/

As far as the progesterone goes, I didn't realize how well it worked for me until today. I looked at the calendar (that is the hardest part about bioidenticals) and I should have started applying the progesterone 4 days ago. The last couple of days, I have been a bear! It was so bad that I actually thought "I'd better check the calendar to see if I was getting close to start on the progesterone" and of course, saw that I was 4 days late! Never have done that before, maybe a day, but not 4 days.

auntjen, sounds like you are really trying, hope you find something that works, it must be really miserable putting up the the hot flashes. I am still hoping I don't get them. Could I be so lucky??