She has enough evidence to fill out the paper work. She needs to get it started STAT. That said, she needs to be careful. ROs don't always work. If it enrages this creep, there aren't enough law enforcement officers to offer her a constant body guard.

Bad things can and have happened in spite of a retraining order. She needs to get counsel from the police. They are very wise. They know better than most how to read signs being put out by crazy control freaks.

Good luck!

Yikes! I really don't have much experience in this area, but I'd encourage her to use her 'village' to help protect her.

I imagine she's uncomfortable sharing her private business with her neighbors, but I'd suggest she get over her discomfort and do it anyway. Talking to her immediate neighbors about what the guy looks like, his car, and that he has been violent and destructive in the past. Ask them to keep an eye out.

Same at her work. Tell them he's stalking her and show them pictures of what he looks like. Maybe she can get an assigned parking spot? Security escort if she works late?

I've seen 'Wildlife Cameras' advocated for folks on the Building a House forum to deter jobsite theft. They don't sound very expensive, and could provide the kind of evidence that might get this guy locked up if he does violate a restraining order or vandalize her place again.

What other steps have the police advised?
Has she talked to a battered women's shelter? I know -- not a perfect fit, but they'd know what to do.

Here situation sounds exactly like one I had minus the paint can thing. I even had my home broken into and trashed. I kept thinking if I ignored the guy he would stop and go away. They don't. They escalate. The guy would vacillate from threatening to kill me if I would not "be with him" to sending stuff from Victorias Secret with love notes or flowers from delivery services. My mail was stolen. My utilities mysteriously cut off.

Due to the poor way in which the police handle women who are victims of such crime my city has a task to help women navigate the court system and filing procedure. They may even accompany you in court.

Keep in mind that a restraining order is only a piece of paper. It doesn't stop bullets. It is useless if the police won't come out to investigate continuing behavior by the perp. Getting a RO can cause the perp to escalate their behavior! Is there a woman's group in your area who has experiences in these things who can offer advice? Keep in mind that the perp often goes after those who try to help her. You may be putting yourself in danger too. Believe me, you won't get any help from the police. Women are killed clutching their RO. 911 calls are ignored and women are found dead clutching their phone.

Google *stalking* for websites that offer advice and books to read on this.

I highly recommend the book 'The Gift of Fear' by Gavin de Becker for anyone who has not read it yet. It was on the NY Times best seller list for months. Becoming a stalker victim can happen to anybody and the victim has done nothing "wrong".

Here is a link that might be useful: The Gift of Fear

Your friend has enough for a Resrtaining Order, from what I understand; however, a RO doesn't always stop the person. Sweeby gave excellent advice as to how she can try and protect herself.

The most dangerous time for the person who is being abused is when he/she tries to end the relationship ...and afterwards.

I wish your friend the very best. It's a very, very difficult situation.

Thanks so much, everyone. I know an RO is not a body guard. The police suggested it after the last incident, so that they can have a reason to check him out if something else happens. She has called stalker and domestic violence hotlines and got some info. The stalker hotline said on average stalkings can last at least a year! Sweeby makes a good point to make sure that her neighbors & co-workers know what is going on. She told me that she feels like such a loser to have had a relationship with someone like him, so I'm sure she's embarrassed to tell anyone, but she's going to have to. What makes it worse is that this guy has a friend who lives at the end of her street that has been reporting her comings and goings to him -- so sick. Stealing mail is something that hasn't happened, but I can see the possibility -- maybe a PO box might be a good idea for now. She has a security alarm, and I thought that a camera would be a good addition, but it stinks that she has to pay for something like that.

I have a great attorney in Burlington County if she needs one & is in that area. As far as the camera - she can buy a web cam and have it record to her hard drive - there is a free program.

I also suggest moving the mail. If she doesn't want to get a PO box, she can ask the PO to hold it until she comes to get it; or she can forward it to a friends house temporarily. She should also watch what she puts out for garbage & recycling. Yes, I've had someone that went that far.

FWIW, the restraining order can be pretty worthless unless someone sees him doing something to her. My ex threw a bucket of sea shells at me & even though I had a mark; it was my word against his.

A friend that snitches? How totally sick...
And how counter-productive for the 'friend' -- to enable the kind of behavior that could put his pal in jail.

Any chance of having someone talk to the guy's 'friend' to let him know you guys are playing hardball and he needs to cease and desist?

Sweeby: they're all slimeballs. There is no talking sense to them. My friend was at a very vunerable point in her life when she met this jerk. This is not her typical type at all.

Dilly: how did you get rid of your stalker?

What about taking a self defense course and or carrying some mace just in case, along with getting a camera, talking to neighbors and coworkers etc.

Please keep us posted on her situation. I'm sending out good Mojo but feeling very unsettled about your friend. I care.

This isn't probably a popular suggestion but if she doesn't own a gun she might want to consider going through the proper paperwork for that. At the very least, get mace that shoots a good distance. Self defense classes were also a good idea. Someone threatening to kill you isn't stable.

And what on earth is wrong with his friend! He can't be right in the head either.

Hopefully this all ends soon for your friend. Keep us posted.

I'm curious though... I thought someone saying they were going to kill somebody was a big no no. Get you in trouble no no. No?

I had a (stranger) stalker for more than two years and it was HELL. Police and phone company were next to useless since I had no idea who was doing this. But, it must be even more maddening when you know who is doing this and even then you can't get any action, or help.

I agree that it may be dangerous (though probably necessary) to get an RO. If your friend can get even one small prosecutable thing acted on, that could get this giuy before a judge who might be able to make an impact on the creep and issue a RO at the same time.

If not then I'm afraid she may be in for a long and difficult siege to endure enough to get an RO, or an arrest. I second the suggestion for the book Gift of Fear. It's very useful in coming to grips with what will be necessary to face, mentally

She should also take as many precautions as possible to safeguard herself and property. I had such an ambivalent feeling about doing all this at the time since it made me so damn mad to have to live like that. In looking back now I'm glad I went ahead and did what I needed to do. But it was so hard!

Effective immediately she should get a PO box and move all her correspondence to it. She should get herself off all social media (cancel accounts like MySpace, FB, Twitter, Linkedin. etc)Don't think you can just shut down one account and start another up, not for now at least. Get rid of any phone number the guy may know. Get a new and deeply hidden landline number. Give that number to no one, so you have one completely "clean" line. Get a new, throwaway cell/mobile and give that number only to trusted people with a warning not to share. When asked in a ordinary way for your phone number give a work one, a friend's one or be prepared just plain MAKE ONE UP on the spot. (We get asked for a phone number all the time, in most cases, like say at Barnes & Noble Club, it's just a tool to keep an account straight. It's not like B&N is going to call you so there's no penalty here for fibbing) Get rid of any email or ISP service that the creep might know about. Get new screen/user names for sites like this and maybe consider staying away from posting for now.

Cancel any subscriptions or accounts like Netflix, etc. the guy may know about. Change any utility suppliers that you can to new providers and notify them in writing that NO ONE can make changes to your account unless you do it in person.

Look at your banking &credit card arrangements. Change them if you can. Can't change the bank, then change to a new branch location. Find a sympathetic manager at the old branch to explain it to and see if you can get the transfer info concealed. If your friend is a homeowner, consider having the tax bills sent to an attorney's/accountant's office, certainly not to the new PO. Or even in a pinch to a fake address. You can always just call up at tax-due time and get the amount of the taxes over the phone or go and pay in person having "lost" the original bills.

Then she should alter every single predictable aspect of her personal life and routine: when she leaves for work and comes home; she should change gyms, library branches, where she shops for food, buys gas, goes out to eat with friends, which dry cleaner, auto repair, orders out for pizza etc. In short, any place where she was before has now become a place where this guy can get info, contact, even second hand, and interfere with her life.

Creating this Teflon-like wall will give her a second life where she may feel more secure, but she should still operate in a very need-to-know basis with everyone until this is resolved. I found the hardest thing was that I had to learn to curb my truthful, and simple responses to everyday comments like, "what are you doing this weekend, or over the holidays?" You need to learn this sort of subtrefuge in order to deny the creep any chance of reaquiring info that will help him keep up the harassment. Even apparently "safe" people may not know they are inadvertently passing on dangerous info. The only successful strategy is to make sure they know nothing to pass on. I found I had to learn to lie, smoothly.

On a physical level she needs to rekey all her locks (use a locksmith who can come in an unmarked van and meet him there so there is no chance of a slip-up.) Put locks on the windows. Get rid of or chain up ladders stored outdoors that could reach second floors. Lock up storage sheds. Get rid of any flammable things like outdoor grill propane bottles or spare cans of gas. Keep car locked at all times. Keep a key in your pocket for the door and the car all the time. Sleep with a phone, turned on and within reach. Sleep in sweats or something you could run out of the house in without taking time to dress. If she wears contacts get a pair(s) (keep one in car as well) of glasses made so she can see without having to stop and put in contacts. Keep a small wallet on hand with license, credit card and cash (at least a couple of hundred dollars so you could check into a motel.) Think about wardrobe issues - don't wear clothes you can't run away in, if necessary; always have a coat and gloves at hand if it's very cold, and warm boots and clothes in your car. Keep your car full of gas. Don't let yourself run out of food or other neccessities, if youy can. Plan ahead if there are large regional storms or power outages in the offing. Those times I left my house and checked into motels, because I knew response would be slow at those times and there was enough advance warning for a dangerous plan to be hatched. Sometimes I would rent a car and leave my own at the airport, so I would have an unrecognizeable car to drive for a weekend away.

Now, having advised that she tell no one new details about her situation or safety plans (lest someone inadvertentlky spill the beans), I also recommend telling a few of her trusted neighbors about the "current" situation and get them watching and reporting to the police (this is where an actual RO may come in handy as it may remove some reluctance on the part of others to act and get involved.) Same thing at work. Get help from HR to instruct receptionists, parking lot attendants and co-workers how to handle inquiries. HR departments have to get involved if you have a reasonable fear and an RO. (Hopefully the guy doesn't work there, too!)

And she should make a plan about a lot of possible contingencies so she can act on them without thinking or becoming paralyzed with fear. What if she hears something inside her house? Outside? As she arrives home from work? It's hard to know what to advise without knowing her details. But here are a couple examples of things I thought about and planned for: If I believed someone was in my house, I was getting out because I live the country and I am more familiar with my property than anyone else would be. I knew (and I practiced in daylight and in the dark) which tree I could climb up in and hide. I slept in dark sweats and socks. I made a dark fabric cover for my cell so I could operate it and not give away my location at night. I made up my mind that if I felt uncomfortable under any circumstances (acting on the intuition - perception skills I learned in the Gift of Fear) I was going to act on that sense even if I wound up feeling foolish. This means I was prepared to drop the basket of laundry I was carrying to the line and run to safety; or ask the manager at WalMart to escort me out if I suddenly got spooked.

And I thought about my necessary routine and what I had to do. I was working as a reporter at the time and I had to attend public meetings and do interviews. I was afraid of being approached unaware (my situation was different since my stalker was unknown to me, but the principle is the same) in public, so I made sure I literally always sat with my back to a wall. And I made sure I returned to my car with a couple of known people. And on a few occasions, I just asked someone to walk me out to my car (I worked in the evenings, mostly.) I didn't explain, I just asked and no one ever turned me down.

I think she should make additional contact with her local stalking groups as they may be able to help more. She should make it clear she WILL prosecute if the guy is caught. (Police and DAs often find complainants won't actually go through with court - especially in a situation where there was once a personal relationship - so they are reluctant to "waste resources".) I went to the DAs office and met with an ADA, which I think it made a difference in the previously lackadaisical police response. The local stalker victim advocates group will know who takes the problem more seriously and that can help. Hopefully you're in a state where stalking has been made illegal, irrespective of any damage or personal injury that might occur.

You'll notice I haven't included suggestions for cameras, and electronic surveillance. I used those, too, and my husband went to unbelieveable lengths to secure and watch our property in that way. But I found that stuff even more emotionally draining and time consuming than the other needed mental changes. He didn't though, so I guess, that's good. (And to be fair, it was a elaborate, but not very high-tech technique that we contrived which finally nailed the guy, complete with simultaneous videos from three directions and recorded-in-the-act phone conversations.)

I'm not going to sugarcoat this; this will probably be the most awful time of her life, but she is not without resources - even though it may feel like that. It will be exhausting emotionally, timecomsuming and possiblyy also financially. And it may be the most dangerous time of her life as well, so it should be approached that way, right from the start. The stats on this sort of thing are quite terrifying. She should guard against feeling, or absorbing, the idea that this is somehow her fault because she had a personal relationship beforehand. From my own, completely different situation, be sure she knows that I often felt it was my fault even though I had no idea who it was, or why he picked me. Internalizing the responsibility for this situation is a mental trap and it won't help you cope with enormous emotional costs, or prepare to act decisively in an emergency, either. And many outsiders (including sometimes cops, family, friends) will explicitly or implicitly tell you there's nothing that can be done, so you should just get over it.

That's not true. Stalking, threatening, menacing, vandalism, and harrassment are all crimes, no matter what led up to them.

In the end, I told the judge I felt like I had lived like a fugitive for two years. But I made that statement on the day my stalker was sentenced to jail. Let's hope that day comes soon for your friend!

PS: I'm sorry for this tome. I hope it is useful.

Wow, liriodendron, I can't imagine what it must have been like for you.

Kitchenwitch - your friend has more than enough documentation for a restraining order. It sounds like she needs someone like you to do the research and then drive her to do it - literally and figuratively.

I'm curious though... I thought someone saying they were going to kill somebody was a big no no. Get you in trouble no no. No?

Unfortunately, speech alone does not constitute a threat of harm from a legal standpoint. There needs to be a certainty to it, immediate and specific. Pointing a gun at someone while you threaten to kill them, for example.

I'm sorry to hear of this situation.
liriodendron, what an ordeal to go through.
I've been involved indirectly in a stalking situation. It was a very long time ago, but some might remember some of my posts as it was happening. Just being on the fringes was not fun, and from what I saw (and read about during) stalker's tendencies are zero regard for the law and unless stopped by some event, average length of time stalking is years (5 sticks in my mind for some reason, but there are accurate statistics out there on that).

My neighbor (stalked) got a RO against stalker (former romantic live-in). It was about as valuable as the paper it was printed on. Stalker didn't let up even with RO. Authority meant nothing to this person. Activity went on for a couple years here.

There was a period right before the RO was issued that adjacent neighbors were dragged in by bizarre phone calls and visits, stalker trying to get close to victim or get info any way they could. (The reason we got caller ID). One morning the stalker showed up in my drive shortly before 6 a.m. (My neighbor would be getting home soon from their night shift at work.) After I didn't answer the door my phone started ringing off the hook. I was more angry than anything, because I could see stalker out the window, sitting in my driveway, calling my house from a cell. Left another weird rambling message. What a nut case. A couple times the stalker just showed up at our rear gate, calling out my name like family would that had dropped by looking for me in the backyard. Creepy, and the calls and visits always happened when DH was not home. (Neighbor's knew because he had a company vehicle.)

So all this is going on with a person who had moved in with my neighbor, we had a handful of chats about gardening and nothing more. A year or so later the relationship soured and stalker was asked to leave. And once things went haywire I had zero communication with the stalker.

A few days after we learned the RO was issued I got a strange message from stalker, asking if I was going to let the law stop us from being friends, and then demanding to know whose side I was on. (We were all in our 40's then, these weren't young kids.) That was the last straw for us. DH was ready to come to blows. I wanted to move. The next day I visited the police station and asked them for advice. Document everything, save messages (which we did) but nothing could be done until a crime was committed against us, our property. Or we could file for an RO ourselves. All that and we weren't even the intended victim. Just a source to try to get information from. Several months later a house over on the next block came on the market. Stalker bought it. It was literally feet outside the boundary of the RO.

What we saw or experienced as neighbors was nothing compared to what the victim went through. Harassment at work (stalker showed up there so much they were banned by security and it was a public, not private, facility.) Harassment of mutual friends and family, vandalism, spying, being followed. Threats of harming pets they had shared (have another story about that, I got sucked into, but it's too long.) Neighbor was physically harmed during cohabitation (the reason stalker was kicked out), I don't know about after that during stalking phase. The mental duress had to be almost unbearable. I haven't even scratched the surface of stories of what happened on our block or that the victim relayed to me on a couple occasions.

Our neighbor ultimately moved in the middle of the night. For all intents and purposes they just disappeared. That set the stalker off on a neighborhood vandalism spree that lasted a few months. We all knew who was doing it, just couldn't prove it. They were eventually caught and charged for one instance. I don't know what tripped their switch to Off. (I heard they had a new live in, don't know, I stayed clear away from the block they now lived on.) But it was about a year after victim moved before things settled down in our neighborhood with the stalker. It was a few years later I bumped into former neighbor when I was out shopping. They had taken a job transfer, moved to the next county, used a PO box for mail and new roommate's landline phone (so no phone was in their name). And yes, stalker had managed to find them through a mutual casual acquaintance who was unaware of what had happened and stalker charmed enough information out of them. (Also bizarre, stalker could be quite charming and engaging to those who didn't know what they were really like.) I don't know what happened after that, victim told me they were considering moving out west where they had friends.

The stalker was an unusual person. An intelligent, articulate, well-educated professional who was seriously disturbed.

kw, I hope your friend can get through this and take some of liriodendron's tips and take strong self-defense measures. This kind of thing tends to not be short or fleeting, it's a sick obsession that sadly too often turns violent (which you've already mentioned has occurred).

oh, wow, all these stories are just awful. It's amazing how many of these creeps there are out there. I'm sure there are crazy ex-girlfriends, that do this, too, but it seems to be mostly men from the stories I've heard. And each one is eerily similar, like there's some kind of manual that they follow.

My friend has to fill out paperwork, and then get a court date. The abuser will also be notified about court, which knowing him he will attend, and that whole thought is very frightening. Especially since an RO isn't any kind of guarantee that this will stop, and as most of you have said, it can escalate the stalking. She will be out of town during the time between filing and court, and she alerted her neighbors about the vandalism and asked them to keep an eye out. I've never been in a situation like this and it's so hard for me to understand the mindset of this guy.

Liriodendron -- How horrible for you! But thankfully, you survived, and I hope your generosity in sharing your experiences here can help someone else through this nightmare.

Lirio, ow! I second sweeby's reaction! Yes, how generous of you to step in to help others when it would be so much easier to put this time out of your mind and try to forget. Each time you help someone, your memories must come flooding back.

You are a very special person. I know you have helped more than you know with your great advice. I am certainly filing this away. One never knows when sound advice will be needed.

You said you were a reporter. I am assuming you held a public role, not just a newspaper reporter. Much like celebrities seem to collect stalkers, yes?

Golddust,

LOL, at your comment about having a public role ( i.e. reporter on TV, though I did work on air during a period in my 20's - decades ago.) Nope, all this stalking happened while I was even less than a beat print reporter. I was working for a contract local news service covering planning boards and town council meetings. As lowly, practically anonymous, as you can get.

And that's the essential thing about this stalking stuff. It isn't about you; it's about the twisted feelings and intentions of the perpetrator. You don't have to be famous, or prominent, or a particularly notable or attractive, or anything, for it to happen. It's not you, it's them.

But they get off transferring their crap to you, and unfortunately you must deal with it, or you'll get crushed by it. And the crushing will happen as the rest of the world (mostly) stands by and tries to figure out what you did to deserve it. This isn't as coldly callous as it sounds. I think it stems from an understandable reaction among non-involved people to search for reasons why it won't happen to them so as to ward off the terror that it might.

I'm glad the OP's friend is going for an RO, even with the attendant complications of having to go to court and face the stallker there. Having the RO doesn't protect, per se, , but it's kind like the ticket to ride in attempting to get serious help down the line. And occasionally, you have a strong judge that can bring the creep up short and instill a real fear of prosecution.

But failing that, the RO will be an effective tool in enlisting help on the many protective tasks that may need to be undertaken. It can help smooth the path, and often so be sure to ask, waive fees for canceling or changing accounts. It will help get attention of HR at work. And it will be impressive to neighbors who might not want to get involved in a "boy friend/girl friend spat". Most normal people respect a court's power and a paper that orders protection has certain amount of mojo. But most importantly, it will help with the police and DAs office because it's the first step to building a case and getting a conviction. Violation of an RO is a crime not only against the victim, but a crime against the legal system itself.

Of course, as noted above, sometimes a woman dies with an RO in her hand, too. And so it should never be considered a shield, just one more tool. (I didn't have an RO until after my stalker had been identified and arrested since I didn't know who he was until then. And to his "credit" once I had one, I never had any further contact before trial and sentencing to jail, or after he was released during the years he was on probation and the RO continued in place. Though I do live in the same small town as he does, still.)

And I regret that my laundry list of essential tasks probably seems horrifying, and certainly daunting. And it's only a fraction of what I undertook. I can't emphasize, enough, how angry having to do all this made me, but I can see now that each thing I did helped me retain a feeling of control of my life in a situation that seemed to rob me of that essential human right. So in addition to being effective management tools, these little strategies also helped to push back the panic and despair I felt.

I reread what I wrote last night and I apologize for the intensity of it. You'd think I was still stewing about it after all this time. (I don't think about it at all, any more, though I'm sure I am indelibly marked in some - many? - ways.) But I really wanted to stand witness on the other side of the experience, since I remember feeling I'd never, ever, be free again. And I'd never heard of anyone else, except famous people, that this had happened to. And everyone (cops and, sadly, victim's rights advocates included) told me it was most unlikely I'd ever be able to identify and prosecute the guy. Even the stalker told me (on the phone) he'd never be caught. I still have that tape in my safe deposit box.

If at all posible I think the OPs friend should ask the local victims rights/stalker group to go to court with her. They will be familiar with the process and know if she's getting as much help as possible, or just a casual brush off.

These are terrible stories, but I am appreciating their sharing, and, Kitchenwitch, I am so very sorry for what your friend and you also, are experiencing. That kind of fear is almost unimaginable.

My story is about the other side of stalking. I have an ex-friend/acquaintance who is in jail awaiting trial for felony stalking. He is a diagnosed paranoid schizophrenic who refuses any kind of treatment for his illness. I don't know whether he'll be sent to prison or a mental institution, but this is the second time he's in prison for stalking the same people. His stalking began many years ago and his obsession has only gotten worse over time. He has broken every RO ever issued. He's never been violent (although with paranoid schizophrenia it's wise to assume that that might come) or damaged property. Instead, he has used following and tracking, notes, phoning, and the legal system to pursue his victims. When they moved and changed their phone numbers, he was easily able to discover all the new information. He is no kid, he's approaching senior citizen-hood, and was a well-educated professional. His stalking obsession cost him his marriage (wife divorced him and fled far away with the children), his job, and his home. How and where he was living before his last arrest no one knows, although his ex-wife tracks him as much as she can and informs those who need to know about his whereabouts.

This and the kinds of stalking described in the posts above are the result of severe mental illness. Our legal system as yet doesn't cope very well with this, since so many of these people, unless caught in the act, cannot be touched.

One of my sons is a volunteer with his local police department. He is part of a team that responds to domestic violence calls. He has "seen it all". Am pretty sure I know what he'd say here: Get an attorney today, and pay serous attention to Liriodendron's terrible story.

I forgot to mention something. It's easy to purchase software to monitor PC activity in the home or work, etc. It's not legal to monitor a PC owned by someone else, but it's very easy to do. There are some programs out that that only require an email be sent to a recipient. Once they open it the key logging software does a behind the scenes install, and then every single keystroke typed on the recipient's computer is sent via email reports to the sender. (I know a man who suspected his wife of an affair and that's precisely how he caught her.)

So if your friend gets any emails with attachments (even from 'known' senders) don't open the attachments. If she gets emails without attachments but the sender is not someone trusted implicitly, don't open it. Hit Delete. It would be best to just open a new account (gmail, hotmail, yahoo), do not provide any 'real' info when registering for it, only give the email address to select, trusted people and never use it to register at sites on the internet.

Make sure antivirus and spyware detection are new versions with regular updates done. Avira is a good freebie antivirus I use, it will detect keyloggers. Malwarebytes will also detect keyloggers, also free.

lirio; thanks for your in-depth information. What an ordeal you had! I didn't tell her everything you said for fear of scaring her -- I'm going a little at a time -- I was able to convince her to have her mail held by the Post Office while she's out of town. She was going to have a neighbor get it for her! One thing that you said that really hit home, however, was what you said about her having to let go of the idea that it's her fault because she had a relationship with such a creeper. She feels a lot of guilt, and that's the hardest thing for her to get over. She's coming around, though...

Moonshadow: he's a low-tech low-life. Hacking would not be his thing, but stealing her mail would be right up his alley.

My friend was especially touched by your attention to the matter, and your well-wishes. I had a little bit of a hard time explaining exactly who you are, however!

She feels a lot of guilt, and that's the hardest thing for her to get over.

kw, I wish your friend wouldn't feel this way. And I hope you'll share this part, I should have clarified. My neighbor felt the same way. We live in a quiet little nook where nothing much ever happens. Neighbor started to stay away from home on days off or just lay low if home, they just did their best to become invisible. I suppose also to discourage stalker's presence, but stalker would have none of that. It was so sad. We only had a couple conversations about it while it was happening, and then the one at the chance encounter a few years later. Each time neighbor was apologetic, mortified, and clearly felt some blame. But no one else viewed it that way. I mean we had this crazy, hell on wheels person to deal with, but no one ever took the position 'why did neighbor bring this on us'. Other adjacent neighbors would talk about it (usually after some crazy stunt happened.) The attitude was always the same: we all wanted stalker to disappear and leave everyone alone, including our neighbor. And no one was relieved or happy when neighbor moved. It was reactions of disappointment and concern and was a pretty sad thing to see. Once neighbor moved, they never came back, even the later sale of the house was handled 100% by a realtor. Everyone impacted expressed genuine concern for neighbor's well-being and wanted to ring stalker's neck. (After it became clear what was going on, this unspoken protective veil sort of evolved. So when stalker would turn up trying to get information, people put up whatever barrier they could to protect neighbor. Does that make sense?)

I have no where near the direct experience that others have had, so don't want to pretend that I do. But I can offer a little bit of insight from the parameter. And based on what we saw, there were no clues. There was no way to predict what was coming. I never would have dreamed in a couple short years I'd be talking to a police officer about keeping this person at bay. Neighbor and stalker were educated, had good careers, not troublesome at all. There just was no indication this person was going to be so volatile. It was like once that break-up came, it tripped a switch inside, and then there was no clear perception of right or wrong on their part, no respect for authority. It was as if in stalker's mind, even people on the fringes were as consumed by their obsession as they were. So the 6 am visits or crazy rambling messages weren't odd in the least, because we 'got it'.

sable's right, this is a manifestation of severe mental illness and our legal system doesn't cope with it very well. I barely touched on the crazy things Stalker did to turn this neighborhood on its ear, and as brazen as they were, they were equally hard to catch. What they did to my neighbor's life was a thousand times worse. I gave my neighbor a hug when we bumped into each other a few years later, and wished them well. I bet your friend could use a hug too, so am sending one her way. Please let her know how those of us in our neighborhood felt? Because I'm betting those around your friend feel the same way. She's an innocent victim and she's not to blame in any way.

She feels guilty that she made a bad choice bringing a damaged person into her life, and the lives of those around her. Outside people can keep telling her this is not her fault -- she didn't know the extent of his craziness, and once she did, she made every effort to get rid of him. As I said, she met him at a very vulnerable time in her life. Last spring she was diagnosed with breast cancer. She had to have a lumpectomy and radiation (luckily she caught it very early). All of a sudden, here was this guy that she met though friends (he must be OK, right?), doing the cooking, cleaning, cutting the grass, trimming the hedge. He drove her to her doctor appointments, yes, he was very helpful. He wasn't working, so he had the time to do all this. Her elderly mother flew in from Florida when she had her surgery, and her brother also came to help, and this guy sent them all away -- "I got it from here!" And he definitely kept other people away, too. Kept a close eye on all her visitors -- DH & I jokingly referred to him as "the Hawk", although it was no joke. This is where her guilt mainly comes from -- she feels so stupid for allowing him to just move right in. During her radiation treatments, she was very tired, so would be in bed by 8:00. He would have his friends over, watch the game, smoke pot in the garage. He had been living with his parents, and now he had it made -- nice house, full fridge, sleeping girlfriend! When she got better, the dynamics all changed. Now she wasn't in bed early, and he couldn't have his friends over. Now it was her doing all the cooking, cleaning, shopping, and he sat and watched TV -- he earned this, right? He was getting more and more unreasonable, demanding and controlling and she was trying to get him out of her house and get her life back, but he would have none of that -- what, go back to Mom & Dad's? No way! After all he did for her?!...until Christmas night, when he was drunk and her adult son started mouthing off to him, and he attacked him. She called the police, and they removed him. So of course he's upset -- the cushy lifestyle is over and he wants it back.

She's starting to come around, though, and is now more angry at him than at herself, so I see it as progress. She's seeing the "after all I've done for you" turning into "after all I've done to you". Today she's going to file for the RO, and I'll be sure to update you all. Thank you so much for all your advice and cyber hugs.

I had a 'mini-stalker'...it was a guy I had gone on 4 dates with, and the 4th was the one that told me he was going to end up being a stalker. I won't go into all the details...just that I was terrified of this guy. (It was because of him frightening me so badly that I asked a girlfriend if I could PLEASE go with her and her friends out one evening and I ended up meeting my DH that night.)

He was a mini-stalker because it never got to that point of what your friend is going thru, but I know it would have had it NOT been for DH. This guy kept calling me even after I threatened to call the police on him, and I was terrified it was going to escalate into physical (rape). Finally one night DH (then my boyfriend) answered my phone and the guy quit calling me. But then one day he just showed up at my place with another woman. She seemed weird, too...and he wouldn't leave. I told him my fiance was going to be home any minute, but he wouldn't go, finally after about 15 minutes DH showed up and the guy left and I never heard from him again. Of course, DH and I moved shortly afterward, but I can tell you...you never know what kind of guy you're going to meet.

He was articulate, funny, popular, genuinely nice...I thought he'd be a good guy to go out with. And he was, at first. When he went sideways on me no one was angry with me for what he was like, they were also scared because he'd seemed so normal.

I'm curious Pesky -- How'd you know he'd gone sideways? Was it blatantly obvious? Or did you pick up on something and listen?

Well, my weird-o-meter went off when he started with some random, overly affectionate names for me. Then one date he was making these comments that struck me oddly, like how I was his woman, and I swear he slipped the L word, but played it off when I said something. And this was only our 2nd date!

The last date was when I threatened to call the police...he was just too, affectionate, then I realized I just didn't want to see him any more so I hinted the date should end. He took me home and asked if he could use the bathroom, so I agreed. Then he came out and sat on the sofa and was saying how tired he was and took off his jacket. Long story short, he refused to leave my place and he went into my bedroom and was lying on my bed. He claimed he had had too much to drink and just needed to sleep a bit before leaving. Anyway, it was freaky weird, and I just didn't trust him. After that he'd call me all the time, sometimes he wouldn't say anything, other times he'd cry and say he needed me. He'd stop by my house and leave presents for me and ask my neighbors about me.

I'd dated other guys who were affectionate and sweet,too, but something about him just set the hairs on my neck on end when he said the things he'd say.

I have not read the responses, so I apologize in advance if this is duplicative. I would recommend your friend read a book on stalking by Emily Spence Diehl. It is not something to be taken lightly and she should discuss her situation with professionals who can advise her how to protect herself.

National Center for Victims of Crime

2000 M St. NW, Ste. 480
Washington, D.C. 20036
Phone: (202) 467-8700
Web: www.ncvc.org

ÂRead its guide for stalking victims on the Stalking Resource Center page, www.ncvc.org/src/Main.aspx
National Domestic Violence Hotline

ÂThe NDVH helps victims find safe houses.
(800) 799-SAFE
Web: www.ndvh.org
E-mail: ndvh@ndvh.org
U.S. Dept. of Justice report, including stalking statistics

ÂStalking Victimization in the United States: National Crime Victimization Survey (Jan. 2009), http://bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov/content/pub/pdf/svus.pdf
Cyberstalking Resources:

ÂWorking to Halt Online Abuse, www.haltabuse.org
ÂWired Safety, www.wiredsafety.org/cyberstalking_harassment/index.html
ÂCyberangels, www.cyberangels.org
ÂWomen's Issues, 12 Tips to Protect Yourself from Cyberstalking, http://womensissues.about.com/od/violenceagainstwomen/a/CyberPrevention.htm
Other Websites:

ÂNational Coalition Against Domestic Violence, list of state-by-state resources for victims, www.ncadv.org/resources/StateCoalitionList.php
ÂNational Network to End Domestic Violence, www.nnedv.org
ÂEnd Stalking in America, www.esia.net
ÂStalking Behavior, by D. T. Coon www.stalkingbehavior.com
ÂFeel Safe Again (Sandy's Law, Massachusetts) www.feelsafeagain.org
ÂLos Angeles Co. District Attorney www.lovemenot.org
ÂStalking Victims' Sanctuary, by Linden Gross www.stalkingvictims.com
ÂAssociation of Threat Assessment Professionals, www.atapworldwide.org (no endorsement implied)
ÂPrivacy Rights Clearinghouse www.privacyrights.org

I dated someone who 'went sideways' too. I had known his family for years. His father was my old math teacher. We were introduced by a mutual friend one summer when Aimee was visiting her dad for three weeks. The first date was great. He was very attentive, handsome and very polite. He opened doors, held my elbow, etc.

On the third date we went for a drive. He began driving way too fast on a narrow, curvy road. When I asked him to slow down, he sped up. I thought he was going to kill me. I asked him to take me home. He refused and was getting obvious joy out of scaring me to death. When he finally did take me home(after a horrible day), I asked him to leave immediately, not inviting him into my house. He got agitated and began bad mouthing me, followed me intomy house and refused to leave. I had no telephone at the time. (Poor young single parent alert).

So I left. Jumped on my town's rural bus system and rode the bus, hiding for hours. The bus looped past my house so I stayed on the bus until he left. He came back to my house the next day (Sunday), demanding I repay him for the dinner and flowers. I told him I would if he promised to leave me alone forever. I gave him money.

He kind of held his agreement but I would find him parked outside the grocery store when I came out. (He lived in a neighboring town. No reason for him to be there.) I saw him at a funeral not too long ago. Even though I 'dated' him 35 years ago, I dodged him like dodge ball. He still gives me the creeps.

I can't imagine what this poor woman is going through.

Thought I'd let you all know what happened.

My friend was granted a Temporary Restraining Order when she first applied for it, and was given a court date which the loser could also attend. At court, he said was going to get a lawyer, so he was allowed an extension. Today was the second court date. He did not bring a lawyer and she was granted a Permanent Restraining Order based on the threatening e-mails he sent. He actually stopped all contact as soon as he was served the papers at the beginning of the month, which is all she wanted. Now they have his fingerprints on file and she feels safer since he has been leaving her alone. Hopefully, he will continue to do so!

You were all so helpful and caring -- thanks so much!

Although I've never had any problems like the ones above, when Oprah recently had a show devoted to stalkers and frightening ex-spouses, boyfriends, etc, I sat riveted to the tv for the entire hour watching it all. The show was just a week or two ago and the info given during it sounded smart and very valuable. One of her guests was a top expert in the country on these kind of problems. He has advised the military, congress (or the House), etc, on this. I believe that he's former CIA. But, the point of my posting this is that he's written books on it. I believe that he may be the author listed above by several posters. And Oprah stressed many times during that show that viewers could log onto her show's website and there was more info there with links to helpful sites . . . AND a questionnaire that any viewer could fill out if they were concerned about their spouse, ex,boyfriend, etc. Anyone filling out the questionnaire would have their identity kept totally private but it was my understanding that it would help you determine if you had anything to be concerned about. Anyhoo, this is just more info for anyone in need of it. My heart and my prayers go out to anyone being stalked. The above stories are frightening to hear, but we've all heard many stories over the years of stalkings going tragically bad. I recorded Oprah's show and have since made my 16 y/o DD sit down and watch it with me. It's a problem every woman needs to be aware of.
Lynn

I am proud to say in CT the legislature recently passed a law that will have certain stalkers/ex-spouses who were deemed dangerous by the judge to wear a GPS device. The woman/victim will then have some type of alert system in her home that will sound an alarm if the stalker gets within a certain distance of her home or work, so she can escape/call the police before he gets too close to harm her. Apparently, some other state (Mass?) also has this for people with restraining orders. What a smart way to help prevent the tragedies we read about with abused women.

Here's the link to the Oprah show on Oprah.com. It WAS Gavin de Becker that I was talking about. BTW, this link will take you to the info on that specific show, where there's a link to Gavin's assessment questionnaire and other related links, as well.
"Show on Oprah w Gavin de Becker"

I saw that Oprah show, too, and it was very informative. I also bought that book, The Gift of Fear, for my daughter several years ago when she was in college. One thing that really stood out to me from the show was something he said about if you say "no" to a person, and they continue to press you, that's a big flag, especially right when you first meet someone. Something as simple as "have a drink", "no, thanks", "oh, come on, just one" and so on. Maybe they're just being polite, but if they were really being polite, they'd stop insisting. Makes you think!

Your friend still needs to be careful. Our daughter had an ex semi-boyfriend get crazy when he got more serious than she wanted to get. She got a restraining order. And things got quiet for about 2 weeks and then he came back with a vengeance.

My God, the stuff he did AFTER THE RO was worse than what he had done before. Actually made an imprint of her house key through the lock (I didn't know you could do this)and had a duplicate key made. Bought an apparatus to get into a locked car, etc. Slashed 4 tires of her car. Went into her home, listened to her phone messages and called everyone on her phone list to threaten them if they befriended her over him. He even trashed the businesses her other dates worked at.

The scary thing, among others, was that he was in the Coast Guard and was licensed to carry a gun.

We hired a PI and did a background search on him. We learned he had done this in several states to other women and simply was transferred to other cities when he became a liability to the Coast Guard.

He,too,was a real charmer but a real evil man.

The PI followed him and had proof through phone records and pictures and fingerprints on the exterior of her car and in her car as well that he was violating the law. This was done over a period of 6 weeks and it cost us a fortune to have round the clock coverage of this man. But it also gave us protection for our daughter since investigators were right there should he have attempted to harm her.

Well, we had proof but the police were dragging their heels. We got in contact with his commander on the base; met with her and he was permanently relieved of his duties.

Then 2 weeks later, right after he called my daughter in the middle of the night, rambling and threatening, to explain it was all a misunderstanding, we left our home at 2:00 AM and drove all night to his home (crazy, I know) but we were desperate. We spoke to him and made him a firm offer he couldn't refuse.

Well, what we said must have made an impression, because he packed his bags, left town and hasn't been seen there since. And that's been about 8 years ago.

The police never did anything because the charmer explained it was simply a love affair gone wrong. Can you believe that?

Kitchenwitch,

Thanks for the update. I have been wondering if your friend had been able to take action, or if she was still stuck in the stage of hoping it will all just go away.

It's probably not completely over yet, despite the RO and a hiatus in drama, but she's on the right track and hopefully there won't be too many more eruptions. She should be especially on guard during any anniversary dates/periods, which may bring up emotions in unstable people.

I will keep sending her mental messages of strength and good cheer.