Critique my house plan (thank you in advance)

14 years ago

We are planning on building a house next year. It will be located in a rural area on a large lot.

Our main goals of the plan are to economically build a light filled house that opens from the living area to the covered patio in the rear.

Anyway your feedback would be much appreciated and it would be very helpful to know what problems you see with the design. I had trouble with the placement and sizing the bedrooms and bathrooms. Thanks Again.

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Comments (15)

etr2002
14 years ago
I think you are going to enjoy the open family, dining, and kitchen. My current home is open between our den and kitchen and it is wonderful! If there was a way to take-out my wall into my dining room I would but that's just not possibe.

Now, I will preface this next part with a disclaimer that I have never built a home before. My husband and I are in the planning and dreaming stage of the process right now. All that said, this is what would concern me:

I don't like walking through the master closet in order to access the bathroom. Would it be possible to switch the placement of the two? Also, the windows in the master bath are going to make it difficult to place mirrors over the sinks - I would definitely need the mirrors for getting ready in the mornings. If you have to keep the bathroom where it's at, could you rearrange the rest of the master so that the closet is long but narrow and runs the length of the bedroom? This would give you a deeper bedroom and take some of the width but at least you wouldn't have to walk through the closet to access the bathroom.

The back bedroom doesn't have a closet. I live in an older home right now and our closet space is limited, so I will tell you firsthand that you are going to regret not having a closet in there.

The nook between the bedrooms looks like it has space for a closet, so I would make that a linen closet because I don't see one in the shared bath.

Is the deck to the garage going to be covered? Again, my garage is detached now and there's no cover over our walkway and I despise getting drenched from rain but alas that is what occurs whenever it rains. I would add a cover if at all possible - especially considering you are going to have to carry laundry to and from the garage. If you can't cover it all, at least do the portion above the back door because you aren't going to like getting wet as you try to unlock the door with groceries in your arms - BTDT for the last 7 years!

Is a pantry important to you?
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sferber
Original Author
14 years ago
Hi ETR,

Thank You for your feedback. It is really helpful to read your comments and suggestions.

Originally, we had planned to place the Master Bedroom where the Master Bath is shown but we ended up with less usable sq ft due to having a large hallway in between Mbath and Closet. If a more skilled designer can show or tell us how to make this change, it would be great. We are hoping to stay below 2400 SqFt and making the bedroom areas larger increases the complexity of the build and also increases the overall SqFt of plan.

We will add a closet in the back bedroom in the next version of the plans and will likely change out the Nook for a linen closet.

The deck area will be covered all the way to the garage.

The Pantry will be taller type pantry with slide outs next to the fridge/freezer.
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As others have said the garage is nice and big which is fine but does overshadow the rest of the house somewhat. If it can be sideloaded it might help. The windows appear to be casement ..which is fine but you have somewhat narrow windows. I would suggest considering double hung windows. You can usually get them a bit wider and also operable but they are usually cheaper than casements. Im just not a fan of too many narrow windows that you see more frames/sash than you do glass and view. The wrapping porch is almsot worthless. I would consider just taking the house straight across and changing shape and orientation of the closet. The stairs does apprear to be very tight and may not work well. Im not sure of ceiling heights. They should be 42" wide MINIMUM in a scissors stair configuration and the landing should be that deep as well. You have to consider getting furniture up and down. Then you have to consider when its on an outside wall the foundation sticks at least 4 inches further into the landing and if you want to furr it out and finish it you lose another 4 inches. So possibly you may want to add a bit of space there as well. The family room is a bit narrow/shallow at 13'-6" or so. lay out some furniture and you will find it fairly tight Im guessing. The other area that is tight is the laundry. You will be walking through it quite often and clothes and shoes laying around will make it quite tough to keep organized. Its always tough to judge because we arent aware of your restrictions and budget but if possible consider making a seperate laundry room. Good luck
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Is there a particular reason to have a full bath on the hall instead of a powder room? If you do not need that tub/shower, you could use the space to make a small vesibule where the master tub is now with access to the bath and closet from there. Our current house is set up in a similar fashion with a 3 x 3 area off the master with one wall being entrance to our closet, one wall with linen closet (deep enough for hampers) and one wall with door to bath. I am always going between the closet and bath, so I don't think it would be a pain to walk through the bath to get to closet (I am designing our new house this way). But the vestibule idea may solve it altogether. Also, if your master closet and storage laundry area back up to one another, I would make sure there was a way to pass laundry through from one room to another - hampers that roll under the counter and into the closet, laundry drop doors so you could do a very short laundry chute of sorts, etc. If it is just you guys 99% of the laundry will originate in your closet. So you would want a way to pass dirty laundry through and pass clean laundry back easily. Perhaps there is some way to do a "walk-through" linen closet of the vestibule that would go to the laundry room. Then sheets and towels would be easily managed, too. I agree with kirkhall on the entry. You will end up with a ton of room under that stair for the closet and can combine uses with the coat closet as drawn. When you are designing bannisters for your stairs, you may want to make sure you use some design that will accomodate a spring loaded baby-gate so you don't have to install something more permanent. You didn't mention grandkids, but with four kids, they are certain to come. :) Best of luck!
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If you do two stories (walk out basement plus main floor) and have master bedroom up and other two bedrooms down, I would think you would want two bathrooms (or at least two WCs). People sleeping downstairs who wake in the middle of the night needing to use the toilet should not have to climb a set of stairs to get to one. If you want the master upstairs, consider putting the laundry room down next to a downstairs WC and cluster both directly beneath the upstairs bath and WC. That will allow you to cluster the plumbing which helps keep costs down. With a second WC and the cost of building stairs, it might or might not be more economical to build two stories than to spread the whole house out on a single floor. But, given your sloping property and your desire to maximize views, I'd go with two stories anyway. Having a second WC or even a second full bath won't cost THAT much more if you can cluster the plumbing. As for critiques of your latest posted plan. I would agree with previous comments that your living room/dining room area won't work very well. With three bedrooms, one assumes that at least occasionally you will have 3 to 6 people staying at the house. The living room would not be at all comfortable for that many people. Plus, do you expect to watch TV, or converse in the living room. No place for a TV and no room to create a conversation area where people sit so that they can look at one another. As designed, you don't really have a LIVING ROOM. You have a dining room with a sofa off to one side. The trip from the master bedroom to the WC requires you to walk thru your closet (wardrobe), out into the dining area, and then turn back down a hallway. Not a trip I would want to navigate during the middle of the night...especially since I have to admit that I often leave my shoes scattered about in my closet and I'd be tripping over them in the dark. Maybe you're a neat-nick and ALWAYS put shoes away exactly where they belong. But, do you really want the only path to your master bedroom to be thru your closet??? Also, you show no closets except the Master bedroom closet and a very small broom closet. Most of us have tons more stuff that needs to be stored away than will possibly fit into those two small closets. Eg, X-mas decorations, extra blankets, towels, and pillows, off-season clothing, the big bag of dogfood, the vacuum cleaner, the ironing board, board games, umbrellas, recycling bins, etc. With no garage, any of that stuff that you own is going to have to be stored somewhere inside your house. The biggest complaint I hear about new homes when people move in is that they don't have enough storage space...and that is often from folks who have a two or three car garage!. And, the space you have allotted a staircase isn't nearly long enough. Even in Australia, I suspect there are building codes that restrict just how steep a staircase can be. Here in the U.S, for a house with eight foot (2.44 m) ceilings and 1 ft thick joists between floors, you would need a staircase run about 13 ft long (3.96 m). Anything less will result in a staircase that is too steep to meet code. Plus, even if you're not restricted by a building code, if you make the staircase steeper than about 40 degrees, it is VERY uncomfortable to use and pretty dangerous. Definitely NOT something you want to deal with in the middle of the night when trying to get the the WC! Suggest you look up the building codes in your jurisdiction and find out exactly what the staircase requirements are. Then you can do a bit of trigonometry to figure out how much linear space you need to devote to your staircase...assuming it is a straight line staircase. (BTW, please don't think that if you design a bent staircase - a U or an L or some other shape) that you can squeeze it into less space. Every bend makes the staircase take up even more room. You need to understand staircase requirements before you begin trying to design two stories and then block out the necessary staircase space first on both floors. Trying to design any two story space without knowing up front how much space must be dedicated to the staircase is an exercise in frustration.
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I understand what you are trying to do with the 4 foot increments; however in real life they mostly don't work out that way because you have to account for the dimensions of the layers, such as drywall, finish trim, siding/brick/stone, etc. So it's important not to go OVER your increment, but it's very likely you will go slightly under most places, or else you will end up with slightly over on external surfaces. If you are planning for certain siding lengths on the exterior then this can put you into small pieces, etc. On the interior: depending on how you cover your windows, there may be space lost due to window coverings out into the room. For example, if you use curtains (and curtains are an energy saving layer at night when drawn during cold weather), they typically use up at least six inches into the room off the wall. So a window over a dresser will use up your dresser top with curtain overhang, etc. Or if the curtains go to the floor then you would have to pull your dresser out 6-8 inches from the wall. Likewise for the desk in your second bedroom. Don't forget this same concept with your barn door, too. You will have to pull furniture out 6-9 inches for the door to clear behind any furniture pieces. Right now you have furniture pieces in the track of your barn door, in the drawing. It's also very awkward to have a piece of furniture partially covered by a window, as it looks your master night stands will be. Much better to have pure wall behind them, or all window, but not in between - it will not look right visually. Remember that your birdseye view shows only the window width. You then have to visually account for more width due to casing/trim and then a few more inches still if you hang curtains and have the rod wider than the casing. Allow about six inches between the bed and a night stand, too. That six inch gap is the perfect place for an outlet bedside. But you also just need it for space. If you have a seating corner in the master bedroom, you will likely sometimes read while sitting there. Therefore you need real estate to put a desk lamp or floor lamp, for lighting. Next up to think about: lighting (and where the controls will be) for the dining and living rooms. This is more of a challenge than it first looks, because you need most your light coming from above in this over-sized single space. Normally you get a good chunk of light bounced off the walls in smaller rooms, but in the case of huge rooms then your light has to come from above and be adequate without being piercing to the eyes. You'll want at least two carefully placed floor outlets in the living room. You'll want to locate your dining table light fixture carefully so it ends up over the table correctly. We did a chandelier type fixture centered over the table, and then two down pointing cans, one on either side of the chandelier. In our case, the chandelier has frosted type glass and the bulbs in the glass pointing UP. It does a great job of washing the ceiling with light, but the table is muffled and rather dark. So we needed down light as well to increase the intensity of light on the table, which you want so you can see well when you are eating, and to highlight table decor. One thing you can do in the living room is plan wall sconces along the available walls that will wash the walls with light both upwards and downwards. Another approach is to place some ceiling can lights near walls, such that their light cones then hit and wash down the wall (if you don't want to have sconces on the walls) Otherwise the room will tend to look dark during non daylight times. Don't underestimate how lit walls will make the atmosphere inviting and cheerful, whereas non-lit walls, even with good ceiling light, tend to make a space dreary. Another great option is to use carefully planned LED strips up against the wall or ceiling, to make a light wash, similar to above cabinet lighting. These concepts do not have to be expensive to do or energy hogs, either, if done carefully. In our bedrooms we used wall mounted two x 4 foot fluorescent t8 fixtures, mounted horizontally on the wall up high. We then put up a curtain rod and valence/cornice to cover the fixture. Light washes the wall and ceiling from the top bulb, and washes down the wall from the bottom bulb, but does NOT glare into your eyes, due to the valence/cornice. Very cheap to do, very inexpensive energy-wise for the amount of light you get, very cheap parts to replace. Lighting is one area where you can EAT IT in your budget if you don't plan carefully, both in buying fixtures and in energy consumption. The three big challenges of "open concept" spaces are furniture placement in the absence of walls, lighting, and electrical outlet placement. (With a two story house you have another: infrastructure placement such as heating ducts and plumbing lines to reach the second floor, but this doesn't apply in your one-story house case.) Don't forget there are in-between models, too, to open concept. Half walls maintain the visual feel of open concept, but also allow for furniture placement against a (half) wall and outlets placed in (half) walls. One thing we did was put cased openings (like glassless windows between rooms) in the wall between our den and dining room. This was intermediate between a wall and open concept. It gave us the wall space we needed for furniture placement and in-wall infrastructure (ducts, etc.) but still gave visual sense of openness between the two rooms. It was a great balance for us. I'm not seeing glaring wasted space. There are a few pockets of space that are just... space. Like the chunk outside the entrance door to the master bathroom. There's a chunk in the guest bedroom. You'll want to trim the size of the shower in the master back into that niche and not bring it the whole size of the niche. This will cost much less to build, be MUCH more friendly to clean and maintain, and give you a chunk of "in-niche" space outside the shower where you can have your ceiling ventilation fan mounted (in our case we mounted two heat lamps on either side of the fan in that niche, but they are on separate control so we don't burn energy using them unless we are chilled). You have very generous spaces in general but not that much wasted space; part of it will be how you use the space and arrange stuff in it. One more thought: if you are a pet person, then plan for real estate for feeding, food storage, bed/crate, toy storage, litter box, etc. And a cabinet or drawer for pet related stuff (grooming brushes, treats, etc.) This post was edited by beautybutdebtfree on Wed, Jul 30, 14 at 22:59
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pps7
14 years ago
Generally I like it, especially the central coutyard setup. I love that you walk in and see through the house and into the courtyard. I also have one large open space and it functions well for us.

You didn't mention what part of the country you are in or what your family looks like so it's hard to comment, but here are a few thoughts:

The bedroom in the back is only 8 1/2 feet wide. I would be very hesitant to build a bedroom less than 10 1/2 feet wide. There seems to be enough space to do it, I just think the designer needs to play around with the space back there. There's some wasted hall space back there. Also, there are alot of patio doors in this bedroom wing. Patio doors are a lot more expensive than windows.

I would flip the master bedroom and master bath. I know hall space is wasted space but some hall space between the Family room and master will be nice. The guest bedroom at my SIL's house is right off the family room like that and let me tell you, we can hear everything in the family and kitchen.

Are you sure you need a tub and shower in the master bath?

There's a large area of empty space when you enter the home. This also isolates the kitchen/dining form the family room. You could perhaps shift the family room to the right by 3 feet, shift the wall between the family and office to the right also. This allows you to shift the office so it's 10' from left to right and 8' front to back. The extra space can then be incorporated into the master suite.

Good luck!
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joyce_6333
14 years ago
I agree with everything ETR said. I'm not an architect or designer, so my opinions are strictly personal.

I really like your open area and the patio area is going to be a great area for family and entertaining.

I'm curious about your window placements. Some of them just don't make sense to me. Also, you might check your door swings as a couple of them seem awkward. I dislike doors that open in the middle of the room, and not next to a wall.

Major issues for me would be the laundry in the garage and no mud room area. But we live in the snowy north where tracking stuff into the house is an issue.

With two windows, and two doors in your master closet, it leaves little area for clothes rods or shelving. And you might check the width..is it wide enough for two clothes rods? I think ETR had a good idea to switch the bath and closet.

Can you add a door into the tub/toilet area of the Jack/Jill bath? Adds a little privacy when two are using the bathroom.

Wishing you well in getting your plan together. It's a long process, and you have a good start.
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homeagain
14 years ago
I didn't have a lot of time, but played around with your plan a little. It's choppy as I just cut and pasted in paint.

I would want more privacy for the master than you currently have. I also think the office and back bedroom should be a little bigger.

You could easily add some cubbies behind the kitchen door. The fridge should be located closed to the stove/sink area, so that you don't have to walk around the island to reach it.

There's a lot of wasted space in the middle of the family area.

Anyway here are a couple of ideas....
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sferber
Original Author
14 years ago
I will definitely make some changes to the plan based on your advice.

The home is being built inland San Diego. Much warmer temps than the coast, especially throughout the summer/fall.

I am going to work with the designer and change the following based on your recommendations:

(1) Increase back bedroom size and add a closet.
(2) Remove a few of patio doors to save money.
(3) Flip Master Bedroom and Bath
(4) Increase office size and slide family room to the right to reduce the amount of empty space at the entrance.
(5) Adjust door and window placements.
(6) Add storage cubbies behind the kitchen door.
(7) Rearrange fridge location

The designer also suggested possibly adding laundry / mud room area between kitchen and garage.

I will post a revision to the plan ASAP. Thank You again for your suggestions, help and advice.
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david_cary
14 years ago
No coat closet.

Those tall pull out pantry's are expensive and while cool at first are a lot less practical than a reach in pantry. There is not a doubt in my mind that building in a pantry is cheaper. I did a remodel and used one of those pieces and it made sense in that setting. But I don't think it makes sense in new construction.

Also - you have designed a kitchen with very few uppers. That maybe by design but you should realize that. A relatively small kitchen with no real pantry and no uppers makes for a storage problem.

Is there a reason for a detached garage? I realize you have the space but it is cheaper to combine walls during construction. Now - maybe you build the garage to a different standard and it isn't as much of an issue (ie siding style etc). But I imagine brick or stone and you are only adding expense by detaching it. A attached garage has issues of decreasing HVAC requirements a little and saves the occassional rain issues. Obviously, where you live it doesn't matter much but still.

Teens? Too many escape routes at night

High electric rates? lots of windows and 4 sliding glass doors. That is an a/c nightmare. I know inland LA area a bit and my BIL lives like a vampire because of his a/c bill. Mind you, closing blinds on windows helps some but it is better to not have a window if you are going to close it off all day long. Posting orientation helps figure how much of a problem that is going to be.

Privacy in master. I am on a personal crusade to get people to stop this - putting glass doors onto public decks from bedrooms. There is no good stylish way to get privacy. It might not matter to you but at least think about your master in full view from public areas.

What is that thing in the middle of the house with one inside and one outside? Fireplace?
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chicagoans
14 years ago
I'm so glad your designer mentioned a mudroom/laundry between the garage and house. That's one of the first things I look for in a design and many designers seem to ignore the fact that most people need a place to take off shoes after working in the yard; put sports equipment and backpacks for kids; etc.

Also noticed as mentioned above that there is no closet by the front door. Although you don't need winter coats like we do, there will probably be times when people need to hang jackets, etc. Or you'll want a place to store the vacuum cleaner. (If you have a nice sized attached mudroom/laundry, that could solve some of the storage issues. And if it is something like a breeze-way between your garage and the rest of the house, that will keep the house light and open.)

Just as you've done with the FR furniture, you might want to draw scale size images of your bedroom furniture to see how and where it will fit (dressers, chests of drawers, nightstands etc.) It looks like space in the 2nd and 3rd bedrooms will be tight.

I would also recommend posting on the kitchen forum your whole plan and a close up / detail plan for the kitchen. There are some talented folks there with good advice re: making a layout efficient.

This will be a lovely home full of light, and I think with a few tweaks it will also be very efficient.
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summerfielddesigns
14 years ago
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summerfielddesigns
14 years ago
posted a plan for you ...
have you given any thought to the exterior style of the house?
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sferber
Original Author
14 years ago
Hi David,

Thank You for the additional feedback. You have given us many additional items to consider. I wasn't too concerned about not having a coat closet as it rare here in San Diego to be wearing a coat. It would be nice to have.

The pantry system that we really liked was similar to a traditional taller pantry but with a combination of slide out drawers inside of a taller cabinet and with additional racks on the doors. The slide drawers seemed to allow easier access to the rear of each shelf. Does this make sense?

We would like to have mainly have shelving in place of upper cabinets to make the room open and lighter. We would like to have one upper cabinet to the right of the sink that will hold glassware. We also are considering pushing out the kitchen a small bit to allow deeper drawers near the L. A kitchen designer we spoke with suggested that deeper drawers up to 30" deep cabinet will provide for a lot of good accessible storage otherwise not available. In an average-size kitchen, this is equivalent to three additional base cabinets. The designer also told us that the deeper cabinets will allow appliance storage on the counter-top for frequently used items and still leave useful working counter-top depth.
We liked the idea of having a detached barn style garage and we may also not build this immediately. It will likely be built to a lower standard. If we can avoid HVAC inside of it that would be great as it will add additional costs. We have also looked into a mini-split system for the garage. These units are not very popular here, but seem to work well...

No Teens yet, we are young couple, but limiting escape routes may be a good idea to consider in the future. Hopefully they don't want to escape!

Unfortunately, we will likely have high energy costs during the summer and fall. We would like to reduce the energy usage by building with efficient walls and ceilings (R-40+) and deep overhangs on the more exposed sides of the house. The house will be positioned so that the entrance faces west. Here are aerial images of the lot. We will plan and wire for solar so that the house is "solar ready" but likely not be able to afford to install it.

We had not really worried about privacy in the master as we will have significantly more room than where we live now....But privacy is something to consider.

We wanted to have a Fireplace both inside and outside, and were wondering if it would make sense to have it located where it could serve the great room and from other side the outdoor living space. I am not certain if it makes sense.

Thanks Again for your feedback.

Aerials showing orientation posted below
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sferber
Original Author
14 years ago
Hi SummerfieldDesigns, we really like the changes and suggestions that you have made to the design, it seems much cleaner. We need to think about this. We were trying to use our creative juices and make every inch count avoiding having dead-spaces, but this may inevitable with a courtyard layout. With all of the ideas out there we have been a bit overwhelmed with information.

We have also thought about pushing out the master bedroom more to allow for additional bedroom or office.

I will post examples of the exterior style that we are planning to build. Lap siding, single story ranch.
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chisue
14 years ago
Have you spent much time in a house this shape? Unless you are able to leave doors unlocked and can walk though the courtyard night and day, it is tedious to have to walk around a 'horseshoe'.

Let's say you have young children. 'They' are on one side of the house. 'You' are on the other. I see no room for young children to play and inadequate laundry space for a family. Where would family enter the house? Is there a toilet facility nearby? Will you have a pool? (Changing facility?)

This plan is very much like the House Beautiful/Architectural Digest plans I loved as a young married, before parenthood. There are a few historic remodeled stables in our area with this shape plan. They are hard to sell.
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lavender_lass
14 years ago
Hi, I think your floor plan is very interesting, but is based on the idea that there is no view from your lot. The view all goes out to the courtyard...which is why this design is so popular in large urban areas...like Mexico City. When your only view is the one you can create, a courtyard is a wonderful choice.

However, you're going to be on a fairly large rural lot, so you can create views on many sides of your property. Since you have a rectangular lot, I would try to find a house plan that makes the best use of your space. If you want to have a backyard for the kids to play in...you need to be able to see it from the kitchen. If you want to have a private patio/deck off the master bedroom (maybe a hot tub) it could easily be screened and provide another nice view.

If it were me, I would find a more rectangular floor plan, that puts the bedrooms on one side with the living spaces on the other. You can provide some separation from the kids' bedrooms, by your closet and bathroom placement.

For the fireplace, what about a big fireplace in your main living area, on the outside wall, which backs up to your entertainment patio? This way, you can have another fireplace on the outside. Instead of boxing it in, you could have the patio stretch out along the back of the house and have the play area beyond. This way you're close to entertaining spaces, but still able to see the kids, while they're playing.

If you live in San Diego, think about making some space for gardens, too. I know you can entertain outside, year round, but growing some of your own food (fruits, veggies, herbs) is not only healthy, but fun for the kids.

Hope this helps. There are SO many house plans available, I would look for something more like a traditional ranch plan. You can always have an L, with the garage in front, with an entry area/smaller front yard. Work with your lot...right now it's your best feature...so enjoy it :)
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sferber
Original Author
14 years ago
Hi Chisue,

Thanks for your comments. Distance to walk around the house is something that we need to consider, as we had not placed much thought into this.

We have not spent a lot of time in this exact shape house. They are rare here. There are many Spanish/California Spanish style homes with smaller courtyards here and they seem to have a nice feel.

We would like to add a pool in the back of the house at some point but will likely not be able to afford to do it at first. We are leaning towards adding a laundry room in between the garage and kitchen. The family would enter the house from here. In my next post I will put an updated plan with some different ideas. Thanks Again.
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Critique my house plan (thank you in advance)

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