I would split the difference to show the builder you are attempting to work with him....I assure you many things will creep in like this and you want to be fair and have your builder do the same. You can mention the wrong door was framed but then quickly mention again you want to be fair. $250 is peanuts in a build. Good luck and great choice to add sidelights!

Ask the builder if he has personally visited the site and seen the dimensions of the existing framing, or is simply going from comments to him by the framers.

If the opening is incorrectly framed for the original opening, it will obviously have to be reframed. If it's correctly framed for the original opening, that's an entirely different situation, and you will be responsible for the costs of reframing.

To keep a harmonious relationship (and a productive one), it may be a good idea to have a personal, on-site conversation about this with your builder to reach resolution.

Good luck on your project.

It's a change from the initial plans, no matter what. That IS a standard change order fee, plus the actual costs of the change, plus the builder's markup. It should be documented with both of your signatures.

Reworking the header size and having the engineer sign off on that would cost more than $500, regardless of any initial ''mistake'' on your builders part initially. He was already eating the cost of that initial error, and asking him to eat even more is not fair. Ask him what the cost for re-engineering the header actually was, plus the material costs, plus the labor to change it. I'd bet that he is already giving you the bargain rate on that change order. It's mighty damn cheap for what's involved in actually doing it.

Remember that ALL he is obligated to do is to produce what is on the original plans, at the original price. Pick your battles carefully on the change order front.

They originally framed in a 13' opening, when they were supposed to frame an 8', and now you want to make it 10'(?) and they're charging you to fix it?

It "should" be their cost, as they would have to bring it down to 8' anyway. But if they did, then you'd have to pay to bring it out to 10'. So I'd probably split the difference as a goodwill gesture.

They wouldn't need to redo the header. Maybe cut it down. So it's not as bad as having to make the window bigger.

"They originally framed in a 13' opening, when they were supposed to frame an 8', and now you want to make it 10'(?) and they're charging you to fix it? "

Not quite as the OP then says:

"the whole point of my sharing this story, I quickly drove to the lot to see what had to be ripped out and redone that will cost $550 and they framed in the wrong size door anyway!! They only framed for a 6ft door not an 8ft door."

I was very concerned last night and appreciate all the responses.

Hollysprings yours gives me pause. It was an 6ft header instead of what was suppose to be an 8ft header. And what we want to change to a 12 ft header. Who should eat the cost of the redo? What if we decide we don't want the 12 ft. We want what is on the plan. He'd have to redo it and eat the cost.

Thankfully, our builder has done the right thing in our opinion. The moment the PM confirmed the framers framed the wrong size door anyway (and without the authority to start in the first place) our builder confirmed that we would NOT be charged for anything besides the vendors cost of the new sidelight. They will be paying for the new header for the larger opening (which was even more than we expected and a little confusing) and the framing company with cover the cost of all lumber and labor to fix their framer's mistake.

We did point out the mistake and say "We are reasonable people. What do you think is fair to charge us to fix the mistake and add the new sidelight" because we agree with paytonroad that keeping a healthy working relationship is important. But when others go into great detail to explain why the builder shouldn't have to eat cost for mistakes it makes people like me weary and untrusting.

Not to mention means a lot of gals like me are out there climbing over beams to measure window openings like a freak because they can't trust mistakes will be caught paid for by the right party.

Anyway, alls well that ends well. Or starts well. Or is fixed after not starting well...

adieu

Thank goodness my gruff often unfriendly builder sees it that way too.

No, I already said that the builder would be eating the cost to rectify his mistake. As he should. It's a mistake.

That puts you back at zero, where he's doing the house according to the plan. What you want is not the plan. It's a deviation from the plan. Thus a change order. If he agrees to waive the change order fee as a customer service gesture, that's good PR. You are asking to profit from his mistake with an upgrade that costs him money. That's not fair. It's not as though they installed the wrong colored floors through the whole house and then installed all of the built ins on top of them. This is an easy to rectify situation at this stage. It's just not a $100 error.

You should pay the cost difference between the originally planned header, and the increased size header. And you should pay for the engineer review and stamp needed to upsize the opening. If he's replacing the header in a basement that supports an upper floor, he'd be extremely foolish to try to slip that past the inspector without the stamp. It supports the whole second floor and roof, and any snow load.

Yes, you are right. I will ask about that. Of course it needs to be safe. And you suspect it might not be? A 13ft opening that was designed to have an 8ft sliding glass door will now have an 8ft sliding glass door and a 4ft side light. Might not be safe from an engineering standpoint? When they mentioned the larger header they called it a microlam. Of course at the time they thought it was a 12ft slider. It will still only slide 4 ft. There will just be a 4ft sidelight added. Raise a concern from your knowledge?

I should mention we are a cost-plus. So I suspect I will be paying a bit. The lumber number was just an estimate. I won't know for sure. I doubt I'll get a tear sheet with breakdown.

Thanks for your input!

While it might be legal, it would still be pretty nitpicky (though conceivable) for the builder to charge you for a change when it was his mistake in the first place that left you with the extra-wide opening.

It would cost him a lot more to close it up with blocks or a new pour than giving the engineer a quick call for specing a new header.

Whatever windows or sliding doors you place under the header are irrelevant since they are non-supporting.

Count yourself fortunate. A builder's mistake got you a better design for free.

This post was edited by worthy on Thu, Oct 2, 14 at 21:40

"It would cost him a lot more to close it up with blocks or a new pour than giving the engineer a quick call for specing a new header."

Worthy, I'm curious why you are mentioning blocks and concrete pour for what seems to be a lumber framing issue? Or are you suggesting the blocks to support the header, I'm not following and I'm always glad to see your posts of useful information so not trying to be critical, just trying to understand your comment.

13ft opening was not a mistake. Framing in a 6ft door into said opening was the mistake. It was suppose to be 8ft.

So they have to tear it out. Meanwhile, we've decided to add a 4ft sidelight to that 8ft door. So the question was should we have to pay for the tear out? The builder decided no.

I've asked if we need an engineer to approve the add. No response yet.

The end. Thanks again for all your input!

Can someone explain what "change order" means in the context of a time and materials job?

We've paid for changes we made when it meant un-doing something that was in the original plan, but not for changes related to things that have not been done at all. And for mistakes by the GC, (few and small, fortunately,) he's re-done them on his time and in one case, his materials.

It gets muddier when things get done that weren't supposed to be finalized yet, as described by the OP, but we didn't have too many of those.