How dark the north side feels has a lot to do with what's outside the windows. If you back up to a forest, it will be dark. But if it's open and light, you'll have plenty of reflected light, especially in FL.

Hi Tinker!

Overall, I think the plan looks great. I couldn't tell dimensions, but I can seen the flow and it seems to work.

I just wanted to comment on the light. My sister has a similar layout and she backs to the North as well. She has issues with the house being dark. Her porch is covered -- is yours? And she doesn't have large windows. But there are no trees in her backyard. If your deck is uncovered and you have large windows, you should be fine. She also does not have the East windows in her kitchen. Good luck with your final plan!

It looks fine. I would build the fireplace into a wall instead of letting it project out into the room. There might be other things you can do to soften the hard edges of this layout but it's hard to work with it in this scale.

I suppose you don't need much closet space in the entrance in Florida. I would try to avoid bi-fold closet doors especially where they would prevent the room door from opening.

Generally looks pretty good. I do see alot of door swing issue, so carefully go over the plan door by door.

-I would not have the door open into the garage.
-Gernerally prefer to have exterior door swing into the house.
-Reverse swing on entry door
-master closets: doors should open up against the wall.

MBR toilet room - I've been here awhile, but years ago, someone posted about a friend's DH passing out in the toilet room. They couldn't get in to help him due to his blocking the door. Better safe than sorry.

Garage door - open into house.
Entry door swing too wall, not block LR.
There does seem to be a lot of door swing issues.

Instead of two doors going into two closets for MBR, why not only have one door? Can still do two divided closets, but have only one door, with quick walk-thru to other closet. Won't loose much, if any, hanging space.

As always - LOVE this forum, it is just such a great site! Never really thought much about how a door opens until now!

I think I made the image larger - hope it helps! {{gwi:1494739}}From Drop Box

Our backside will be wooded, but I'm hoping that some of the east side windows will flood some light into the great room. We might be able to slightly turn the house a little more east, so that some additional light gets in. Here in FL, as winter approaches and the sun sets lower.. we get more light in the north.

What do you all think the lowest acceptable porch depth should be? What if it was 8' instead of the 9'6"?

macv, I'm going to have built in on each side of the fireplace, is that what you mean? I didn't draw them in, because I really don't know what I want yet, and I may even wait till I move in, and get a feeling. I felt with my last house, living in it made me think of other things and I would have made things different. As far as an entry closet, your right. We really don't need one (thought about it) and I confirmed the decision not to add one after touring 30 models homes here.. all without an entry closet. I actually have never lived in a house here with an entry closet, don't miss what you don't have (well.. in this case!)LOL

I didn't catch the entry opening like that, and see it definitely should be changed. Thanks!

I'm curious as to why the garage entry door should open into the house? Just interesting our last 2 homes, (both new) opened into the garage.

pps7, I agree with you on the master bedroom closets.. that is actually how I instructed the designer to draw them, but last night - looking at the room in 3D, the doors looked better when the knobs were side by side.. more like a french door.

allison, in our current bathroom, our toilet door opens into the room, I hate it. In the dark I have hurt myself bumping into the edge. It's always left open, half open, 3/4 open.. It is something that really bugs me. Speaking of things bugging me.. it's DH's closet!! LOL, I really, really want 2 separate closets, don't want to look at his, smell his, or whatever! LOL (I do love the man dearly, but hate how he keeps his closet!)

Okay, so for the door issues.. I see the entry, that will change. I should have mentioned, that the far end french doors will not open, (near master bedroom) but be stationary only. No bumping there.

Garage entry, I'll have to think that one over.. would like to know why it should open into the house?

bedroom and hall bathroom.. I don't see how to fix those bumping... I personally think the door need to open in the direction it is in the small bathroom, I could put doors to open the linen closet in the hall, but think that would look not so great.

Laundry room, pantry, back porch.. do you all see issue with those doors?

Hi Tinker,
I think this is a really nice plan. Reminds me of our new build in many ways. We had to have the door opening into the garage, as we have a small bench in the entry.

We put our pantry and laundry room closet on the opposite wall, so that the pantry is right behind the kitchen.

In our current house a couple of doors open against closet doors and we have no problem with them at all. Hope that helps.

There is one thing I wish I could have done with our new house, but there wasn't enough wall space and that's have french doors in the study on the foyer wall. Just thought I'd suggest it.
I love everything else. Good Luck!

I would make the porch/deck/veranda that you will spend the most time on quite a bit deeper...at least 10'. The others should be fine. I find that there is not enough room to put a table with chairs on a deck that is not at least 10'. I do like space, though, so that may just be me.

I don't like the way the pantry door opens in front of the laundry room doorway, but what else to do.

Are all three sets of french doors going to be operable? We have three in our great room, two sets in the lower level den. Only one set in each room are operable - why? Loss of heating/cooling and furniture placement options. Both inside and on the veranda.

Our upper and lower back verandas are 10.5 ft deep. The front veranda is almost 10ft deep.

Here is a link that might be useful: my house tour

I did not read all the posts but this may or may not be helpful.
I would leave the laundry door off. Period, it is in a private area-no one will go back there if entertaining...
OR I would leave the dining room open to the pantry area. I think an arched or cased opening will help with flow to that room from kitchen.

Can you put french doors on the study bedroomopening in? They would beautify the front door area as well as the study. Just a thought. If a bedroom, they could be covered with sheers or such. But that would sort of kill drawer area space.

All and all it seems as everyone pretty much thinks this is an okay plan, I'm relieved! It's the few bumping door issues and a few designs details that people suggested, but otherwise I feel good! Thanks for all your comments!

Allison, I remember your house from a couple years ago.. just love looking at all the photo's again! Beautiful! We do plan to have only one operable door in the great room, the others will be stationary.

peytonroad, did have the dining room open at one point into the pantry area, but looking at it in 3D, it just doesn't look great, especially if you look down into an open laundry room. I will be using that bedroom as an office, so I have thought of doors, still thinking I might.. but I also really have some quaint foyer photo's that use a bench on that side.. so that whole issue is up in the air, need to decide!

Autumn, we too have had bumping closet doors, and it wasn't a problem for us either. Ideally there would be o bumping doors, but I don't think that is possible when your trying to build a smaller home. I was hoping to keep this house 1800 - 2000 sq feet, but found I couldn't give up some areas of space I wanted.

macv, that all makes sense why northern doors open into the house. I couldn't even remember how my door is now, so I just looked! It is built to current codes in our area, it is 32" wide, and we have a small step up - about 6" (just like a normal step).

On the master BR closet doors, I hope you will decide function trumps looks, and make them open against the walls!

In the small BR, if you move only the section of the wall that the door is in to the R, so that it is as close as possible to the bathroom door, you will no longer be hitting most of the closet doors (if any) with the BR door.

Anne

Pantry door: It could swing IN. You could also have a true *swinging* door that swings in and out. (You would want a window in that.)

Exterior doors: I'd want all to open into the house. (And open against a wall wherever possible.) If they swing out, they are opening over a 'step' down. We also have the issue of screen doors here. THEY open out; interior doors open in.

Deck/Laundry Door: You could get extra light by making this a half-glass door.

Garage Door: Building code here requires a 'gas curb'. The garage floor must be a few inches lower than the floorplate of the house to prevent potential auto exhaust gasses from seeping into the house. No door can open over a 'step', so...this door must swing IN. It also must be a fireproof door.

MBR/bathroom door: Reverse the swing to open into the BR against the BR wall.

'Her' Closet: Do you want a big window in a *closet*? A WEST-facing window?

Covered Porch: I'd like it deeper. Perhaps it doesn't all need to be covered, or you could use some skylights in it? What is your ceiling height? What is the pitch of the porch roof?

Study: I like autumn_09's idea for French doors between this room and the Foyer. We use our 'library' a lot; access is both from the BR hallway and from the Foyer -- lots of traffic Kitchen/Foyer/Library.)

Passage Door Sizes: Ours are 36" wide. The men delivering our new TV and removing our old 36" tube Sony were ever so grateful! We also have levers instead of handles -- planning for old age. (Oh wait! It's HERE!)

Will you have a door at the top of the stairs? If you leave the upstairs 'unfinished' until you need it, you won't be assessed on it.

I'd still miss having a half-bath near the family entry, back door and garage. I spend a lot of time in our kitchen and breakfast area and use the facilities in the back hall often. To use your hall bath guests will be leaving the 'public' area of the house. (No need to reply on this.)

Do you really want that closet at the foot of the stairs? It cramps the space.

chisue, I like the idea of the swing pantry door, with window! I do plan on having a 12 light door on both the side porch and laundry room exit.. lots of light. :)

HER closet, only has a transom window along the top to let a some light in. It shouldn't interfere with closet space at all.

yes, door at top of staircase - for sure!

LOL, yeah that old age creeps up fast, doesn't it!

Found out why our garage entry doors swing into the garage... makes sense to me.. *if* there was an explosion in the garage, the door would stay shut (hopefully!), vs. blow open into the house. It's code here in our county, according to the builder we just spoke with.

That "closet" at the foot of the stairs isn't a closet, it will be a custom builtin cabinet, not very deep, but without it - it loooked weird, very unbalanced. {{gwi:1494740}}From Drop Box

ditto on the garage door. I believe code says all ext doors swing in only.
Why have any doors on the Master closets? IMO..they are already in the master bath. Just use fine moulding around the entrance.
There is no way to build the fireplace in the wall with the entrance to the master bedroom behind it. Have builtin's on both sides of the fireplace.
Be sure to insulate the wall between the Master bedroom and Great Room.

hey Tinker- lookin' good. I love the pergola covered deck off the kitchen. That will be a pretty view for you.

Funny thing about exterior doors - here it is code (because of hurricanes) that they all swing out. I bring it up because there are a couple of things that I would suggest:
1. Increase the depth of the back covered porch by at least 3'. Reason: the traffic path required by your french doors will reduce your available porch area to 6'6". If you want to set up an outdoor dining table that will be too tight.

2. Consider pocket doors for master watercloset, and master closets.

3. Use 9' wide doors in the garage, 8' doors are so tight, particularly with a side entrance. An alternative would be an oversized double door. We are installing 10' doors. We are a little nutty when it comes to garage doors (or maybe it's because we are a little older and it takes greater clearances for our cars to avoid taking off a side mirror).

4. Increase the width of the area between the stair landing and the little closet in the entry. 5' would be my clearance #. BTW, that little closet is going to trim out to about 15" interior depth- not deep enough for a hanger. Will it be shelved?

pamelah, thanks! Feels good to be finally feeling like I'm on the right track! I've been planning and planning for months and months now!

You're 100% right - I forgot to type that about explosions AND hurricane's.. it is code here in FL to have the exterior doors swing out.

On our back porch, only one door will be operable (the one near the breakfast room) the others will be stationary ( fake french doors).

Pockets doors.. I am still considering this option, and I really do like pocket doors (with one exception). I currently have one on our bedroom into the master bath, and it works well.. open most of the time, but I do close it when I shower. I think I will switch that swing door to a pocket door. On the closets, we currently have pocket doors, and that where I find I DON'T like them. I like the look, they work well... when WE take the time to close them! I find we are lazy with them, and that our closets are always half open, which bugs me. For the watercloset, it probably would be fine to use!

Great suggestion/reminder - larger doors on garage entry! Not that I actually NEED a larger door.. my car is a Mini Cooper! LOL I have started a notebook with all things I need to double check, so - that's been added!

That 'closet" at the bottom of the stairs is not actually a closet (see picture above) but more of a flush, custom built-in cabinet. It will have shelves w/cabinet style double doors and drawers.

I actually will have a ton of time to think everything over. Our permits are going to take a while.. and may even take us a YEAR! We have 5.25 acres and we have 'gopher tortoise'

The gopher tortoise is federally protected as a threatened species... but just on our one little parcel, there are at least a dozen! We have to obtain a permit to relocate them, and them silt fence our construction area before we can do a thing! That's a small hiccup, but we MAY or MAY NOT need a Scrub Jay survey ( a protected FL bird), but we've been waiting for 2 months for the US Fish & Wildlife service to tell us.. yes or no! Who know when they will tell us.. I'm so frustrated! My worry is that they will tell us we need one (even though experts say our property is NOT conducive to Scrub jay's) and than we'll have to get that (not a big deal and WAIT again for months and months until they review it.

tinker- I have a bad habit of not re-reading everthing on the thread before I post. I now see the pic of the shelves. They look good. The stairs-to-shelves clearance still seems a little tight. If you are using Home Designer or Chief Architect, place a person in that space to check it out. BTW- I love the "walking woman" image. I have placed her all around my 3D! I particularly like the fact I could re-size her to my height. It helped me make some decisions.

Too bad you have to relocate the tortoises. I wouldn't mind sharing space with them!

pamelah, I am using Home Designer and have not found the walking women!! LOL I'll need to search that, hope my version has it! I too don't mind sharing our property with the birds or the turtles! We'll be relocating the turtles to the back of our property, and we are not removing one tree (space cleared enough for our house). I just wish they wouldn't make it so hard to get permits, I'm ready to build! (we'll.. almost!) LOL

I don't want daylight in a closet; it fades clothes. The 'daylight' fluorescents are better.

There is not enough room at the foot of the stairs. Lose the closet. You can move the stairs or recess the entry into the BR hallway. You can 'define' the entry with wide casings or an arched casing. (Would "L" shaped stairs work with the upstairs layout? That would be safer, too. I don't like a straight run with no landings...for accidental 'landings'.)

While I think of it, destroy any plans that are not your FINAL plans. We had some hiccups when the electrician somehow got a set of unaltered plans. (Had to retrofit for under-cabinet lighting in the kitchen.)

tinker- click thru the libraries as follows to find "walking woman". When she appears you can right click on her to change her height :-)

Chief Architect Libraries
Images
People and Animals
People
Women
Walking Woman

are you going to put your heating system in attic??
or can you give up floor space to make it in conditioned space? better performance, longer life and easier to work on.

Also...exterior doors in hurricane zones should swing
out. so if you get a hurricane the wind will not push
the door in. Personally I don't like outswing exterior
doors..but if the inswing door fails then the house's
barrier is breached and your house can fail.
also check in to hurricane resistant windows..glass shatters
but does not fail...kinda like a windshield on an car.

foam insulation on the roof line will eliminate uplift
and also make house more hurricane resistant.

best of luck tink!

pamelah, love the walking women and the men, I've been having fun looking at the areas!

Energy_rater, currently, we have one unit in the attic space of our home and one in the garage, so I'm thinking we might do the same. We are also thinking of a radiant barrier, what's your thoughts?

I did just check our current home doors, which all meet current codes (home built 2 yrs ago). They all swing out, except for our front entrance, double door.. that swings in, but has some special '3 point' locking system. (not sure what that is). We also have hurricane impact windows now, which is nice not to have to fuss with shutters.. but than again, I don't think a storm has really came close to us since Charlie, in '04 or '05. We're not sure we want to spend an extra $20,000 or get shutters..? What is the foam your talking about, I haven't heard of it mentioned before.

Overall I like it a lot!

Other than the door conflict issues, my only concern is that you might find it difficult to get large pieces of furniture down the rather twisty hallway to the bedrooms. You also need a bit more space at the bottom of the staircase. I understand that the bumpout and closet are there to help define the Great Room space but I think you might do better to make the bumpout only half as deep and get rid of the little closet entirely. If you did that, you could hang a large mirror hung on the wall where the closet door is now that would reflect the stairs and you could put a small bookcase or a narrow table with a vase of flowers below the mirror to create a lovely "focal point" at the bottom of the stairs. Then, on the hallwayside instead of a tight corner, you would have a nice wide space to move furniture around. And, when you're not moving furniture down the hall, you'd have a niche where you could put a family bulletin board or the house telephone, or a wall of pegs for family jackets and bookbags. Just an idea.

As for door conflicts and other door issues, here's what I would do to address them. (This thread had gotten pretty long so I admit I didn't read thru all of the comments so others may already have made some of these suggestions)

1) Masterbathroom/closet conflict. Lose that conflicting closet door entirely and instead put an opening between the two closets so one door serves them both. You wouldn't lose any useful space and the change would probably actually make the smaller closet MORE useful because you wouldn't have to walk around the closet door to get to clothing hanging on the east wall.

2) Your masterbath toilet room really isn't large enough for the door to open inward. I'd either open that door outward or consider using a pocket door there. Or you could use a bifold door there. It could probably open either inward or outward.

(BTW, this isn't a door issue but while I'm talking about the masterbath, I'd also suggest moving the sink that is closest to the bathroom door about 4 inches closer to the other sink and then cutting about 3 inches off the corner of the bathroom vanity (so the vanity a 45 degree angle)...especially if you're planning on granite countertops! Don't know about you but I am a born klutz, especially in the early mornings when I'm only half awake - and I would bruise my hip on that 90 degree corner on a DAILY basis. You will never miss the lost couple of inches of space between the two sinks - but if you or your spouse are at all klutzy, your hips will thank you for easing off that corner.

3)Southwest bedroom/closet door. Incorporate about 18 to 20 inches of the hallway (right up to the bathroom door opening) INTO the southwest bedroom to create an entry alcove for the bedroom door. I think you can steal just enough hallway space for the alcove so that when the bedroom door is open it will clear the opened bifold closet door.

4) Bathroom/bathcloset. Instead of a closet, consider using open shelving or cabinetry such as one would put in a kitchen. You might actually get more useable storage in the space if you didn't have 4" taken up with the front wall of the closet. And, if someone left a cabinet door open, it would just bump closed when you opened the bathroom door instead of blocking the door the way a bifold closet door might.

5) Pantry/laundryroom doors. Shift the pantry closet to the southwest corner of the area (where the door to the garage is now) and bump about four feet of just that westermost section of garage wall out into the garage about one foot. You'll actually have more useable garage space because the wall won't come out as far into the garage as the door does now. Then, move the door to the garage the so that it sits between the pantry and closet in an alcove that is BUMPED INWARD so that it is even with the edge of the panty. That way the garage door will no longer jut out into the garage. Okay, I'm struggling to describe what I mean and realize that my description isn't at all clear.... Guess I'd better just take the time to sketch it out for you.

Without seeing the second floor plan, it is impossible to tell whether your great room has a vaulted ceiling (and thus the possibility of having some clerestory windows over the roof of the covered porch. If you don't have clerestory windows, I think you may find your great room a bit dark - surrounded as it is by the deep covered porch. You might want to look into putting some sky lights or a couple of those "light tubes" (solatubes?) into the covered porch roof. I personally don't like skylights because where I live (central Texas) they admit WAY too much heat along with the light. I understand that light tubes don't admit so much heat and if you could position about three of them so that they throw light right over your patio doors, that would definitely help brighten your great room.

Hope some of this is helpful and best wishes with your building project!

bevangel, VERY helpful, thanks! That's a great idea for the pantry.. never thought of it! Frees up the door issue totally. So glad you sketched it! I was reading it word for word trying to gasp your idea.. and when I got to the end - saw the sketch! Thanks!!

Like the idea of open shelves and cabinetry in the bottom to store cleaning stuff in, and if it should be left open, not a problem like a bi-fold would be (although.. I would think whoever used the bath closet last, should have to close the bi-fold to get out).

Hate the thought of sky lights, but solar tubes.. that could be an option!

Master bdrm closet and toilet area was already suggested.. thinking about a pocket door in the toilet, but you missed my reply on the closets, MUST have separate doors! LOL.. this is a top priority for me! I don't want to see or smell my hubby's clothing, and after 25 yrs together, I don't want to kick him out and make them both a Her & Her closet and send him packing to the guest room! LOL (he would not be happy!)

I won't ask what kind of work you DH does to get his clothing so yucky! LOL!

So another option might be to hang the Masterbath door so that it opens outward. Far as I know, there is no rule that says a private bathroom door HAS to open inward. We're just used to seeing bathroom doors that open inward to avoid blocking hallways.

In fact, to avoid a door conflict in my own new house, I wound up hanging an en suite bathroom door (guest suite) so that it opens outward into the bedroom and it hasn't been a problem. In fact, guests seem to like it because, when they take steamy showers, the full length mirror that hangs on the bathroom side of the door defogs very quickly when they open the door.

LOL.. he actually works in the office, but plays outside hard! It's hot in FL and he is just not the neatest closet person! He is so neat around the house, but often HANGS smelly clothes (he must not smell it!) and to me, his closet has an order! LOL.. did I mention that I do LOVE the man, just don't want to share my space with him.

I've been playing around and looking at the cabinet at the bottom of the stairs, and taken it away - it just looks odd! Not sure what my solution for that area should be,, but looking at how I have it with the cabinet, it looks balanced and pleasant in 3D view...) hummm

I played around with the area below the stairs and I hate how it looks without that built in, or wall. I also readjusted I also measured the area.. and figured I'd have 4' between the bottom step edge and wall with cabinet. I took out a measuring tape to feel that space, and 4' feels totally spacious to me. I'm curious to know why some people mentioned it is not enough space..?

Can the stairs change to an "L" to free up space at the bottom of them? Does that mess up the Kitchen/DR route?

I'm not OK with only four feet from the bottom step into a wall. Just standing in the space isn't the problem. You need to be able to travel forward and put two feet on the ground, coming off the bottom step. My nose would be inches from your closet. Someone hurrying down the stairs would have even more momentum.

Bev and I are both OK with the MBR/bath door opening into the BR against the BR wall. I love the angled corner on the bath vanity. We have angled corners on our kitchen island.

Why have the wall at all opposite the stairs? The master bedroom area is concealed, the bedroom/study door isn't visible, nor is the hall bath door, and if the second bedroom door should be open, it would serve to bring light into what would otherwise be a dark hall.

chisue, no.. no possible way in our house footprint to have an L shape landing on the main level.. however, I will address the stairs with the designer and see about possibly making a turn in the upper level. However, I really have played and tested my current stair case out and I have 42 inches from stair to wall, and I never had a problem.

bevangel, I just now noticed the adjustment you made to the wall, and on paper it looks like it would work, however, I plan to have built-in beside the fireplace and therefore, that was the reason to the hall wall.. to balance it out. I probably could shave 3-5 more inches off, just not sure I actually need to, I don't see the space problem, although a few do.

sureo, I would not care for the open hall look at all. My hopes is that my house will look a little more 'older' style, and to me, I wouldn't care for that open look, I like hallways and think they have a place. Seeing it in 3D really helps so much - and that is why I added the wall.