Thanks diane nj! I sent you an email yesterday. dennisb1, my best friend lives where you are. She is a gardener, too. I grew up in Collingswood, now live next door! I agree that our climates are very similar, so your 2 cents is much appreciated. I wouldn't mind up to 50% defoliation. We might not want Madam Hardy, according to mad gallica. mad gallica, I'm taking Madam Hardy off my list! It's own version of damask crud-that's the info I need to make informed decisions-thanks!!! labrea,thanks for the good info. Very interesting about the differences you've seen between various SdlM's in your area. I'm going to get her-we'll see how she does. I know she might ball here sometimes. Carol se pa, hi neighbor! Thanks to you and Melissa, Shakespeare 2000 is def. off my list. I will keep Sharifa on my list. You all are the best. I love being a lurker in this forum- I always learn something and often smile when reading everyone's posts. You are generous with information, even with infrequent posters such as myself-I ALWAYS feel welcome here! Thanks so much for your help. I'm hoping to pare down my list to no more than 12 roses. Leslie

MSG is bad. And it has not been used for centuries anywhere. It was lab-developed in 1907. There are natural glutamates and there is monosodium glutamate. I started looking into it a while back because I do experience bad effects from eating it - especially in hot liquid form (Chinese restaurant soups, for example). Manufacturers are hiding it now - look for: "Monosodium glutamate is one of several forms of free glutamate used in foods. Free glutamate can also be present in a wide variety of other additives, including hydrolyzed vegetable proteins, autolyzed yeast, hydrolyzed yeast, yeast extract, soy extracts, and protein isolate, any one of which may appear as "spices" or "natural flavorings." The food additives disodium inosinate and disodium guanylate are usually used along with with monosodium glutamate-containing ingredients, and provide a likely indicator of the presence of monosodium glutamate in a product [6]. For this reason, the FDA considers labels such as "No MSG" or "No Added MSG" to be misleading if the food contains ingredients that are sources of free glutamate, such as hydrolyzed protein.[6] In 1993, FDA proposed adding the phrase "(contains glutamate)" to the common or usual names of certain protein hydrolysates that contain substantial amounts of glutamate.[6] For example, if the proposal were adopted, hydrolyzed soy protein would have to be declared on food labels as "hydrolyzed soy protein (contains glutamate)."[citation needed]" It has been accepted and infused into our manufactured food processes for a long time, just as high-fructose corn syrup is prevalent now. Both the above are prevalent in commercial pet foods as well. They are both unnatural substances touted as natural (because they are made/isolated/tweaked from natural substances) and safe. You can find all kinds of info on it on the web now, so go for it. It's another reason not to eat processed foods if possible. And who knows what additive they'll lab-create next and how it will affect us.

Hubs had absolutely no interest in watching, and since we're out of town and can't watch stuff we DVR'd, I went ahead and watched Body of Proof. I doubt that I will watch it again. Much of it was just too far fetched for me. Yes, I understand that Dana Delaney's character is supposed to be exceedingly brilliant. But she was a neurosurgeon for many years, and has only been a medical examiner for FOUR years. Yet, we're supposed to believe that she is just about the best medical examiner that ever lived. Nope. And the bit with her daughter. It made no sense to me that her ex-husband would refuse to allow her to see their daughter, just because she was so busy working all of the time before the accident. So she hasn't really seen or spent any time with her daughter for four years, yet she goes to see the kid on her 12th birthday, spends about 7 minutes with her -- just long enough to give the girl a key to her apartment -- and the girl instantly forgives her (not sure what there is to forgive) and leaves her mom a piece of birthday cake. And only Dana Delaney's character has a clue as to what was really wrong (Lupus) with another patient yet the Chief Medical Examiner and Assistant Chief Medical Examiner are totally clueless. Sorry. Awful.

There is a gauge that you can purchase at Home Depot, I just added a fitting for a total cost of about $15.00 and checked both inside my home at several points and outside. You just screw it onto a faucet and turn it on. I wanted to know the interior pressure for the thermostatic shower system install and outside for a future underground irrigation system. Depending on the distance of the faucet (where you attach the gauge) to the main water line it can change by maybe 5 psi, but that's not very significant. Personally I noticed a difference of about 2 psi. Since the purchase I lent out the gauge about half dozen times to friends so it's been useful. Maybe a neighbor has one you can borrow if your inclined to know what your pressure is. Water pressure is water pressure regardless of where it comes from. Sara_in_philly I never consider a question "dumb" as that's how we learn. nancyinmich Sorry I missed your post. I purchased the Pfister 8 1/4" thermostatic rain can and I believe it has self cleaning around (200) nozzles. Pfister has several different rain cans but I purchased this one as it had a good price point and was on sale on Amazon.com for around $50.00 for brushed nickel on a list price of around $200.00. It comes with the arm and flange. I liked it so much I purchased a couple more. It comes with a restrictor down to 1.5 gpm but I removed it on one shower and it does make a difference. The restrictor is simply a stainless steel screen. meanom Sorry I also missed your post. The friend in question had the Riobel thermostatic system and the difference was, the riobelbody sprays were designed in a way that the water flow didn't react well with change in water pressure, plus the nozzle's were designed more like a shower head rather than a rain can. As for the Riobel rain can, maybe it was the specific rain can they had but it only has 100 nozzle's and it didn't really feel like a true rain experience as the water flow was more forceful rather than a gentle stream of rain.. I guess you had to be there as I can't put it into words. In conclusion Pfister has two different sets of thermostatic systems (not including the shower panels which I stay away from) the 7.0 gpm with the volume and temperature in one valve and the 12 gpm with seperate volume and temperature valves, Each system has separate styles of body sprays rain cans etc. I installed my own system and went with the 12 gpm system since I like the body sprays, rain cans etc. I believe the key is to have a good volume control and set up where as you can adjust it so that you can have 12 drops of water from a rain can/body spray fall per minute up to thousands per minute depending on your wants, needs, and desires. If I can be personal for a sec.....I like to trickle down the ceiling mount rain can down to around 1/4 volume to run down my back to keep my body.........hot, while I lather up. Since the rain can is ceiling mount I don't have to turn around, I simply lean forward or back to direct the water flow from the ceiling. Ok, too much info..........let's move on...........