1) I'd have to know more about this to say one way or the other-- there could be several bonafide reasons for doing this-- anything from the walls being just a hair over full tile, to the corners being way out of plumb and needing to be cut in.

2) It depends on just how far out of plane the pieces are. Good chance, though, especially being that they're being set with as tight a joint as they are, that once grouted, it'll actually ACCENTUATE the fact that corners are sticking out or in. Just for the record, using the large format doesn't make it even CLOSE to impossible. It just means that the installer has to take a little more time and care. If he can't stand the heat, throw him out of the kitchen.

3) As far as this one's concerned, I need to ask you-- did he apply that thick coat of mortar and let it harden before he tiled? I have a feeling, from what you've told me, that he did a mud job-- floating the walls to flatten them and make them plumb and square.

If that's not what he was doing, then there's a major problem. That's the ONLY time when greenboard's allowed in a shower without waterproofing, and even then there should be some form of vapor barrier or waterproofing keeping moisture away from that greenboard.

Bill...Thank you so much. I can't tell you what he did technically, but I can describe it. And although your pics show brown and this is black, it looks the same. On Saturday, he applied greenboard. On Sunday, he spent hours applying thick black stuff (morter?) that looks like concrete. One of the photos I posted shows a side view of the wall with the thick layer of black stuff. That dried overnight, and on Monday, he started to tile. The stuff he used to stick the tile to the black cement-looking stuff was white, and you can even see some of it between the tile and the "mortar."

When we had our conversation about my unhappiness about appearance, he explained that if he used the thin Home Depot something or other, it would leak, and he put the thick whatever/mortar on it so that it would be a quality job and hold the thick 5/8" tile.

I'm a pretty experienced business person, and he seems to be honest amd competent person, and he was recommended by more than one acquaintance. My concern is appearance and communication. He promised squares and I got something different. Is this asymetrical layout pattern going to look nice. Can you see the tiny tiny areas that are not flush? Or am I overreacting. I wanted straight squares with 1/16th matching grout (to minimize mold) for a very traditional appearance. What I got looks very modern to me, and I can't visualize what it will look like when (IF)it is grouted. My other big concern is size. The shower is now under 34" square. It feels too small.

This message board is amazing. I'm so thankful for this advice.

Hopefully, Shaughnn will see this and chime in. The way this guy is putting this together is a "west coast" method of installation (mudding over greenboard), and Shaughnn's alot more experienced with it than I am (he's on the west coast). Although the end result is supposed to be the same, we do things jut a bit differently over here on the east coast. :-)

As for the "thin Home Depot something or other", I would imagine he was talking about cement board (Durock, Wonderboard, Hardiebacker, CBU), and when used properly, it will NOT leak. That's how most showers are put together now.

Shaughnn...hope you see this. I really hate these thick walls and the tile layout, so I'm ready to start over unless somebody out there persuades me that I'm being overly emotional and it looks great.

Assuming that doesn't happen, what's your best guess about what I should have to pay (on the SF peninsula near the airport to get somebody to tear out this mortar, make the walls thinner and put up some new tile (I found a 3/8" honed marble mosaic but if I have to I'll go with subway - it's always a classic). Any ideas about the best way to proceed -------- or salvage this?

I have to say again that I suspect this guy's reputable - he just didn't LISTEN to me when he bid. I don't really know if the tile is flush or not. My perfectionist eye sees very tiny areas of variation that are almost immeasurable. Bill Vincent pointed out that grout may make that even more noticeable.

I would appreciate opinions.

Anybody else out there with opinions about appearance? I like traditional, not modern.

I just "pinged" him over at John Bridge's place, so hopefully, he'll be here soon. :-)

Hello Karen,
Sorry it took me so long to find this thread. Bill left a trail of breadcrumbs though and that's helped me along. :)
So, from what I see in the photos it's a textbook Bay Area "single-coat mortar installation". He's got a moisture barrier of Aqua-Bar asphalt-impregnated Kraft paper and he's used 1" galvanized chicken-wire for lathe. His float looks to be a nominal 5/8" thick at the exposed edges and he's been pretty dang clean judging from the surrounding walls, so I don't think he's a hack.
Now for the not-so-nice news. I can also tell from the photos that he's got quite a bit of lippage on those walls. It may be that those large porcelain tiles are not "rectified" (re-milled at the factory for flatness and squareness)and so he's made the best out of warped materials? Ann Sacks, and many other boutique showrooms, sell beautiful tile but it isn't always a guarantee that it's also flat or square. The best test will be to lay a straightedge across the tile (front and back each)from corner to corner and from side to side. Can you see daylight between the straightedge and the tile? Does the straightedge teeter and rock? If either of these is the case, then your installer did his job. If the tiles are flat however, he's ruined some very fine material.
Without a better picture of the return-walls, I can't tell you why he chose the cuts he did. It may be that he allowed the niche's dimensions to dictate his layout, rather than the other way-round?
All-in-all, it's not a terrible job and grouting may shine it right up or it may make things worse? A good grout job is like **magic** though so I think in this case I'd share your concerns with the installer and emphasize how much you HOPE he can make things better with a spectacular grout job. He should take the hint and screw his wizards cap on tight for the task.
Best of luck,
Shaughnn

Karen I hope you see this post. I was in your boat 6 weeks ago. My issue was that my shower being installed looked more modern whereas I am more traditional/country. The debate I originally had in my mind was white subways tiles (like you were replacing!) or earthy textured tiles...My bathroom designer chose the earthy tiles and the shower was 1/2 way installed before I checked in and my eyes filled with tears. It was a concrete phonebooth. I was a mess. I would have bargained with ANYONE at that point to have chosen the white subway. No way would this thing work, I hated it! Of course I felt at the time I didnt' have an option 1500 worth of tile sat in my garage with some of it up, etc. What I did then was handpicked thru the tile and got rid of what I felt was too dark etc. but obviously what was in stayed. TODAY the bathroom is done besides the painter. I can tell you with every honest bone in my body, I would NOT change a thing. Once the border went up and the floor was revealed (it was hidden while he worked) it looked MUCH better and then the grout just enhanced it perfectly. In fact as a "mental test" I said to myself today "would you change this for the subway tile" and my answer is NO WAY. Whether it grew on me or just came together, I really don't know. I just know that the initial site of the shower shocked me. NOT what I imagined...I can't speak for the craftsman aspect of your shower but I can speak from the emotional part of thinking contemporary vs. traditional. my shower DID turn out a bit more contemporary than I would have liked but I am fine with it now. 6 weeks ago I was looking for a ledge to hop off... Melissa

Melissa,

How did you know! Concrete phone booth is an absolutely perfect description. It's Thursday, and I can laugh now, and you made my day. Tears from laughter are much better than those on Monday when I saw the phone booth. PLEASE RESPOND TO THIS ONE QUESTION: WHAT SIZE IS YOUR PHONE BOOTH? I understand your approach: embracing a less-than-perfect tile job and making everything else perfect. But my phone booth is now only 32 inches square. It used to be 34". That is a huge issue.

But...your experience has given me a flash of brillance. Pull out the curb and make it curbless and maybe doorless. Tile the floor in something traditional to soften the look, and extend the floor pattern just a little farther out so I'm not boxed in by a door. Just removing the curb will give me about 6 more inches. Hmmm! I'll be thinking tonight.

Actually, I logged on just now because I had decided to tear it all out and to start over. I know - $1,200 of Ann Sacks tile to the dump. I found Claire de Luna's bathroom today on an old post, asked her some questions about the size of her curbless shower and subway tile, and wanted to see if she responded. She did, and her curbless, doorless shower is much much larger than mine. But her subway is so beautiful. You know the feeling.
Thanks so much Melissa for taking the time to tell me about your experience. It's truly very helpful. Aren't people great. It's going to take me time to decide (I'm a Libra and have real trouble deciding at Baskin Robbins). Karen

Karen your shower is LOVELY. I am a lousy visual person but what my tile setter guy did and I am forever greatful (I can email you pics, I just don't know how to post yet) is that one entrance of my shower is like a door and the other entrance is flat. This really helped my cause - made it feel more open, not so doorwayish. My opening is about what yours is 33 at best for me but only having one entrance wall helped. my girlfriend had 2 - like a doorway and I didn't care for this look. Not sure if her style or mine is more common but I like what happened here. NEXT the border broke up the look SIGNIFICANTLY and you are at a point where you can do 2 borders if I read your pictures correctly. And the floor can really really just tie it all in. DO NOT ditch that tile. You are insane if you do! From the girl that cried in her phone booth 6 weeks ago!!!! EMAIL Me at SCOTTMEL@zbzoom.net if my note is unclear, i can send you a picture. Thanks! M