WOW!!!!!! Absolutely gorgeous! Have you tried your local Farm Credit office? They specialize in in this sort of thing. We have excellent credit and the going rate for a 15yr loan 2 years ago was 6.5% with 30% equity based on their appraisal. They can do shorter terms or a 20 year term too. They can even finance your build when you're ready. I think they work with those customers with so-so credit, but not sure. Definitely worth looking into even if you don't think (key work here being 'think') you have the 30% in the property.

I haven't priced personal financing in a long time, but returns being what they are right now you may be able to get a good deal. However, personal/owner financing come with their own pitfalls so just make sure you research it to death and cover your rear by using a really good real estate attorney (don't use the same one the lending party uses) to draw up/review the contract.

Any word on why the owners are selling? I would have to be in some pretty dire straits to part with that property. Makes me wonder if there are plans to put a highway in, frack for natural gas, or something else undesirable is planned in the immediate vicinity. Speaking from experience, definitely check with city/county planning departments before you sign on the dotted line.

Good luck & hope this helps!

Here is a link that might be useful: Farm Credit Main Page

I think what other people are getting is irrelevant to your situation, since you have credit issues that make you a high risk to lend to person... That is why you aren't getting info from major banks or CUs.

That said, I am aware of a land loan (on farm land) for a 3 yr interest only term at 8% (in Washington state) (not mine, but I know about it). At the end of the 3 yrs, it becomes due, or can be renegotiated, or they can sell to the private lender (private lender gets first right of refusal on the potential land sale)... The person took this loan because it was less than the 15% they were paying another private investor...

We don't frack in Washington--we have enough issues with earthquakes without that.

Though, it is worth looking into to see if it is priced too low, why (it may not be). For example, is it in the federal flood area if the corps of engineers takes out a few dikes (the area that is now ineligible for federal flood insurance)? Is it in the flow area if Rainier decides to become an active volcano again? Are you willing to take the risk of either flood or mudflow in either case?

Mydreamhome: I will try Farm Credit again, but I'm not too optimistic about them. I contacted them last fall to find out credit requirements and such for constructions loans and our credit issue, foreclosure, wasn't something they were willing to work with for several more years. I would guess that's the same for a land loan.

As far as the seller's motivation, I think that they just changed their mind. As far as I can tell there's no issue with the property. One of the neighbors, who has a much larger property, has signs up indicating that the property is a private duck hunting club. I'm not anti-gun or anti-hunting, but I do have concerns about shooting near my house or kids. I need to find out the rules regarding this sort of thing.

Kirkhall: I understand that the rate other people are paying isn't necessarily relevant to what we will get. It's just that I'd like to know what the typical going rate is for a land loan so I can determine how much more we are paying due to our credit issues. With that information we can decide if it's worth it or not.

The property is no great bargain. I'd say it's priced right, maybe a little high. I think it is listed as moderate under lahar risk, which we are okay with. I do not think it is in the floodplain, but I need to double check. I looked at the king county map, but I found it hard to read.

A land only loan with Farm Credit for $100K ran us 4% last July. We've been very pleased with their customer service and intend to use them for our construction loan.

I love your views!! What an excellent piece of land. My wife and I just got a land loan for a 1.13 acre lot in the Cleveland suburbs.

I called 19 banks to research lot loans (both national and local banks). Out of 19, only 3 provided land loans. Here is the basic info on each.

1) 20% down, 4.7% 5/1 ARM, 30 year term. Fifth-third bank.
2) 25% down, 4.125% fixed, 25 year term. Home Savings &Loan
3) 40% down, 4.2% fixed, 3 year term. Local credit union.

We dismissed the third bank immediately. The first two were very close, but we ended up going with Fifth-third. The ARM isn't typically a big deal since the lot loan will be rolled into a construction loan or perm mortgage before 5 years anyways.

I am not sure what the credit limits are on the two viable banks I found if you do not have good / excellent credit. Getting a land loan is not the easiest process because it is riskier for the bank.

This post was edited by jc_ufl on Wed, Jun 5, 13 at 8:44

Gorgeous! How about approaching the sellers with a owner finance for X years? You get the land and more time to fix your credit and apply for a conventional loan. I agree though, the views look like flood plain territory so make sure everything is insurable and that there won't be any surprises later. Loans often require that some types of specialty insurance be carried until the loan is paid off.

Gorgeous! Sorry, no advice on borrowing.

So the property is within the 100 year floodplain.

And out of nearly 14 acres, 12 have been deemed a wetland due to seasonal water. WTF. The whole western side of the state is a wetland 9-10 months out of the year.

Can I vent about how much I hate king county, Wa.
F---ing communists, they want everyone to live in high density urban housing (I.e. apartments) and ride a bike.

Oh and the hypocrisy of the "wetlands". There's a thread on this page where another poster and I both looked at the same 8 acre lot that backs into a small mountain. This lot had 5 wetlands per the county, each with a 50-100ft buffer. The county owns 285 acres of the mountain which that lot backs into and guess what, not a single wetland they claim. They are free to harvest the timber as they wish. And a few miles away a huge master planned development is going in (6,000 homes which will result in something like 10 homes per acre, no real yards all shared open space BS). Of course the county sold this huge parcel and allowed changes in zoning all through backdoor dealings. Well guess what, out of 1,500 acres only three small wetlands. But I'm sure the property owner next door has a virtually unbuildable lot thanks to numerous "wetlands".

I HATE King County WA!

ETA: As 87% of this lot is unbuildable I'm pretty sure it will not be selling anytime soon unless the price is dropped substantially. The current owners purchased it for 120K two years ago via owner financing and then spent money improving it and getting some surveys, permits, etc. I do not think the property is worth 120K now that the CAD is complete. But, since it was owner financed I'm not sure how likely it will be for a short sale type scenario to happen.

This post was edited by olivesmom on Wed, Jun 5, 13 at 18:03

Ugh. I'm sorry that you've had such a rough time. This is the second time - and in a relatively short period of time - that you've found property and had it not work out.

I've heard terrible things about King County for building. The permit process alone is supposed to be awful - if you could find property. We were approved in about 2 months here (Snoh County); I've heard it often takes 9 months in King County...But - could you come to Snohomish County? We still have wetlands and flood plains here, but I think they're a bit easier to work with. Also, the prices tend to be lower here than they are in King Co...

This post was edited by gladys1924 on Wed, Jun 5, 13 at 18:09

Gladys: We may consider moving out of king county (either up to snohomish or south to pierce), but we like where we are at (maple valley) and I find it really convenient as a stay at home mom. I know that sounds lame but shopping-wise we are less than 15 minutes from Costco, we have a really nice Fred Meyer and new retail is going in. The area feels safe, the schools are good and I find that despite it being a bedroom community there is a small town feel which is nice. Im just really unfamiliar with snohomish county, perhaps I need to do more research.

We came from MV also. I am a SAHW (no children). I know the schools well; one of my relatives is in administration there, so perhaps I have a biased perspective on TSD! But really - you should check into Granite Falls. The land prices are good up here, we definitely have a small town, safe feel - and I *currently* live in the middle of town (renting an apt while we build). GF may have had a "drug" reputation, but I don't think it's deserved any more. Shopping isn't so terrific, though - the nearest Fred Meyer is over 20 miles away (Monroe); Lake Stevens has good grocery stores (Safeway, Albertsons), but that's 15 miles from our new house. I just plan in shopping less frequently.

Sorry - I'm on a roll here. But I love feeling safe when I walk, either in our neighborhood or in town. And the wildlife - yes, GF has deer in the middle of town, not to mention on our 6 acres - the wildlife is a nuisance. The deer will eat our garden, and we'll have to share our huckleberries with the bears. But I'd rather deal with the critters than the urban "wildlife", if you know what I mean!

2 acres with an already existing septic system is more than enough space to be able to place a homesite on, as long as you can get a driveway to that 2 acres without encroaching on the wetlands. Even if the rest cannot have structures on it, that just ensures that your view remains unspoiled. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this as a possibility.

Yeah our lot is almost ALL wetlands except .5 acre building site.... if you love it do some more research. I don't think that discounts it entirely.

"2 acres with an already existing septic system is more than enough space to be able to place a homesite on, as long as you can get a driveway to that 2 acres without encroaching on the wetlands. Even if the rest cannot have structures on it, that just ensures that your view remains unspoiled. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss this as a possibility."

True. And having a well already there is a plus. Having to drill for a well can be a huge financial outlay, and you don't know how much that well will cost until you start doing the job. Plus you need to build some kind of structure for the well equipment - that should already be in place. Not having to deal with that would be a plus.

Hollysprings: I'm not dismissing it, but I think they are asking too much. There are several other properties nearby, while smaller, are listed for 1/2 to 1/4 the price of this lot. And since the lot is currently financed by the previous owners, I'm not sure how it's going to work out. I feel no rush though. We will just wait until we are ready to build (1-2 years from now) as I'm fairly confident that the property will remain unsold.

I'm also unsure about the floodplain thing. Is it possible to bring in dirt and have the house at a higher elevation? Too costly?

Oh and it doesn't have an existing septic system. The soil has perked though. There is an existing well and I was under the impression it was new, but after reviewing some of the documents it appears it may be older...not sure if there are any concerns there. The driveway is in and I think it does go through some of the wetlands, but it has been there for a long time. Also, the property has been used to grow hay and pasture animals for some time now. I want to be sure that we could still grow and cut the hay even though some of the field is considered a wetland.

This post was edited by olivesmom on Wed, Jun 5, 13 at 20:25

We considered homes in a flood plain. All new homes in a flood plain have to be built on stilts *and* you have to buy flood insurance. That's what we found in Carnation/Duvall, at least - that's King Co. Bah! Much of the remaining open land in the King/Snoh area is in a flood plain or something. Too bad - there are some really gorgeous properties, but dealing with the potential flood issues gets darned pricey when you go to build the house..and knowing King Co, even with the house on stlts and all, they'd still make you fill out more forms, have more government crap to deal with - that all adds to the cost.

Our land includes a flood plain. I wouldn't let that rule anything out, but I wouldn't pay top dollar for a lot that is mostly lowland either.

We are fortunate to live in an area with pretty reasonable rules about building. As long as we build high enough and far enough from the river channel (when it's not flooded) and put in a silt fence to keep dirt from the building site out of the river, they're happy.

You could always put in a request for wetland boundary mitigation or some such thing... paperwork and $$.

Kirkhall: I need to look into the mitigation process and see what it entails. The rules regarding wetlands seem quite complicated and I'm having a hard time finding definitive answers online.

I'm okay with only two buildable acres (assuming house, septic and yard will fit) as long as we could continue to have hay (or something similar) growing and cut down some or all of the cotton wood trees in the wetland. I *think* that because the hay and cattle grazing has been happening it could continue and although I don't know about the tree thing.

I can't say about the tree thing. In Kirkland, you wouldn't be allowed to take them out. But, that is a city thing and not a county thing.

As for wetland area for pasture (or hay)--I am almost certain that is fine. That is the reason the "horsefarm" down the road didn't sell a few years back--they have a lot of wetland area so it isn't buildable. But, they've got horses out on the pasture 6 months of the year...

Though, having grown up on a real farm (E. Washington), what is your plan for harvesting that hay you want to grow? Do you have the equipment, or are you going to have to hire it out? It may not really get you ahead at all.

I only want the hay for aesthetics, I think a field of hay looks nicer than whatever would grow naturally. I'm not sure about the harvesting aspect, maybe there's a grass or something that would be better suited for what I want.

Most people with hobby farms around here let a local cut and bale the hay and just keep it. Or, they hire them to do it if they've got horses that can use it. It takes quite a bit of money to buy all of the equipment to deal with 14 acres, even if you're not baling hay. I have a friend who got a pretty good bargain for a 35 horse tractor, bush hog, finish mower, grader blade, box blade, etc. It still came to 40K. Adding on the hay equipment on top of that is another 10K easy. That is an expense that most city people fail to take into account when buying acreage. It's work and it doesn't take care of itself. A good portion of your time will be spent keeping opportunistic saplings cut down, and the fence in good condition, and mowing.

I just came back from the flooded areas along the Danube.

Lots of people who lost everything because they built in a flood zone.

Once the water destroys everything it's not so f..king communist anymore that there are regulations.

And your pictures of this property look like it could easily turn into a brown lake if there's lots of rain.

Jrldh: the communist comment wasn't in reference to floodplain regulations. I do not have a problem buying flood insurance or elevating any structures.

King County, WA has a history of infringing on the right's of private property owners. In 2004 they passed an ordinance that essentially seized 65% of rural land owners property, only allowing them to develop the remaining 35%. It was overturned in 2008, but I think since then they have made it just as difficult, if not more so, to develop property (out of spite?). They claim the regulations are to manage growth and protect the environment (all BS IMO), but they are corrupt and self serving.

jrldh--except, you don't know KingCo. They are pretty ridiculous when it comes to wetland protection... As Olivesmom said, 1/2 the county is "wetland" 10 months of the year (it just rains a lot here). And, the county has this tendancy to "move" wetlands. You pay enough money, they'll move it (why I suggested the mitigation consideration)...

It is different than having a river (the Danube) overflow its banks. We do have several streams and smaller rivers here that overflow every few years, but it isn't like the Danube, which hasn't been as high as this since the 16th century...

Not. at. all. the. same.

Though, very sad for the communities being flooded around the Danube.