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Anyone else build a home for their large family??

fiveunderfive
13 years ago

We have 5 kids and the potential for several more (we are still both young and open to whatever God blesses us with). We are in the design phase of building our dream home. We close on the land tomorrow and have already had prelim plans drawn up and our builder selected. We are looking at a fairly open downstairs floor plan with multi-purpose spaces. We subscribe to Sarah Susanka's "Not-so-big" concepts of building, although we joke that we are building the "not-so-little not-so-big" house as early estimates have it around 4000 sq feet with potential for a finished basement and possibly a small finished 3rd floor down the road. (The house has a high pitched gable roof). The area over the garage will be a dormitory-style area for our 4 (currently) girls to share, complete with a large walk-in closet and bath that will have at least 2 vanities, plus dual showers and toilets. The kitchen will have a large island that hopefully will be able to seat at least 6, and the dining room will have room to expand to seat the 30+ family we frequently have over. The living room is large enough to accommodate our huge sectional, and will also have several other seating options including window seats flanking the entertainment center. A mudroom area will hopefully have enough lockers for each family member and the adjoining laundry will one day house a double set of front loaders. (I wish I could go with high capacity top loaders, but I'd rather have 2 sets and there is not enough room for 4 top loading machines).

I'm looking for advice from other large families. Things you couldn't live without. things you wish you had. Any suggestions??

Thanks!

Comments (38)

  • bigkahuna
    13 years ago

    I am from a family of 9 kids. I grew up in what used to be a one room school house( hence my desire to grow up and design new homes lol)We had 4 per room ( small rooms) I have found over the years that made me easier to adjust to college dorms.

    Anyway. I would suggest a large island as you have spoke of. But a large pantry with possibly second refrigerator or a second beverage fridge under the island out of main kitchen work space or both. Unless you need a separate dining...Just do one semi casual dining space open /close to kitchen with large oversized dining table. Good sized linen closets/cabinets in those baths. and a good size broom and linen closet in the halls somewhere. Possible consider second floor laundry? or a laundry chute. Although you can just make the kids bring their laundry down.lol Make room for baskets /shelves for laundry room

    A separate living room( on back side of house as well) if you entertain that family alot ? or play space so that you can separate by men /women young vs old , quiet vs noisy etc. Consider 6 burner cooktop and speedcook microwaves like GE Advantium 240 or the one by meile. Multiple sinks in kitchen. large garage( 24' deep min. x 3 cars with 9' wide single doors or 18' wide double. With all the bikes and toys etc you will need extra room and need space to open lots of doors between 2 vehicles and also bringing in all those groceries. A separate family entry that leads a hall past laundry /mudroom will be where all the family enter after first visit nobody uses front doors it seems. Give family and friends that entry where the people usually park anyway without passing through laundry. Also is good for letting dogs out if you have them and wet messy/muddy,snowy kids as it may be. Leave a spot for message boards and keys and cell phone chargers possibly.

    Nice size, well located guest bath that gives privacy and modesty for all those kids and family gatherings. Consider outdoor entertaining spaces..covered porches will extend seasons and make outdoor enrtertaining easier when sun, rain are issues. It extends the seasons as well. If not in budget now plan for a future one if possible.

    {{gwi:1459550}}

  • lyfia
    13 years ago

    I spent my summers with my cousins who are a total of 10 siblings. 6 girls and 4 boys. My uncle designed and built the house they were in then and what was really nice about the bedrooms were that they were set up so the ends were little alcoves with a wall separating a space for a twin bed and night stand, but no door, wall ended just after the bed and a window was also in each alcove. Then in between was a large shared area. The house was 4 levels so the top floor was angled roof and the space where the oldest used with a room at each end and a common space in between. The only ones that were private and also could be used for guests.

    I don't remember what the bathroom was like since I was a kid when they lived there and didn't pay attention to those things then.

    I just remember really liking the separate sleep alcoves with the shared play space. It was nice for me and my one cousin who liked to read at night and to not have to worry about turning off the light for my other 2 cousin sharing the space who wanted dark when they slept. We could all still whisper to each other, but also had some privacy. I do remember that part too as I'm a very private person and needed my privacy even as a child and except during the summer when I was with my cousins I was an only child until I was 9 years old.

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  • mdev
    13 years ago

    acountryfarm,

    You sound like a lovely person. Nicely put :)

  • J. .
    7 years ago

    Late to the game for sure, but I'm wondering if you achieved your not-so-big house for a large family. We're in the same boat and making plans for a remodel.

  • Renee Texas
    7 years ago

    We are the same- I decided any large dinners would be held as a picnic. Our dining seats our family, and expands a bit, but if we have lots of guests? We go outside! Luckily, we can eat outside 10mo out of the year. My only suggestion is build-in as much storage as you can possible find!

  • Kristal Nagle
    6 years ago

    I know I am way late to the game on this topic but we are just like the O.P. have kids but know at least one more is in the picture. We have 3 girls and 2 boys. Right now we are in a 1500sqft house and no storage and the kitchen only big enough for 1 person at the time. We are getting ready to sell. Instead of spending all our budget on a house that doesn't really work we are wanting to design something that works. We are homeschoolers, and live in an area that is colder. But I am hoping that some of you would be willing to share your knowledge. We are thinking 4 bedrooms. Master, and 2 bedrooms upstairs. Each bedroom having a bathroom, I would like a tub/shower combo since right now our youngest are all 4 and under. A guest/master downstairs with the bathroom connected to the mudroom. We know that my husband's grandma needs to move in ASAP. Laundry that will hold 2 washer and dryers upstairs, and probably a "family closet" idea within the laundry room. But also a mudroom with one washer and dryer in it down stairs. We have a small farm going on and just don't want some of the dirtiest clothes carried throughout the house. I am not wanting anything fancy for the design of the outside just a basic rectangle with four 90 degree corners. Its the inside I need help with. I want storage and ton of it! I need a big pantry but don't want to make it too big and waste my money. We buy bulk monthly and store in buckets. I have found for us using the kitchen table doesn't work well for schooling. Just to much cleaning up and taking out the school books for me. We were thinking a library on the main floor with just three side and open up to be able to see from the kitchen. With a table in the library area for schooling. I really like the open floor plan idea just need storage within it! I have been reading the "Not-So-Big House" and do agree with it but keep thinking "yeah but what about when you have at least 5 kids that stay home all day?"

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    Hi Kristal! OP hopefully has moved in! I see similar ideas with yours and "Acounrtyfarm" ideas. You and I have almost the same ideas for a home. I am no help for the buckets though. Just keep looking on pinterest at restaurants! I know I found some great ideas for pantry with the terms "open shelving" and interestingly, "curtain under counter" and "freestanding kitchen".. Leads on how to best love those buckets, I bet you might find some hints! I love your idea of the library!

    Your home is very similar to our friend's home. She only has two kids now, but it is 3500 sq ft with full basement. She hosts a large Christmas gathering at her place and it is very nice. She would change a lot about her home but I think she is feeling very settled today in a good way. I have 2 (+ coming) and might be blessed with 4 one day. That would be full for us. Of course we homeschool as do many we know. I would totally ask them and listen sometimes to their plans. Our friend with 9 has currently in 1600 sq ft and just bought a farm with perfect land and not so perfect house. It is 1800 sq ft and they may have more; they are planning on adding 2 bedrooms (to complete 4, but currents are small!) and it is a one level. Just one washer and dryer but it is mudroom style and again one level.

    Some one posted above about quiet, that is good for structure reasons as well. more walls are good! More storage and outlets too and not, to me, the temptation of walling everything in a big open space and getting a big room with bundles of things to walk around. I thought about this a lot after I rendered an open floor plan. I think they are super cool when I see them! But homeschooling is where you start to feel the blessings of the loudest having their audience and the quiet ones, some reading, thinking, having some focus time.

    I think we may decide to put a W/D stack outside the bath upstairs, now it is a cleaning closet. Seasonal bedding, some other kind of space for the 6 month items. The sheets I was tempted to place in a split closet with shelves and a vacuum and broom in that space. Another counter with wall cabinet is down the hall and we could try a small vac upstairs that could fit under the counter and hang broom and brushes on a country rail outside bathroom. We could simply put sheets in an open closet system within the kids rooms. We all have cream sheets, but I could initial. We do have a laundry shoot. I am a bit worried about changing over the laundry and also having lots of wiggle room to breath, a window, folding too, so I kept keeping laundry first where I really want the dust bunnies and icky to get stuck, still debating this because I think we could do both for a small amount of money. That would keep me basically sorting it exactly how I do now, dark and gross, light and with bedding, and keeping the towels for first bath and messy, away from nice towels upstairs.

    I do grow food too. We have a balcony off MBed for sprouts to harden off away from deer (and star gazing.)

    South facing kitchen will offer space to start the early/late spring ones safer and faster. I have a wood stove idea that works for central heat and the farm entrance, mud room, is also on the way to the major wood pile which we will refill over a rug and under a bench in the LR. I love this vs wood place in the house, though I love the veritcal look! We think all these little details are not "basic" and when you build a house, getting it done and closed in is first when you have homeschooled kids. Some houses are best detailed to me after you experience the space, warmth and light too.

    Here is a video I made for help. I am still tweaking bits of it. I could post a floor plan but it is pretty easy to figure out now since the windows in it are so unique. I was on pinterest for years following some "Great eyes" and was playing around with making a room from the inside and not the out. For passive solar, chill wind, light giving and CV. I am getting closer but I have already made some nice changes.

    I posted here for help but...well... I don't want to talk about it! lol! Tonight I went to a gathering with HS clan and spoke up about it. They all laughed so hard. It is tough for some people that don't farm and homeschool to get any points! I had to delete most of my comments. It had negative vibes..I can't delete the post but I flagged the few worst comments, I think they are gone but someone from Houzz will decide.

    The main floor beams still need to be reviewed (again) by our local builder (truss and joist) but we could use steel I beams (again) too. We are trying for traditional lumber. From left to right, just imagine the LR & DR being 15' about from front door to back windows (over looking orchard and pond) on both sides of a main supporting wall (but the DR is 14'9). We have a coat love in each child, rain, city, heavy sweater or jean. The big doors are for this and other essentials. I have already played around with this and pushed back one nearest the kitchen curved doorway to be shallow at 15-16" and the other to be more of a 3 door to keep the doors all the same width. I ended up deciding that shelves for folded sweat jackets and others are probably going to work out better as well as keep the look uniform for the width of the doors, and also, if not jackets, it is cool we could use this for other items! I think we may store the heavy heavy winter coats so puffy under the upstairs stairwell. Maybe in a box too vs hung. Most likely these massive coats will be rail hooked (like fancy brass kind) in the mudroom during the winter. I also plan to fancy wall rail under the stairs on both sides a higher and lower, so we can use for playgroups and also getting to deeper storage in this little spot. I think! or changing our minds. There is also a shoe closet nearest the love seat in the entry. (Everyone voted I drop curve in the stairs, probably will next week.) Parallel to coats is HS supply (art too) and the office hall is mostly for papers, books (chapter book size) and Tech. It might be helpful to you! The curtain in the dining area is our pantry, but also a 15" deep tall cabinet nearest the baking counter. We can close the LR with pocket doors and try to trap heat from all entry doorways (leaving ;) and also close off mudroom up the hall stairs nearest bath. I think this is a great way to come into potty in the cold and go back to sledding or just come around to the kitchen door with boots on and beg for coco and a snack :). Hoping to slow down the Hot/Cold air exchange with not only private spaces for focus homeschooling, but also structure, and storage spaces as well.

    I keep worrying about the kitchen growing. It can only go so far! It is nice because the bump out of the main home still gets some light from another wall and Cvent. We also have double walls in plumbing on the exterior wall for the upstairs bath and a half wall for the downstairs bath. I really like the insulation for cold for the up and insulation for the busy bathroom opposite the LR.

    We really married the site first and our needs! Hope you can do the same and dream beautiful!! Simple always is to me!

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    I forgot to add! There is also a root cellar under the mudroom, it conforms to the land at the door for how the hillside looks and waterflows now, but we will have a flat foundation through out, under the "landing" floor of this room is were we are plumbing in a very small 3rd bath (those full tile kind) to be built later, but putting a root cellar a bit beyond, right under the landing. We have trouble every year with storing our pumpkin pie crop. If we out grow it though, I want to try an outdoor hillside design common in VA (back when). I can't handle the problems that come with mold in the house and checking. So it will probably be enough to store and keep well with the heat until Jan. My husband is happy about a "secret room" for anything no matter what. We studied Eastern Europe and Russia and it is like a shed outside for them! I am going to be trying this in our little stone cottage basement and the workshop too. but pulling ten or so in here like a pantry.

    And the basement was just what I could make look nice! You should think more kid art, nature photos, books, toys, experiments, duck tape cardboard houses :) a globe, big telescope ( it think, it might go under the first floor stair) art supplies, etc! We have a walkout basement that faces a nice view and also need to escape heat. You go down in the summer, and up in the winter here to live in a very nice range of degrees! I am sure we will love and live in all of it year round, but there is a difference in hours spent for sure.

  • cpartist
    6 years ago

    Kristal Nagle I would suggest starting a new thread asking the question. Have you considered working with an architect or person of design talent? Do you have the land yet?

  • J. .
    6 years ago
    @Kristin Nagle We have six, homeschool and live in ~1300 sq ft. After years of debate we decided remodeling what we have was the best choice for our family. Because we have lived in the house for 13 years, we understand what works and doesn't and hopefully those items will be fixed. It's certainly not cheap, but moving wasn't either (and especially not moving & remodeling).

    I would suggest making a list of needs and room flow and finding a good architect. For us it was well worth the expense to have someone take what I was thinking and translate that to real drawings.

    Good luck with your project.
  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    I agree with J.. it is a heart felt effect to stay and be close to kid instead and not get lost in a home build.

    Friends with 9, that just bought went after land for farm animals, water and growing food. They found amazing 7 acres with such nice fencing, pond and barns! The house needs things like "building up the floor" and the kitchen is a strange hall. I think they saved a ton of money find a home they could remodel though!!! We tried the very same thing but the land and a tiny stone cottage (stone.. it is lovely, like wow, just not very easy to adjust! Lol! About 3x 250.. hard with a ladder hole in the center!) but it helped us with site planning so much! After we looked and wondered, it is not an ordinary remodel or addition project. It would eat up almost $150k, not kidding. We are leaving it rustic and as a guest home.

    We never set out to build a home. We did know we wanted water and to grow food which had us checking a list all about land, hills, quiet, sun, soil, established plants. We tried so much to find a house built we could remodel. We actually looked in the good homeschooling states all along the east coast. I do agree with above "J. ." Though maybe because I am not moved in yet! We did find unreal property.. amazing! I guess I just don't like shopping. I like nesting but more with the kids, holidays and of course the garden. You loose a lot of time building new unless you can hire a whole team of people to help. It costs a lot.

  • dsnine
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    Hi all! We have a half dozen kiddos and one has special needs, so the plans we are considering modifying will definitely be built large AND with universal accessibility. We are currently in a small tract home and all the kids except the baby are in a single room. Happily we are moving to a cheaper part of the country and buying land to build by the end of summer.

    Like the OP from several years ago, we also LOVE Susanka's work and are designing with it in mind. My husband is a structural engineer and will design and build it himself, but we both find it MUCH easier to work off existing plan pictures when space planning, then modify as needed.

    For our aesthetic this floor plan is the best fit I've found (including a second main floor master for guests/caring for elders/etc):

    https://mobile.houseplans.com/plan/4208-square-feet-4-bedroom-4-5-bathroom-3-garage-craftsman-38758

    Modifications will include making the utility/mechanical room smaller and moving the laundry there, so the mudroom is larger and separate. We will also bump the powder room back down the hall to add an elevator shaft.

    Each room having a master bath is fantastic as we will have a boys and girls room upstairs, and the bonus room is a play room.

    The garage will have to be taller for my big van, and the exterior I will make a cleaner modern farmhouse with some cottage or arts and crafts details - much less heavy and dark than the one shown. But the actual layout and size is almost perfect. We will pop it on a basement if the soil of the lot will allow for it and that will give us the increased storage and shop space we desire.

    I'm so excited to build this after waiting and waiting for years. We are expecting it to be around a two year process, realistically.

  • cpartist
    6 years ago

    dsinine, while this house may work for you, it would be best to find your land first and then work alongside a person of design talent to help create a house that will work with your land too. Even though your husband is an engineer, and expects to build it himself, having the eyes and ears of someone with years of residential design experience can help you to not miss anything and to make it work perfectly for your family.

    A few thoughts. Bravo on getting a plan that isn't a dark cave and allows light into every room. I like the overall L shape. However once you find land, you may find that a T shape or an H shape or even a U shape will fit your land better.

    Additionally, when you do work to refine the plans, think in terms of getting rid of all those jigs and jogs on the exterior. They add to the cost to build and make it more difficult to build.

    Also think in terms of having your master bedroom on an outer corner and not the bathroom.

    Another thing is that having the upstairs open to the downstairs means heat and noise will rise.

    Upstairs think in terms of how small those two bathrooms will be for all those kids and their things as they grow. As my MIL used to say, little kids, little things...

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago

    Wow Dsnine that house is beautiful! We left our expensive living and mortgage area too and found just the perfect match for us!

  • dsnine
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    @CPartist - good thoughts and my apologies for not posting more clearly.

    I know the land dictates the house. We have land that is all but a done deal, that we will be purchasing within the next month (we wanted to move our junk down and not be dealing with contracts right now in the shuffle!). We are waiting on some additional geotechnical down the line just to verify the soils in the neighborhood.

    I wasn't particularly clear - my husband is a structural engineer (licensed PE/SE in multiple states) and designs buildings for a living, and residential design is something we are very comfortable with. This floorplan fits the land very well (which is over 1.5 acres, nearly completely flat, and triangular) and we have specific reasons why we need an h/l shaped house relating to sightlines and interior access for our special needs kiddo. We may bump out the den a bit more the make a more symmetric shape, which will be an office space for my husband when he works from home. Closets will also be added to the foyer, and a variety of built ins and halt walls/framing to define each main floor space better. The flow along the lateral axis and ability to modify for a wheelchair and large numbers of people are precisely why we like it.

    Style will be simplified to a farmhouse silhouette with some cottage/arts and crafts details, which should help with those silly facade bumpouts. I'm with you 100% - every jog in the wall just adds cost and we are cogent of that. We wouldn't do them because they're overly complex for what we need, but in terms of design the floor plan this is a skeletal starting point in terms of basic room layout and the first one out of literally hundreds we have found that fit what we were looking for in our spaces.

    The overall space design isn't a worry about HVAC either. That is an element very easy to control. In our case we were likely going to widen the catwalk upstairs and turn it into a library over the great room, decreasing the pass through between the windows and down below and enclosing it a bit for more intimacy. With proper returns and zoning of the temperature it's no big deal to manage a two story area and we have one in our current home, but we wanted to make it significantly more confined than it currently is designed to be AND we need a home for all our books. Win win to add a library/study area to the kids zone up there.

    We like the outer corner bathroom...? Home is going to be ICF with poured floors and interior walls and doors specifically insulated for noise, so the only big concern is functionality of the layout for us. The further bathroom is easier to access with a wheelchair or walker, big concerns for us.

    Ditto that on the upstairs rooms in terms of size and bathrooms. If we did need to more private space for college students we can do it in the basement or in division of the bonus room a bit in remodel, but the home is already enormous and a ton of work to keep clean just based on sheer size, so we are shaving square footage wherever it isn't absolutely crucial, but our kids sharing rooms and bathrooms is their preference too. Boys and girls dorms with decently sized master baths attached not only makes sense for us, it's a heck of a lot easier to resell in a nicer suburban neighborhood than an eight bed/six bath home ;)

    Each kiddo is getting their own lofted queen bed and desk unit underneath, so the rooms will be sized appropriately for that. The bathrooms are already plenty huge though. I just can't stand cleaning a bigger one for each! We have found, in our current home, that even with more and bigger people the bedrooms and bathrooms aren't the bottleneck so much as the size and functionality of the storage and common spaces, so that's the focus here. Adequate bedrooms and baths are needed, but we only use them for sleeping and getting ready, so the spaces we work and live in are where we feel the size pinch more than anything. Even with college students and high schoolers, this should be sufficient to not feel cramped. But having the option to divide the bonus room or add more accommodations in the basement level is something we wanted to have open to us. Soils are going to determine basement though, some in this area have a fairly high water table and some don't, so that's part of our due diligence once we get down there in a few weeks.

    I'm sorry if I gave you the impression we didn't know what we are doing, nothing could be further from the truth with regards to space planning, design elements, permitting, and making it buildable. We also have access to geotechs, architects, and interior designers as needed. I'm totally with you in not picking a dark cave though - sightlines to windows and flow are super important and the basic layout and shape of this one were love for both of us, but it will be getting some modification as we CAD it up ourselves and make it fit with our family. We won't be buying stock plans but rather used existing floorplans along with our tiered needs list to figure out exactly what we wanted and where in layout and functionality it needs to be (which I highly recommend, it's easier than planning a space from scratch in terms of visualizing).

    I'll definitely start my own thread on the build progress over the next year, though :)

  • dsnine
    6 years ago

    @greenacresmama - I know right? It needs some changes, as I detailed above, but for a basic idea it was a lightbulb moment for us. We had our needs and space designs but the layout was tricky and the previous lot much more narrow. This has better flow and functionality for us and fits easily on our lot, which we should be able to get in cash. Whew! It's still going to be a massive project but it's doable and we are excited. This has been delayed for medical expenses several times over and we are so desirous of a completely custom home - it's been a dream we have talked about since before we married.


    Do you have a thread set up yet for the one you're planning and I just missed it? I'd love to see the details!

  • dsnine
    6 years ago

    @greenacremama - I missed that the video upthread was yours. It looks fantastic!

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    @dsnine, I am expecting and have that mad rush now! Lol! We have stock market income that banks are so touchy about too.. we understand though.

    We also do not love to clean! Husband is much older so we may try for one more to make 4. And that will be all we can raise. :D my details are in "3 tweaks" but mostly just a question. I opened up more on a homeschooling thread and planted our video up there too; picked up most of us here do homeschool and that space is a very big deal in our family. We both teach and often want to at the same time some days for outings. I don't have much more to say but just to add, I found closets downstairs for coats + outing supplies to be more vital than upstairs. My kids want clothing racks ("please no closet mom!" )and I do too for bed options for sharing rooms. We eventually may build them some where they want. There is a room over the kitchen I wanted as a "deep" cozy space for treasures almost imagining a twinkle lite winter room, treasure chest, old things we love.. but that also may be okay for new baby. We still co-sleep :0.. maybe kids will feel better in new home about staying in their bed and I think they will leave once baby comes. Baby again co-sleeping of course! lol! So I am not sure what will happen.

    We know for sure that 3500 including walkout basement is enough but honestly like you, wish the gathering rooms where bigger still. I am happy about our semi open split basement area! We are making a theater, possible projector space but maybe not, on the main support wall in the back and if not, tv hiding behind a painting. We have a budding artist in the family and she has good taste! I just want the basement to be happy and fun! Tried to make tons of light with a huge modern feeling picture window in the homeschool/play area (more a creative space tables + chemistry, but for sure summer heat escape), polished concrete, shag rugs, and lots of open play okay for the cardboard messes that seem to follow us. Son loves inventing + chemistry too.. all of it. We are a very tinkering kind of homeschooling family.

    I wish I had a library! My only plan for books is the reality that they will land in each room but the bathroom. We check out 100+ at a grand library that caters to HS too. It looks like a palace set in an old town with a play museum down the street. They also order anything I ask in print; we think it is a plan to not own so many books!

    My my main concern like you sweet one child, is making sure the home can help us become better farmers. I looked into greenhouses and they were more for hired help or completely absorbed gardeners! We are thinking of trading our stone cottage stay for help with the growing life, but I don't know how much we can rely on that going well and how long they will stay on before starting their own family and such. Therefore I just tried to think on how a heavy lover of plants would make do with the our place. We are more of a permaculture farmer type.. this means we buy our tomoatoes to can them and just do a few tomoatoe plants. We DO plant perennials each year and add more. We will have about 6 acres of them with pumpkins growing wild in a electric fence, tons of vines (we have many established berries). Another three fenced gardens we will turn.. veggies at various times basically. It is a far walk to them but we like that because we don't need to share a well. Bees are happy and we are too. ;) just plan to keep flowers and herbs around our home. Actually I plan to do a really beautiful type garden in the front now that I found my way with herbs here so well! I think it makes the awkward dining area so close to the entry feel okay, like opening a garden door. I have always know that we will have various outdoor rooms and the courtyard is my way of honestly beginning the house, but the real beginning is also about 2-3 acres away .. it is on 22 acres.

    Anyway, for each baby periennal I start to add on, I need a good starting window! Going to try half seeded in the fall and half seeded in the kitchen. Buy some too. We hope to keep planting about 50 new fruits (and asparagus) a year. :) I guess that explains why no green house! A kitchen can handle 25 small pots of racks and carts easy! The balcony can help harden them outside too.

    My only take on normal bathrooms is I really love outside storage rooms if the hall is big enough. Something thing about small spaces and toilets! Lol! I made so sure I was able to clean very well around plumbing fixtures. Husband is not to keen on why the faucets are so far from the wall. I am not sure why, he cleans the caulk in our rental just the same! And I just don't like the mold that builds. Same as laundry (glad you are moving out of mudroom! Even more inspiring for me to add a second w/d stack upstairs!) I really like some nice big space to clean around the icky. I know the farm laundry (+pet) will be gross and so will kitchen towels and bath towels downstairs (we are only having one shower/tub to soak in tub only upstairs with no shower).

    What ever you think when you look at my plan just remember our budget is $175k! We will dig a well with other money (+drafter), but the site is established now so that is what is left to build with and hire builders. The bank is happy we have almost paid off the land loan too. If it were not for taxes we could this year!! But we try to keep spending low and slow!

    I love your elevator idea! That has soooo many good uses besides your little! I like it for other resource reasons too and cross ventalation of the upstairs!

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago

    Ps.. sorry.. I just wanted to note that many people around us barter/trade food and our CSA farmer loves too! She is all about annuals too. :) and we grow greens easy. We don't think growing all your own food is a reality for us but we don't plan to sell, just barter for the rest of our menu with people like her. That is another reason I am shy of a greenhouse. I watched her and others handle them, heating, wind storms destroying.. no thanks! And the sunrooms are not so easy to good either. We wanted more of a normal lifestyle and focus on homeschooling but we seems to do really well with seeds in the fall and for some reason pumpkins love the electric fenced orchard!

  • J. .
    6 years ago
    FWIW something else we considered when planning was how the house would feel and function when the kids are gone. This is where we plan to stay and I did not want to rattle around in an empty home, passing quiet bedrooms, but at the same time, I hope that they will marry and return with grandchildren. I think we have created a home that can expand and contract as needed, making the most of our square footage, lot and views, and not overextending ourselves financially.
  • dsnine
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    @greenacresmama - I think your farming plans sound wonderful. I'd love to do a little myself, it's one of those areas I haven't had time or energy to explore. We homeschool as well and with three students and three littles it's just been too crazy but I'm absolutely planning on it when we move. The property is in Ohio and setting up some vegetable patches shouldn't be an issue. Your plans are quite a bit more ambitious but I think setting up your home and hard to accommodate it is very wise. I was wondering about how to do enough pots in the windows but I figured racks in front of the great room windows, since those will face south-ish, are probably our best choice. So you're doing an apiary too or just natural bee populations?

    I admit I'd probably want a second laundry area for farm clothes too - they can get disgusting! Big big fan of separate mudrooms for kids and shoes though. I've thought about an upstairs laundry but we like having full folding tables so it tends to live in hampers and on the floor less. Hallway laundry close to bedrooms hasn't worked well for our particular house keeping habits *blush*.

    On easy to clean surfaces and setup have you looked into Don Aslett's book "Make Your House Do the Housework"? It's one of my favorite primers on the subject of home design for easy maintenance:

    https://m.barnesandnoble.com/p/make-your-house-do-the-housework-don-aslett/1000096066/2672041433116?st=PLA&sid=BNB_DRS_Marketplace+Shopping+Books_00000000&2sid=Google_&sourceId=PLGoP1948&k_clickid=3x1948

    We are definitely doing wall mounted toilets instead of floor mounted, and simple wall mounted faucets and sink basins where we can to minimize the splash and grime around the base. Suspending shelving slightly and keeping things off the floor is also crucial, that eats up a ton of my time housekeeping right now. I feel like I have to move six things to clean one! He's also a big fan of built in vacuums and so am I. Having some hose attachments and a vacuum kickplate for sweeping out the entryway or mudroom quickly and easily is so helpful. And while it is hard to renovate in, building in vacuum conduits is easy with new construction.

    Central floor drains and slightly sloped flooring is also key in bathrooms, mudrooms, and whatever other areas get grime. Being able to mop and squeegee to a hidden or unobtrusive drain saves enormous amounts of time and effort, as well as preventing the messes from being tracked into the rest of your house.

    Was that sloping roof section down the hill in the video going to your planting shed/greenhouse or were you thinking of a separate building?

  • dsnine
    6 years ago

    @J - exactly our thinking too! I want to keep it as small and functional as I can while suiting our needs because I don't want to have to downsize just to function when there are two of us instead of eight or ten.


    The floorplan we chose and are going to work from that I linked above? I LOVE that I can basically ignore the upstairs entirely when the kids aren't around. All main living fornan older or disabled member can take place on the main floor and is a manageable size. And then the kids have their own upstairs wing that is focused on their needs and space but not something that is going to take a lot of maintenance energy when they're gone. The two main floor masters with handicapped accessibility are going to be huge, especially if we need rails or a hoist for our special needs kiddo one day or to house an older family member needing more care. And we can manage them and still have our own suite and privacy on the other side of the house, but without miles of wasted space we are still heating, cleaning, and paying taxes on. Two upstairs bedrooms and a playroom are a lot easier to swallow for long term living than six ;)

  • J. .
    6 years ago

    @dsnine I remember calling about a house for sale and the owner said it only had 4 bedrooms so some of our kids might have to share! The oldest is the only one who had his own bedroom and that was only for 18 months; I can't imagine having a 7 bedroom home. It seems like you've really thought about your needs and planned accordingly.


  • dsnine
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    Heaven forbid they share a room right? ;)

    My kids actually really like it! They were actually excited when we switched from two bedrooms to one so they could have a play room in our current place. And it had the added benefit of moving all toys to the other room so their bedroom was just a sleeping area and easier to maintain for them.

    I figured the lofted beds for each with their own zone and belongings underneath was a good way to get them each private space without adding walls. And three or four sisters or brothers sharing a bathroom that had a separate water closet hardly seems like a hardship.

    Thank you for your kind words - we are really trying to think this through and be as efficient as possible. One of those benefits of cramming eight people into about 1400 livable square feet for years has been that I've gotten better and better at figuring out what I really need to live and what is just more work without a lot of gain. I'm really, really ready to move out of this tiny place though. Our rental is even bigger than this place :D

  • J. .
    6 years ago
    @dsnine Sounds familiar - we have about 1300 sq ft. It's really had some advantages but the time has come to recognize that the kids are only getting bigger. The kids rooms were about 10'x10' and had three apiece 2 boys & 1 girl in each). One solution to the sleep/play area was to build bunk beds in one closet; granted, they were crib mattress size but it worked for several years. Now it's time for real beds and the chance for the girls to have their own space. I'm so excited to have more room for us to just be together (this is where we are all.the.time) and a more comfortable space for hosting others. Now if the rain will stop so the roof can come off!
  • cpartist
    6 years ago

    Sounds like you have a really good handle on what you're doing. I agree that each child doesn't need their own bathroom. (When did that become a thing? My kids survived sharing one upstairs bathroom with my ex and me. Seriously, we all managed.)

    Just was making sure there's enough room to store kids stuff as they age.

  • dsnine
    6 years ago

    @CPartist - we think each kid will have a desk and dresser built in under the queen bunk, a shared closet for hanging items, a locker/stall in the mudroom for personal effects, a bathroom drawer and shared linen closet, and possibly some extra storage in the basement if needed. Does that seem about right? We are minimalists and don't keep a lot of stuff around that isn't actively useful.

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    Dsnine, where are you moving from?

    Thank you for the book idea! We have a neighbor with hives but he lives 2 hrs away. It is just land. We have two 20+acre lots around us we are always hoping come to us for the kids maybe! And just for nature. We sort of keep his bees lol! He is kind to us I think for our help being organic and yummy for him. I am not sure I want to host them though. They are dangerously busy as it is here. I actually am researching avoiding bees and mosquitoes a lot with plants.. we have so.many.bugs.

    I would just be careful and go slow for food but NoT! About the outdoor rooms and trees. No uncovered decks ever in my opinion unless totally against shade trees.

    There is a nice book out there about finding your gardening style and I highly recommend it! Sorry I don't know the title- new though 2015 or so.

    I am the type of home lover that expects plants to blend with the outside colors and themes. If you had a color in mind, I would auto think the landscaping colors! I think it makes a home so much nicer too.

    We know our style well! It is natural flowing, and easy! Cottage gardens, meadows, long fern gully near the stream, many forest with tall trees (and permaculture guilds) water lilies in the pond, we have a lot of micro climates here and so many trees that make the ph change, so it is mostly wild and we love it! Very calming and it just knows how to keep the balance so well! So many interesting species. We don't get bored often! But I do have some ideas. Mostly I just throw seeds too. They are $300 for nice seeds and 1ks! It doesn't take much! Sometimes I scratch the soil for good luck and pinch it down. When you have some much land you do funny things! Just don't go overboard is my best advice. You need to experience the space and go to local gardens too.

    We are mostly "potager" types of gardeners for veggies but easiest is knowing permaculture for the orchard.

    "Parterre" is very popular here in VA and most historic gardens make me melt with them. We are planning a 1,500 sq ft courtyard as our entry "room" and I hope to honor winter spring and fall there (not summer!)

    Along with having 6 settings for outdoor eating, we have plans to split the kitchen of 350 we ft in half or maybe a portion of the living room with pocket doors for senior living. Something tell me we will not be having an issues! The winters here make us want to sleep up and the summers, down! I think we will need to be very very slow to change the BR. We will most likely craft and office in the kids room in the winter and basement for summer when they leave.

    This was also another reason for my courtyard idea. It is a small house but I have been in many gardens in Hawaii and Courtyards in VA (and picked in Charleston!) We all love outside and have a lot going on out there. I have a lot of experience too. In our waving temps, you can't be with our trees close, it doesn't matter, they just plain regulate the temp! The lower trees will not help much but that is why I am not planning it for the summer. In my opinion it is a huge plus to plan for winter!!!! I know sounds crazy but you can enjoy winter outside very well and it makes your home so lovely when it is grey outside too. We have 200 ft of stream that drops down in the temp and we enjoy with the pets everyday. It is our wild hike. If I were to plan for summer I would make as much shade as possible! And not a large place. But you are a bit closer to the north! Just make sure you plan your trees and dabble the research as soon as you can! They are so worth it! They can make your home and views so lovely! And they have host plants, litter, berries, ph life, talk to other plants well and poorly (walnut for example) and also carry some interesting problems. I always start with height ;) when thinking of spaces.. then bugs, deer, and how it propagates. You have to narrow it down for plants; too many.

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago

    I forgot. The roofline sloping down in question is just a screen porch room. It is still in the design works for lines. The land is basically like pictured and we wanted to keep it as close to how the land is today for water flow issues. We have a foundation builder that lives on our street and did almost all the new homes here; he gives good advice! And helped us find a few right spots too.

  • cpartist
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    @CPartist - we think each kid will have a desk and dresser built in under the queen bunk, a shared closet for hanging items, a locker/stall in the mudroom for personal effects, a bathroom drawer and shared linen closet, and possibly some extra storage in the basement if needed. Does that seem about right? We are minimalists and don't keep a lot of stuff around that isn't actively useful.

    I think that should mostly be ok as long as you also have the extra storage for things like sports equipment, winter gear, etc.

    How large a bathroom drawer for the kids? Remember eventually there will be things like feminine items for the girls, makeup, extra hair and skin stuff, etc.

    For the boys there will be shaving equipment, extra hair and skin stuff, etc.

    I might try and allocate a bit more hanging room in all the closets for the time when they turn older as pants, skirts, shirts etc take up more room as they get older.

    While you and your spouse may be minimalists, one or multiple of your children may take an interest in clothes or accessories, or even making their own clothing and accessories and might need a bit more space.

  • dsnine
    6 years ago

    @greenacresmama


    Let me know if you think of the book, I've never even considered my gardening or landscaping style except very loosely. The rambling cottage type garden really appeals to me and what you describe sounds fantastic! You've really thought it out and I'm impressed! The planning for winter vs summer is also a really interesting idea. Here in Alaska we obviously plan for summer but Ohio is a lot milder in the winter and much shorter too, so I'd be more amenable to theee or four season living.

  • One Devoted Dame
    6 years ago

    Dsnine, what style is your house? I'd extend the house's style to the garden/landscaping, but I'm a total "theme" nut. I joke with my husband that whoever designed Disneyland must have been the same personality type as me. ;-)

    I'm even going so far as using only Texas-climate-adapted plants that are found in traditional Tudor style gardens (climbing roses, boxwood topiary, carnations, iris, jasmine, strawberries, herbs, etc.). Benches and lampposts will be black wrought iron to complement the red brick and carry the English theme. Even in the backyard, I want the kids' play structures to resemble primitive, aging castles.

    Themes are fun.

  • dsnine
    6 years ago

    @ One Devoted Dame


    I'm actually struggling a bit with the style. I have a layout and have very eclectic tastes but we tend to lean toward modern iterations of farmhouse and arts and crafts. Utilitarian, comfortable, classic, but not overly fussy. I like my landscaping the same way - rambling paths and loosely structured planters and patches, nothing too groomed.

  • One Devoted Dame
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    For me, picking one style and sticking with it really helps with the decision making process, especially since I can find *something* that I like about almost everything, lol.

    I actually had to pick a style first, before I even thought of making my list of architects to interview. I suspect the style will dictate nearly everything about the house, both inside and out. (Windows, for instance, are often grouped in a Trinitarian set of three in Tudor homes; a theme I expect to replicate in the design of my future custom house.)

    I totally think settling on a style will help tremendously! CPartist is building a "modern" Craftsman/Arts & Crafts style house. I say, "modern," because it's being built in 2017, but she has wonderfully classic design elements throughout. I think the official term for historically-inspired homes like that is "transitional," but I could be wrong, lol.

    PS -- In my experience, loosely structured and rambling are harder to "get right" than formal and symmetrical... Maybe consider hiring a landscape architect or garden designer?

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago
    last modified: 6 years ago

    Dsnine.. okay.. well.. I just have to get you caught up on something I am sure about! You are going to experience a lot more bugs than Alaska! I am familiar with upstate NY, near Buffalo, Rochester and Finger lakes. We almost moved to Ithaca but the taxes ;). The summers are really lovely in that zone more than VA! The summer; the heat, bugs, humidity, but I still have lots to do with kids. Plus still need to keep gardening for me (food, harvest, sowing again for more susscesions like lettuce, sometimes carrots (a bit later) and radishes and beets.. but eventually, life suddenly tells me, to go inside and drink some ice tea and homeschool the kids! Take them to the pool, etc. It seems like my choice not to do summer is also based on native annuals that are super happy! And some others like daisies. I guess I was trying to say; I don't try for summer but I keep up with what is going on; watering. I don't like to weed unless a weed is going to flower because the earth gets like a sun burn (top soil death)! And I relax in the heat a whole bunch to protect the roots of the plants I want to stay happy near by. I should have had all my weeding done but, nothing is perfect!

    Summer to me is a time to get busy and relax too! Lol! It is lovely weather for all kinds of fun in the evening here at least and some days; telescope out, campfires etc.

    Spring and fall for people that eventually grow green thumbs are a big deal and people that grow cheaper thumbs- FALL! Not only cheaper but surpirsingly well established plants had the luck of fall planting or seed sowing. Many native bulb like plants (perrienals) that will be gorgeous and give you so much interest and spread well, are almost unknown to me without fall seed sowing. Many annual seeds I tried sowing in the spring for our fenced garden showed up the following year due to, my layman's guess, a freeze!

    There are some nice bushes and bulbs (you will see Lillies in Ohio I bet in summer) that love summer. That is absolutely worth a try! You have figured me out by now that I can't stay away from the plants lol. We were suppose to not garden this year for house! But I was trying to voice that I threw seeds; tickseed, echineace and echineace and daisy keep on each year like almost wild flower annuals here. This is how I define my "no summer gardening plan" (starting self sowers (annuals, each fall, or when a free seed packet comes, even in winter under the snow sometimes.) I want to water the fruit trees and veggies on a timer one day! But we have to share the well for now and too tricky. The summer flowers and ornamentals need to be totally independent plants and they absolutely are! Drought tolerant or just not me tolerant. Watering in the spring and fall is so much more enjoyable with breaks with the rain and cool weather. Summer watering is so hot too, and basically, we feel irresponsible if we do more than for our food sake; very minimal for other plants. Small trees are okay to help start.

    Winter gardening is a new book topic (and fall too, but that book points mostly to color and sometimes to fall blooms, but chances are if it is foliage, the plant will be thriving in the spring too.) I love talking winter gardening! This is still new to me but what it says to me is mostly about form, evergreen and surprising blooms! The winter garden can be so everlasting! Elegant and besides sourcing the plants, easy! It is lovely to think of still forms placed carefully that add enough grace year round that the garden feels like a familiar room. Much like a favorite tree and a bench or swing. I don't see winter gardens that often and I know I will be one of the first in my circle. Many people have them if you thought about it a tiny bit.. like all the landscaping basic installments that people line their homes with. That is almost exactly it. You just take those plants and make them in front of your and on a path that you focus your attention on instead of something hugging your house or porch, like walking down a brick, or mulch, pea gravel path to a bench and a winter garden delighting around you. That is what it felt like to me anyway! You need to go to more historic gardens than most to find some.

    Here is the book! It is like a catalog and very few pages are the same but chapters do hold the similar ideas together.

    https://www.amazon.com/Cultivating-Garden-Style-Practical-Personality/dp/1604694777

    Praire nursery is great eye candy too! (And a teaching and design catalog if you read it right.) It can help you sow wildflowers seeds on your septic leach field. We didn't buy a mix from them of it, but have gotten seeds from them before. (It can be pricey but easy and a good source for seeds; they always tell you the mix). They have your style for sure! And btw, you might like some purple grass! A sedge is like a grass (but not) and a wonderful mate to iris and others if you have water spots or gutter runs.

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago

    One devoted dame!

    I like what you said.

    I think some landscape styles really help homes, especially at sale time when they focus on that vs staging! I think our home should be stucco or brick but that isn't happening. I think the paterre will be like the pattern above but the plants used for the border will be 3 types so be more relaxed. The fruit trees, flowering and others will suit the farmhouse life pretty well, they will just be neatly spaced on the courtyard border here with a walking path and another row, then driveway, carport and guest parking, and another row of neatly spaced trees. This is more "formal" gardening than I usually go for but after a lot of messing around in beds, I find some comfort in some uniform! Beside wild 12 acres, some potager veggies, permaculture orchards, the whole place has been wild meadow and cottage relaxed beds. It is my hope with the winter garden to make a high style outdoor room front courtyard (1500 square ft max) where our little house (1350 footprint with dining room shared entry) feels just a touch more upscale and just a twist of European. I had to look at homes for sale in Europe; Sweden helped with the white lap sided part, but the rest of the place, oh my Italy, France, Spain and if brick, right at home in UK! Trouble with brick now is not only expense but the rain. We looked at the problems and how they build now days. Not like old times at all.

  • greenacresmama
    6 years ago

    Dsnine, I want add. Your house design change with the white makes me feel comfortbale with your ideas for gardening very well! Plus actually a lot of many other themes beside atomic. You have a lot of traditional elements but adding the white makes a cottage to me. There are lots of colors that invite those playful gardens! A certain bold middle Blue is fun! Purple is surprisingly okay. Yellows get a little touchy for me, but Sage/ not avocado but the pastel kind of green is one of the hardest ones to me but some people have a way of pulling it off well! I love a peach house but it yearns for a small palate of colors. The ones that match though are beautiful! My favorite is white stucco. So white anything else recalling New England photos, and the door opens very well! The style you picked out to me is mid west but area is middle! I find Ohio much like NY but mid westerners might be more mid western. I think this allows a lot of variation for you! And relaxed cottage and some modern Grasses, plus flowering trees and fruits, kid gardens and play, Is what I see. Trees are for the darker version for sure! Trees still to for he lighter version but more colors and more flowers, more tall grasses.