Contractor Asking for Overages after Signing Contractor Affidavit
Tagi1
10 years ago
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MFatt16
10 years agoRelated Discussions
Contractor will walk away if I sign contract
Comments (25)Thanks so much everyone! I called the CCB who told me that regardless of ANY paperwork or contract that my contractor wants me to sign, I have the state right to file a report with the CCB and get money from his bond if need be. In other words, the contract I'll sign will be meaningless because I can still file a claim in the future, regardless. Whew - that makes things a lot easier! At the same time, the contract - written by he and his partner - shows that they're releasing me or at least that's their intention, in writing. That can't hurt. Lascatx - CCB stands for construction contractor's board. I won't mention the cushion, thank you. If the rest of the work goes of without a problem (not holding my breath) I will consider giving my contractor some much smaller amount of money for any work he did that he didn't goof up. Dianalo - thank you! :) Oldhousegal - yes I've looked into him and he has nothing negative on his record. He's been a contractor for 5 years - those are the only two things they could tell me about him - oh besides that he has a $20k bond. Thank you for all that info as well as the link! Shar-az - thank you for your support. I hear what you're saying. The problem is that even the CCB said they can't guarantee that I'd "win" the case because the issues with his work are mostly aesthetic. They'd be more likely to find a compromise for us and I think his walking out the door, giving up his 1/3 final payment is better for me. I've gone through enough stress and awkward feelings that I honestly don't feel like I have the strength left to pursue this further with him and file a claim, even though I understand your point. I truly believe he's learned a HECK of a lot on this job - to the extent that yes he should be paying me as if I were "contractor's college" - haha. I don't think - under these circumstances - that I'm being unusually nice NOT to report him if I get what I want without having to do so. I believe that in the future, he'll think twice about tackling a job that's beyond his ability. Even though he brought it on himself, this was a real nightmare for him and while he's not a good contractor, he's not that stupid, either. He lost a lot of money on this job. The first 2/3 of the money went almost all to sub-contractors, a new electrical panel, plumbing, permits, etc. Not saying "oh poor guy" necessarily but I just don't think he's willing to lose that much ever again - and I do think he learned a lot -the hard way. Weissman - Thank you. The contract that he wants me to sign has a release of lien written into it (not by a lawyer but I think that's good enough). As others here have pointed out, I think I have enough evidence via emails that he couldn't come after me and really expect to have a positive outcome, and I think he knows that. Johnliu - Thank you for making that list for me! Much of what you wrote, I have done, though not all. I didn't send anything certified mail but I have printed-out copies with concise lists as well as plenty of email exchanges. Haha to needing to turn up my b*tch dial. That dial's well used actually, but admittedly not so much when it comes to using it in these types of situations. I have a friend (who happens to be a lawyer) who is SO quick to be confrontational that I find myself just not wanting to be like that. I don't mind being assertive usually (although I admit I've been a real wuss with this guy, in some ways - not in others obviously) but confrontational people seem so toxic, you know? Generally though I agree with you. I will INDEED be getting and checking references in the future as well as checking with the CCB in advance, etc. ABSOLUTELY! Man oh man have I learned a lesson! The guy I got a good hit off of charges a bit much according to a friend of my mom's who is a contractor/designer (I won't work with him because of his personality - long story - but he's very helpful in many respects). He said I think $3,500-3,800, possibly less (he said a week's work @60.00/hour) to repair all the things my contractor goofed up on, plus to remove the cracked farm sink and replace it with the new one, scribing again but a good job, and painting, etc. So on one hand it's less than what I'd be paying my contractor but I'll still meet with a couple of other contractors so I can know how reasonable the first guy's price is. Athomesewing -thank you! As I wrote at the top, it appears I don't have to worry after all. :) Buehl - I didn't research him well enough. I checked with the CCB and knew he had no complaints. I hired him cause my neighbor who is a pretty close friend (was??!) highly recommended him after he landscaped her back yard and remodeled her basement, which looks nice, at least if you're not going around and looking at details closely. She spoke highly of his work ethic and said how he cares about the environment and how he and his partner-brother are really decent people, etc. etc. Then that same lawyer friend I was talking about above checked on Angie's List and said she saw positive comments (how stupid was I not to ask her to go into more detail?? We were in a hurry when we talked and we never talked further about it!) and THEN my close friend hired him - having heard what I'd heard - to do her small bathroom (it was probably a pre-fab kit job, in retrospect) and she said he did a great job. It was after my contractor had begun work on my kitchen that she called me to say he did a bad job installing windows on a second project...I remember thinking "uh oh." So there's my long-winded answer to whether I researched him ahead of time. Not so much. I went on those two friend-references which usually holds more weight, right? Not enough... As I was saying to someone above here, I think my project was like going to school for him. I think he learned a lot, the hard way. I feel better about his work in the future for other people, actually, though you might think that's me just being in big-time denial. My assumption is that he's done projects for friends and family prior to my neighbor's basement but who knows. Artemis78 - BINGO. I totally agree. And in fact - in his defense (oh no there she goes again, defending him! ;) he was originally only supposed to take my ugly, pre-existing and non-original lower cabinets and make them look better by making the doors stay on better and repainting, etc. (much less removing and installing essentially custom-made cabinets with inset doors, yes) and then neither he nor I discussed which type of sink I'd be getting until after the contract was signed. I didn't have enough experience to know it would be an issue (do now). Furthermore, neither he nor I realized i'd be picking a wall-mounted faucet, and that therefor the farm sink would have to sit back more rather than stand out proud (the latter case of which would result in a much easier job, and for which he'd done in the past he said) so he'd end up having to do 3-dimensional scribing. Then to top it all off, neither he nor I realized I'd be picking out an integrated dishwasher door, sure enough. So basically he walked into the project thinking it would be a much easier job, though when I told him I wanted to do these upgrades, he never said he couldn't do it. He said it would be a little tougher and would take a bit longer in some cases (more money) but that he's good - he can do it. That's where things went south. :( How was I to know he was challenging himself to figure it out and was actually too inexperienced when it came to these complications? I didn't even know enough about kitchen remodels to know these things could be a problem at all. Thank you. Morgne - Thanks for having sympathy. Crazy huh? I didn't know I was having issues with the cabinetry in general either (!) until I had other carpenters come in - when my contractor was out of town - to give me an idea of what it could cost to remove the sink without damaging (hopefully) areas around it, and then to reinstall the new sink. I was worried my contractor would deny having cracked the sink and could possibly refuse to be accountable and fix it himself, so I wanted to get ahead of the game to save time. It was when these carpenters showed up that they looked at the rest of the cabinetry and said things like "what happened here?" and "why is the dishwasher framed in so that it can't be removed?" and "I'm really sorry to have to tell you this but this is pretty shoddy work" and "who did your cabinetry?" and "your doors and drawers aren't on evenly and have no reveals - they're on too tight - these should be 1/8 of an inch" and "this scribing is - hehehea (awkward laugh) pretty awful (wince) ." One guy said right off the bat that he wouldn't touch this guy's work with a ten-foot pole and another guy said I should report him to the CCB and tear it all out and start from scratch. So there you have it - that's what's been going on! :-/ I will post pics, thanks. The old pics will show some of it, though the bad scribing probably can't be seen closely enough and the dishwasher door which looks terrible may not have been installed yet either. Also - since last taking pics - my contractor put hand-made lightrails in (just strips of wood cause I didn't want anything fancy looking to go with my simple shaker hundred-year-old upper cabs) and when he nailed them in place, he didn't have them attached flush. Why oh why is beyond me. They're almost flush, but enough not that he had to try to putty it in (probably the wrong kind of putty too) but that didn't hide the off-ness. I'll take pics soon, thanks. Oy! Ci lantro - I agree. I'd asked him if he could handle that (it was actually he who suggested inset with the face frame to match the look of the original uppers more). I remember asking with some concern about the scribing job and he said something to the effect of "no it's not a problem - I'm actually really good at this type of work, though it's time-consuming due to it being 3-dimensional..." I didn't even know what scribing was before he introduced it to me! I will DEFINITELY make sure the new person knows how to do this type of work, thank you!! Chrisk327 - that's why I'm okay with paying more (e.g. the $3,500-3,800 guy, if need be). I'm not screwing around anymore and I'll take full advantage of this opportunity to pay the same or less, but to have it done right. Not everyone gets such a second chance, you know? I agree that ripping it out is extreme. I'm assuming the general plumbing and electrical is okay (though truth be told, there's a leak under the sink which is the reason the sink got hairline cracks in the first place: because my contractor was trying to fix the leak and tightened the flange! And then a few days later the leak came back, regardless). The only concern about the cabinets is that they're a bit uneven. E.g. if you measure the left side of one cab's opening in height, then measure the right side of that cab's opening in hight, there's a discrepancy, which makes the cab doors uneven. So the new guy will have to remove the doors and carefully cut them to fit the opening unevenness. I am being very specific about what needs to be fixed, and have a very detailed list based on the comments from the various guys who came in to see the kitchen. I also agree that he's at least on the surface entitled to come back and fix the problems himself - even the CCB more or less said as much (they're not allowed to say much at all, without a case being opened). Davidro1 - hahaha thanks! :) Lascatx - yes I see your point - but the good news is that now I don't have to give up my CCB rights! Yahoo! Igloochick - I see your point too! Thank you for your frankness. I only wish I didn't feel pushed into the corner of having to defend him - haha. As I wrote in one of the paragraphs above (you may not each be reading what I've written to every one of you) - I do honestly believe he'll never make this mistake again. I think that the changes we made once started were not anything he predicted (the original plan was something much, much simpler) and he thought he could handle it but found out he couldn't. Next thing he knew he was in over his head. I think he knows that now and won't make the mistake again of allowing difficult scribing or anything else too challenging. He even said next time he'd pay someone else to help him if it came to that (like a sub-contractor). He lost a LOT of money on this job, as most of the money I've already paid went to the sub-contractors or materials. It's also not every day that someone asks you to push back a Shaws farm sink with rounded front corners. Usually they stand out proud - I'd say 95% of the time if not more. He also learned a lot from my job - even though yes, at my expense. He's robbed me of my time, yes, I won't argue with you there - but not my money at this point. I don't feel guilty about what he'll do in the future because both he and his partner were very humbled by this experience, and embarrassed even and I just don't think he's going to make the same mistakes again. He had a clean record before this and he wants to keep it clean and doesn't want to trick people. He just made a huge mistake and is dealing with it now. People aren't all black or white. I'm NOT defending him as much as it might sound like I am - I think he did me a terrible disservice but I don't think he meant to and I know he'd never put himself or the client in this position again. I simply don't perceive him as a villain. If I really thought he was capable of doing this a second time, I wouldn't think twice about reporting him, honestly. I can tell by the way it panned out that he's never gone through anything like this before. Now all that said, I wouldn't be able to refer him, if I were to get a phone call in the future or if a friend wondered how I liked him. I'm just not going to file a claim over this since he - in the end - was willing to work with me....See MoreOverages!! Overages!!
Comments (7)We have built two houses before so we weren't strangers to the process but this is the first time we have extensively remodeled and that process is unique, especially if you are living (camping) in the mess. But it had been 16 yrs since last built so prices have changed. I know, not an excuse, but we both work a million hours a day and decided to hire a GC that we knew personally to make it all go smoothly. We we still like our GC but realized he has several big drawbacks. First, he doesn't have a lot of experience with remodeling, he mostly builds spec cookie cutters smaller homes. He is extremely fair, honest, friendly, does terrific work but he doesn't know "custom" or higher end appliances, tile, carpet, cabinets, details, etc. at all. He thinks that a one piece fiberglass (molded) bath/shower compartment is high end. We are also in an historical area which has a number of requirements. He did not work and play well with the architect, which in reality was probably the architect's fault as he saw this as his "project" and nobody could interpret it but him. He bid the project, we had several other much higher bids, and we thought the others were too high and realized he might be a little low but should be okay. We told him what we wanted but soon realized he had bid really low for laid tile work including blue board. Well, needless to say the tile work is twice that especially since laying on diagonal and not ceramic tile. So, we solve it by him writing the tile company his portion of the tile check and we write another check to the tile company to cover the overage, same with carpet, cabinets, paint, etc. That way, we don't have a huge overage at the end and pay overages as we go. We aren't doing even high end, just really nice medium we think. But, we are getting to the limit of the $$$ and may have to not complete several portions upstairs, landscaping, patio, etc. I am doing more research on products, prices, etc. than I thought I would be doing as I can't ask the GC his opinion on things so feel pressed. I am also having double knee replacement in 3 weeks and will leave my husband alone with this. Our project has been going on since before Thanksgiving and it should have been done a long time ago. I can't reschedule my surgery for a number of reasons. I guess I am just really stressed trying to get as much done at work and home before I go to the hospital. The other thing is we seem to be in a real rainy spell, it doesn't just rain but huge rains lately every few days and that sets back the outside work. Thanks for listening to me whine....See MoreQuestion for contractors - after job is done (paying/thanking)
Comments (17)Because that's their job. They have it built in profit and oftentimes, you are even using their showrooms where even more profit is built in where you could've gotten the stuff for half the price if you'd of shopped around.... Also, we are a tip happy society. People want to praise their kids for achieving things normal to every day tasks! Also, you got tip jars on counters where someone takes something and throws it in a bag? It's ridiculous. Now waitressing is different because they don't get a regular minimum wage most times. Or delivery people who use their own cars and get wear on them etc. Stuff like that I bend over backwards. Or if someone went out of their way (one of my contractors went out of his way to find brick that matched my 55 year old house). That's tip worthy because he drove and spent extra time to find it. But for someone just doing their job? In that case, why not tip the school janitor? Does anyone do that? No they don't. Or the trash collectors? Nope. How about cops, firemen who actually save people? Do you tip your plumber when they unclog your drain? How about the cable guy? Why just the contractor and not all the trades it subcontracts too? Really we should tip our teachers when the kids actually learn something (they're underpaid and there's a lot of bad teachers out there... why not reward the good ones!). There's like 20 guys working on your house... you got 100 dollar bills for those guys? How about the secretary, designer, architect, or the lumber yard people? Most likely, the main contractor keeps the tip. Some might disperse it out but undoubtedly, unless it's a HUGE tip, it'd be equivalent to a couple bucks per worker. Might equal a lunch at best. Far better to offer them lunch. JMHO. That way I know they guys who worked out in the sun got something out of it that I did myself to show my personal appreciation. Oh and a girl/design section at Lowes where I got kitchen cabinets went out of her way to get me extras/save me money, working with time schedules so I could get several discounts at once, then got the cabinet people to work with me on glass doors and sat with me three times to make sure I was getting it perfect .... SHE deserved a tip. I tried to tip and they would not let me! So instead I wrote an email to the company praising her and telling them they needed to reward her somehow if I couldn't. I'm sure my contractor will do a great job. But no tipping as there'll be like 20 people involved... but I'll make their experience with me great if they do a great job. hehe. Don't you got me started! LOL...See MoreExploring bathroom renovation and need help in what to ask contractor
Comments (15)I am in Los Angeles and finished a remodel in a high rise. My remodel included a the master bath - I replaced the tub shower combination with a tiled shower which followed the footprint of the original tub. As has been posted, a shower in a high rise ESPECIALLY requires permits and multiple inspections. The plans were submitted to the City and my HOA had to approve everything. It required my signing a construction agreement with a deposit against damage. As I recall I also needed access to my neighbor's unit below me because the drain for a shower/tub is different than a drain for a tub but I might be confusing this with access needed for my neighbor's apartment in the guest bathroom because of some issues with old pipes :-). The shower itself was inspected three times including a 24 hour flood test as well as inspection of the fixtures installed. At least in Los Angeles, there are additional construction requirements for building in a high rise. For example, none of the framing can be wood in a building over three stories. The framing in my bathroom (and in a few other places in my unit) was replaced and it was metal and had to be installed at very specific distances and with specific metal materials. The FRAMING had to be inspected as well. I am not familiar with NYC Code requirements but would imagine that NYC is at least as stringent as Los Angeles in terms of building codes - especially in multi family high rise units. In my personal experience, one of the best sources for a great contractor if one lives in a coop/condo is to ask your manager who people in the building use and/or ask neighbors who have recently renovated. Hiring someone who has done a few jobs in your building is helpful as they know how to work with management and they also have experienced some of the quirks of the building. Doing major remodeling work in a high rise condo/coop is like nothing else. Just getting materials in and demo debris out on elevators is something that needs to be factored. Most condos/coops also have strict rules about how construction is done. And as pointed out, the ramifications of shoddy workmanship are potentially catastrophic - a water line that bursts or leaks can costs millions of damage as the water cascades through every unit in the stack down to the lobby. My GC (and my designer) were both people who had worked on projects in my building before I hired them and there was actually a network of GC's who knew each other working. My GC would regularly visit with the GC down the hall who was working on another unit. ETA - And the cost of work in a metropolitan condo/coop for anything is higher than the same work would be in a single family home - even in the same area in terms of cost of living. Because of construction rules, hours are limited which increases cost; floors and surfaces have to be protected - this is expensive in terms of both materials and the labor required to put down and take up every day; bringing in materials takes time; parking can be limited. For this reason many great contractors don't want to work in a high rise and so the pool is somewhat limited - which can be a good thing since as I wrote, it is generally helpful to hire someone who has worked in a specific building before. What was the scope of OP's work for his previous work with his GC. In my experience there is a huge difference between doing relatively minor cosmetic remodeling versus the kind of critical expertise needed for bathrooms. My HOA required proof of GC’s license and insurance as well as Certificate of Insirance naming the building as an additional insured. They also required proof that the permit’s had been obtained....See More_sophiewheeler
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