I haven't grown it, but I couldn't help but dig around for a little info because it sounds like something that would interest me. Tatiana's Tomatobase has a little story about it and says it is:

Determinate, regular leaf, medium to large, midseason, red, pear shaped, paste type tomato, similar to Franchi's Red Pear, which is indeterminate. If there is no confusion about the growth habit I would prefer the determinate Goldman's. But Sandhill Preservation sells the seed with this to say (scroll):

• "Goldman's Italian American: mid, Ind, RL, high yielding, about 1 pound, blood red, ribbed paste tomato. Fruit is fig shaped and described by Amy Goldman as "very heavy in the hips". Reasonably firm, meaty and juicy, makes a very creamy sauce. Named for Amy's father's grocery store in Brooklyn. Pkt. $2.00"

So it's likely an indeterminate either way. 'Plantfiles' has no reports from growers but adds that it is an Italian hybrid that has been stabilized to OP status. There was a thread here about a year ago (I searched), but it wasn't very helpful. A thread elsewhere had comments from some who grew it, but didn't reveal anything to speak of. Carolyn mentioned there that it wasn't much to look at and she recommended this Piriform, which is also Italian and very similar in description, but reportedly had great reviews.

I did find a pic (From Amy Goldman's book) that disputes Carolyn's claim.

I did find a pic (From Amy Goldman's book) that disputes Carolyn's claim.

*****

What was I claiming?

I have Amy's book, sent to me when it was published by her and it is piriform shaped, and others had said itlooked like Franchi's red pear one and I think I said in that thread that folks could go to JOhnny's Select seeds and could see a variety that was called Piriform, from Italy to know what a piriform shape was . Amy never called it pirifrom shaped, but it is, it just means pear shaped.

Here is Amy's description in her listing in the SSE YEarbook; in the 2009 YEarbook there are only two listings for it but I'm sure there will be more with time.

..a voluptuous red pear shaped paste tomato, heavy in the hips, similar to Franchi's Red Pear, makes the best sauce, up to one pound, dehybridized from a tomato found in Italy years ago.

Most listers note the DTM's, the plant habit, indet or det, and the leaf form, but Amy didn't do that.

If I recall correctly Amy got it from a distant relative in Italy. Yes, her father did have a grocery store in Brooklyn before he got involved in real estate, but I can't see that the variety name is named after him unless Amy said so somewhere and I missed it, which could be. Amy is Amy Goldman and the variety was from Italy, hence Goldman-Italian.

So what was I claiming? What does it mean that there isn't much to look at? Look at what?( smile)

Carolyn

Hi Carolyn. :)

I don't think I should link to T'Ville here, but there's an old thread there where this mater is discussed and all you 'claim' is that "it isn't much to look at" before going on to recommend the Piriform from Johnny's. That pic from Amy's book disuputes that 'claim'. Nothing major; mostly me being silly because I found the tomato porn pic. I'm sure here in my conditions 'not much to look at' will be the correct description.

pyriform

Mojave, I found the thread in question and it's a long thread about wrong seeds for German Red Strawberry and Cuor di Bui that were listed and pictured at several US seed companies this past Spring and that brought up the issue of piriform/pyriform varieties which were pictured for both of the above varieties and neither one is piriform in shape and in that context someone mentioned Goldman's Italian American.

Such varieties from countries other than Italy of that form were mentioned and I made the following comment:

(So if I were you I'd concentrate on just those varieties from Italy, b'c, as I said, the same varieties can travel and do.

Goldman's Italian American isn't a good one to look at, IMO bc its the result of a selection made from an original hybrid, probably an accidental X pollination, and was dehybridized to the OP state as Amy has said, and she compares it to Franchi's Red Pear as her Goldman one does in its dehybridized state. So you might want to get Franchi's Red Pear which you can do by going to Bill's site at Growing Italian.)

And that suggestion that I made was implied to suggest comparing GIA with the Franchi one.

So I explained there WHY I thought that Goldman's Italian Amercian wasn't perhaps the best one to look at b'c it had been dehybridized from a hybrid, as opposed to those pyriform/piriform ones that were being discussed that were OP from the outset.

And it was good to go back and review that thread b'c I saw that a couple of folks were going to send me seeds for D'Albenga and Liguria and a few more, and I'd forgotten about that. LOL

Carolyn

Or he could buy Goldman's Italian American at Underwood Gardens . He could also pick up the True Black Brandywine (not that inferior RL,sport) and the Shah Mikado (cat#v1183) from your friend and mentor William Woys Weaver.
And Sweetie: Piriform does mean pear shaped but only in the context of Human Anatomy.

Here is a link that might be useful: Underwood Gardens

from Goldman's Italian American at Underwood GardensTomato, Goldman's Italian-American
Tomato, Goldman's Italian-American
Indeterminate. Ongoing production of large, red, voluptuous (large in the hip) pear shaped, paste tomatoes with exceptional flavor and few seeds. Individual tomatoes can reach one pound each. Makes one of the creamiest tomato sauces. Named by Amy Goldman for her fatherâÂÂs grocery store in Brooklyn after she found this at a roadside grocery store in Cernobbio, Italy. 80-90 Days. Approx. 45 seeds per pack
In Stock shows Ind here and a Heirloom

Thanks for confirming that it was named after her father's grocery store. And I should have known that b'c that's also said in the blurb for the variety at Sandhill Preservation where seeds are also available. And I haven't taken the time to actually look at Amy's book to see what she said herself.

It would be nice to know what the hybrid was that this variety was derived from, that is, a known F1 or from a natural cross, but if she got the information from a roadside stand the person there must have told her what he or she knew, so I doubt that that aspect will be known. And that would have helped to know if it's an heirloom or not.

In the end what's important is what folks who grow it think of it as a paste tomato and it's listed in that section at Sandhill and uses at other sites also speak to it as a paste/sauce type.

Zebra wrote:
(And Sweetie: Piriform does mean pear shaped but only in the context of Human Anatomy.)

Maybe you should take that up with Rob Johnston at Johnny's Selected Seeds where that one variety from Italy is called Piriform.

Below I've tried to link to the page at Johnny's where four "Traditional Italian" varieties are featured, one being named Piriform, but if my link doesn't go to that page you can go to that page from the Johnny's index.

What the thread I referred to above at another message side showed, as did a long thread at another message site, is that the whole situation with the large pear shaped red varieties is very confused and it goes back to some of those in Italy who are the seed suppliers since that's what happened with the problem at one site when they traced it back thru their US supplier to that person's supplier in Italy only to find that currently in Italy they're referring to large red pears by a variety of names. The name that was given in Italy for the wrong GRS one was D'Albenga, and I bet I spelled that wrong, perhaps, but whatever. ( smile)

Territorial, Reimers and Baker Creek were all sent the wrong variety, and at BC is was said to be GRS and at the other sites is was said to be Cuor di Bui, and what was shown was neither. Reimer's pulled it apparently after folks notified them and BC also pulled it when folks notified them about it. I don't know what Territorial did.

I do trust the info at Johnny's Selected Seeds as to the four Italian traditional ones on that page.

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&source=hp&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=piriform+tomatoes&btnG=Google+Search

Above is a link to a google search when "piriform tomatoes" is entered. The link from acta-hort is notable as well as the many other links referring to piriform tomatoes.

Carolyn

Here is a link that might be useful: Piriform variety

"It's Pyriform, not Piriform. And just because it's spelled that way in a garden seed catalog doesn't make it so. Seed Catalogs are 'Hyperbol' (sic) to Sell seeds!" [zebraman]

Dude, it's hyperbole not "hyperbol." Just because you spelled it that way on the Internet doesn't make it so.

HC

ORIGINAL POST :Would appreciate any info from some one who grew this variety lately "
Although its nice to see everyone fighting . Still no helpful reply .None of the replies answered the original post

hoosier you crack me up I needed a good laugh and thanks for turning me on to IS what a great tomato!!

George

Either spelling is accepted for meaning "pear shaped" in Latin. "piri" is the Medieval Latin form derived from the Latin prefix "pyri".

Hi, Everyone
I did grow this variety this past summer; got my seeds from
Underwood Gardens. I had purchased Carolyn's and Amy's
books and was impressed by the picture in Amy's book.
This was my first year growing heirlooms and I tried about
40 or so varieties.
I did get quite a few that looked like the pic posted above
as well as many smaller ones on large, regular plants; mine
were at least 6' tall. The larger fruits had hollow locules (they did produce seed-also a lot of air space)
possibly because they grew so large due to excess rain.
They were hard to peel (other heirlooms peeled easily) and
I didn't want to bother scalding them so didn't bother
canning them. The taste was extremely bland, more so than
the rest of my tomatoes which had a watered-down taste this year. They produced fairly late-I was overwhelmed
canning other varieties and before I knew it, the remaining
Goldman's developed bad spots. At any rate, I decided that
I'm not going to grow this variety again despite the awesome appearance. I grew several plants for a neighbor
to pick, including a Goldman's, and they were her least favorite, mostly because of the hollow locules. They also
tended to crack at the top; the cracks turned black giving
many a bad appearance. Daughter also was impressed with
the photo (neighbor couldn't believe her eyes!)but rated
Goldman's last after Cowlick, Russian Rose, KBX, Steak Sandwich (a pink Burpee hybrid), Ramapo, Indian Stripe and
Black Cherry.

If you'd still like to try them, send me a PM-I believe I'm
set up for that)- I did save seed. Please put "tomato seed" in "subject" as I'm getting tons of junk mail lately.

Thank you greyghost. I just got the book and that picture knocked my eyes out. I don't need a paste tomato and I won't bother growing it.

Got my seeds from Sandhill last year. Overall 2009 was a very good tomato year for me. Goldman's was less than average. A very shy bearer and somewhat bland in taste. I will try again this year with the left over seeds. BTW I prefer the description "wide at the hips" :)

Gee and Amy's book says it's excellent sweet and lucious flavor and heavy yield

And many tomatoes that I like she ranks on them - as Carolyn always says the taste is different for everyone - mine just happens to be in my mouth and tongue - sorry Amy

Dennis

as Carolyn always says the taste is different for everyone - mine just happens to be in my mouth and tongue - sorry Amy

****

Not exactly Dennis. LOL

What I usually say is that taste is individual and subjective and perceptual there's also a genetic association with human taste buds, etc/

So not everyone tastes every variety differently b'c if that were true there wouldn't be so many varieties that MOST folks agree on as to taste, yield and whatever. LOL

Easier said as......your mileage may vary. ( smile)

Carolyn

Carolyn
Yeah I never say it exactly but you get the idea- everyone tastes things differently -

like Ami and I do at least from a lot of her taste from her book
Dennis

Dennis wrote:

Posted by mtbigfigh 10 (My Page) on Sat, Feb 20, 10 at 20:44

Gee and Amy's book says it's excellent sweet and lucious flavor and heavy yield
And many tomatoes that I like she ranks on them - as Carolyn always says the taste is different for everyone - mine just happens to be in my mouth and tongue - sorry Amy

Dennis

But don't they all???

korney
actually a lot do but there are some who do not exaggerate - but then again maybe to Ami and others some are excellent tasting but not to me

what really gets me is how quite a few growers or people like ourselves say a certain tomato is avg for production or moderate but certain seed sellers and plant sellers say high or very high production - just irks me
Dennis

Does anyone know where I can find or have a picture of the goldman tomato leaf? I recently planted these from seed in my parents' compost, but the only problem is the fact that my parents threw everything in the compost, including discarded tomato remains from previous dinners. Of course the seeds from the tomatoes my parents threw out are now growing, so I am having a difficult time trying to figure out which tomato plants are my heirlooms and which are simply from the discarded remains. If anyone has a picture of the Goldman tomato leaf I would be much obliged.

IMO, It is not possible to identify a tomato in seedling stage, even way later than that.
You can tell the difference between PL and RL, but not much more than that.
Of course, few tomatoes may have signature features and also some claim
to be able to tell the differences by the smell of the leaves, so fort.
But in most cases you have to see the fruit to believe and be sure what they are.

Hmmmmm.... where did I see this tomato before?

Was it red.....

{{gwi:1351705}}

Or was it pink....

{{gwi:1363730}}

Which is the imposter???

What are you trying to tell us Mark?

Are you saying that you got both red and pink fruited plants from this variety and that it still isn't genetically stable as an OP derived from the original hybrid? ( smile)

Carolyn

GIA,I grew this variety last year. Seeds from SandHill. It was my largest producer. This was one of the highest yielding tomato plants I have ever grown. The tomatoes were also juicy and tasted great. Some had hollow areas but they were minor. It was also a HUGE plant and extremely heavy with the fruit. Fell over after every storm,even staked with two 1/2" conduit poles.(They bent)

Carolyn, I have not grown ''Goldman's Italian American.'' I have grown Ernie's Plump which has quite prolific production and the red ones pictured, and I've grown Yugoslavian, the pink one pictured, that was also fairly prolific and sometimes slightly hollow on some fruits. (another coincidence--see above post.)

What a coincidence that [at least] 3 varieties can look so similar, huh? ;) There's also a fourth that I believe Terry in OH sent me from another continent, perhaps Europe, called Pero Gigante I think. Another dead ringer!

Mark, last year when it turned out that Baker Creek was offering German Red Strawberry that wasn't, and Reimers was offering Cuor di Bui that wasn't, same for Territorial, it turned out that the problem was in Italy as to seed suppliers and they seem to be sending out seed that looks like the Goldman one as well as many other named ones that I can't remember right now, but there's a number of them discussed in a thread at another place where I post and they ALL turned out to be pyrifor shaped, like the one that Johnny's showed the past two years and just called it pyriform.

So no, at this point I'm not surprised at all that there are several named varieties out there that are darn near identical, in shape at least.

Carolyn